Are UK train tickets more expensive lately?
 

I'm pricing tickets between London and Loughborough at the end of May. I'm getting a lowest price of £62 for a return fare (£61 for a single). I made this trip a couple of years ago and the tickets were much cheaper - maybe £15? I'm also pricing tickets for a day trip from London to Bath the first week in June, and those are also a little more expensive than I was expecting based on trip reports here (£19). Is my memory just that bad, or have ticket prices increased? Any chance of them going down if I wait a bit?

While I'm asking, we'll be arriving at Heathrow at noon (hopefully). Is four hours enough time to deplane, go through immigration, get baggage, and get to St Pancras for a train north? Thanks so much for your input!

I'll be watching closely to see what response you get, Jennifer. I'm trying to figure out how to order tickets from London to York and then York to Edinburgh. I was told to order between 8 and 12 weeks ahead. We're in that window now, but unless I'm not reading it right, the prices are not as low as I'd been told they should be.

The goal of the rail authority i believe is to even out the discrepancies of ticket pricing from the deep discounted to the often extremely high fully flexible tickets bought on day of travel.

Very expensive spur of the moment tickets are said to inhibit such travel by train - if folks don't book far in advance they may find the fares to high and drive or fly or whatever.
ve found.
For pass prices and lots on British trains: www.seat61.com; www.ricksteves.com and http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id11.html. Like going to Scotland and back check out the 4-consecutive day pass - which would also allow you to do a day trip from Edinburgh to Sterling or St Andrews, etc. or to return to London via a different route like the West Coast line via the Lake District

The cheapest way to travel is to get an Advance Ticket.
You have to travel on a specific train at a specific time.
There are no refunds, but date & time of tickets can be changed up until the time of departure, minus a £10 fee per ticket per person and any difference in fares

Palenque - we're taking a few people to Loughborough and not doing any day trips, so much as you love the passes ;), I don't think they're our best option for this trip, based on my research. Thanks for the web sites, though. I wish "evening out the discrepancies" didn't mean "raising the prices of the cheap tickets".

Josser - I'm looking at advance fares. That's what has me so puzzled - the "anytime" fares are even more expensive.

(CAPH52 - your thread was what reminded me to post my question! When will you all be there?)

jent - the more people the cheaper the passes - 3rd thru 9th traveler pays 50% of what the first two pay - kids under 16 get free passes - the London Plus Pass also gives you a voucher for travel from and to Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted on express trains and can be used outside the validity of the pass.

that said if that is you only travel just get the cheapest - you obviously do not need flexibility like folks arriving by air do - but if you have a whole lot of folks then the pass could be interesting.

Yes i love passes because then i do not have to spend weeks trying to nab some fare that is non-changeable - i like full flexibility - but for many who do not then the advance fares are best.

Pal - yep, I looked into the price of the passes. Right now the advance tickets are working out to be about $90ish per person, and as those are the only tickets we'll need (and our dates are not flexible anyway), it's still cheaper to get the advance fares. (The London-Bath trip was just for me - I'm staying for a bit after the rest of the group goes home.)

We actually will be arriving by air and going straight to Loughborough, hence my question about our arrival at Heathrow. Any thoughts about whether four hours is enough to comfortably make a train from St Pancras, or whether we should plan on a later one?

It should be easy unless the plane is quite late - there can be long lines at U.K. Customs so walk as fast as you can to get to the queue

the quickest way probably is to take the heatrow express to Paddington - 15-20 mins only and then a cab to St Pancras - about two miles to the east.

Not sure what rail line Loughborough is on - if it's on the one going thru Watford Junction then you can get a direct rail bus there from Heathrow.

Train fares increase faster than inflation. However:

- getting the cheapest advance fares in May can be tricky because of the two bank holidays
- you certainly won't get a return ticket for £15, which is absurdly cheap for 120 miles each way
- putting in a date away from the holiday weekends, leaving London after 0930, gets you £50 returno Loughborough
- there's virtually no chance of prices going down
- of course "anytime" fares cost more: they're fully flexible
- The cheapest way from London to Bath by train (apart from the possible use of Megatrain from Waterloo, which I think won't work with a daytrip) is to get two Advance singles. Bath is just too far for proper day returns: play with different times (and days) on the National Rail site

There are special internet fares which do not appear to be available yet for the dates you want. They are available for dates in April, so inputtting some trial dates would give you an idea of the fares that might also be available at the end of May.

Note that the low internet fares are not available between about 15.30 and 20.30, which is the rush hour and just the time you might want. You could also find that the cheap fares are not available around the public holiday at the end of May. Monday 25th May is the public holiday, so the whole of that weekend could be either busy or taken up with engineering work.

Thanks, everyone. I was afraid the bank holiday had something to do with it, but unfortunately our dates aren't flexible. Chartley, yes, I'm afraid that at least on the way to Loughborough, those are exactly the times we might want! I'll look into the internet fares just in case, though. And flanner, thanks for the Bath advice! (I just remembered that our fare two years ago was just a single, so if it actually was £15 [debatable] that at least makes more sense!)

At www.nationalexpresseastcoast.com I found a super off-peak return of £50 (£49 off-peak single) for London-Loughborough.

The advance single fare for London-Bath Spa can be as low as £9.50 on the same site.

FWIW, jennifer, last May (2008), I bought an advance train ticket from London to Bath (1-way) to travel on the morning of the May Bank Holiday Monday. My 1-way ticket was £9.50.

However, when I booked (about 2 weeks in advance), only the 7am train had the cheap rate, so that's what I took.

TimS - thanks so much for taking the time to check that. I got an error with that site, but if I'm correct, we probably can't use the off-peak tickets. We don't arrive at LHR until noon and need to be in Loughborough by evening, so we were aiming to leave somewhere between 16:00 and 17:00. (Those fares to Bath were exactly what I was finding via nationalrail.co.uk.)

yk, that's exactly what I'm finding. It's good to know you waited awhile to book - I'm debating the merits of locking into a date now to get a cheaper ticket, or waiting until I get back to London and checking the weather first!

Oh, NO NO NO, jennifer, don't get me wrong. I didn't WAIT to buy my tickets, it's just that I decided to go on a trip at last minute! Do buy your tickets ASAP when your dates are set. In my situation, I would have MUCH PREFERRED a later train (like the 8am one) instead of the 7am; but because the 8am cheap tix were all gone, I had no choice but to take the 7am. (the price difference was so huge that I decided it was worth giving up an hour of sleep).

The thing is, if you want flexibility (eg, checking weather the day before), be ready to pay £££ for train tickets. You may be eligible for the off-peak sameday return for Bath, which would be cheaper. but since I was going 1-way, the difference was something like £9.50 vs £40 (walk-up price).

Wow - that is definitely the most passionate "I didn't mean that!" I've gotten on here. :) Your correction is duly noted! I'm used to the idea of either booking way in advance or paying for flexibility, so no worries - understood now. :) I was actually surprised you were able to get a cheap fare at all! Now if only someone with a crystal ball could tell me which days would be better for museum-ing vs. day-tripping...

I have found recently that I can get slightly better prices using...

www.thetrainline.com

...rather than the national rail website.

The best-fare-finder facility is most useful.

I think thetrainline charges a nominal fee for people booking from overseas; at least that's what I found out last year when I tried various train websites.

As for day-tripping, certainly going on weekdays will mean fewer tourists...

thetrainline.com - i think a Virgin train site, does charge a 3 pound service fee julia? did a few years ago and am just curious - could make the slight difference the same?

also curious as to how the nationalexpresseastcoast site can have different fares than nationalrail.co.uk even for trains not on their franchise - i know alan i think and other Brits prefer that site - but seems should have the same national rail fares info?

thanks

While booking earlier will normally get you tickets at a lower price, it is sometimes the case that you can book too early. If the train company can sell tickets well in advance at high prices to American tourists, why should they lower the price too soon to fill the train?

I suggest that you keep checking the fares for the next few weeks, and see if the cheaper internet fares become available.

Jennifer, we're going to York June 16th and on to Edinburgh the next day.

Palenque, I appreciate the advice on the pass. But we're doing one way tickets as we're flying from Edinburgh to Dublin (which is where we're starting our trip because my daughter is getting married in Ireland) and then back home the same day.

Not sure why, but I find this train stuff very confusing!

Chartley - thanks. I may just do that. When I checked prices to Loughborough for next week they were the same as for around the May holiday, so am I correct in thinking that at the very least, they shouldn't go up too much in the next few weeks? (We'll definitely not wait till the last minute.)

CAPH52 - I know, it does seem confusing when you're in the midst of it! But I've done it before. It's really not so bad. If you're not looking for flexibility, just focus on the advance tickets and make sure you have the right dates! And picking up the tickets at the FastTicket machines is incredibly simple (I think you asked about that on your thread?). Sounds like you'll be there a bit after I will. Congratulations on the wedding!

CAPH -one way - no way if i had known that - thot you were going up and back. Sorry.

jent103 - If you leave at 16:25, you can't get a super off-peak fare; but you can still get a slightly higher off-peak fare. If you leave at 17:00, you'll pay full fare.

I just reserved our tickets today for May 12 going from London to Edinburgh because the price has gone up 2x since I've began looking in February.

Does anyone know how to change seat reservations? We asked for window seats but both got aisle seat. Do you think they would have been full already for May? I'm not sure what number to call from states.

TimS - I see the fares you were talking about on nationalrail.co.uk. I think we'll probably go for the 16:25 train and really, really hope that our flight isn't delayed!

Sue878 - I assume you will be traveling on a National Express East Coast train. If so, you can make a phone call and ask to change your seat reservations. Dial your country's international access code + 44 (UK country code) + (0)8457 225 333. Omit the zero in parentheses. It is only used for calls originating in the UK.

TimS: Thanks - I'm in US so I would use 011 + 44 but do I need a city code after the 44 (before the number)?
I must be doing something wrong, I keep getting a recording saying the call can't be completed as dialed.

The London-Loughborough fare of £49 or £61 is an "off-peak" fare and can be bought at any time right up to the train's departure (though if you buy at the last minute, you won't have a reserved seat). The ticket is not tied to a specific train, but can only be used within a certain period: the £49 fare seems to be valid on any train leaving London from 1030 to 1500, the £61 fare between 1500 and 1630, and the £49 fare after 1900. These tickets do not need to be bought in advance.

The telephone prefix 08457 can only be used within the UK, I believe.

Thanks for the Congrats, Jennifer! And for your kind words about my confusion. Which only seems to be getting worse! Good luck with your train tickets!

Oh, when you do buy them, assuming you're doing so on line, could you post back and let us know whether you had any problems? penel523 reported problems due to softwear issues every time she tried to order tickets online. I'm hoping that's been cleared up.

Geoff - thanks for that information! I assumed (badly) that anything cheap had to be bought in advance, whether advance fares or off peak. But if I'm understanding you correctly, the off peak fare is the off peak fare regardless of whether you buy it weeks or minutes in advance. Right? Are all weekends considered off peak?

(OK, now this is crazy - since this morning, a fare has appeared for the exact same trains/trips for £50!)

CAPH - I'll give an update just for you. :) I wonder how exactly penel523 was trying to buy them? The National Rail site sends you to the vendor (there are several different companies that run different routes), so I'm guessing it was a specific vendor, or perhaps the Trainline site, that he or she was having trouble with.

Sue878 - You could try sending a FAX: 44 (0)191 227 5986.

The off peak fare can be bought at any time and can be used on any train during the off-peak periods. Weekends are usually off peak. The price does not depend on when you buy the ticket.
Advance tickets go on sale a few weeks in advance, and are probably not on sale yet for June. If I put in a date in April, there is a £32 advance ticket on the 1630 train.

jennifer - I had some trouble last year when booking my ticket from London-> Bath and Bath->Salisbury; which are opearted by first Great Western. I tried using National Express East Coast website but it didn't show all the train times. I looked at thetrainline but it charges an extra fee. Finally I figured out how to order directly from First Great Western. You can read the details here:
http://www.fodors.com/community/euro...omment-1935008

I can't remember if you're going alone or with someone else. If there's more than 1 of you, don't forget about the 2-for-1 special at Bath which you can use with a valid rail ticket.
http://www.firstgreatwestern.co.uk/Content.aspx?id=3023

Thanks, yk! Bath would be by myself - I'll be in London a few days after the rest of the group goes back to the US. Still trying to figure out what all I want to do.

Geoff - thanks for the explanation. I'll keep checking out fares for a few weeks, then.

Just wanted to report back to say that my tickets finally started showing the lower prices. I ordered them today and had no problems with the credit card. I got tickets for two adults London/York, York/Edinburgh for 42.80 GBP.

Now I'm wondering why I was so nervous about the whole thing!

Oh, good! See, it's really not too bad. ;) Hopefully ours will be lower soon - that £50 fare disappeared pretty quickly!

mark