tekwriter

I have been mining this forum like crazy, planning for our three-week trip to China, Taiwan and Hong Kong in September. I have so enjoyed and appreciated the wealth of information about how to best travel in China, especially the detailed trip reports. One thing that concerns me are the stories of when English-speaking people try to engage you, they may be trying to scam you. The "art students" and the "tea ceremony" pushers seem like they'd be pretty easy to spot, but how do you find other legitimate people with whom we could chat? I don't want to be on guard so much that I reject honest attempts to interact.

One drawback to traveling in a place like China is the language barrier is so absolute. I'm spoiled by traveling in Europe and being able to speak French and Spanish; I've had the most marvelous experiences with residents that many tourists wouldn't. I'm not shy, but I don't want to be foolhardy either. For me, travel shouldn't be just museums and mountains... I want to get a feel for the people as well. How have you been able to overcome language or cultural differences to get the most out of your trips in Asia?

PeterN_H

There's a bit of a contrast between the examples you being by quoting (the 'art students' and 'tea ceremony' scams), and the 'trips in Asia' you end with. These two particular examples are particular mainland Chinese scams. I doubt you'll meet them in Taiwan, which simply doesn't get the foreign tourist volumes and is quite a different place anyway, or in Hong Kong, where the culture is again different, and where very many people can speak English anyway, at least compared to mainland China.

In mainland China the 'feel for the people' mainly has to come through observation: through visiting places of public recreation (parks and exercise areas) and non-tourist markets, ordinary shops and department stores, and by walking through the hutong.

The people who approach you for purposes of their own are actually easy to identify when you go forewarned, and they have a tendency to come up to you very unsubtly with a loud greeting of, 'Hello foreign friend! Welcome to China!' or similar, and only to do so in the most tourist-haunted places such as Wangfu Jing or Tian'an Men Square in Beijing, Huaihai Lu in Shanghai, etc. If they do approach more subtly, then the alarm bells start to ring as soon as the conversation turns to art exhibitions, to viewing a 'tea ceremony', or to going into a bar or café to continue the conversation--something that under usual circumstances would not happen.

Away from the key tourist sights it's still rare to be spoken to in English, and if someone asks you on the metro, as you look at the map to check your stop, whether you need any help, you need have no fear. If you move down to any smaller city, or, better still, go out into the countryside, you need have no worries at all about the standard scams, and people will in general be more willing to engage with you, although even less likely to have the skills to do so with language.

One excellent way to get a chance to engage with Chinese people who have no interest in your wallet is to take a one-day Chinese bus tour from Beijing (for instance--one of the Chinese ones from Xuanwu Men that run on Saturday or Sunday), or to take a long-distance train journey. On the bus tour you'll often by the only foreigner, and you may find yourself adopted. Parents will be eager to send their children to try out the English they've learned at school.

On the train there you are, either in a compartment of four with lots of passers-by, or in doorless groups of six, depending on the class of sleeper chosen, and sat right opposite each other for 10, 15, 20 hours. Gestures do a lot, people passing by who happen to have English may look in, and if you take a phrase book you can make great strides, and will be swapping food before you know where you are. Better still, take a device on which you can run PlecoDict, translation software that allows you to tap in English and get characters, and equally allows someone else to write Chinese characters (e.g. with a stylus on the Palm, or finger on the iPhone) to obtain the English. You'll often gain a little gathering of spectators, and someone or other will eventually try out a little English.

And after a few experiences you'll be able to anticipate the questions almost every single person asks: What nationality are you? Are you studying in China? How old are you? What's your job? How much do you earn? Are you married? How many children are you allowed to have in your country? How many children do you have?

If at the end of a train journey you receive an invitation, then take it. But likely someone will just make sure you exit the right way, and will try to put you in a cab to your destination.

Peter N-H

Amy

I had some great conversations while waiting in huge lines at train stations, and I second the idea of going on a Chinese-only tour: this is how I got to Tibet, and it was lovely to be the token foreigner. (Except when I had to sing karaoke on the bus. I really, really can't sing, especially with a Beijing-befogged throat.) There's a trip report here: http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...s-in-china.cfm
On the overnight train you have proximity, but not necessarily a whole lot of communication.

I loved going into the supermarkets; the variety of, for example, tissue packets (I want the mint-scented ones with the poetry!) was astounding.

One of the experiences not mentioned above was getting a ride back to the hotel in the pouring rain in Shigatse: the student on the trip who could speak a little English somehow arranged for a friend (a young man with a brand new car on which the windshield wipers didn't even think about working) to drive us back to the hotel. Interesting ride.

rhkkmk

the scams are what they are, but they are not dangerous....all you do is waste some time... make a game out of it if you find yourself in the middle of one and take advantage of the scammer

Marija

You can waste more than time:
http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...in-beijing.cfm

PeterN_H

Scams can indeed be dangerous, and not uncommonly lead to large muscled men preventing you from leaving unless you pay an absurd sum, and even walking you to the bank machine to withdraw extra funds. In most cases the pressure is more through embarrassment, but you waste a great deal more than time; you waste several hundreds (or thousands) of ¥RMB.

merckxxx

A kind of amusing way to meet local people is just to sit in one place for a while. I have tried this in many Chinese cities. Usually in a park, I sit for a while and soon one or two people will approach me and want to talk - both students wanting to practice English and old people who want to know more about why you would come here and where you are from and what you think of their city.

Elainee

If your husband is 6'3", many local people will want you to use their camera to have their photo taken with him. They want to show their friends the strange foreigner they met. Why should picture taking just go one way?

LAleslie

We had this happen in India, Elainee. My 6'4", blonde, blue-eyed and very white husband was appraoched buy a lovely family in Old Goa, fellow tourists in a church. They wanted to photograph their 6 month old baby in the arms of my husband. She was a dark little beauty with all sort of golden bangles, and looked like a little doll in the crook of my husband's elbow. The photos were hilarious, and we all had good laughs and a lovely conversation.

Hanuman

This is a perspective from the other side. On a few occasion I've approached tourists who look lost and ask them if they needed help. I would here their spouse whisper things like "don't make eye contact" or "don't talk to him". Oh well c'est la vie!

Marija

Hanuman, I think there may be good reason to be wary of the locals in Thailand. Do you remember a beloved poster on the Asia board who entertained us all with shopping hints for Varanasi, winning shuffleboard strategies for cruises and best camera settings for tribal festivities? The stories abruptly ended. Among his last words:

"I'm just back from Hanuman's house. Well, via a few evil kuranosake diversions. Life is good. I'll have to lie down. I can't think why."

Kathie

lol, Marija.

While one has to be wary of scams, if you aren't open to the people in the countries you are visiting, what's the point of going? I've had interesting interactions with locals wherever I've gone, even with people with whom I shared no common language. I had a long "conversation" with an old man in the jade market in Taipei about an old carving I wanted to buy. An old Vietnamese man managed to tell me he had been to Moscow and Beijing though we shard only a few words in common. I've shared a beautiful view with people when our communication consisted of appreciative smiles.

tek, it's always useful to be aware of what the local scams are, but remember that most of the people you encounter will be people going about their daily lives. A smile, a request for a photo, those small interactions will be an important part of your travels.

Hanuman

Marija,

I was able to lured the dogster to my house by inviting him to a secret ancient Siamese tea ceremony performed by virgins. After the foolish man came we put rufies in his tea(Lipton!) and before he realised it we switch his gold Rolex to a fake Patpong version. I made over 10 grand that night just on the watch alone!

rhkkmk

i'm still working to get my virginity back after two visits to hanuman's house.....wouldn't you think i would have learned after my first visit?? maybe i liked it...???

we have had hundreds of interactions with all sorts of people while travelling....i can't think of one i did not enjoy, even when it was a tout who lured us away under some false pretense....i just turn it into a game and turn the tides on them.... i'm a fodorite and the ultimate tout...

Cicerone

I don’t think you will find the language barrier to be as big an obstacle as you are expecting, certainly not in Hong Kong, major cities in the PRC and at least Taipei if not other parts of Taiwan. I know form your previous posts that you are attending a wedding in Taiwan, which IMO will be a great opportunity to meet people. My rule for the wedding would be: if someone invites you to do something from having a meal to taking a trip to a local sight, say “yes”. Also, as Taiwan is relatively untouristed by Westerners, I don’t think you will find the scam issues you can find in the PRC and just a tiny a bit in Hong Kong. (And in Hong Kong they mostly involve shopkeepers, so they are easily avoided.)

My suggestions for meeting people on a more local basis would be as follows:

1. Attend a service at a church, mosque, synagogue, etc. Go to a service for whatever religion you may practice, or perhaps for one you do not. For Catholics and to some extent Jews and Muslims, the fact that services are not in English does not matter for the most part, as you can still participate in most of the liturgy. Many of course offer services in English. But even without that, there is a chance you will meet English-speakers during or after a service. (I attended a mass in Goa last sunday, which was in Konkani, one of the local dialects, and found plenty of English speakers. Plus I could not understand a word of the priest’s sermon, which to me is always a bonus…) There may be events sponsored by the church as well which you can attend. Check websites for these types of activities. http://www.catholic.org.hk/ will give you a full list of Catholic churches in Hong Kong and mass schedules. St John’s (Anglican) on Garden Road would be another place to consider, in addition to services, they have evensong and evening and lunchtime concerts see http://www.stjohnscathedral.org.hk/home.html. I am sure you can find similar websites for other places on your itin.

2. Attend a cultural event like concert or play, a local sporting event or a local jazz club. (In Beijing, Shangahi, Xian, etc, I would not suggest that you attend something you book through the hotel like the acrobatic shows or dinner shows, where there are bound to be more tourists in the audience than locals). Chinese opera in Hong Kong and Taiwan would be good places to meet people, and probably to an extent in Beijing provided you avoid touristy places. In Taiwan, I would seriously consider attending a baseball game. No issue on understanding the game! Don’t forget about the movies. Most larger cities offer them in English. Tourists generally don’t go to them, so you will have the locals all to yourself.

For Hong Kong you can see a list of all activities, both free and paid, at http://www.lcsd.gov.hk/en/cs_prog_week.php. For a list of just paid programs, go to http://urbtix.cityline.com.hk/internet/action/index.do.

For some of my favourites: the Sunbeam Theatre in North Point on Hong Kong island offers a good bit of Cantonese Opera and sometimes dance, they are listed on the cityline site above. Performances often have electronic subtitles in English, but you can ask the person next to you about the meaning of costumes, gestures, etc. as a conversation-starter. Try the Hong Kong Chinese Orchestra at http://www.hkco.org, or the University of Hong Kong which has a program of paid and free concerts, see http://www.hku.hk/music/concerts/, some of them outdoors in the plaza on their campus. Another good place to go is the Hong Kong Philharmonic Orchestra, which performs in the Hong Kong Cultural Centre on the waterfront in Kowloon, see www.hkpo.com. The Hong Kong Academy for Performing Arts runs terrific programs all year, and often has free recitals by its students, take a look at http://www.hkapa.edu. The Fringe Club in Central always has interesting exhibits or performances going on, often including musical evenings, take a look at http://www.hkfringe.com.hk/english/index_eng.asp (please note that the building in which this gallery is located in closing sometime this year, so check the website before going). The Royal Geographical Society has lectures about once a month with guest speakers. See http://www.rgshk.org.hk/. The Asia Society offers lectures on a myriad of topics almost every week. Non-members are always welcome to attend (there is a fee for all lectures, usually around US$15). Go to http://www.asiasociety.org/ click on “Events Calendar” in the top right, and then choose Hong Kong from the pull-down menu on the next page. You can tailor it to the month you plan to visit (although most events are only listed about a month in advance, so check back right before your visit).

For other cities try sites like Whats on When at http://www.whatsonwhen.com/sisp/index.htm

3. Get out of the main tourist areas. For Taiwan, this would mean the countryside, although I think you will find that even Taipei is so relatively untouristed that you will probably meet locals there. (Learning to like stinky tofu will also go a long way toward striking up conversations with locals as well.) For the PRC, without knowing your itin, I would say this means the countryside as well, or at least away from major sites like the Forbidden City (which you want to see of course, just don’t expect to meet a lot of people there or perhaps be wary of those you do meet). For Hong Kong, to me this would mean satellite towns in the New Territories, or – more pleasantly perhaps -- walking or hiking in the countryside, esp Sundays, when large numbers of people are out. Taking local ferries, like the little wooden <i>kaidos</i> running between Aberdeen and Lamma, or between Sai Wan Ho and the gorgeous Tung Lung Island, or just over to Kwun Tong, is also another good place to meet people. At places like the Big Buddha on Lantau, which is popular with foreign and local tourists, be sure to go further out to areas like the Wisdom Path/Heart Sutra, where few Western tourists go, but many locals do (the views are lovely there are well). Ask for an interpretation of the sutra.

4. Learn some local history, both past and present. If you know “Canto pop” stars here in Hong Kong, this could lead to some interesting discussions. Knowing local politics is helpful too, esp in Taiwan, where things are quite colourful.