TylerTraveler

Hey Fodorites, I'm in need of your vast knowledge again.

I'm kicking around an idea for a group of 2 or more for before Christmas to take a 12(ish) day trip. I kicked around a palm-tree Christmas but Europe is just calling to me way too strong.

After reading a bunch of your posts I've decided that doing a trip from Paris, to Swtizerland to Munich to Vienna would be a great idea. I kicked around the idea of spending a bit more time in France heading to the wine region (my potential travel buddies are wine nuts), but it sounds like December probably isn't the best time for a wine tour. Plus I'm sure we can find great wine in the locations I mentioned without heading to Bordeaux. Any of your knowledge on the wine issue is greatly appreciated.

Paris - easy, I've been there before, it sounds magical in Christmas. I assume this is a fairly cheap location to fly into Europe... I've always flown into Frankfurt or London.

Switzerland - I've been to Interlaken, Lucern, Zurich... none of which seemed particularly "Christmasy?" however I did go in the summer so I suppose it's a night and day difference. I want a couple nights in the alps at a nice warm fireplace eating fondue with a picture postcard view out my window. Is Interlaken or Grindlewald probably good bets? Any other ideas? Anyone who has been to Switzerland in December please let me know what your thoughts are!

Munich - Everyone says THIS is the place to go for Christmas markets. I've been here once, and it looks perfect because it's on the way to Vienna.

Vienna - I was only here for 5-6 hours once in the winter and from I could tell it was BEAUTIFUL with all the lights up etc.

Is there a good airport in-near Vienna? Because I'm hoping we can fly into Paris and out of Vienna to save time? Any thoughts on this? We want to fly in/out of Portland Oregon for this trip ideally.

Do you think we can do this in 12 days? I'm certainly sure it's possible. I did 26 countries in like 70 days of travel not long ago if you remember my earlier trip:

http://www.tylernofziger.com/message...wforum.php?f=9

Please let me know what you think! THANKS!!!!!!! =)

Musicteacher

Vienna's airport is Schwechat (VIE). You could easily book an open-jaw flight Portland-Paris and Vienna-Portland.

TylerTraveler

Good thinking, thanks for the tip! I'll have to look into that.

BTilke

Vienna's airport is pretty passenger friendly. And as a bonus to your wine loving friends, it has an excellent wine bar where you can try an extensive variety of Austrian wines (many of which are very good, surprisingly under-rated and certainly difficult to find in the U.S.).
Depending on the size of your group, you could arrange an easy afternoon outing from Vienna up to Retz, home to one of the largest wine cellars in Europe. They offer very nice guided tours. An attractive, if quiet, town that was the setting of an extremely popular Austrian tv series.

ira

Hi TT,

>...Paris, to Swtizerland to Munich to Vienna...<

A bit more traveling than I would do, but not unreasonable at all.

Check www.voyages-sncf.com for Paris to CH, and www.bahn.de for CH to Munich and Munich to Vienna.

You might find flying is better than training. See www.whichbudget.com

swandav2000

Hi TylerTraveler,

Well, Switzerland doesn't do Christmas the way Germany & Austria do. I spent Christmas 2004 in Gstaad and though I loved the scenery, there weren't any decorations or lights at all (well, a few fat Santas . . . ). I later found out that the Swiss consider Christmas a time of family & private time, not a time for public displays. So the mountain resorts probably won't have a lot going on in that way --

The main cities will put up holiday decorations & will have pre-Christmas markets -- Basel, Luzern, & Zurich.

But if you just want some snow & scenery, then yes Grindelwald or Wengen would suit perfectly. As would Gstaad or Chateau d'Oex.

Have fun!

s

TylerTraveler

Thanks for the Austria tips! They are greatly needed. I haven't traveled a lot in Austria... just Innsbruck and half a day in Vienna. The tips about wine in and around Vienna are GREATLY appreciated! Thanks! It's also good to hear that Vienna has a great airport.

You know, I hate to do it but Switzerland might be the first place to cut. I actually have heard that the Swiss consider it more of a quite family time now that you mention it. Perhaps to save on time we could cut that from the list, or maybe just do a night or two in the mountains just for the snow and mountain view.

Why can't I think of the name of that monestary or castle or whatever in France that you can only walk to when the tide is out. Somehow I missed that in my last trip and would like to go there sometime. Is December not the best time to do that probably? Maybe that would be better served in a later summer trip.

Thanks again guys! All your comments are greatly appreciated!

Underhill

The Christmas masket in Vienna was the largest and best of my trip--really like a big party, with stages for entertainment (we heard a man playing an alpenhorn) and plenty of glühwein for keeping warm. Lots of places to get food.

laurie_ann

Don't anyone start the debate about Rick Steves, but he had last year a DVD and companion book on Europe at Christmas. It was really quite lovely and might give you some further insight as to customs and celebrations for your trip.

cls2paris

Tyler- are you thinking of Mont St. Michel?

TylerTraveler

"Tyler- are you thinking of Mont St. Michel"

I was! Thank you! It looks far too out of the way for this trip. In fact, after further research it looks like we may be skipping Paris and doing an extra day or two in Switzerland or Germany. That will shorten the distance we have to travel as well.

I figure we will save France for the summer when we can really do the wine region justice.

ALSO, I just heard a rumor that if you REALLY want to see the BEST Christmas market in the entire world you need to go to head to Nuremberg. Or that's what some travel brochure said. Also Rick Steves claims that that's the best place to go in Germany at least... a more modest claim.

SO... let's say my itenerary includes:

Nuremberg, Munich, Vienna and (random alpine Swiss town... Gimmelwald?), in what order would you do that? I could get a 5 day, 3 country rail pass pretty cheaply. Would you still want to fly open jaw? Or just burn a half day taking a train back to your starting airport? Which would be the best place to fly in to?

And thanks for the tip laurie_ann, I just ran out and got the Rick Steves Christmas book. While not chalk full of info it definitely helps! Thank you!

TylerTraveler

I'm wondering if we could add Strasbourg in there as well... A little French twist to the trip would be great... And it sounds like that's one of the cities in France that actually deserves a Christmasy reputation

cls2paris

You might find this site helpful for the Christmas Markets. I'd love to go to them, it looks so fun!

http://www.germany-tourism.de/

Then go to Culture & Events and you'll find the Christmas markets.

Underhill

I was at the Christmas market in Nuremberg but think Vienna's is better.

TylerTraveler

No one has mentioned anything about Munich's Christmas Market... Perhaps I should skip that (I've already been to Munich and can't see the beer hall atmosphere as being very Christmasy) and just do Nuremberg instead? And I'm still trying to decide between Interlaken, Grindelwald and Gimmelwald.

Man flights into and out of central Europe are more spendy than flights into England... who would have thought it? haha

I'm thinking December 10th - 22nd maybe... do a 12 days of Christmas Tour =)