Timing for my Great Wall day
 

Hi fodorites,

I am trying to plan one of my days for my cousin and me. How long is the drive from downtown Beijing (Park Plaza hotel) to the Great Wall (Mutianyu) via car (hired driver)?

After the Great wall, we’ll be stopping for lunch at the Family Reunion Restaurant (in the town of Huai Rou) and we then want to visit the Lama Temple along with a visit to ghost street (Guijie Street); and the Nanluogu alley with the hutongs.

I’m looking for distances/times to these locations and back to Beijing to get an idea of the length of day.

I'm planning for us to head out for the day at 7am.

Not sure if I'm putting too much in 1 day.

Thanks!

Monica ((F))

> How long is the drive from downtown Beijing (Park Plaza hotel) to the Great Wall (Mutianyu) via car (hired driver)?

I'm away at the moment, but the answer is, I think, around two hours, depending on traffic. A 7am start is indeed recommended.

> ghost street (Guijie Street)

Minor technicalities to help with communication. 'Jie' is street, so the name is 'Gui Jie', not 'Gu Jie Street'. The proper name for the street if you should be looking for it on a map is Dong Zhi Men Nei Dajie (Dajie = avenue, or in general a broader street). This is in the heart of Beijing inside the Second Ring Road, and easy enough for a car to drop you there. And purely in passing, although many Beijingers get this wrong, the 'gui' character is not the one for 'ghost', but a relatively rare one for a three-legged cooking pot. A giant replica of one of these stands at the east end. The street has been largely torn down and rebuilt in recent years, with a mixture of foreign and local restaurants. There's some very good Sichuan hotpot to be had.

To be taken to Nan Luogu Xiang you'll need to call it that. 'Xiang' is another alley word (like 'hutong'), and this one is a short taxi ride west. Traffic moves up and down it rather slowly, so it's best to alight at one end and walk.

Note that this is artificially gentrified hutong ('hutong' is singular and plural), and the alley in question is now all bars and restaurants (including good Indian and good fish and chips) and souvenir shops, targeting foreign residents and visitors (there's a popular hostel in the street), and younger Chinese with spare cash. You'll need to wander well off to one side or the other if it's a genuine hutong experience you're looking for, and this is best done in daylight.

I have to point out again that an itinerary worked out in quite such microscopic detail is almost certain to go awry, although I wish you the best of luck.

Peter N-H

Hi Monica,
It took us approx an hour to get from Beijing to Mutianyu by taxi.
It's good you are leaving early. We did too & when we arrived there was really no one on the wall. Fantastic. You will probably spend 2 to 3 hours on the wall. Take some water with you. There are a few water sellers on the wall but no where near as many as at Badaling. H has been to both & by far prefers Mutianyu.
Not sure how long it will take for the rest of your itinerary as after the wall we visited the forbidden city.
We did the Hutong bit near the Drum tower on a different day. I think we spent about 2 to 3 hours wandering about this section of the Hutongs.
I so wish I had made a trip diary like Linda. We are back in China in April so I will take proper notes this time!
Annie

A great way to visit the hutongs is to do it by bicycle. We did it in early July with a 2.5 hour bike tour with Cycle China. We rode through the Forbidden City, Tiennamen Square hutongs, and around the lakes. It was 150 yuan and a pleasant and easy 23 kilometre run.

Note that with pedicab tours you cannot go across the major streets so are limited in what can be seen.

Monica - we just did the wall at the much maligned Badaling site. It was spectacular nonetheless. Despite being warned several times of how steep the wall was, it was much steeper than I thought it would be (we did not take any cable car/luge). Build in some snooze time somewhere. Have a great time.

Thanks everyone for your comments. Right now I'm planning for the wall, lunch, and the lama temple. Anytime after that, well, I'll just have to see. I'm sure Reenie and I will need to rest and relax at some point. My itineraries are plans and I always adjust as I go along. I know we can't do it all!

The biking through the hutong sounds like fun, but not sure if Reenie will be up to it. Will do some reading on that and check out Cycle China.

Monica ((F))

NoFlyZone, is this the tour you did?

http://www.cyclechina.com/Tours/2007...783180170.html

Monica ((F))

I'm glad you are revising your plans to do the Wall and Temple, and take it easy after that. I agree with Peter your original day plan is too detailed, sounds like going to Mt. Vernon, then visit Arlington Cemetery, walk The Mall and browse Georgetown, whew. Not sure about your choices of the dolled up Guijie and Nanluogu Xiang, much better to walk or take a pedicab in the hutongs. Why not pair the Wall with the Ming Tombs, the Summer Palace or the Temple of Heaven?

Peter -- Hats off to your deep knowledge of chinese characters, my paternal grandparents lived in a siheyuan (hutong courtyard) at Dong Si Liu Tiao, they named their children after cooking and serving vessels with the character precious in front of it, DF was Bao Yi, bros were Bao Ding and Bao Tan. I brought my Xinhua Zidian (dictionary) 1979 version with me when I left China.

Shanghainese,

I thought of the Summer palace, but think that may need a few hours to visit and after all our walking/climbing the wall, the palace grounds may be too big for more walking.

I've read various comments about the Ming tombs: Go; or Don't bother. It's not really high on our list at this time. I thought the Lama Temple would be a good choice.

Monica ((F))

I'm also trying to organize some trips to the wall. I'm very athletic (past 2 weekends did 7 hour hikes) so would like to do some adventurous hiking on the wall. I've also heard that you can bike along the wall?? Finally the cable car/luge sounds great also. Will I need to go to different sections to do all these?

From my research, I have ruled out Badaling is too touristy. Mutanyu sounds good because of the luge. Regarding hiking, Simatai and Jimshanling sound most interesting. Would you recommend one of these over the other? Should I do this on my own or should I join a group (such as Far East Youth Hostel) for safety reasons - I heard some of the wall (particularly at Simatai) can be precarious)?

If I go on my own, what is best way to go - on one of the city sponsored tourist buses (you)?

Does anyone know about biking on the wall?

Thanks
Susan

From what I undestand, Simatai and Jimshanling are harder to hike than the other two locations and they are further away from Beijing. I know I'm not in shape for Simatai and Jimshanling so will stick wtih M. and enjoy the luge ride! :)

I have a driver for my day trip. Email me and I can provide you his email. You can check his prices and see what he has to say about distance to the other two locations.

Monica ((F))

mjpileggi @comcast.net

> I agree with Peter your original day plan is too detailed

I think with an early start there's adequate time, but the hutong (wherever they are seen) need to be seen in the daylight, and Gui Jie isn't really much of a sight, but more an entertaining (and 24-hour) location for eating, offering an immense range of choice. I would go for dinner, but not just to look around. But I don't see why a mid-afternoon hutong stroll and then dinner at a Gui Jie restaurant wouldn't work.

It's the overall approach of producing an entire itinerary organised down to the minute, with everything booked in advance that I was questioning, and which I've suggested several times isn't perhaps the best approach to China travel (some of it is bound to go wrong), and certainly will make the trip many more times as expensive as necessary.

> Hats off to your deep knowledge of chinese characters

Thanks, but praise unmerited, I'm sorry to say. Eclectic rather than deep.

> my paternal grandparents lived in a siheyuan (hutong courtyard) at Dong Si Liu Tiao

According to the local community office, San Tiao to Ba Tiao are to be preserved, although I dare say in that special meaning of the word 'preserved' you only find in China. Liu now has a couple of very traditional Beijing restauarants, as well as a rather good Xinjiang one.

According to local gossip a Frenchman bought one siheyuan there for ¥10 million which had been effectively rebuilt with an underground car park added. Another sold for ¥40 million.

That actor famous for playing the Kangxi emperor on television supposedly lives in Wu Tiao.

On the corner of Nanbu Qiao Hutong and Liu Tiao, the Chang Li Zhu Zhai, which supposedly belonged to a sister-in-law of Cixi, will shortly be opened as a museum, they say.

> A great way to visit the hutongs is to do it by bicycle.

Agreed with certain caveats. Cycling in Beijing takes either long familiarity, or nerves of steel. For those from gentler places, the effective absence of rules of the road can be terrifying.

> We did it in early July with a 2.5 hour bike tour with Cycle China. We rode through the Forbidden City, Tiennamen Square hutongs, and around the lakes. It was 150 yuan and a pleasant and easy 23 kilometre run.

This is a good illustration of the difference between taking a foreigner-targeting tour arrangement perhaps booked in advance from overseas, and simply doing it yourself. Bikes can be rented in Beijing for ¥10-20, and you can go wherever you like.

But when it comes to visiting the hutong (which, remember, are nothing mysterious--just the alleyways that fill in the space between larger roads) just strolling about by yourself is easier. Many a guide book has suggested routes if you want to go from sight to sight by hutong routes.

> Finally the cable car/luge sounds great also.

I have to admit to thinking the opposite, and prefer not to have the Great Wall turned into a funfair. But an assortment of rides are available at every commonly visited Great Wall site, not just Mutianyu.

> Regarding hiking, Simatai and Jimshanling sound most interesting. Would you recommend one of these over the other?

The hike most commonly discussed is between Jinshanling and Simatai, and although this has become popular as the official hip and alternative way to visit the Wall, it's a very pleasant hike.

> Should I do this on my own

Many people do. Short of the difficulty encountered by one poster here a few years ago because he turned right instead of left after mounting the Wall at Jinshanling, you can hardly get lost.

>or should I join a group (such as Far East Youth Hostel) for safety reasons - I heard some of the wall (particularly at Simatai) can be precarious)?

At Simatai you are now prevented from entering precarious sections, and these lie beyond Simantai, not between Simatai and Jinshanling.

> If I go on my own, what is best way to go - on one of the city sponsored tourist buses (you)?

Tourist bus 5 runs on Sats, Suns and public holidays mid-April to mid-October from the southwest corner of Tian'an Men Square and from outside the church at Xuanwu Men metro station with departures 6.30-8.30. The price is ¥95 or so including entrance ticket.
If you walked to Jinshanling you'd need to tell the bus people you weren't coming back, and at the Jinshanling end make your way back to the highway (there's only one route) and flag down any passing bus with the characters for Beijing in the window.

A better choice is perhaps to take a long-distance bus going to Chengde and alight at the well-marked turnings to Simatai or Jinshanling, and negotiate with waiting vehicles to run you up to the base of the Wall itself (at Jinshanling you can walk it).

Peter N-H

I would highly recommend the Downtown Backpackers Hostel organized trip from Jinshanling to Simatai. It was extremely well run and a complete pleasure. The van takes off early in the morning at the hostel and drops you off at Jinshanling, at which time they give you all the tickets you need for the hike. The tour group provided a "guide," which was a woman who positioned herself as the last of our group along the hike. I felt so much more comfortable knowing she was there, in case anything went wrong. I thought the price was right, and it was hassle free.

Peter,
You are a travel expert. I have one question for you. Could you let us know your email address? I am interested in you and want to be friend with you. Thanks.
My email address is [email protected]
Waiting for your reply.

Peter -- Did you read the "bike along the Great Wall" question? Hope it isn't the BMX extreme sports Olympians practising at the wall, sounds insane.

I think the "biking along the wall" is on the Xian wall rather than the Great Wall!!

We just did both walls. The Xian wall was easy. Anyone who can bike where we were on the Great Wall is using performance enhancing drugs in great quantities.

Hi SusanC,
I love Mutianyu but I wouldn't be swayed by the Luge. It is really fun to come down on but it is a bit of a fun park ride. you can go fast if you want to but I even saw a couple who were in their 70's come down it - very slow I might add! but good on them.
If you are into hiking I would go Simatai etc.
If you really are stuck on Mutianyu there is a company that run tours nearby that specialize to trips on this part off the wall - Camping biking etc.
Annie

Thanks everyone - I'm going to do the S to J hiking tour that Nutella recommended!

Quick question: should I bring hiking boots for this excursion?