Ingrid

I believe I have searched and analyzed every post on this forum regarding Italy and it's been very helpful. However, I am now in information overload! My husband and I and our 2 daughters (13 & 15) have 20 (maybe 21) days to visit Italy next July. We're pretty sure we want to start in Rome (about 5 nights) and we know we want to end in Venice (for about 3 nights). The in between is the difficult part. I like the idea of staying in towns such as Siena, San Gimingano and Florence, because it's nice to be able to stroll around before and after dinners and not have to drive to find places to eat or drive home afterward. However, the idea of finding a place in the countryside with a pool, and with perhaps biking and hiking available, is also very appealing (especially to our girls!) <BR> So... I've been thinking it might be good to blend the two experiences. With that in mind, your opinions please. <BR> <BR>5 days Rome (B&B Monte di Pieta?) <BR>2 days, 2 nights Siena (rent a car here for.. <BR>4 days - Agriturismo near Montepulciano-Pienza area (Palazzo Bandino w/pool) <BR>4 days in the San Giminagno area (Hotel Pescille? - 1 mile from S. Gimingano w/pool) <BR>2 nights in Florence (?) <BR>3(or 4) nights in Venice (Hotel Flora?) <BR> <BR>Is 5 days enough for Rome or should we shorten the Tuscany part of the trip and stay longer in Rome? <BR> <BR>Should I just stay in two places instead of 3 in the Tuscany area? If so, which is the better two, the Montepulciano-Pienza and the San Gimingano areas or the Montepulciano and the stay in Siena? <BR> <BR>To those of you who have stayed in Villas or Agriturismos, did you ever regret having to "go back out" after having returned home from a day of sightseeing? Or, did you plan your sightseeing day so that you ended with dinner on the way home? Did you ever feel you should have stayed in the town of Siena (or Florence) instead of just treating it as a day trip? <BR> <BR>It's such a problem trying to decide (but of course a very nice problem to have). <BR> <BR>I truly appreciate any comments, advice you can give. I am always amazed at the "combined" expertise avialable at this site! Thanks in advance for your help!

kitkat

My two daughters loved the Amalfi coast.

Beth

Ingrid, I think you have a great itinerary. My only thought would be to subtract a night off one of the Tuscany visits and add it on to Florence. We spent about 17 days in Italy, and only had 2 nights in Florence and it definiely wasn't enough. There is sooo much to see there. Your 5 nights in Rome and 3 nights in Venice sounds good to me. <BR> <BR>We spent a whole week in Tuscany in one place, renting an apartement in a small town. It was fun to walk around in evenings, and be able to walk to restaurants. But I would also have enjoyed the quiet of the countryside. Those towns are much more noisy then I realized. We had trouble sleeping at night because it was so hot we had to keep the windows open, and the noise from traffic, vespas, and talking was very loud. I would recommend finding a countryside agriturismo for at least part of the time.

Ingrid

Thank you both for your comments. Beth, which small town did you stay in? Did you like your apartment? Did you visit Siena? Do you think 2 nights in Siena is long enough? Do you think the areas I chose for staying in the country make sense? <BR> <BR>Thanks again for your help.

lisa

Basically this looks good to me but I do think you're moving around quite a bit. I often find it difficult to stay someplace for only 2 nights. Florence and Siena are not that far apart, and you are staying 2 nights in each -- personally I think you might want to condense these and choose one or the other and stay 4 nights (I would probably choose Florence and stay there 4 nights, but do a daytrip from Florence to Siena for one full day). Just a suggestion. Otherwise it looks great to me. 5 nights in Rome and 3 nights in Venice sound perfect. You're going to have a terrific time.

elaine

There's nothing "wrong" with your itinerary, but I agree with Lisa in that I'd try to eliminate one of the moves. <BR>Aside from wear and tear, every check out, travel period, and hotel check in takes up too much valuable time, so if you can eliminate one you'll be ahead of the game. I loved Siena and it deserves more than a day but perhaps you can take a day or two from the rest of the Tuscan stay. Unlike some people, I was not that impressed with San G. itself, although I'm glad I saw it and I could see that the area surrounding it is gorgeous. <BR>Unless you have absolutely no interest in art museums, Florence really deserves more than 2 days. And if you are planning to go to the Uffizi and the Accademia museums at least, order advance tickets. <BR>I have notes on Florence and Siena and on Venice; if you'd like to see them, email me.

Paulo

It looks like I'll have to divide this in little pieces to go through ... <BR> <BR>Though our daughters were a shade older than yours, the highlight of their trip was undoubtely Venice. Therefore, for starters, I would plan to guarantee a minimum of 3 full days there (one day to explore the sestieri of Dorsoduro and San Polo, another one for the sestieri of Castello and Cannaregio, a morning for Piazza San Marco monuments and an afternoon for a trip to the lagoon islands). If you have to leave Venice in the early morning (flight?) this would mean a 4-night stay in Venice. Among other more obvious sites/activities in Venice, the Museo Storico Navale in the <BR>Arsenale is a kid's favorite. <BR> <BR>Four FULL days in Rome (ALL spent in Rome, no side trips) were ok for us. Therefore, independently on the time you'll get there or leave, 5 nights seems perfect. In Rome we had planned to use one afternoon to go on an organized bus tour. Even though this would come out more expensive than doing it on our own, we stuck to it because all the strolling ends up tiring one after a couple of days or so. To spend time relaxing on an a/c bus is nice for a change. Once visiting a catacomb is a most for kids, we took the tour that included the Sta. Maria Maggiore and San Giovanni in Laterano basilicas, the Scala Santa and Battistero and one of the catacombs besides many monuments that are seen from the bus windows. The catacombs are quite distant from the historic center (the San Giovanni basilica is also oof the main axis) and going there on one's own steam is kind of awkward anyway. <BR>

Paulo

For the two of you, certainly Florence would deserve an extra night ... I don't think it would do much difference from the girls' perspective, though. It depends on how they'll behave visiting museums. We stayed 3 days and this was fine because our girls were "trained" to love museums ... appart from the Ufizzi, Accademia, Barghello (we didn't make it to Palazzo Pitti) and several churches, they loved the Palazzo Vecchio, the Boboli gardens (superb view), Piazzale Michelangelo (more views), climbing the campanille and shopping around in the San Lorenzo's open market. <BR> <BR>In summer, there are quite a few agriturismo properties that will resist dealing for less than a week. I don't know the ones you list. If you're able to deal as you're planning, I would prefer splitting my stay in 2 places rather than concentrating in a single one. IMO, one extra checking in/out, packing/unpacking operation outweights the larger driving distances that would be involved in staying in a single place. Also, kids do love some change in the setting after 3/4 days. IMO your choice of bases is perfect. In my experience, driving up to about 3 hours during a side trip is perfectly bearable (specially if you have a pool waiting for you in the late afternoon . From your southern base you may plan to visit Pienza, Montepulciano Monte Olivetto and Montalcino one day. Orvieto (Pozzo San Patrizio is a kid's must) and Todi could make another daytrip. Assisi (more than the basilica, kids love the narrow alleys and the dramaticity of the city hanging from the hill) and Perugia; and Cortona/Lake Trasimeno would be other options. From San Gimignano (another kids must), there are less side trip options. My girls didn't have much interest in touring the Chianti district. But they loved Pisa and Lucca, which I would say is almost a must. <BR>

Paulo

Finally, Siena is a kids town (at least my girls elected it their preferred Italian city after Venice - I must say that they sneaked out from the hotel one night and went on to explore Piazza del Campo and suroundings on their own . Two nights seem ok, specially considering that you won't arrive early (coming from Rome) and that you probably will leave early for your agriturismo <BR>adventure. <BR> <BR>Everything considered, therefore, MY family would probably spend nights in Rome (5), Siena (2), Pienza (4), San G. (2), Florence (3) and Venice (4), adding up to 20 ... The extra night you may have I would probably fit it in Rome, for a side trip either to Pompeii (very tiring), to the Tivoli Villas or to Ostia Antica. <BR> <BR>Paulo <BR> <BR>PS. IMO your girls are old enough to join the planning efforts ... I provided our girls with all info I could gather, and they were totally in charge (our guides in 3 cities each) in Siena, Pisa, Orvieto, Assisi and San G. (and Verona). As in a school term paper, they had to come up with a visiting itinerary in each city, monument description (including museums and churches) and the whole lot (well, I helped them a little when it came about eating out ...) Needless to say they were very interested in looking for an artwork they'd singled out in a museum/church and they got hooked in travel planning ever since! <BR>

Ed

Pretty good plans, really. <BR> <BR>Rome in four full days (5 nights) is 'doable'. You may feel a bit rushed, but hopefully you'll fall in love with the city and return for a more leisurely visit in the future. Make the most of your time and plan your sightseeing well ... www.twenj.com/romesights.htm will be a help to you. <BR> <BR>I concur with the Siena/Florence suggestions. Spend evenings in Florence, do Siena on a day trip ... that'll be adequate time for a first visit. This way you'll have two full days in Florence, a good amount for a first visit. <BR> <BR>Ed

sally

Ingrid: I'll just jump in here and muddy the waters a bit! We stayed at La <BR>Pescille outside San Gimignano and for what it's worth, even w/ having to drive out for dinner, etc., we LOVED it. The setting is wonderful w/ a view to San G. Was so nice to go into San G. at night when it was not so filled w/ <BR>tourists. and you could do day trips to Siena, etc. if you wished to cut down on changing locations in Tuscany. W/ the luxury of a pool you could come back, have a swim and/or nap, then go wherever for dinner by 8:00. Must mention they had a great breakfast; don't know if they serve any other meals; seems that perhaps they do, but were not when we were there (late fall).

Karen

Ingrid, <BR>I have enjoyed all the posts soncerning Ingrdd's itinerary. I just booked three weeks in the summer into London and out of Milan. We have three children 10,13 amd 15. We were in Tuscanny 3 years agon in a rented villa near Pisa we used as a base and did day trips as well as longer trips to Venice and Rome. We missed Siena and Lucca . Wheere did you find info on the Arigoturistmos (sp?) They sound wonderful. Karen

Ingrid

Aaahhh... you people haven't let me down! The thoroughness and quality of the replies thrill me. As they say in Hawaii... Mahalo! (Thank you) I just walked in to find all of these wonderful replies and want to comment on/answer them all... However, I need to take care of dinner (only 5:30pm here) and other housewifely type duties before I am able to put my travel planning hat back on. I will return! This is just TOO much fun! Aloha

Ingrid

Have tried to post this a couple of times but it hasn't worked - too long? Breaking it into two parts... <BR> <BR>Lisa & Elaine - Thank you. You both agree that Florence needs more than 2 days. I'll start working on that. I'm pretty sure I'll have 21 days and not 20, so I can add that extra day to Florence. Siena still seems to be the question... I agree that the checking in & out, packing & unpacking can be tiring and a waste of time, but so many people have said that Siena is great to stay in for 2-3 days and (like Paulo), that it's a great city for kids. Am leaning toward keeping a couple of days there. Elaine, I would love to see your notes and will email you when I finish firming up my itinerary. Thanks for the generous offer. <BR> <BR>Paulo -Wow! You should write a travel guide. Maybe one for family travel? You are so kind to take the time to write so much. All of it is very helpful. I agree that Venice is fantastic for kids. My family was there 2 summers ago and we loved it. That's one reason I didn't give it more time. However, after your post I'm reconsidering because you mentioned many things we didn't do! We'll actually be arriving in Venice mid-day, then leaving around 1pm (by train) to Milan. So, our three days there would actually be 2 full days, 2 half days and 3 full nights. Sounds as if everyone agrees that 5 days is enough for Rome (see my comments to Ed, below). Your suggestions for sightseeing and your itinerary for Tuscany are so much appreciated - especially since you also have children! THANK YOU. Right now, I'm pretty much leaning toward your suggested number of days and cities to visit. My "possible" extra day is almost a certainty, but won't be confirmed for a month or so. (My 17 year old son will be in Spain on a school exchange program while the rest of us visit Italy (boo-hoo), and we need to meet him in Madrid. As soon as his school confirms the day to meet him, we'll know when to end our stay in Italy!) Also... love your suggestion about getting the girls involved in the planning. Have tried before to get them involved, but usually with too little time before the trip. I'll get them started earlier this year! <BR>

Ingrid

<BR>Ed - we will arrive via an overnight train (from Paris) early on the 1st day of our stay in Rome, so we will actually have 5 full days and 5 nights. We've travelled by night train before and we sleep well so I think we should be able to make the most of that 1st day! From the research I've done on Rome, I think I could spend my whole trip there! Guess it'll give me an excuse to go back. <BR> <BR>Sally - Thank you for "muddying the waters." I have been so interested in the Hotel Pescille as the photos of it on the web look very nice, and there have been many positive comments about it on this site. Since you say breakfast is good, and going out in the evening wasn't a problem for you, I'm tempted to give it a try! My only hesitation is, when I contacted them via email to get information, rates, etc., I received a very terse (rude?)reply saying that they were not taking reservations for 2001. I wrote back saying I hadn't asked for reservations, only information and rates, and received just as terse a 2nd note, with no information except for the rates. There wasn't even a name. I've tried to reserve judgment, thinking it has a little to do with not speaking English well, but my gut feeling is that it was rude. Were the people there friendly? Who runs the Hotel? <BR> <BR>Karen - as for the Agriturismos... I began by searching the web for "Tuscany Agriturismos" or "Farms." After going nuts trying to sort through them all, I began searching this site for various ways, i.e., "Tuscany hotels," "Tuscany Agriturismos" "Tuscany B&B," (and the same using Pienza, Siena or San Gimingano, etc.) I made a list of all the names that came up, then searched the web for the hotel/farm name and voila! The information was boundless! Hotel Piscelle has had very good reviews. I have the names of several others if you need them, but it's senseless (I found out the hard way) to start looking at them until you have a good idea where you'd like to stay. Let me know if I can help. <BR> <BR>Once again... thank you all. You're great! I'll post again when I've digested and finalized my itinerary!

kimo

Enough planning...get back to making dinner