About to cancel my trip to Turkey- thoughts?
 

Given the latest developments in the middle east, we're seriously considering canceling the Turkish segment (Istanbul and Kalkan) of our vacation in May and instead spending more time in Greece. I'm sick at the thought of missing out on Turkey (which sounds like an incredible country!). Are we overreacting? Your honest thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

I do understand your hesitancy, but having just been there last summer, I have to say that it's one of the best places I've ever been. And we were there on September 11; the outpouring of sympathy was amazing. Remember, it's a secular country, a strong supporter of the U.S. and is not an Arab country, even if it is Islamic. In fact, I'm willing to bet that the pro-American tone will be stronger in Turkey than in Greece. <BR>I encourage you to continue your plans to go to Turkey; the people are very welcoming. It has also undergone an economic crisis (the Turkish lira was devalued by half last year), and really needs our tourist dollar. <BR>

I totally agree with Paule. Do not cancel your visit to Turkey! We had a great time there last year, and I will definitely return. Istanbul is a wonderful city.

Christine: Only you can determine your comfort level, but I will say that I went forward with my plans, made long before 9/11, to go to Morocco in November and am eternally grateful that I did. And Morocco is ever so much more Arab and Muslim than Turkey. I have terrifically fond memories of my very few days in Turkey almost 20 years ago and have always wished to return. Paule is correct about Turkey's support for the USA, and I would guess that if you do go, you will come back, as I did from Morocco, with a deeper appreciation for the Turkish culture than you might have gained under other circumstances and possibly even a new world view. It's a stretch for Americans to travel to "marginal" countries these days, but I can attest that doing so reaps great rewards. I'm not exactly the world's most astute politically informed person, but I do keep up with current events and I don't see anything in the recent Israeli-Palestinian situation that would make me change my mind about a trip to Turkey. Yes, there is the possibility that the entire world will dissolve into chaos if Sharon and Arrafat get into full-blown war, but even then I wouldn't expect Turkey to be an unsafe zone. The Turks love Americans for the most part, and they need the tourism dollars. It's a beautiful and phenomenally historical part of the world, and I would go see it before the world devolves to total chaos and you can't.What struck me in Morocco was that the individual people I was exposed to, whether the hotel staff or our driver, or the man in the stall selling spices in the souk, were just ordinary people, and no matter what their political affiliations they were kind to us and even more, wanted to be friends with us. I didn't come across a single anti-American sentiment in my four days in Marrakech. I came across people who wanted to debate the great conflict between Islam and the West, and that was fine, but I never met anyone who was openly anti-American, and I was "out there" in the souks and on the streets every day I was there.<BR><BR>I know it's a hard choice, but I would encourage you to go no matter what. I think Americans who can afford it have an obligation to understand other cultures. This sounds like a great opportunity, and if you don't have considerations like possibly jeopardizing the life of your two-year-old, you should do it.

I have been to Turkey 3 times and am ready to go again! My son taught school in Istanbul and a friend from there visited him here last month. I asked the friend about safety and he said that it was safer there than ever before. The Kurdish situation of 2 years ago has settled down. We were in Greece on the same trip to Turkey. We saw anti-American grafitti there but not in Turkey. The Turkish people are very friendly to everyone, especially Americans. As someone pointed out, Turkey is a secular country that is determined to belong to the EU. Having terrorist problems there would hurt their economy which has been struggling to improve. I think you will be as safe there as anywhere. Have a wonderful time!

Now for the scaredy cat vote. I know many will slam me for this but I would cancel. Honestly I am afraid, i'm worried about encountering anti-american setiment as things worsen in the middle east. I also worry of a terror attack against americans. I am visiting ireland and england again who i feel are our true allies. This is a decision you have to make. The others make good points too. I wish you the best!

We were in Greece and Turkey in September 2000 and Turkey was amazing. We had 2 weeks in Greece and just one in Turkey. I really regretted not spending more time in Turkey. I liked Greece a lot (I had been there many years ago), but Turkey was incredible. We took the ferry from Rhodes to Marmaris and then took a bus to Fethiye for a couple of nights, then Kalkan for 4 days. Kalkan was beautiful - it seemed like a picture perfect Mediterranean town. <BR><BR>My husband has an American passport and before we went, people had warned us that it might not be safe. That's what other Americans told us, not Canadians. We didn't feel the least bit nervous in Turkey and to be honest, I was surprised at how easy it was to visit. <BR><BR>We wanted to go back to Turkey this summer - I really want to see Istanbul and Cappadocia - but have decided to go to Nova Scotia and PEI instead. (We live in Canada and have never seen the east coast.) September 11 played no part in our decision - the fact that we had to buy a new car was more the deciding factor! I will definitely be going back, hopefully next year.

Hi Christine:<BR><BR>We travelled to Istanbul on a cruise right after 9-11. We left on 9-15 and were in Turkey on 9- 19.<BR>The Turkish guides we had, were very adamant saying they were NATO and that they wanted to be in the European Community, and were working in that direction. I saw american flags in some of the stores, and generally a pro-american sentiment. If anything, the people in the market (which you can't miss) were very sorry for the events that had just taken place (maybe due to the lack of business...) The turkish lire is very devaluated and they rely on tourism as one of their main sources of income.<BR>I don't think these thing have changed, but only you can determine your level of confort in the current circumstances.<BR><BR>Ana<BR>

Don´t cancel, you are very much overreacting. The situation in Israel does not affect tourists in Turkey. I have been there 8 times, because it is one of my favourite vacation countries. When Kurdish situation few years back was at its height I avoided going to eastern Turkey. But now Turkey is fiercely trying to get their act together to be able to meet EU´s regulations and to be able to enter the union. So the first things they are fixing are human rights questions and banishing of death penalty (and I think they already did the latter). <BR><BR>You would probably meet more anti-American sentiment in EU-countries. Turks are friendly people by nature. They are very moderate muslims and not even arabs.

I totally concur with all the "Go ahead and go" folks. We were there in 1999 when the Kosovo campaign was in full swing... in fact we were on the runway in Brussels en route to Istanbul when the "B 2's" were flying over N.A.T.O. airspace and had to sit there in the plane on the ground an extra hour while the air traffic control "cleared" the airspace. EVERYONE in Turkey made us feel welcome...EVERYONE we came in contact with made sure that we knew they were "on our side". And "EP"... I'll go a step further than you and say that I've seen more "Anti-American" feelings expressed in this very forum than we saw any evidence of in Turkey!<BR><BR>Like I've said in previous posts... the only real danger there is to the Turkish Police from the Kurdish Separatists (sp) ... so just donl;t stand near the police! While we were there we walked through Taxim Square... about an hour later a Kurdish woman suicide bomber was walking across the Square toward a police station to try and wreak havoc... she tripped and only blew herself up!!! <BR><BR>Turkey is a great country ... GO!!! <BR><BR>Barry<BR><BR>(p.s. - make sure to by leather coats and silk scarves while there... they are cheaper there than anywhere I've ever been!)

Hi I have a question about purchasing rugs in Turkey. Is it really cheaper? Any suggestions? I am planning a trip and have started pricing rugs where I live to get an idea. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Oh my two cents? Yes go! I was a little apprehensive but I have decided to go anyway. I think it sounds like a fabulous place with a lot to offer. I enjoy meeting people from all over the world. I get such a broad perspective and really enjoy the interaction.

Christine<BR><BR>I would definately go. I travel to Turkey regularly and the people are extremely friendly and welcoming. Istanbul is a big city and you have to take the usual precautions there that you would in any other city. Kalkan on the other hand is about as laid back as it is possible to get without falling over. It is my regular bolt hole when I need to escape 21st centuary life and I have made many life long friends there. I can guarantee that you will be made to feel very welcome.

hi,<BR>My husband and two young children are leaving this April 25 for Turkey it will be our third time in six years. I have to tell you I feel safer going there then to America. And that is not to say anything bad about the American's but as people have posted Turkey is very friendly and the people are wonderful. Security is also better then here (Canada) even before 9-11. We are still going I won't cancel.

Hi Anna -<BR><BR>Yes, buying rugs in Turkey is definitely a good idea. We bought 5 at 2 different shops and yes, I did a lot of homework ahead of time.<BR><BR>I have to ask you a question, and I hope it does not come across as either chauvanistic or offensive... are you traveling with your husband or a male companion? My wife had a negative experience shopping there ... as did friends of ours that were there 3 months after we were. In our friends case, she (the wife) went into a rug shop by herself while her husband was at a Turkish bath... not just to look but to buy... she was totally ignored by the staff and finally left.<BR><BR>In our case, my wife went into a shop by herself and was, to quote her, "literally descended upon"! She was quoted prices, left and came back to get me. When I got there, the prices she was quoted as their "best price" dropped drastically before I even began to negotiate! <BR><BR>In both cases, both my wife and our friend, who are both professional women, were just incensed!!!<BR><BR>However, it is just a cultural thing, they are just not used to doing business like we do in the States.<BR><BR>If you would like the name of the stores we got good deals in, just e-mail me directly... I don't want to be accused of putting out an advertisement here on the forum ;&gt;)<BR><BR>I will say this... generally speaking their "opening price" is close to twice what they are really willing to take... especially if multiple purchases are involved! And if you do buy, do it with a credit card, have the rugs shipped to you, and insist on signing the tag on the back of the rug so it will be more difficult to "switch rugs" on you.<BR><BR>Best wishes,<BR><BR>Barry

Hi Barry<BR>Thank you for responding. I am traveling with my husband. I do not mind the different cultural way. For me I would not be offended. My father who is a retired Attorney taught me something long ago. Learn to go for the result you want no matter how you have to get there. I know that might come across as harsh but I live in the real world and not an idyllic one. <BR>I will definitely have my husband along. Also does it help to seem as if you are not completely "blown away" by the rug? If I seem to anxious they might stick to their price no?<BR>Thanks

topping<BR><BR>

To Anna,<BR>Regarding shopping for rugs, there was a pretty good thread on this a while back. You might want to do a search for it.<BR><BR>I think the general consensus is that if you know what you're doing, you may do reasonably well (that is, doing "better" than you might do here in the U.S.), but there really aren't the great bargains people expect. For the vast majority of us, with only some knowledge, you may find a rug that you love, only to find out later that its 1)no bargain or 2) not the quality you thought. But with some preparation, you can find/buy rugs that you'll be satisfied with-- and probably save some money, too. But don't expect it to be rock-bottom prices; the dealers are savvy and deal internationally, too. But definitely shop-- it's part of the experience, being courted with tea and viewing the rugs.....and hopefully, you'll find some you like, too!<BR><BR>And, as far as appearing to be "blown away" by a rug, I think you need to have in mind about how much the rug is worth to you, and how much you're willing to pay. Yes, I believe you need to be willing to walk away if something seems too high-- the original asking price is NOT what you want to pay! But again, it's important to know what it's worth to you, and not worry about whether or not you have a "bargain". It helps to do the research and go into several shops before buying, so you do have a good idea of price and the process.<BR><BR>We bought a kilim in Konya, and are very satisfied with our experience there. We found out how much to expect to pay, and we paid a FAIR price, not a bargain price. <BR><BR>

Hi again Anna -<BR><BR>I agree with Paule... there was a good thread on this sometime back but I'm not sure of the exact wording. I also agree with your retired attorney Father.<BR><BR>Before we went to Turkey I had seen a show on the Travel Channel (back when it was good!) about "negotiating protocol" in other countries. There was a segment on Turkey and part of what it said was that "if ones does not engage in a good negotiation one is not respected". Many people in the U.S. do not like to negotiate... my wife and I do! She has been a real estate broker for 22 years and I have been a general contractor building high end residential properties. We are quite used to negotiating ;&gt;)<BR><BR>I saw this on that show and used it... the Turkish fellow was virtually "blown away", and after he got over his shock at having this done to him by an American he said " Well, well my friend... you negotiate like a Turkish man!" The technique is this, and this is absolutely true! Once the seller had made his "best price" he stuck out his hand to "seal the deal"... just like I saw on the show I stuck out my hand, but instead of shaking his hand, I pushed it away with the back of my hand ... made him "my price"... and then stuck out my hand to shake! After a few more "back and forths" he said "not my price and not your price but x$$$$...." ... I agreed, we shook hands, and we both came away feeling good about the transaction!<BR><BR>Another thing is that after you have shopped and decided on the shop and maybe "THE" rug, try to come back the next day at opening time and be his first customer of the day. The first sale of the day is a culturally important thing in that part of the world or to people from that part of the world. I have used that all over the world... even in this country! I just try to find a shop that sells whatever I am looking for that is owned by an individual with that sort of cultural background! We bought Orrefors crystal in Stockholm last summer from a shop that was owned by a Pakistani gentleman... we got the same pieces for WAY less than the very best prices in stores that were owned by Swedes... just the differences in cultures and their affinity (or lack thereof) for negotiating.<BR><BR>Best wishes and "happy hunting"...<BR><BR>Barry

Thank you for your advise. Now I have learned something. I live in Texas and have gone to Mexico and learned how to negotiate. I think it is easier in Latin America than the more Eastern countries. I have to tell you about an experience I had on my honeymoon in France. My husband and I were in Paris and I decided to buy all of my crystal there. I wanted Saint-Louis. One day when my husband decided to take a nap I went to La Samaritaine (my favorite dept store). I had the 10 percent off card. I went up to the housewares area and it was a slow day. I walked up to the saleslady and told her I wanted to purchase all of my crystal. Twelve white, twelve red, 12 colored hocks, and a water pitcher. Her eyes got as big as a half dollar bill. She left for just a moment and brought out a really nicely dressed lady. The lady worked for Saint Louis and just happened to be in the store. Without my asking she gave me an extra 30 percent off since I was buying all of the crystal. I had priced everything at Neimans before I left. After all of the shipping and discounts I saved about 50 percent of what it would have cost in Dallas. I thought it was funny that they were willing to give a discount on crystal. Neimans, unless you are a top customer, never negotiates anything. Anyway that is my bargain of the century. Thanks for giving me the tips as I have now written them down in my travel notebook.

Don't cancel - I think it's very safe, and the beauty and history are too valuable to pass up.