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Back from 2 weeks in Italy: Florence, Montalcino, Rome and Positano

Back from 2 weeks in Italy: Florence, Montalcino, Rome and Positano

Old Oct 21st, 2002, 06:37 PM
  #21  
Anon this time
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I hardly ever respond to posts like this, but I can't let this one go.

BTD, I don't think you "had more negative experiences than most posters on this forum," I think your PERCEPTION of the experiences was far more negative than most travelers on this forum who are (thankfully) able to be more open minded than you. What a pity that your glass was half empty.
 
Old Oct 21st, 2002, 07:14 PM
  #22  
Nan
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Yes, I agree, it is not so much what happened to you but your perception of what happened. I have had hard towels, so I use them and get on with the day. I have had cold showers which I hate, but I say I "have been refreshed" and go on with my day. I have had bad food in Italy, but that is usually when I make a bad choice of restaurants or go where I see tourists or when the waiter beckoned me inside, a sure sign of a struggling place.
Try to lighten up when you are in any other country on earth, don't go with preconceived notions that all the towels will be perfect, etc.
In no way am I blaming you for your experiences, I have had many crabby and downright rude shop clerks too. If I let it, it would ruin any trip, I agree. But I have the good fortune to travel with people who can laugh at these situations with me, and we get over it and have gelato.
 
Old Oct 21st, 2002, 09:45 PM
  #23  
Open Minded
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I thank you very much for your informative posts BTD. You shared some very good examples of what you BOTH liked and disliked about Italy. I think the people who are actually closed-minded (not open-minded like they're suggesting you be) are posters like Anon and Nan who obviously have their heads stuck up some Italian man's arse! They obviously can't stand any view of Italy that's less than perfect and feel the need to insult you, especially exaggerating your silly comments re towels. You would think they belong to the Italian Tourism Board. Drop the rose-colored lenses folks! BTD is not a troll, but the rest of you just may well be. Sure there are "ugly" americans, and it seems there are "ugly" fodorites as well.

BTD gave a fairly detailed trip report with both objectivity and subjectivity. I am currently planning a trip to Italy and appreciate the efforts of posters like her who offered their trip reports. Their posts, as well as comments from BOB the NAV, Rex and many others, share the intent of helping fellow travellers down the road. But unfortunately there's a childish minority who simply post insulting banter, especially when anyone is even remotely critical of Italy. Instead, let's thank these trip posters, whether or not they're negative/positive/or both, because we can all learn from them. Peace Out!!!
 
Old Oct 21st, 2002, 10:39 PM
  #24  
NOSTAMPSHAHA
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Ok, I have been living in Italy for over thirty years and never not even once have I not been able to manage to buy stamps in a tabacchi shop, never ever. I am wondering what this man was asking for, maybe he italianized the english word stamps and asked for stampe which in Italian means prints instead of asking for francobolli? I cannot think of any other thing,its simply absurd! Its the equivalent of entering a book store and hearing sorry no books! Also if you were cold, tough luck, I live close to Montalcino and it still hasn't been cold this year ,you are full of contraddictions (spelling?) you complain about pollution and yet you would want the heat at full blast in September in your bedroom,(its illegal to turn on the heat unless you are handicapped or ill in this period of the year) you live in the most polluted country in the world (are you aware of this?), the waiters serving you at he restaurant (very rarely are Italian) don't care if you order wine or not or eat only a course.Certainly if you do like the couple that I saw the other day who stoodin line waiting to get a table at a very highly rated restaurant for over an hour. They then sat down, asked for the menù and ordered a salad and a bottle of mineral water, the waiter correctly frowned. Now who is rude in this case? I can't get over Montalcino or Positano being polluted, Montalcino has 4000 inhabitants and is pedestrian, closed even to scooters?! If you don't like the food, fine, I do wonder though what you ordered. If you like spicy hot food why not order pasta all'arrabbiata? its full of red hot chili peppers I think that you are not a good traveller, people like you should have someone take you around and explain the history and the traditions, don't take this personally but I am convinced that you are no good as a tourist, (probably you have very good other qualities) I agree with stay at home....
 
Old Oct 21st, 2002, 11:02 PM
  #25  
Mina
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BTD...

I read your report with much interest for many reasons. I've followed it over the last few days, and have felt quite a cornucopia of emotions reading it.

Before I say anything, I would like to thank you for taking time to post information. Not everyone takes that time.

Being an Asian American myself (Korean, to be exact, and one who plans on going to Italy in a couple of months), I was interested to see how a fellow Asian American's trip went. I understand what you mean about Asians eating spicy, flavorful foods, and that some foods can taste bland by comparison. But then, if all foods had similar spices, it'd all be like Asian food, and then our choices would be quite boring, wouldn't it? Different cultural foods have their own wonderful flavors and characteristics, and should be judged on their own merit.

But the bottom line is that they were YOUR taste buds, and that YOU thought the food was subpar. This was YOUR vacation, and no matter what anyone says, you experienced it the way you did, and nothing will change that. Plus, you did say you enjoyed many parts of it.

But you (or I should say "your post" as I don't know you) do remind me of my cousin (whom I love dearly by the way). It was not an option for her to skip a shower either, even when a gaggle of girls were waiting for her to get ready so we could go out to dinner. We even argued on that point...I thought she was being inflexible; she thought I was being selfish for not allowing her to to enjoy her vacation the way she wanted.

In hindsight, I do understand her point, and I imagine it was a little of both. (But I do travel alone now!) I was completely astounded when during our first full day in London sitting in Tralfagar square, she asked me "do you feel like we are in London?" I could only stare at her as a red double decker zoomed by. Of COURSE I felt like I was in London! But she was too focused on her expectations to savor the moment, and it was only after the trip that she realized she enjoyed it.

I guess what I'm trying to say is I am sad that your trip to Italy wasn't all you hoped. I'm especially sorry if the some of the things you posted contributed to your trip being less than spectacular, because I do feel that a different outlook (as a couple posters mentioned above) could have made some things a tad better. On my recent trip, the water pressure was terrible as well, plus the water vacilated between scalding and freezing, and I had to keep running back and forth in the shower. I kept thinking "at least I'm getting my exercise." Anything can be amusing, but you certainly have to set your mind to read it that way.

I think many will find your report helpful...lots of people seek hot showers and nice towels whether they want to admit it or not. By the way, I'm from Los Angeles, your so-cal rival, so I have to put in a "Go Angels!" in here somewhere. =P

Here's to hoping your next trip is the trip of your dreams!
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 06:32 AM
  #26  
traveler
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I actually did also experience more rudeness in Italy then other places. We went on a trip from spain, through southern France, ending in Venice. People in france were so nice and helpful that it was a shock to find the opposite in Italy. I thought maybe because in Venice they are overwelmed with tourists...? We did have one sweet Italian man come and talk to us in Venice and show us pictures of himself years ago. I was happy to have that positive experience.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 07:22 AM
  #27  
Nikki
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Thanks, BTD, for the trip report. I am contemplating a trip to Italy with my daughter and welcome hearing all the opinions, good and bad. I'm glad you could persevere in giving your opinions even after the harsh criticism you received.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 07:23 AM
  #28  
Heather
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BTD, can you tell me more about the Albergo del Senato? Did you think it was too expensive for what you got? Did you have a room facing the Pantheon or Colloseum? Was your only complaint the water pressuer?
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 07:38 AM
  #29  
diane
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Hi,
I don't think your trip was more negative then most its just the way you look at it. I went to Ireland for two weeks, end of may first part of june. It rained most of the time, all the showers in all of the b&b were either hot or cold and no pressure in any of them. And yet it was the best vacation I have been on. You have to go with the flow in other countries and enjoy the diffrences. No I did not like the rain but the irish rainbows are out of this world, I didn't like the showers but learned to laugh at it with my husband. Italy is my next trip and I know it won't be like home but it will be an adventure .
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 09:36 AM
  #30  
Tina
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Not everyone will have a good time on every trip, but you have to learn to be a good traveler. Not every country has good water pressure, and in hotels with everyone using the water for showers, etc. at the same time, the hot water may dwindle. It happened to us this last trip, I had a nice hot shower that I love, my friend who took one after me, had a nice cold shower, I suppose I used up all the hot water our room was alloted, oops.
I always get stamps in tab. shops, sometimes with crabby shopkeepers.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 12:07 PM
  #31  
JAFA
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I have a question for NOSTAMPSHAHA: I see you've been living in Italy for 30+ years, and I'm just curious about your comment that "waiters are very rarely Italian." Do you mean you find the waiters in Italy are usually from other countries? I've only been to Italy twice, but I only experienced that the odd time, unless we were totally tricked. Maybe it's not as common in the cities and towns we visited? Just curious...
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 12:27 PM
  #32  
JAFA
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In response to BTD's food post, and in the interest of the other side of the opinion coin, I'd like to say that the key reasons my husband and I are so crazy about the food in Italy are the simplicity and the freshness of the ingredients. The fact that something so incredibly delectable can be made by using just two or three ingredients changed the way we think about, as well as the way we prepare, food. I'm shocked that BTD didn't find much in the way of fresh herbs. Though I suppose, depending on the season, you don't necessarily find a huge variety. But that's exactly the reason what you get is so incredibly fresh, and tastes so different from, and so much more flavorful than, most anything in the states (we live in NYC, so we're getting a pretty good variety as well).

Two observations about the pasta in Italy: one is exactly what BTD doesn't like: the al dente aspect. The more al dente, the better for me. And, the other thing is the pasta to sauce ratio. For years, I'd been scooping the sauce to the side here, since there's always such an abundance of sauce. How thrilled was I my first trip to Italy, to find out how it's supposed to be done. It's not just about the sauce! They respect the pasta and therefore, the ratio. It was an amazing discovery for me. Again, as many have said, all of this is in my humble opinion, and I certainly respect others' as well. Hope BTD will re-visit and have better experiences.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 12:43 PM
  #33  
Rocky
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I am not surprised at the vitriol on these web sites. There are so many people with nothing better to do than to criticize and ridicule other peoples experiences. You were just being honest in reporting your experiences. While I enjoyed my 3 weeks in Italy this summer I was definitely underwhelmed with the Italian food, other than the gelato. There was much I didn't care for-the crowds, noise, heat- but so much to enjoy-St. Peter's Basilica, Sistine Chapel, Borghese Gallery, David at the Academia, riding a gondola in Venice, Portofino, Dolomites, etc. that it was still the best vacation I've had the pleasure to enjoy. To each his own.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 01:14 PM
  #34  
For Jafa
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For JAfa

Yes the majority of waiters are now from Albania and ex Jugoslavia. This is a rather recent and very common phenomenon, Italy is getting a huge immigration from the East and South. Nothing wrong but a fact. My favourite restaurant now has 2 girls from Sarajevo and 1 from Albania out of a total of 5 waiters.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 01:35 PM
  #35  
JAFA
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Thanks to NOSTAMPSHAHA for clarification on waiter issue. We did get to know our waiter from Switzerland and waitress from Austria at our favorite restaurant in Tuscany and an Australian hostess in Positano. But other than that I think we went to mostly family-owned/run restaurants. Thanks a mil.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 01:56 PM
  #36  
Get Over
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It is not that the people here are attacking BTD, it is just that we are mostly all serious travelers or travel lovers and to read about someone who can't take the travel knocks is upsetting.
I sympathize with her, but to an experienced traveler they are really nothing to get riled up about. I know people who backpack and who climb mountains all over the world, and a stiff towel complaint would put them in gales of laughter.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 05:18 PM
  #37  
BTD
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NOSTAMPSHAHA

You crack me up.
The hotel clerk told me exactly what you told me --- ANY tabacchi shop sells stamps.
However since you speed read my post --- I explained but will repeat for your sake that I went to several Tabacchi shops – with clear English signs on the door saying they sold stamps ,…even with pictures of stamps on them.
I thought (as you pointed out) that what I was saying may not have been understood. So I repeated myself again and pointed at the picture of stamps right in front of me and the shop owners and they looked at the picture,…looked at me and flat out said NO.

Whethor this is because they ran out or because they simply didn’t want to sell me any….I have no way of concluding. But for all of them to be sold out…..well too much of a coincidence for me.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 05:23 PM
  #38  
BTD
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Heather

Re: Albergo Del Senato.
The hotel faces the Pantheon. The hotel is very nice, very nice and friendly service, will answer any and all questions you have to the best of their abilities. The room is small (to be expected) but nice, clean, etc. There was a tiny balcony in our room that faced the back/center of the building. Nothing to look at – but very quiet.,…which is what I had asked for. The room was 240 Euro for 2 people (1 bed). The prices differ depending on number of people and bed type.

You walk out immediately you’re in the pantheon plaza. But beware – there is a McDonald’s there and there are tons of tourists and locals eating there.

The restaurant raved about here called “La Rosetta” is just around the corner (2 minute walk) and we did make reservations (one night ahead) and had dinner. This is where I had the bad experience with not purchasing any wine. But we ordered our dinners and the meal was THE BEST Italian meal I had while in Italy. I did ask for my pasta with lobster to be made with some spice and it came just that way so was perfect for me. (spice meaning pepper)

It is very pricey though so be prepared for that.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 05:26 PM
  #39  
BTD
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JAFA

As for the pasta in Italy --- I had no problem with the sauceasta ratio --- it isn’t much different here in California restaurants that I go to.

As for simplicity --- I believe in simplicity. Traditional Chinese dishes stir fry vegetables (only one veggie) with a small amount of oil, a dash of salt and fresh garlic. You get the flavor of the vegetable to the fullest and this is one of my favorite ways to eat vegetables.

However, again, maybe I ordered wrong, maybe I went to the wrong restaurants….but I found the pasta dishes totally plain.
 
Old Oct 22nd, 2002, 05:31 PM
  #40  
BTD
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GETOVER

Yes you said it right there didn’t you. YOU are a seasoned traveler and maybe you and others are making the assumption that everyone who reads and posts on this board are as well. Surely you HAVE to know that FODORS is more meant for “unseasoned” travelers to get an understanding of how things work in other countries and to get an idea of what to expect and not expect. You must also realize that there are countless people traveling to Italy who have never been to Italy --- like me who have to go so that I can learn and have an easier time the NEXT time I go.

I never said I was holding any personal grudges against the rude, the mean, the cold, the pollution or the country. I am merely pointing out things that others should consider that they might experience themselves when they get there…… therefore if they have this in their minds – they can be prepared for it (ie. Bring your own stamps, bring more warm clothes if you travel in between seasons, etc).

I never said everyone’s going to have MY experience.
Sheesh – some people are just so quick to jump on others backs for “saying the wrong thing”.
 

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