12 Days in Provence, a bit of Rhone and Cote d'Azur: Taking it Easy?
Aug 26th, 2009, 09:33 PM
#1
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
12 Days in Provence, a bit of Rhone and Cote d'Azur: Taking it Easy?
Hello,
We are traveling to England and France for our honeymoon in Oct/Nov. We've got 5 days booked in London, 7 days in Paris and then are headed southward in France. We are looking forward to all of the wonderful things we'll see and do in London and Paris, but we are really rural or small village/town folks at heart. We will be more than ready to settle into a more relaxed pace when we leave Paris.
On the forums we've received so much wonderful information from all of the knowledgeable posters. However, we would like to ask for itinerary recommendations (including specific smaller towns to lodge in or near) for something paced thus. . .
2 nights near Lyon and northern Rhone for wine and food
6 nights in Provence to very slowly explore the villages and sites
2-3 nights on the Cote d'Azur to catch what remains of the sun
We will be renting a car. Would it be wise to take a train to Lyon/Northern Rhone and pick up a car there, drive southward and keep the car in Provence and the drop it off when we arrive in a Cote d'Azur town that is connected to the train that will take us to Nice to fly out? On this leg, our overall aim is to relax, and enjoy Provencal food and wine. It's also important for us to make it to the Gorges du Verdon at some point.
Many thanks!
Julie
We are traveling to England and France for our honeymoon in Oct/Nov. We've got 5 days booked in London, 7 days in Paris and then are headed southward in France. We are looking forward to all of the wonderful things we'll see and do in London and Paris, but we are really rural or small village/town folks at heart. We will be more than ready to settle into a more relaxed pace when we leave Paris.
On the forums we've received so much wonderful information from all of the knowledgeable posters. However, we would like to ask for itinerary recommendations (including specific smaller towns to lodge in or near) for something paced thus. . .
2 nights near Lyon and northern Rhone for wine and food
6 nights in Provence to very slowly explore the villages and sites
2-3 nights on the Cote d'Azur to catch what remains of the sun
We will be renting a car. Would it be wise to take a train to Lyon/Northern Rhone and pick up a car there, drive southward and keep the car in Provence and the drop it off when we arrive in a Cote d'Azur town that is connected to the train that will take us to Nice to fly out? On this leg, our overall aim is to relax, and enjoy Provencal food and wine. It's also important for us to make it to the Gorges du Verdon at some point.
Many thanks!
Julie
Aug 27th, 2009, 12:25 AM
#2
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,422
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Were it me, I would keep the car and drive it to the Nice airport.
Since you are talking about November, you should consider staying in Nice itself (dropping off the car immediately) while on the Cote d'Azur -- or so close you can easily go there if you get significant rain. I live further south on the Riviera (in Italy) and the stretch of the Riviera between Nice and the Italian border can be drier than other spots along the coast, but you are still running a risk.
What time is your flight out? Were it me, I would be tempted to use the rental car to drive into Italy and stay there and eat before driving to Nice (one hour away) to fly out. My choices would be Dolceacqua for its wine as well as food.
Since you are talking about November, you should consider staying in Nice itself (dropping off the car immediately) while on the Cote d'Azur -- or so close you can easily go there if you get significant rain. I live further south on the Riviera (in Italy) and the stretch of the Riviera between Nice and the Italian border can be drier than other spots along the coast, but you are still running a risk.
What time is your flight out? Were it me, I would be tempted to use the rental car to drive into Italy and stay there and eat before driving to Nice (one hour away) to fly out. My choices would be Dolceacqua for its wine as well as food.
Aug 27th, 2009, 12:55 AM
#3
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,422
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aug 27th, 2009, 06:40 AM
#4
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Here is what I would do.
Take the TGV to Dijon in the AM & explore Dijon for the better part of a day. Rent a car at the train station.
Drive to beaune & stay there for several nights. Explore castles, wineries, small villages, etc.
drive to the Luberon in provence & stay at Kevin's B&B - Mas Perreal if it is open in Nov. He's an American & can help you with your exploration of Provence. http://www.masperreal.com/index.html
Drive to Nice & stay there. Dump the car. We like the Hotel Windsor.
Stu Dudley
Take the TGV to Dijon in the AM & explore Dijon for the better part of a day. Rent a car at the train station.
Drive to beaune & stay there for several nights. Explore castles, wineries, small villages, etc.
drive to the Luberon in provence & stay at Kevin's B&B - Mas Perreal if it is open in Nov. He's an American & can help you with your exploration of Provence. http://www.masperreal.com/index.html
Drive to Nice & stay there. Dump the car. We like the Hotel Windsor.
Stu Dudley
Aug 27th, 2009, 06:43 AM
#5
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,047
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Late October/early November can still be very pleasant on the Cote d'Azur. We had been swimming in the sea by end of October. Provence can be much colder, esp. when the icy mistral is blowing (the mistral season starts in October).
I would even skip a day or two in Provence and add it to the Cote d'Azur. The Cote is very beautiful, because flowers start blooming again in October.
The Cote d'Azur has several sections:
a) The section between Cassis (in the west) and Fréjus/St. Raphael (in the east) and with St. Tropez in the middle is the Cote des Maures which has rocky cliffs and sandy beaches. This section would be the first choice for a beach vacation whereas it is somewhat weak when it comes to art and culture. A good compromise would be St. Aygulf which has a gorgeous sandy beach but which has also good access to the autoroute which brings you in an hour or so to Nice, Cannes, Monace.
b) The section between St. Raphael and La Napoule is the Cote de l'Esterel. This is the most scenic part of the Cote, with gorgeous red cliffs. With the exception of Agay, which has a long sandy beach, the coast is rocky with some spectacular bays with large red pebbles. This coast is excellent for snorkeling.
c) The section between Cannes and Nice is heavily urbanized. Here, you find some extremely ugly beaches and architectural sins (Villeneuve-Loubet is the worst), but also some beautiful spots, especially at Cap d'Antibes. Juan-les-Pins has a wide sandy beach and also Antibes itsself which has also a charming old town. Cannes has a sandy beach and a row of hotels and apartment buildings along the beach. Nice has a rather ugly beach, consisting of grey pebbles, and is in fact a large city. However, this section boasts world-class art museums, galleries, posh yacht harbours, grand hotels, star-awarded restaurants and charming villages in the hinterland.
d) The section between Nice and Menton with Monaco in the middle is the stretch of the three Corniches. Driving the Moyenne and Grand Corniche with breathtaking views is the ultimate Cote d'Azur experience. Monaco is also an attractive destination with its palace, casino, grand hotels and oceanographic museum.
So, what you choose is a matter of personal preferences and travelling style.
We have never stayed in a hotel on the Cote d'Azur, but always rented a house, sometimes in the hinterland of Cannes (Mougins), sometimes right on the coast, with commanding views (Theoule-sur-Mer). If you do not want to change bases during your stay, then something between Theoule and Antibes would make the best base, because you can take daytrips in every direction from there (you must be close to the autoroute).
BTW, I strongly suggest renting the car on the Cote d'Azur. It is true that you can do a lot by train and bus, but the coastal highways offer unforgettable driving experiences.
I would even skip a day or two in Provence and add it to the Cote d'Azur. The Cote is very beautiful, because flowers start blooming again in October.
The Cote d'Azur has several sections:
a) The section between Cassis (in the west) and Fréjus/St. Raphael (in the east) and with St. Tropez in the middle is the Cote des Maures which has rocky cliffs and sandy beaches. This section would be the first choice for a beach vacation whereas it is somewhat weak when it comes to art and culture. A good compromise would be St. Aygulf which has a gorgeous sandy beach but which has also good access to the autoroute which brings you in an hour or so to Nice, Cannes, Monace.
b) The section between St. Raphael and La Napoule is the Cote de l'Esterel. This is the most scenic part of the Cote, with gorgeous red cliffs. With the exception of Agay, which has a long sandy beach, the coast is rocky with some spectacular bays with large red pebbles. This coast is excellent for snorkeling.
c) The section between Cannes and Nice is heavily urbanized. Here, you find some extremely ugly beaches and architectural sins (Villeneuve-Loubet is the worst), but also some beautiful spots, especially at Cap d'Antibes. Juan-les-Pins has a wide sandy beach and also Antibes itsself which has also a charming old town. Cannes has a sandy beach and a row of hotels and apartment buildings along the beach. Nice has a rather ugly beach, consisting of grey pebbles, and is in fact a large city. However, this section boasts world-class art museums, galleries, posh yacht harbours, grand hotels, star-awarded restaurants and charming villages in the hinterland.
d) The section between Nice and Menton with Monaco in the middle is the stretch of the three Corniches. Driving the Moyenne and Grand Corniche with breathtaking views is the ultimate Cote d'Azur experience. Monaco is also an attractive destination with its palace, casino, grand hotels and oceanographic museum.
So, what you choose is a matter of personal preferences and travelling style.
We have never stayed in a hotel on the Cote d'Azur, but always rented a house, sometimes in the hinterland of Cannes (Mougins), sometimes right on the coast, with commanding views (Theoule-sur-Mer). If you do not want to change bases during your stay, then something between Theoule and Antibes would make the best base, because you can take daytrips in every direction from there (you must be close to the autoroute).
BTW, I strongly suggest renting the car on the Cote d'Azur. It is true that you can do a lot by train and bus, but the coastal highways offer unforgettable driving experiences.
Aug 27th, 2009, 07:08 AM
#6
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,422
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't disagree with traveller1959's descriptions, but for people who are rural/small town people at heart, i'm not sure Monaco is an important or desirable addition to the tour itinerary. Likewise, driving the Corniche road probably is the ultimate Cote d'Azur experience (and there is nothing difficult about it) but it's not everybody idea of a way to relax. I don't thin it's such a big payoff (even though I recommend keeping your car for touring southern France, up until the time you leave).
Provence is one of the most tourist-amenable, tourist-accessible places in Europe. The trick will not be finding Americans who can tell you where to go, but to discover something for yourselves. It may have already been "discovered" before by others, but there is a difference in quality I think in exploring on your own and being guided.
A lot of the French coast, as traveller1959 describes, is really not rural or small town., although such places can be found (mainly by ignoring guides!) Nice is not rural or small town. Just convenient.
Provence is one of the most tourist-amenable, tourist-accessible places in Europe. The trick will not be finding Americans who can tell you where to go, but to discover something for yourselves. It may have already been "discovered" before by others, but there is a difference in quality I think in exploring on your own and being guided.
A lot of the French coast, as traveller1959 describes, is really not rural or small town., although such places can be found (mainly by ignoring guides!) Nice is not rural or small town. Just convenient.
Aug 27th, 2009, 10:34 PM
#7
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thank you all very much. It looks like we will do the following:
-TGV from Paris to Avignon; pick up the car
-Gordes for 4 nights exploring the Luberon, Avignon, Aix and perhaps a day trip up to Valence
-Quinson and the Gorges du Verdon for 3 nights
-Cote d'Azur for 4 nights (town to be determined) or cross into Italy
Any additional thoughts about these choices would be most welcome!
-TGV from Paris to Avignon; pick up the car
-Gordes for 4 nights exploring the Luberon, Avignon, Aix and perhaps a day trip up to Valence
-Quinson and the Gorges du Verdon for 3 nights
-Cote d'Azur for 4 nights (town to be determined) or cross into Italy
Any additional thoughts about these choices would be most welcome!
Aug 28th, 2009, 06:56 AM
#8
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 6,047
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Your itinerary sounds reasonable.
Be aware that Quinson is in the lower Gorges du Verdon and not in the spectacular Grand Canyon du Verdon. We have stayed several times at the Lac de St. Croix. The region is pretty forlorn. Moustiers Ste. Marie at the mouth of the Canyon is the most attractive town in the area (fayences, food, canoeing etc.).
Be aware that Quinson is in the lower Gorges du Verdon and not in the spectacular Grand Canyon du Verdon. We have stayed several times at the Lac de St. Croix. The region is pretty forlorn. Moustiers Ste. Marie at the mouth of the Canyon is the most attractive town in the area (fayences, food, canoeing etc.).
Aug 28th, 2009, 06:58 AM
#9
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Why Valence? We stayed near there for 2 weeks & thought it was a mediocre/un-attractive/un-interesting town.
I'm guessing that you'll wish you'de spent less time in the Gorges du Verdun - especially if the weather isn't great. I don't imagine you can raft/canoe down the Gorge that late in the year.. I thought the Gorges to Tarn (too far away from you), and the Ardeche Gorge (close to you) were much more interesting - plus the Aven d'Orgnac Cave (3 stars in Michelin - their highest rating) is at the Ardeche Gorge. If you've visited the Grand Canyon in the US - you'll really be underwhelmed with the Gorges du Verdun.
I think the French Riveria is much more interesting than the Italian Riveria - till you get past Genoa - which is a tedious & exhausting drive, IMO.
Stu Dudley
I'm guessing that you'll wish you'de spent less time in the Gorges du Verdun - especially if the weather isn't great. I don't imagine you can raft/canoe down the Gorge that late in the year.. I thought the Gorges to Tarn (too far away from you), and the Ardeche Gorge (close to you) were much more interesting - plus the Aven d'Orgnac Cave (3 stars in Michelin - their highest rating) is at the Ardeche Gorge. If you've visited the Grand Canyon in the US - you'll really be underwhelmed with the Gorges du Verdun.
I think the French Riveria is much more interesting than the Italian Riveria - till you get past Genoa - which is a tedious & exhausting drive, IMO.
Stu Dudley
Aug 28th, 2009, 07:17 AM
#10
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9,422
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
It's a very subjective call about people who prefer the much more orderly French Riviera to the Italian Riviera, but in terms of sheer interest and surprise, I think areas within a half hour of the border in Italy have a tremendous amount of unique charm, and have suffered far less standardized development and tourist tweaking.
You may prefer to stay on the French side, but you might at least want to try a lunch to see for yourself. For illustration, but here are some pictures of places within half an hour of the border, on the Italian side:
Apricale, half hour above San Remo:
http://www.liguriaproperties.com/public/apricale.jpg
Bordighera, just over the border on the sea:
http://www.globeholidays.net/Europe/...a_Giardini.htm
Bordighera, as painted by Monet, who painted quite a few paintings there
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Bordighera.jpg
Dolceacqua, 15 minutes above San Remo
http://www.carlotrabatti.org/?Pics_a...a_a_Dolceacqua
http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/med...dolceacqua.jpg
and others...
http://www.visitrivieradeifiori.it/D...aspx?tabid=979
And there is a lot of good food along the Italian coast in the hinterlands. The best guide and most precise wine guide is David Downie's Food and Wine of the Italian Rivieria, which covers in detail the area near the French border, wineries and olive oil producers featured.
You may prefer to stay on the French side, but you might at least want to try a lunch to see for yourself. For illustration, but here are some pictures of places within half an hour of the border, on the Italian side:
Apricale, half hour above San Remo:
http://www.liguriaproperties.com/public/apricale.jpg
Bordighera, just over the border on the sea:
http://www.globeholidays.net/Europe/...a_Giardini.htm
Bordighera, as painted by Monet, who painted quite a few paintings there
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...Bordighera.jpg
Dolceacqua, 15 minutes above San Remo
http://www.carlotrabatti.org/?Pics_a...a_a_Dolceacqua
http://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/med...dolceacqua.jpg
and others...
http://www.visitrivieradeifiori.it/D...aspx?tabid=979
And there is a lot of good food along the Italian coast in the hinterlands. The best guide and most precise wine guide is David Downie's Food and Wine of the Italian Rivieria, which covers in detail the area near the French border, wineries and olive oil producers featured.
Aug 29th, 2009, 12:33 AM
#11
Original Poster
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lovely, Zeppole. Thank you! You've certainly peaked our interest in the Italian Riviera. I think we'll be taking a drive or two across the border at least. We may even chose to stay on the Italian side. We have yet to decide. Many thanks for your post.
Aug 29th, 2009, 07:22 AM
#12
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 16,434
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
>>>We may even chose to stay on the Italian side<<
I certainly wouldn't. You've only received 1 person's opinion who preferred the Italian side west of Genoa - and he/she lives in that region. There have been lots of discussions on Fodors about visiting the Italian Rivera while staying in the French Riveria. Perhaps try to find these past posts, or start another thread like "day trips to the Italian Riveria from the French Riveria" or "I only have 2 days to spend near the French/Italian border near Nice. Sould I stay on the Italian side near San Remo or near Nice/Villefranche". Make sure that you mention that you'll be traveling in Oct/Nov, you'll be accessing this area from Provence, you only have 2-3 days to explore the region, you're departing from the Nice airport, and it's your honeymoon. If you are young & a first-timer to Europe, state that too .
Get more opinions.
Stu Dudley
I certainly wouldn't. You've only received 1 person's opinion who preferred the Italian side west of Genoa - and he/she lives in that region. There have been lots of discussions on Fodors about visiting the Italian Rivera while staying in the French Riveria. Perhaps try to find these past posts, or start another thread like "day trips to the Italian Riveria from the French Riveria" or "I only have 2 days to spend near the French/Italian border near Nice. Sould I stay on the Italian side near San Remo or near Nice/Villefranche". Make sure that you mention that you'll be traveling in Oct/Nov, you'll be accessing this area from Provence, you only have 2-3 days to explore the region, you're departing from the Nice airport, and it's your honeymoon. If you are young & a first-timer to Europe, state that too .
Get more opinions.
Stu Dudley
