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An act of kindness in France and a lesson learned

An act of kindness in France and a lesson learned

Old Jun 14th, 2006, 05:55 AM
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An act of kindness in France and a lesson learned

Last week we returned from a 2 week tour of Normandy, Brittany and the Loire Valley in a rental car. While travelling to visit a chateau on a Sunday, we stopped for gas at a station, fully knowing that they were closed on Sunday but also knowing that there is a credit card machine at each pump. When our cards were repeatedly rejected by the machine I resorted to asking 2 elderly women who had just pulled up to the pump next to ours if I was doing this correctly. They tried and failed as well. They then told us to follow them to another gas station where the cards were still rejected and then, somehow, told us in French that they would put the charge on their credit card and we could reimburse them which we did. We were so impressed with their kindness and tried to convey how grateful we were. I'm sure they understood.

Upon returning to our B&B, I asked our host what the problem was. He told us that in France, one doesn't sign a receipt for a credit card purchase, but inserts a pin number instead. Thus, our cards could not work. I don't know what we would have done if those women hadn't come along and helped us.

In all my reading on this site and others, I had never heard of this problem. I don't know how I missed it.

I hope this helps someone and that I am providing the correct information.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:05 AM
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Thank you for posting this.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:11 AM
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There was another thread recently that mentioned the increasing use of PIN#s for credit cards... your incident is apparently more evidence.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:11 AM
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It is rather misleading post.
I used my cc in Paris but I called bank before traveling and TOLD them I am traveling and will charge from abroad (thanks to Fodorites advise). So you are missing something, I returned from Bermuda and got call from Citibank asking me to call and verify some charges on my cc because this time I forgot to call.

Next issue...what kind of award those women deserve to pay for your gas with their credit cards and being momenterely reimbursed by you? Anyone else? I don't see anything outstanding in it but then again maybe for French...Oops!
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:11 AM
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That's a good piece of information to know. Unfortunately, you found out the hard way. I will be travelling around the Loire Valley in August and need to return my hire car on the monday morning full of petrol.

Does anyone know the likely opening times for petrol (gas) stations in France on a weekday?
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:14 AM
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Travelnut,
if PIN issue is correctly reported then France is blocking all world from using cc in France. Is their economy broke free from the rest of the world and crossing finish line first?
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:14 AM
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Here are few threads discussing this problem at gas and train stations:

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...2&tid=34707695

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...2&tid=34616569

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...2&tid=34607994

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...2&tid=34486441

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...2&tid=34423230

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...=2&tid=1367126

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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:23 AM
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If you are returning your car to CDG, there is a service station within the airport.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:24 AM
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Ziana,

US Credit cards do not have PIN numbers. The gas station was not manned and the pump would not accept the card because there was no PIN number. It has nothing to do with notifying your credit card company before travel.

Acts of kindness should be reported just as widely as dastardly deeds regardless of the nationality.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:24 AM
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Ziana - I informed the banks of all three of my credit cards that I would be in France so that was not the issue. Also, I used these cards throughout our trip with no problem.

I don't understand your comment about a reward to these women.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:25 AM
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Ziana: The post is not misleading. Yes, your credit cards worked in Paris. But they would NOT have worked in a self service machine. US issued credit cards don't work in machines in France - not at gas stations, not at train stations, not at metro stations, etc.

And "I don't see anything outstanding in it . . . " ?? The ladies in question didn't just buy the petrol - they actually guided ehughes to an different station to try again.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:26 AM
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I beleive that some machines will only work with CCs that have the chip (puce) in them. I ran into that problem trying to buy SNCF tickets from a kiosk, and eventually had to go to the service counter.

And yes, it was nice of them to help you like they did.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:26 AM
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Ziana:
Anyplace you use your credit card in Romania will require you to enter a PIN (like it was a debit card) so make sure you know it.
http://fodors.com/forums/threadselec...2&tid=34783775
Also:
"...Instead of signing your name when you use your credit card to make a purchase, you enter a four-digit Personal Identification Number, better known as a PIN into a PIN pad."
http://www.mbna.com/europe/creditcards/chip_pin.htmlml
---------------------------------------------------
I wasn't saying all of France now requires a PIN - I simply mentioned that the requirement of a PIN for a credit card had recently been discussed here and in the news.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:27 AM
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I was posting the same time as ehughes and Barbara. Let's just put it that ziana is having a bad day . . . . .
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:30 AM
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Using your card at an unmanned petrol station is different from using it to withdraw cash; even if it works with your pin at an ATM to withdraw cash, it will not work at a petrol station. My Belgian card does not work there either.

In a shop, you will be able to sign if you do not have a pin that works.

Ziana; you do not think it was kind for the french women to let the OP follow them to another petrol station, and then when the card didn't work there either to use their own CC instead? Would you have done the same in the US?
Having a pin on the credit card is much safer than just signing; anyone can copy the signature from a card.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:35 AM
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Is it a question of a PIN with a credit card, or a credit card with a chip in it that requires a PIN? The latter is in Europe and has not made it to the States.

My USAA M/C crdit card has a PIN associated with it, and I can use it at an ATM.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:39 AM
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Budman: it is called "chip and PIN" and is different than just a PIN like we use in an ATM. There are imbedded chips and (for credit card use - not ATMs) un-manned locations don't work since there is no attendant who can override the chip requirement and let you sign a slip.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:41 AM
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That's what I thought. Thanks.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:42 AM
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Even if you do have a PIN, an American-issued credit card will not work in vending machines set up to read the computer chip that is embedded in French-issued credit cards. In a store or restaurant, an employee can override this problem, but at gas pumps on Sunday Americans are out of luck even with a PIN.

Two lessons here:

First, Get a PIN. You should already have one so that you can use the credit card at an ATM in the event of an emergency (it would be a cash advance with interest ticking immediately so not advised unless all else fails), and the PINpad is widely used at retail locations in some countries. I saw them in Amsterdam and Copenhagen several years ago.

Second, fill up the tank on Saturday.
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Old Jun 14th, 2006, 06:45 AM
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Budman: And it apparently depends on where the US-issued card is used...it can still apparently be swiped by business establishments (such as when paying hotel bills as you unoubtedly found out on your recent trip to Switzerland).

On our own upcoming trip to the UK which will require driving I am assuming I am going to have to pay for any petrol in cash rather than using self-service pumps.

Oh, and thanks for that recent trip report and the info about using your own GPs..I've decided to take mine to the UK in September.

Cheers.
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