Patty

I don't think comparing lawyers to travel agents is an equal comparison. Travel agents are in the business of selling a product for which they make a commission. They are not working for free. What's being debated here is any ADDITIONAL fee that an agent imposes on top of these commissions. It's simply not true that only "hungry" TA's don't charge fees. I use an agent who is well established and has a good reputation. All of her business is through word of mouth from satisfied clients and she does not charge any fees. Not charging a fee does not mean working for free.

iamatravelagent

Penny - I can't help but point out one thing here. <BR><BR>On one hand we have posters who feel travel agents are a "dying breed" and say horrible things, wishing a whole proffesion and workforce out of employment and incomes.<BR><BR>On the other hand there are agents like you who say things like "We are not, at least I am not, at all like a car salesmen. I have invested way to much time and money into fine tuning my skills to lower myself to that level."<BR><BR>You are no better then the negative posters who hate agents. Did you ever think about how a car salesman may feel reading that? As if the time they have invested in product knowledge and hours worked is less important than yours? Far be it for you to 'lower yourself to that level'.<BR><BR>I am a travel agent and I think it's horrible of you to defend your proffesion with one breath and put down a different proffesion in another.

Albert

Patty, I think you need to review this thread -- agents make zip if they have people shop and shop and don't buy. As to cancellations, I agree with those who say it is wrong (perhaps even illegal) to charge a fee if the TA didn't announce that policy clearly up front. Nobody should be expected to deal for free with the public all day in hopes that one poor sap will actually sign on.

PattyC

Albert, <BR>I have read this entire thread. First of all, a good agent shouldn't be having problems with a high level of cancellations. Secondly, I do acknowledge the fact that there is a loss (time, monetary, or otherwise), but what I object to is the "working for free" argument. Most businesses have to deal with cancellations - it is part of the cost of doing business. When you cancel and the cruise line gives you a full refund, not only did they not make a dime, but mostly likely have actually lost money as Visa and Mastercard will charge fees for both transactions (original charge and credit). Same goes for my business. If a customer places an order and then decides to cancel, as long as we haven't shipped anything, we don't charge a penalty. Has work been done? Of course. But as long as we're keeping the customer happy, our cancellation level is minimal and it's all part of doing business.

aaa

VIC- GIVE IT A REST! GET A LIFE!<BR><BR>One day you will wake up and all the Mom and Pop travel agencies will be out of business---due to the INTERNET and it's cut-throat tactics---Any GOOD agent can meet or beat the INTERNET cruise fess------<BR><BR>As far as charging a fee for a cancellation-- MOST GOOD AGENCIES are NOW charging a $50 fee for booking a trip- which is put towards your booking IF you book.....If you do NOT book, then you pay the $50 for USING THE AGENT'S MIND and TIME----NO ONE WORKS FOR FREE!!!! EVEN YOU!!!!<BR><BR>If the cancellation fee is POSTED in front of the agent,when you sit down to discuss business,then you are forewarned. 99 pct of the agencies that charge fees have it posted right in front of you...............<BR><BR>Lots of people are of the nature that they feel they can go into an agency,rack the brain of the agent for over 1 hr and then get all info needed and BOOK ON LINE--- Would you call that fair? NEVER!!!! I call that using people!!!!!<BR><BR>BUt PLEASE---------------------LET THIS THREAD DIE---------------Too much negativity isn't HEALTHY,VIC!!!

PattyC

Albert, <BR>I have read this entire thread. First of all, a good agent shouldn't be having problems with a high level of cancellations. Secondly, I do acknowledge the fact that there is a loss (time, monetary, or otherwise), but what I object to is the "working for free" argument. Most businesses have to deal with cancellations - it is part of the cost of doing business. When you cancel and the cruise line gives you a full refund, not only did they not make a dime, but mostly likely have actually lost money as Visa and Mastercard will charge fees for both transactions (original charge and credit). Same goes for my business. If a customer places an order and then decides to cancel, as long as we haven't shipped anything, we don't charge a penalty. Has work been done? Of course. But as long as we're keeping the customer happy, our cancellation level is minimal and it's all part of doing business.

Vic

PattyC raises an interesting point.<BR><BR>Agencies can become credit card merchants. That is, they can accept credit card payments themselves, so that you pay them directly and not the cruiseline. They then remit the payment to the cruiseline.<BR><BR>Don't do it. When you give your credit card number to an agent make sure that the payee is the cruiseline not the agency.<BR><BR>Agency's have a nasty habit of holding your money until the very last moment before they pay the cruiseline. There is a recent post complaining of something even wose.<BR><BR>It's illustrative of the state of small agencies that fewer credit card companies are willing to establish a merchant relationship with travel agents. And when the credit card company is willing, they demand that the agency maintain a reserve. Typically, the credit card companies demand a reserve of $40,000. That is, the agency can draw from their account only when they have a balance of $40,000 in their account. The reserve for most small businesses that behave themselve is usually nominal or nothng.<BR><BR>The card companies are telling small agencies that they don't want their business because the credit risk is too great. Since the card companies don't trust small agencies, why should you with your money?<BR><BR><BR><BR>

Joyce

Vic,<BR>I am not a Credit Card Merchant, except for a small account (max $250) for fees for a completely Different Reason.<BR>About 6 years ago, one of my agents, against my advice ran a $5000 charge through the Agency Merchant Account for a Carnival Group Cruise. The Client's Group took the cruise, but she denied payment, making herself a tidy sum of money at my expense.<BR>American Express said we were liable, since the Agent did not get an Imprint and Signature.<BR>I lost $5000. Never again.<BR>Most people are honest. This woman was not, I never did trust her. My gut was right.

George

Interesting information, I find it most interesting that the people here who do nothing but badger the travel industry dont put an email address that is valid, so I would not take that as a credible comment if they wont leave a valid email.

Sue

If youre not satisfied with your service, write to the better business bureau for the state or country-wide. They can help resolve the issue. Plus, it will always be a mark on their record if its not resolved well. A good business would rather fix one issue than lose more business because of a squeeky wheel.

Penny

Sue rasises another intersting point here. Perhaps it is time for our industry to open an equal to the better business bureau. One that we can report "bad faith clients" too and then hamper their ability to operate and tie up agencies with "bad faith" bookings on a nationwide basis, even internationally now with the internet. Many agencies would vote yes to that one I am very sure.<BR><BR><BR>To the poster who "flamed" me over the remarks of being a car salesman. Car salesmen get a salary over and above the amount of commissions they make. There are several in my family, and my father was one. So, unless they are wearing their feelings on their sleeve, they will understand (car salesmen) just exactly what it is that I have said here.<BR><BR>As for the practice of keeping a commission if the booking is cancelled. I stand my ground.....If I have worked hours, days, and weeks to fine tune a trip for someone and they cancel over a hang nail, then they are going to be charged....whether or not it is the full lost commission is entirely dependent upon circumstance. Only once have I ever held a client to that. And I will not apologize for that...."bad faith" makes for bad business.....and thank god my clients value me and my efforts, my time and my knowledge....ergo....the new "planning to go fee"....weeds the weak right out....the people who will tie you up for hours or days or weeks and then go book on line with the info you have supplied....you don't pay your bills and buy groceries with people like that.<BR><BR>And out of the last 950 bookings I have made, including 9/11....only 6 cancelled...and none paid a cancellation penalty or lost commission penalty. Guess I'm a regular "oger".

xman

Sue. You are sorely mistaken if you think businesses actually listen to the BBB. The BBB is funded by the companies that join it. All they do is push paper back and forth and then claim they can do nothing since they have no authority to enforce penalties for violations.<BR><BR>You may be better off suggesting contacting the Attorney Generals Office for Fraud in your state. They are paid by your tax dollars and have to do a more thorough investigation. Plus they can enforce some penalties (they are friends with the IRS). Nothing scarier than an unwanted audit of their books. I have seen this work successfully in several areas of business from car sales to travel agents to colleges.

Penny

xman,<BR><BR>Do you think the AG's office would actually want to be deluded with frivolous complaints to their offices???<BR><BR>If someone where actually "defrauded" and they had a legitimate complaint, they would be better suited to take it to their local govenment and file a complaint with the DA of their county.<BR><BR>I wonder, how the consumer would feel if travel agency's began filing these "frivolous" type's of complaints against the consumer???? Let's say for "Bad Faith" bookings?????<BR><BR>I don't know that there is really an easy answer. Unless you were told by the Travel agent you were sailing on the QE2 and you get to the port and it was a "Gilligan's" island type boat, is that fraud....after all the boat is named QE2.....<BR><BR>I believe that there has to be 100% confidence in the agent choosen. And I also believe that your going to get what you pay for in anything in life. If you choose to buy a shirt for $10.00 that "looks" like a designer shirt that cost's $100.00 are you then entitled to lodge a complaint when the $10.00 shirt falls apart the firt time you wash it???<BR><BR>COMMUNICATE with your travel professional what you want, what you expect, what you like....if you like driving a Lexus and own a Lexus communicate that to your agent...everybodys idea of luxury is different, because of the way we are. <BR><BR>But to run and tattle just because the toilet didn't work, or the service was poor, that is ridiculous. Or to complain after you have been fairly and justly warned regarding cancellation penalties...that is just as ludicruous.

Vic

Bottom line is, ask about fees before you talk to an agent.<BR><BR>If they charge upfront fees, cancellation fees or other kinds of unconventional fees, think again. There are plenty of agents that don't charge.<BR><BR>Penny isn't too bright. She admits to charging them all.

Penny

Vic,<BR><BR>It's not a matter of being bright.<BR><BR>It is a matter of being, honest, ethical, and morally responsible.<BR>

Allan

I do not understand what all the fuss is about. If you like TA's then use the one of you choice. If not, book online. It is that simple and this is what choice is about.<BR><BR>Fortunately I have an excellent TA. She has saved me many dollars over the years and on several occasions has done the research that caused me to change what would have otherwise been a terrible vacation package. Upsell, no-just the opposite. Like all careful consumers I do check the web. On my last three cruises my TA was able to get me prices that were better that web and had me upgraded. Sometimes I pay a small fee but I believe it is really a function of the commission arrangement that the TA has with the travel wholesaler/cruise line. I am more that willing to pay money for good advice or for good service. Fee advice is often worth exactly what you pay for it. I would say that the TA's who responded to<BR>this post are fortunate that they do not have as customers a number of folks who did post. And by the way-my TA regularily 'fires' unreasonable customers or timewasters like this by asking them politely to take their custom elsewhere.