11 days in France, 7 in Italy, where should we go??
Mar 25th, 2023, 12:53 PM
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11 days in France, 7 in Italy, where should we go??
After receiving some helpful feedback on this forum I am going back to the drawing board and asking for a suggested itinerary! We are travelling to Europe from Australia in September with our 4 and 7 year old daughters (our first time in Europe and the girls first time overseas!). We will begin our stay in London and then plan to catch the train to Paris. We will have 11 days to spend in France and 7 days fro Italy (excluding travel days of arrival and departure as I know these will be written off with logistics and travel). As the girls are quite young we would prefer not to move around too much and are looking for picturesque towns/cities to stay in that will allow us to indulge in the beauty that these countries have to offer while also doing some exploring. We are trying to avoid hiring a car to keep costs low (though could hire one for a day or two here and there to do sight seeing if recommended). Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
Mar 25th, 2023, 03:14 PM
#2
What might be a good destination in Italy depends a bit on where you end in France and where in Italy it's easiest/best to fly home from. I doubt you want to make a long, convoluted and/or costly trek from abc, France, to xyz, Italy, and then need to traverse half of Italy to catch a flight home.
What are your primary interests in Italy? What thing or destination would be at the top of your list?
What are your primary interests in Italy? What thing or destination would be at the top of your list?
Mar 25th, 2023, 09:04 PM
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Thanks so much for the helpful responses! At the moment we’re leaning towards heading down to Antibes from Paris and then onto Florence (with the idea of flying in to Rome from Nice and catching the train on to Florence). We could do a night in Rome perhaps and then catch the train to Florence the next morning to lessen the traveling that day. Or perhaps several nights in Rome and then a few nights in Florence before heading home…we were hoping to base in Antibes and Florence and do a mixture of day trips and quiet days exploring the local area with the girls on foot. Some people have perhaps suggested Antibes and Florence are not ideal destinations for these purposes, however, so that’s why I’m rethinking…
Mar 26th, 2023, 02:59 AM
#7
Nothing against Rome, but I went to Italy around 7 times before I went to Rome, I see it as just less interesting than the northern Florence, Venice, Tuscany, Milan, Turin bit and then again the Sicily, Puglia, Marche bit. On the other hand if you are Catholic then going to Rome makes complete sense, that is not to denegrate the art and stuff you can see in Rome, but flying Nice to Rome to get to Florence is not a good reason to fly to Rome. There is a 5hr bus Nice to Florence for example using Flixbus.
Worth looking at rome2rio website to get the basics, but don't trust the links, click though to get details.
You could do it by train, where you can walk about, take a picnic, talk to people but the whole thing takes 7 hours which would be boring me. I then checked where it stopped and Genoa and Pisa were along the route, both of which are fascinating cities
Worth looking at rome2rio website to get the basics, but don't trust the links, click though to get details.
You could do it by train, where you can walk about, take a picnic, talk to people but the whole thing takes 7 hours which would be boring me. I then checked where it stopped and Genoa and Pisa were along the route, both of which are fascinating cities
Last edited by bilboburgler; Mar 26th, 2023 at 03:04 AM.
Mar 26th, 2023, 07:29 AM
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On the other hand if you are Catholic then going to Rome makes complete sense
Mar 26th, 2023, 08:07 AM
#9
IMO Rome is one of the greatest cities in the history of the world. I guess if you have no interest in history, you'd have a better time somewhere else.
Antibes to Florence is what I would call a long, convoluted trek. Possibly costly when you multiply the fares x4. There are flights from Nice to Florence Peretola, but all involve a connection and the fares aren't cheap (although you can compare to the overall cost of flying to Rome, then training to Florence). And don't forget the train fare to get back to Rome for the flight home.
A traveling couple can easily make the multiple transfers, but a family that includes kids who will need attention and assistance throughout the journey will likely find this a very trying day. I understand you want to go to Antibes and you want to go to Florence, but I suggest you look into the logistics and cost involved.
Antibes to Florence is what I would call a long, convoluted trek. Possibly costly when you multiply the fares x4. There are flights from Nice to Florence Peretola, but all involve a connection and the fares aren't cheap (although you can compare to the overall cost of flying to Rome, then training to Florence). And don't forget the train fare to get back to Rome for the flight home.
A traveling couple can easily make the multiple transfers, but a family that includes kids who will need attention and assistance throughout the journey will likely find this a very trying day. I understand you want to go to Antibes and you want to go to Florence, but I suggest you look into the logistics and cost involved.
Mar 27th, 2023, 06:14 PM
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Thanks so much for the helpful input! I am happy to choose a different destination in both Italy and France that would be logistically more manageable and cost effective, I’m just not sure what would work…I’m hoping to stay in a French town that’s not too much of a big city and that would allow us easy access to Florence or perhaps a different Italian destination (a smaller city/town perhaps?) that will allow us to access places by train. As it is our first time in Europe I may be making some planning errors and am very happy to be guided by those more experienced and greatly appreciate the advice. Would anyone have a French and Italian city we could stay in and move from one to the other with relative ease (though we do anticipate a day of travel). We need to fly home from Rome. Thanks again!
Mar 27th, 2023, 08:35 PM
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I do agree that Paris to Antibes to Florence to Rome would be convoluted, whether you fly or take the train. You must have some very specific reasons for why you want to go to Antibes. And to go to Florence, for that matter. I am biased, because I primarily view Florence as a city for great art, which most 4- and 7-year-old are not so interested in.
If you are willing to reconsider Antibes and Florence, then I would suggest some time in Paris, then taking the short train ride to the Loire Valley. You could stay in Amboise or a similar town, and take a tour or rent a car for a day or two to visit chateaux. Many kids like to visit castles, and they will be able to spend time running around outside, and experience the French countryside.
Then you could return to Paris, and fly from there to Rome. I think there's more than enough to do in Rome to keep anyone busy (I'm one of those people who love Rome), but you could take a train from there to a smaller city for a portion of your time. Orvieto, for example, which doesn't necessarily have a lot that I can think of for kids, but I think they'll like running around the piazzas, while the grownups have a drink.
Even though you have a good amount of time for your journeys, think through moving from place to place with children. For example, on the day you train from Point A to Point B, this is what it would look like: wake up, breakfast, parents pack bags. Hopefully all of your stuff fits into two rolling bags, and each of you has a backpack (including the kids), plus a secure place for your wallets, passports, etc. that's not on your backs (and everyone will have to wear their coats, etc.). Get to the train station (cab? metro/tube? walk?). Each parent will be pulling a bag and have a kid by the hand. Possibly take everyone to the bathroom, buy snacks, a drink. Find your platform, wait for the train to arrive. Depending on the country, you may have to validate your ticket before you get on the train. Find your train, walk to it with bags and kids. Climb on board, one parents takes kids to your seats, the other finds a place to stow the rolling bags. Once in your new city, repeat the process in reverse, finding either the taxi stand or the public transportation. Again, each parent with a rolling bag and kid in hand. Doesn't sound too difficult, but each change of location will take about half a day, and every connecting plane or train means you repeat this again. You all have the right to be able to enjoy your trip, and not spend entire days getting from place to place, or being stressed when you move to your new location.
If you are willing to reconsider Antibes and Florence, then I would suggest some time in Paris, then taking the short train ride to the Loire Valley. You could stay in Amboise or a similar town, and take a tour or rent a car for a day or two to visit chateaux. Many kids like to visit castles, and they will be able to spend time running around outside, and experience the French countryside.
Then you could return to Paris, and fly from there to Rome. I think there's more than enough to do in Rome to keep anyone busy (I'm one of those people who love Rome), but you could take a train from there to a smaller city for a portion of your time. Orvieto, for example, which doesn't necessarily have a lot that I can think of for kids, but I think they'll like running around the piazzas, while the grownups have a drink.
Even though you have a good amount of time for your journeys, think through moving from place to place with children. For example, on the day you train from Point A to Point B, this is what it would look like: wake up, breakfast, parents pack bags. Hopefully all of your stuff fits into two rolling bags, and each of you has a backpack (including the kids), plus a secure place for your wallets, passports, etc. that's not on your backs (and everyone will have to wear their coats, etc.). Get to the train station (cab? metro/tube? walk?). Each parent will be pulling a bag and have a kid by the hand. Possibly take everyone to the bathroom, buy snacks, a drink. Find your platform, wait for the train to arrive. Depending on the country, you may have to validate your ticket before you get on the train. Find your train, walk to it with bags and kids. Climb on board, one parents takes kids to your seats, the other finds a place to stow the rolling bags. Once in your new city, repeat the process in reverse, finding either the taxi stand or the public transportation. Again, each parent with a rolling bag and kid in hand. Doesn't sound too difficult, but each change of location will take about half a day, and every connecting plane or train means you repeat this again. You all have the right to be able to enjoy your trip, and not spend entire days getting from place to place, or being stressed when you move to your new location.
Mar 27th, 2023, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Lexma90
I do agree that Paris to Antibes to Florence to Rome would be convoluted, whether you fly or take the train. You must have some very specific reasons for why you want to go to Antibes. And to go to Florence, for that matter. I am biased, because I primarily view Florence as a city for great art, which most 4- and 7-year-old are not so interested in.
If you are willing to reconsider Antibes and Florence, then I would suggest some time in Paris, then taking the short train ride to the Loire Valley. You could stay in Amboise or a similar town, and take a tour or rent a car for a day or two to visit chateaux. Many kids like to visit castles, and they will be able to spend time running around outside, and experience the French countryside.
Then you could return to Paris, and fly from there to Rome. I think there's more than enough to do in Rome to keep anyone busy (I'm one of those people who love Rome), but you could take a train from there to a smaller city for a portion of your time. Orvieto, for example, which doesn't necessarily have a lot that I can think of for kids, but I think they'll like running around the piazzas, while the grownups have a drink.
Even though you have a good amount of time for your journeys, think through moving from place to place with children. For example, on the day you train from Point A to Point B, this is what it would look like: wake up, breakfast, parents pack bags. Hopefully all of your stuff fits into two rolling bags, and each of you has a backpack (including the kids), plus a secure place for your wallets, passports, etc. that's not on your backs (and everyone will have to wear their coats, etc.). Get to the train station (cab? metro/tube? walk?). Each parent will be pulling a bag and have a kid by the hand. Possibly take everyone to the bathroom, buy snacks, a drink. Find your platform, wait for the train to arrive. Depending on the country, you may have to validate your ticket before you get on the train. Find your train, walk to it with bags and kids. Climb on board, one parents takes kids to your seats, the other finds a place to stow the rolling bags. Once in your new city, repeat the process in reverse, finding either the taxi stand or the public transportation. Again, each parent with a rolling bag and kid in hand. Doesn't sound too difficult, but each change of location will take about half a day, and every connecting plane or train means you repeat this again. You all have the right to be able to enjoy your trip, and not spend entire days getting from place to place, or being stressed when you move to your new location.
If you are willing to reconsider Antibes and Florence, then I would suggest some time in Paris, then taking the short train ride to the Loire Valley. You could stay in Amboise or a similar town, and take a tour or rent a car for a day or two to visit chateaux. Many kids like to visit castles, and they will be able to spend time running around outside, and experience the French countryside.
Then you could return to Paris, and fly from there to Rome. I think there's more than enough to do in Rome to keep anyone busy (I'm one of those people who love Rome), but you could take a train from there to a smaller city for a portion of your time. Orvieto, for example, which doesn't necessarily have a lot that I can think of for kids, but I think they'll like running around the piazzas, while the grownups have a drink.
Even though you have a good amount of time for your journeys, think through moving from place to place with children. For example, on the day you train from Point A to Point B, this is what it would look like: wake up, breakfast, parents pack bags. Hopefully all of your stuff fits into two rolling bags, and each of you has a backpack (including the kids), plus a secure place for your wallets, passports, etc. that's not on your backs (and everyone will have to wear their coats, etc.). Get to the train station (cab? metro/tube? walk?). Each parent will be pulling a bag and have a kid by the hand. Possibly take everyone to the bathroom, buy snacks, a drink. Find your platform, wait for the train to arrive. Depending on the country, you may have to validate your ticket before you get on the train. Find your train, walk to it with bags and kids. Climb on board, one parents takes kids to your seats, the other finds a place to stow the rolling bags. Once in your new city, repeat the process in reverse, finding either the taxi stand or the public transportation. Again, each parent with a rolling bag and kid in hand. Doesn't sound too difficult, but each change of location will take about half a day, and every connecting plane or train means you repeat this again. You all have the right to be able to enjoy your trip, and not spend entire days getting from place to place, or being stressed when you move to your new location.
Mar 27th, 2023, 11:56 PM
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If you want Florence don't fixated on the Florence airport. Look at Pisa,Rome or even the more northern airports. Florence airport isn't that big. Or that well served.
Pisa is an easy one hour train ride to Florence. Rome is ninety minutes.
Pisa is an easy one hour train ride to Florence. Rome is ninety minutes.
Mar 28th, 2023, 07:23 AM
#14
You can fly non-stop Paris-Florence. You can fly non-stop Nice-Rome. You can't fly non-stop Nice-Florence. Flights/connections Nice to Pisa, to Milan, to Turin are all worse. It sounds like you must end in Rome for your flight home. (BTW, you can fly non-stop Nice-Venice.)
You can take Lexma90's suggestion of sticking close to Paris before Italy to give you better flight options. There are a few direct trains from FCO to Florence, and you might get lucky with your timing. The direct trains don't save any real time, but they eliminate the train connection at Termini. (Not to be underestimated in a long day with kids.) However, I'd be reluctant to buy discount train tickets in advance in case the flight arrives late. Full fares... ugh. And these would be on top of all of your other transport costs for that day. Getting to/from Paris airport, air fares + luggage fees (and size/weight limits), train fares, taxi to Florence hotel.
I'd consider spending the week in Rome. Perhaps in an apartment. There are some easy, inexpensive day trips possible by train and/or bus. Frascati, Castel Gandolfo (Pope's summer home/gardens/lake), Tivoli, Ostia Antica... The train fare to Orvieto is a bit higher, but it's a lovely destination. A day trip to Florence would be more affordable because you could safely purchase discount train tickets in advance.
If you decide to fly to Rome and stay in Florence, don't spend the arrival night in Rome. Push on to Florence and put your Rome days at the end. One less hotel change.
You can take Lexma90's suggestion of sticking close to Paris before Italy to give you better flight options. There are a few direct trains from FCO to Florence, and you might get lucky with your timing. The direct trains don't save any real time, but they eliminate the train connection at Termini. (Not to be underestimated in a long day with kids.) However, I'd be reluctant to buy discount train tickets in advance in case the flight arrives late. Full fares... ugh. And these would be on top of all of your other transport costs for that day. Getting to/from Paris airport, air fares + luggage fees (and size/weight limits), train fares, taxi to Florence hotel.
I'd consider spending the week in Rome. Perhaps in an apartment. There are some easy, inexpensive day trips possible by train and/or bus. Frascati, Castel Gandolfo (Pope's summer home/gardens/lake), Tivoli, Ostia Antica... The train fare to Orvieto is a bit higher, but it's a lovely destination. A day trip to Florence would be more affordable because you could safely purchase discount train tickets in advance.
If you decide to fly to Rome and stay in Florence, don't spend the arrival night in Rome. Push on to Florence and put your Rome days at the end. One less hotel change.
Mar 28th, 2023, 11:22 AM
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OK, I'm thinking of children .
Fly into Venice: Your children should enjoy the idea of everything by water. Glass blowing on Murano
Train to Pisa: Climb the Leaning Tower! Easy train to Florence, Cinque Terre.
Train to Comogli: See the giant frying pan.
Train to Nice: This could be broken up with a stop in Genoa (big port). or Ventimiglia (big sales). Riviera towns easy to visit.
TGV from Nice to Paris visit and home. We took day tour to 3 chateaux, train to Versailles.
(You could reverse the order, but international flights from Venice leave very early.)
Fly into Venice: Your children should enjoy the idea of everything by water. Glass blowing on Murano
Train to Pisa: Climb the Leaning Tower! Easy train to Florence, Cinque Terre.
Train to Comogli: See the giant frying pan.
Train to Nice: This could be broken up with a stop in Genoa (big port). or Ventimiglia (big sales). Riviera towns easy to visit.
TGV from Nice to Paris visit and home. We took day tour to 3 chateaux, train to Versailles.
(You could reverse the order, but international flights from Venice leave very early.)
Mar 28th, 2023, 03:03 PM
#17
The kids are too young to climb the Leaning Tower....
The family needs to end in Rome for the flight home to Australia.
I like the idea of Venice, though. If you have no interest in spending time in Rome, you could fly Nice (or Paris) to Venice and spend 3-4 nights there, then train to Florence (or a smaller town) for 3-4 nights, and sleep the last night in Rome. If you want that smaller town experience, you could substitute Ferrara for Florence. Or, if you want an opportunity to see a bit of Florence, stay in slightly smaller Prato for its cheap (2,70 euroes) and quick (25 minutes) train access to Florence, and you could also easily train from there to Lucca (7,30 euros, one hour) or Montecatini Terme (4,80 euros, 30 minutes). If the budget allowed, this is when you might want a car for a couple of days or take a guided bus tour from Florence to Siena and San Gimignano. If the tour is too pricey, you can take the public bus from Florence to Siena.
The family needs to end in Rome for the flight home to Australia.
I like the idea of Venice, though. If you have no interest in spending time in Rome, you could fly Nice (or Paris) to Venice and spend 3-4 nights there, then train to Florence (or a smaller town) for 3-4 nights, and sleep the last night in Rome. If you want that smaller town experience, you could substitute Ferrara for Florence. Or, if you want an opportunity to see a bit of Florence, stay in slightly smaller Prato for its cheap (2,70 euroes) and quick (25 minutes) train access to Florence, and you could also easily train from there to Lucca (7,30 euros, one hour) or Montecatini Terme (4,80 euros, 30 minutes). If the budget allowed, this is when you might want a car for a couple of days or take a guided bus tour from Florence to Siena and San Gimignano. If the tour is too pricey, you can take the public bus from Florence to Siena.
Mar 29th, 2023, 05:46 AM
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Sorry, I missed that you had to be in Rome for your return trip, jspark. You could reverse my trip suggestion and take a train from Venice to Rome....about 4 hours. Back to my drawing board!
"The kids are too young to climb the Leaning Tower...."<<<<< Is there an age minimum, Jean? I, with asthma and a sprained ankle, was able to do it and didn't find it to be too strenuous.
edited to add there IS a minimum age of 8 for the leaning tower. Rats.
"The kids are too young to climb the Leaning Tower...."<<<<< Is there an age minimum, Jean? I, with asthma and a sprained ankle, was able to do it and didn't find it to be too strenuous.
edited to add there IS a minimum age of 8 for the leaning tower. Rats.
Last edited by TDudette; Mar 29th, 2023 at 05:53 AM.
Mar 29th, 2023, 06:04 AM
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"We will begin our stay in London and then plan to catch the train to Paris." I went back to see what you wrote about Rome and see I missed London. Back to reading class as well. Please share what you end up doing.
Mar 29th, 2023, 07:51 AM
#20
TDudette, the Leaning Tower's age limit is a funny story in my family. In 1963, my mom and we 3 kids spent the summer driving around Europe. My sister was not yet 6 and was allowed to climb the Tower. (I guess lawyers hadn't been invented yet.) There were no railings, just a simple rope between the columns, and my mother says she was absolutely terrified that my sister was going to slide right off the Tower from the downward slant of the walkway.
