BTD

Giovanna<BR>Yes we did more than our share of siteseeing, but the sites weren’t the only reason or the main reason we went to Italy. The reasons were to eat, to meet all the wonderful people I’ve read/heard about, to see how the locals do things and of course to sitesee (which is unavoidable).<BR><BR>I believe there are billions of posts here about all the different sites throughout italy and of all the ones I went to see, I enjoyed everything, but didn’t feel like I could add more than what has already been stated over and over on this forum.<BR><BR>If you insist on going back to the nitpicky towels (and make me regret ever mentioning them) – let me just say that you need to reread my post and understand WHY I bothered to mention the towels in the first place. <BR><BR>I never expected Italy to be anything like California --- the only thing I compared is the food, which I know one should never do – but I have no other exposure to Italian food other than that available to me here.<BR><BR>I haven’t visited the entire world and see no reason to compare Italy to my previous vacation destinations since there is no comparison. And If you’re curious, I’ve been to Hong Kong, Taiwan and various parts of Mexico. So no, I’m not a well seasoned traveler. Italy was my splurge vacation that I spent a lot of time planning for. YES for the last time, I KNEW there would be linen towels…<BR><BR>AJ – I think it’s great that you like the linen towels and that you are posting your opinion here. However, I don’t know when you were in Italy – but yes I can imagine linen towels being really nice during the summer when the weather is sweltering and the humidity is high. Such was NOT the case for me. <BR>

BTD

Ann & Rose – Ying and I are both Asians (I’m assuming she is by her name) and I have been to Asia and I know what it’s like. It’s not much different in many respects to Italy but I think since I know the language I can deal with it better. Likewise I think Italians who know the language and go to Italy probably have an “easier” time in certain situations.<BR><BR>I did not treat the locals like they were display items for tourists and I’m not so stupid that I don’t realize people are living their lives. You think we don’t see hoards of tourist going through San Francisco on a daily basis???<BR>

Ying

BTD: Yes I am Asian and grew up in Bangkok. I travel extensively in Asia until 2 years ago when I started to go the opposite direction. I was in a remote part of China where there is no running water and indoor plumbing. A hole in the gound was sufficient! Once when I traveled in the northern part of Thailand, we had to get off the bus and pushed, because the bus didn't have enough power to go uphill. It was raining and bloody muddy.<BR><BR>I intend to travel in Europe every year for the next 5 years at least. Then may be South America in between.<BR><BR>I also had traveled within the US & Canada a few times. I even drove up to a motel in Princeton which I reserved before I left California, only to watch it burned down to the ground. It was still smolding when we arrived! Took a Carribean cruise once and never go back because my stomach refuses to comply with the ocean. The only place I go to relax and practically do nothing is in Hawaii.<BR><BR>I live in Los Altos next door to Stanford. You know where it is. Ha Ha! Great place with great multi-ethnic restuarants and cultures, just like SF. <BR><BR>I don't take offend from people that I do not know, especially the ones who cannot spell my name correctly. I take the good with the bad. People like you who take time to write and entertain others (who may not even know they are being entertained, in a way), are great. <BR><BR>Once again, I truly enjoy reading your travel log. I plan to be in Italy next month. I certainly benefit from many people who write in this forum. Many good advices, tips, and small details that I would have overlooked. I intend to have every bit of a good time. I promise there will not be any trip report.<BR><BR>Go Giants! Wasn't that a great game tonight! (Last night).<BR><BR>Ying

rufat

Dear Ying<BR><BR>Since you are planning to visit Italy next month i can give you advice to visit www.discount-worldwide.com <BR>I found there a very interesting Rome tour. I hope you will like it.

Giovanna

BTD: Although you postulate individuals' rights to their opinions, you seem to have some difficulty in accepting them.<BR><BR>Undoubtedly we all travel not only to sightsee, but to enjoy the food and culture of countries we visit, and experience the activities and lives of the locals to the extent we can. Most who post trip reports include their sightseeing adventures, you did not. Of course, the same places visited are spoken of over and over, but I enjoy reading them and seeing the things I have seen through someone elses eyes, or hearing about an experience they had like yours with the man on the motorcycle who needed help. Isn't that what this forum is all about?<BR><BR>I didn't "insist on going back to the nitpicky towels," I only stated my opinion about Italian linen and its common usage in hotel bathrooms. I believe I clearly understand your post without rereading it, but in no way did I criticize your comments, I only expressed mine. Why so angry?<BR><BR>Oddly enough, Italy (at least parts of it) are a great deal like California (the area we live in) and the reason so many Italians have settled here. The olives, the grapes, the climate in general is very similar. What I was trying to say (and many other posters seem to agree)is that the things that upset you so much: no heat, lousy shower (dare I mention the towels?) weren't what you were used to in California and thus you didn't like Italy.<BR><BR>I haven't visited the entire world either. You have been to Asia; we have not, but we visited extensively in Mexico before we started traveling to Europe. Do you hate Mexico because of less than great plumbing, etc. there?<BR><BR>Again BTD, sorry you planned and hoped for a first trip to Italy (Europe) and it didn't work out. But I still don't understand the way you look at things and your conclusions about them.

yup

Well said Giovanna.

Denise

I have to say I loved this post. As an American living in Italy it was exactly this type of information that helped me cope better when I got her. I remember hearing about the squat toilets, the windows without screens, the vaccuum cleaner like clothes dryers, the showers that make it easy to sh*t, shower, and shave all at the same time. I also remember about the "cover charge" at restaurants that literally covers the table cloth etc... I think knowing about these things makes it easier to take them in stride. I love Italy and knowing these things ahead of time certainly made it easier.

Nan (Of Calif. Also)

OK now I understand better where you are coming from, BTD and Ying too. I didn't realize that you were novice travelers, and that you were warning future novices about the way things are in Italy and other countries. <BR>If this is why you focused on the downside, I suppose you are doing a service to those who might just think that Italy is all "upside". I love Italy the best of all countries outside of the USA and go once or twice a year to visit friends I have met over the years. I have to admit Italy can be exasperating until you get into the swing and La Dolce Vita, then things that go wrong just roll away without a second thought.

syrin

Giovanna et al:<BR><BR>It seems like many people are blaming BTD entirely for her experiences--too high expectations, no flexibility, thinking that Italy should be just like California, etc. Did it occur to you that maybe her "perceptions" of rudeness were actually correct? Giovanna, you haven't stated your ethnic background, but BTD has--she's Asian-American. It never occured to you that what she found in Italy was simple racism? It exists everywhere--in Europe the USA, Asia.

Julia

The problem here, BTD, is not so much your opinions themselves as it is the negative way you chose to present them and your trip! I mean, you started this thread negatively in your very first post by stating flat out that you had a less than spectacular time and then, in a subsequent post, went on to list several, very nitpicky problems that, apparently, made your trip less than spectacular. <BR><BR>I mean, you wonder why everyone keeps bringing up your comments about the towels and making such a "nitpicky" thing an issue? Well, I tell you why, because YOU made it an issue first. It's one of the *very first* things you mention in your list of gripes. We're just taking our cues from you. It obviously was a problem for you.<BR><BR>My point is not that you don't have a right to your opinion. It's that we wonder why you chose such seemingly little things ruin your trip. Or, at least, upset it to the point to where you feel the need to rush right over and express them in the form of a negativly toned post about Italy.<BR><BR>And I don't buy your "I was just trying to share my personal experiences with other travelers." Business. You didn't have the "specatcular experience" you expected to, you were upset about that, and you wanted to let all of us know it. If that was not the case, you could have shared your experiences that while still maintaing a positive tone. For example, you could have said something along the lines of: <BR><BR>"Well, just got back from Italy. Had an interesting time. Fell in LOVE with gelato and made a wonderful memory about a lovely Italian man whose battery we helped jump. Also met a sweet lady who helped us navigate the confusing line system in a local grocery store. Found it interesting that local shoppers seem to be really friendly overall. Of course, there were a few things that didn't quite live up to our expectations. First of all, it was colder than we expected and, at one hotel, the water pressure was horrible and the staff was worse! (tip to Fodorites: Don't stay at the Il Giglio in Montalcino!). Also, am I the only one who can't quite seem to get all the way dry when using those linen towels they have in Italy? Oh well, Vive la difference as they asy in France! Oh yeah, one more thing, if you want to make sure you get to send all the postcards you need to, make sure you stock up on stamps when you get a chance. I had a devil of a time finding some in Rome. " <BR><BR>Etc., Etc. <BR><BR>You would have gotten almost exactly the same point across, but in a much more positive way. You're getting cracked on because your initial post bears a decidely bad attitude, not because you dared to express your opinion. <BR><BR>Just my 2 cents,<BR>Julia

You

If the lady didn't like the trip, why should she should aggrandize her comments? Just to make the italophiles on this board purr? I think not.

Mina

Racism exists, yes. And it sucks, certainly. But it doesn't have to get in the way of ruining your trip (although I understand it can put a damper your day).<BR><BR>I am Korean-American. I don't consider myself totally well traveled internationally, but my during my few adventures (London, Paris, Australia and Ireland)I have never felt bitter racism. The Irish themselves warned me that racism still is alive and well, but I never felt anything but welcome. In fact, most preferred to call me Korean over American...which I thought was interesting.<BR><BR>A few months ago, another Asian-American was worried about her trip to Italy because South Korea had won in the World Cup, and heard stories about rude treatment. You know what? If someone is going to be racist, they don't need a world cup defeat as a reason! I plan on going to Italy next, and if I encounter someone rude, I'll smile at them to death. It will just enchance the stereotype that we Americans smile too much. &lt;G&gt; That will probably be better revenge than rude behavior in return anyway.<BR><BR>Plus plenty of people can be rude without being racist! I try not to read too much into it. Perhaps I'm idealistic, I don't know. If you're going to hate me, so be it. You're not spoiling my vacation over it.<BR><BR>I would have liked to hear that BTD had a splendid time. I do think the majority of the forum would too. But it's here so people can voice their bad experiences too...that's what discussion is all about.<BR><BR>Cheers.

Trish

We stayed at II Giglio for several night a few weeks ago and thought it was wonderful, especially for 78 euros per night including breakfast. Our room was just fine and our patio overlooked the whole valley. I found the hotess shy, but not rude. The village of Montalcino is wonderful - even thought the whole time we were there it rained, we had a great time.

GetALifeJulia

Julia, you are a control FREAK if you think you can dictate to people how they should express their opinions.

Julia

Hey, I wasn't trying to dictate anything. BTD seems absolutely shocked and dismayed at how people where choosing to respond to her sourpuss comments. I simply suggested a reason for that. If you present a bad attidude, you are likely to get comments returned to you in the same vein. Likewise, if you are positive and upbeat, you're likely to get replies that are positive and upbeat as well. To go one step further, if you go into a trip with a good attitude, you're likely to have a good trip . . . even IF you hit some bumps along the way. That's all. I could care less what she says or how she says it. Same with her trips. If she wants to bitch and cry and moan about towels and stamps, she should go right ahead. Should she post said bitching, crying, and moaning, however, she should be prepared to catch some flak.<BR><BR>Julia