spedteacher

Mom and 18 year old will be together for one week in Switzerland for the tail end of a family trip (sending dad home early!). He wants to see the Matterhorn and do some hiking in the Alps.
I think I might have a plan but I need to see if it is reasonable or…I should be "talked off the cliff" and not do so much.

Day 1-travel from Milan to Zermatt. (Glacier Express or regular SBB train?)
Day 2-travel to Murren/Wengen/Grimmelwald. I need to figure out where to stay-any ideas? Probably stay there 3-4 nights.
Day 5-to to Bern for a day
Day 6-7-Luzern and then Zurich airport-home.
My questions are-are we biting off too much?
4 nights too much in Murren/Wengen/Grimmelwald? We are not big shoppers and don't need the lure of stores to convince us to stay somewhere!
Good hikes to do there-hikes to avoid?
Our hotel needs are not too fancy-very basic or B & B are just fine.
Ideas on where to stay in Luzern?
I will probably buy the half fare ticket-as is will help save $.
I was hoping to avoid the Matterhorn but the 18 year old wants to see it…so we will put it on the list.
Thanks for any help/advice/re-routing

PalenQ

Before buying the Half-Fare Ticket investigate the Swiss Saver Pass - an 8-consecutive-day pass may be more cost-effective for your fairly wide-ranging travels plus you never need to wait in line to buy tickets - just hop on any train, lake boat, bus - if staying in Murren or Gimmelwald or Wengen the Swiss Pass covers transportation in full to those places.

And every time I have a pass I end up using it more than i though - on a nice afternoon just hopping a lake boat in Interlaken for a relaxed float - so ad up the costs and if the Half-Fare Card is not all that much more opt for the totally flexible pass - Half-Fare Tickets are great for someone going to one place and staying put - who knows exactly what trains, etc they will be taking.

And again if basing in any of those three remote mountain villages you will probably be going out each day -and if poor weather sets in in the mountains you can go to a nearby city like Bern - nicer in wet weather than hiking in the Alps - point is you may use the pass in ways not imagined.

And also the Swiss Card provides everything the Half Fare Ticket and could be cheaper overall.

For lots of great info on Swiss trains check out these IMO fantastic sites: www.swisstravelsystem.com; www.budgeteuropetravel.com and www.ricksteves.com.

Lake Lucerne to me is the nicest of all Swiss lakes - be sure to do a boat trip on it - like to Mt Rigi - and take a mountain train or aerial cable way to the summit for raved about views zillions of miles around - again Swiss Pass would cover the boat and train up top in full.

Ingo

For Milan to Zermatt take the regular trains via Simplon tunnel - scenic along Lake Maggiore and from Brig up to Zermatt - the latter is the same route as the Glacier Express. Check www.sbb.ch for schedules.

Staying only one night in Zermatt doesn't really make sense. The Matterhorn might be not visible due to clouds/fog. You will certainly want to do one (longer or shorter) hike in the mountains around Zermatt (Findeln, Riffelsee, Gornergrat cog-train involved) and you need a full day for that. Stay two nights, better chances to see the Matterhorn then.

I suggest you stay in Wengen - Mürren is maybe too quiet for your 18 year old (and yourself), and Grindelwald is too busy with tour/bus groups (btw, what time of year are you travelling?). I also like Wengen's location the best - afternoon sun, spectacular setting on a terrace overlooking Lauterbrunnen valley and Mt. Jungfrau/glaciers.

Hikes to do in that area:
1) Wengen - cable car to Männlichen - hike to Kleine Scheidegg - either cog-train up to Jungfraujoch (expensive) or hiking down to Wengen
2) Grindelwald - gondola to First - hike to Lake Bachalpsee (maybe continue to Mt. Faulhorn and back) - hike to Grosse Scheidegg - bus back to Grindelwald
3) Lauterbrunnen - gondola to Grütschalp - hike to Allmendhubel - hike to Mürren - cable car up to Mt. Schilthorn and back down all the way to Stechelberg - bus to Trümmelbach waterfalls, visit the falls, bus back to Lauterbrunnen

So, four nights are perfect. I'd say add another night and do the day trip to Bern from Wengen.

Stay the last two nights in Luzern and head to the airport from there. Lots to see and do in and around Luzern.

dulciusexasperis

First, I would not stay in Zermatt but in Tasch instead.

Second, I would not suggest that much moving in 7 days. In reality, you only have 5 days. Day one is spent getting there and day 7 you leave.

If seeing the Matterhorn is a must, then as noted you have to realize that it can be hidden in clouds on any given day and that includes several days in a row.

I would not suggest staying in more than 2 places given your limited time. Tasch and Wengen for example. You can do a day trip from Wengen to Bern or Lucerne if you want a shopping day.

PalenQ

Why stay in remote Tasch where folks have to abandon their cars and take the shuttle train into Zermatt - why is Tasch better - I'm asking because I do not know - went thru Tasch on the train before Zermatt and save little there - is its rustic rural nature that attracts you?

Curious.

neckervd

Do you want to go from MXP airport to Zermatt or from Milan to Zermatt? The itineraries wouldn't be the same.
There is no Glacier Express train between Milan and Zermatt.
As mentioned above, it doesn't make any sense to go to Zermatt if you don't want to stay there (at least 1 full day).
There are well signmarked scenic hiking trails all over Switzerland, around Zermatt too. The longest glaciers and the highest mountains (and cableway stations)of Switzerland are around Zermatt.

quokka

You squeeze far too much in too little time. Your son's heart is set on seeing the Matterhorn but what if the weather does not cooperate? If the sky is overcast there is a fair chance you won't see a bit of it. No one can guarantee you clear weather in one particular afternoon and one particular morning. Chances for clear conditions are far below the 50% mark. Stay in Zermatt instead of Berner Oberland for a couple of days, do some hiking there.

spedteacher

Oh..the Matterhorn. I must have unrealistic expectations because when I visited it in high school (35 years ago)it showed up the day I was there-doesn't it do that for everyone?
Our trip would be in Mid-July-after having spent 3 weeks in Italy and Corfu, Greece. We are not necessarily going to be at the airport in Milan-we are flying in from Greece on Friday and thought we would visit the Last Supper (haha-no tickets there so maybe not) in Milan. Now, I am changing my mind and maybe we will do a lake closer to Switzerland, send my husband back to the airport (he flies home on Sunday) and we would continue on from there. We really have 8 days-7 days to tour and day 8 we fly out of Zurich. I will research the Swiss Saver pass-I hadn't thought about how it would help us save $ on Mt Pilatus, places out of Luzern, and just the urge to hop off and on of trains/buses. I also like the idea of the local trains instead of the fancy pants Glacier Express and Bernina Express-I always like to "buy local".
Any suggestions of places to stay in Wengen?

dulciusexasperis

PalenQ, I prefer Tasch simply because Zermatt is too crowded for my taste. Also because I can drive right to the hotel parking lot. But if using the train, it is 12 minutes by train to Zermatt and the trains run every 20 minutes. So I would still prefer it over staying in Zermatt itself.

Spedteacher, your expectations are indeed unrealistic. You could spend your entire week in Zermatt and never see the top of the Matterhorn. There is no way to predict that. The longer you stay in the area the better your chances. When people plan on one overnight with the expectation of seeing it with no clouds they may well leave disappointed.

PalenQ

Oh..the Matterhorn. I must have unrealistic expectations because when I visited it in high school (35 years ago)it showed up the day I was there-doesn't it do that for everyone? >

No - many folks have found it in fog, clouds or rain - rain can set in anytime anywhere in the high Alps for long stretches or it could be crsytal clear for days as well.

My experience says that if the Matterhorn is out in the morning and you want to ascend it hop on the first train - I've seen it suddenly disappear (and also suddenly appear).

simpsonc510

Try to include the Transport Museum in Lucerne in your visit. I think your son (you as well) would really enjoy it. I would spend part of my time in the mountains and then a couple of nights in Lucerne, if it were my trip.

And yes, getting to the airport from Lucerne to Zurich is very easy to do, unless you have a very early flight, in which case you may want to stay near Zurich airport your last night.

Look at the Hotel de la Paix or the Ambassador in Lucerne. Both are basic, clean, well located, and less expensive than many hotels in the city.

spedteacher

I think my son would be happy to see the Matterhorn but not heartbroken if he missed it because it didn't show up. Living in Seattle we are used to "The Mountain" (Rainier) showing up and disappearing in a matter of seconds.
Simpson-the Transport Museum is one of 2 museums that he would be interested in-the other being the one in Bern where there is a big Einstein display.
Upon researching the Swiss Saver train pass we may not do Mt Pilatus but rather Mt Rigi because that would be included in the Swiss Saver train pass. This means I need to find a toboggan/luge run somewhere so I can check off the only thing in Switzerland that I need to do-since I was going to do that at Mt Pilatus.
I am now trying to adjust my thinking to what things can we do when on our train pass to justify the cost!
I am very strongly learning towards Wengen-any suggestions of places to stay? I like simple places-wish there was some teacher exchange that I could be involved with but Spring Break is over as of today so I'm running out of time to research it-feel the need to book hotels immediately. I will research the hotels in Luzern that were suggested.
Thanks for the feedback-keep it coming because I am a confused planner!

BarbAnn

OK, I must be different, but I love Zermatt. I grew up in Orange Co, CA with the Disneyland Matterhorn. I have been to Zermatt four times. I have seen the Matterhorn four times. We always stay at the same hotel with a view of the Matterhorn from our balcony. Absolutely fabulous. I love the town. Two nights max. I have taken the train to Gorerngrat (hiking down has fabulous views) and the cable cars to Klein Matterhorn (twice). The Zermatt Museum is very interesting.

We love the OB area also. We have stayed in Interlaken, Wengen and Lauterbrunnen. Four night there is perfect as there is a lot to explore and hike. The cable cars up to Schilthorn are are fun. Jungfraujoch trip is awe inspiring. Hiking on the glacier is so surreal. We went up to Jungfraujoch when it was cloudy down below. At the top we were above the clouds. It was like walking on clouds. Our son (mid twenties now) still talks about it. A cable car trip to Mannlichen will allow you to hike Klein Scheidegg or take another cable car down to Grund/Grindelwald. Trummelbach Fall is interesting (elevator inside the mountain to the top and follow the falls down), as is a hike to stand behind Staubbach Falls.

Lucerne is a one or two night stop for us. We enjoy walking the town. Actually our son enjoyed the night we went to a Swiss cultural show at a restaurant. We have a great time and an OK dinner. Mt. Pilatus was just OK. Nothing compared to Zermatt or Jungfraujoch.

While Berne is a great city, you have to decide what you want to see. We did not see Berne until our third trip to Switzerland.

The Swiss Saver Pass is a super deal. It also includes many museums.

As for the tobaggan run at Mt. Pilatus, it was so fun. We went past pastures of cow (with bells) and through a tunnel. We were then pulled back up (still on our toboggan) through the forest and past the cows. The on down the gondola to a town were we caught a bus (free with Swiss Saver Pass) back to Lucerne.

No matter what you do, you will make memories to share for a lifetime. Have fun!

osteorach

Agree re jungfraujoch and schilthorn, traummelbach...all amazing. We stayed five nights in interlaken at the backpackers in a twin room (I took my mum). Can't recall the name but quite modern and sufficient for our needs. Each morning when I woke up I'd check the webcam at the top of jungfraujoch, if it was clear we were off to take the first train. I had the eurail Swiss pass (actually three country). All rail was included accept to the top of jungfrau. Was expensive but worth every penny!!! You can walk once you're at the top and if you do schilthorn you can also walk down parts between the cable cars.

I chose interlaken and surrounds rather than zermatt as couldn't fit both into 7d.

We also jumped on a train one day to go down to montreux to castle de chillion. Train came with pass and while a long day the scenery was awesome again.

Ps. The Bernina express was included in the eurail pass other than the 22$ to book the seat in the glass cabin. While I thought it was pretty cool (first day), jungfrau surpassed it easily.

Hope this helps,

Have fun

swandav2000

Hi spedteacher,

Yes, I agree that Wengen is the best spot in the Jungfrau region. I like the Hotel Alpenrose (3 star) a lot and have stayed there twice. I think lots of Fodorites also like the Hotel Bären (2 star, I think).

I'm another one who disliked Zermatt -- quite a lot. I stayed there for a week of skiing one year, and several years later, I took a day-trip there from Brig just to see if I might like it more. I didn't. I found it way over-built and over-crowded, jamming too many buildings and too many people into an end-valley.

Have fun as you plan!

s

PalenQ

I would never sentence an 18-year-old to somnolent Wengen, fantastic as that place is. Rather stay in Lauterbrunnen or Grindelwald where there are zillions of folks his age - the apres hiking scene is very neat - sidewalks rolled up at night in Wengen - great for older folk a bore for a typical teen IME.

swandav2000

Hi again,

I normally disagree with PalQ about a few things in Switzerland, and this is another case.

In July, Grindelwald will be full of tour busses -- because that's as high as the roads go, all the busses go there and park. The streets are lined with the busses, and the sidewalks are clogged with the off-loaded day-tripping passengers. I was there once with my mom, and it was really unpleasant for us. Grindelwald and Interlaken are quite alike in this way in July and August.

Wengen won't be dead in July. There is at least one backpackers hotel there, and many small cafes and bars off on the back streets. Plus, if you guys are out hiking, it's likely that most of the teen's energies will be spent.

s

rncheryl

Planning a trip and bookmarking

neckervd

There is a famous transport museum at Milan too.
http://www.museoscienza.org/dipartim...ferroviari.asp

There is much more to do and to see at Berne then the Einstein exhibition.

There is of course no toboggan/luge run at Pilatus. The sledging pist is situated at Fraekmuentegg, between Lucerne and Pilatus. It is usually open form December until March.

Pepper_von_snoot

There is NO SUCH place as Grimmelwald!!!

It is either Gimmelwald or Grindelwald, two very different places in the BO.

LMAO at Wengen being called somnolent, as if Lauterbrunnen or even Interlaken are anything like Times Square.

It only takes 20 minutes by train to go from Lauterbrunnen to Interlaken if you must visit Hooters or the Casino.

The best hotel with the most brilliant kitchen in Wengen is the Schonegg.


Thin, stays in Wengen