Tiger viewing success rate at Bandhavgarh?
Jul 19th, 2009, 01:28 PM
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Tiger viewing success rate at Bandhavgarh?
My wife and I are contemplating going to Bandhavgarh next March or April, but want to get a rough idea on what chance we'll have at seeing the Tigers. Obviously, this is not scientific, and things may change between now and then, but if we have only a 20% we'll probably stay home, whereas if we have an 80% chance we'll probably go.
We're planning to stay 5-7 days, which hopefully will up the odds.
All input is appreciated. Thanks in advance.
We're planning to stay 5-7 days, which hopefully will up the odds.
All input is appreciated. Thanks in advance.
Jul 19th, 2009, 01:46 PM
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We were there in January 2008 and the guide estimated that 1 of 3 game drives had a tiger sighting:
http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...andhavgarh.cfm
http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...andhavgarh.cfm
Jul 19th, 2009, 04:18 PM
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We went to Ranthambore in Dec. 2007 and our guide also told us that 1 in 3 game drives has a tiger sighting. And he was right. We had an amazing tiger sighting on our third drive and the best sighting ever (the guide and driver's words) on our fourth drive. The tiger was only 5 inches away from the jeep! I think it should be the same odds in Bandhavgarh. I say go... it's amazing seeing these animals in the wild. We did a total of four game drives and saw tigers two of the four times.
Jul 19th, 2009, 11:41 PM
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The density of tigers, per unit area, in Bandhavgarh is pretty high. Therefore, the chances of your spotting the animal becomes that much higher. The staffers also hold 'tiger-shows' in the evenings. When a tiger is spotted, a message is flashed across & elephants take the tourists to the spot.
Apart from the Taj Mahua Kothi, you have a delightful Tree House accomodation in Bandhavgarh. The Tree Houses are ac, but as these are just 05 nos. you will need to book well in advance.
Happy Hunting!
Apart from the Taj Mahua Kothi, you have a delightful Tree House accomodation in Bandhavgarh. The Tree Houses are ac, but as these are just 05 nos. you will need to book well in advance.
Happy Hunting!
Jul 20th, 2009, 03:21 AM
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We did 3 game drives in early June and had sightings at two: MATING tigers approx. 20 m from the tracks. The actual mating we couldn't witness because the tigers went behind bushes respectively rocks. But the vocalisation was VERY impressive: 5 times as vicious as lions ;-)
Ranthambore is also quite good. The disadvantage there is that you get a "route" each time you do the drive. There is no possibility to leave that route and you won't get the info where there has been a sighting until the moment you check out of the park. You can ask your guide to request a "route" (from 1 to 5) where the most recent sightings were. But it's a matter of luck whether you get the route you wish for and secondly whether the tigers are still in that vicinity.
Route system for morning and afternoon drives!
Bandhavgarh: Route System only for morning drives and only for half of the driving time. Then you get to the center point where all cars meet. There you get the info where there has been a recent sighting.
Then you can try that location.
The disadvantage is: ALL cars then try the same location and the circus is massive!
Tiger shows there were conducted in the morning when we were there in early June.
We refused to join that show - that term is second best as I would call it "tiger circus".
You get to the elephant spot where there are waiting at least 6 elephants and maybe 25 cars. Then one pays an additional 600 rupeehs per person (it's not the money itself but it shows the ethics involved) and then you get onto the elephant (step from the car on to its back into a basket together with at least 5 other spectators). The elephant takes off, walks up to the tiger and you get 2 - 3 minutes for taking photographs. Then you leave and the next eli approaches.
These elephants are trained and what we observed was disgusting to say the least: A cow was walking attached to really heavy walking chain. Herr calv estimated 2 - 3 years old had both forelegs chained and could only hopp.
Abuse at its worst.
So any tourist participating in that "tiger show" must ask him/herself whether he/she wants to support that kind of abuse and exploitation.
SV
Ranthambore is also quite good. The disadvantage there is that you get a "route" each time you do the drive. There is no possibility to leave that route and you won't get the info where there has been a sighting until the moment you check out of the park. You can ask your guide to request a "route" (from 1 to 5) where the most recent sightings were. But it's a matter of luck whether you get the route you wish for and secondly whether the tigers are still in that vicinity.
Route system for morning and afternoon drives!
Bandhavgarh: Route System only for morning drives and only for half of the driving time. Then you get to the center point where all cars meet. There you get the info where there has been a recent sighting.
Then you can try that location.
The disadvantage is: ALL cars then try the same location and the circus is massive!
Tiger shows there were conducted in the morning when we were there in early June.
We refused to join that show - that term is second best as I would call it "tiger circus".
You get to the elephant spot where there are waiting at least 6 elephants and maybe 25 cars. Then one pays an additional 600 rupeehs per person (it's not the money itself but it shows the ethics involved) and then you get onto the elephant (step from the car on to its back into a basket together with at least 5 other spectators). The elephant takes off, walks up to the tiger and you get 2 - 3 minutes for taking photographs. Then you leave and the next eli approaches.
These elephants are trained and what we observed was disgusting to say the least: A cow was walking attached to really heavy walking chain. Herr calv estimated 2 - 3 years old had both forelegs chained and could only hopp.
Abuse at its worst.
So any tourist participating in that "tiger show" must ask him/herself whether he/she wants to support that kind of abuse and exploitation.
SV
Jul 21st, 2009, 09:06 PM
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According to Jim Corbett, the mating season for the tigers extends from November to April. He hunted & observed these animals in the Kumaon Divisions of the present day Uttarkhand, where the temperatures are not as high as one finds in Central India.
I quote at length from George B Schaller, Director, WL conservation society, NY; who worked in central India for a number of years, “ According to Inverarity (1888), Brander (1923) and others, the tiger in India has no definite mating & birth seasons. Sanderson (1902), for example found newborn young in March, May, October and November, and Burton (1933), in March, April and December. Brander (1923), noted however, that most young are born in November & April, and Rice (1857) stated that the small young are most prevalent in late June…At Kanha certain aspects of the tiger behaviour indicated that the peak of sexual activity was from November to about February, with some mating probably occurring throughout the year. One litter of cubs was estimated to have been born in November, the other in February. The gestation period of tigers has been variously given as 98 to 109 days (Eckstein, 1956), 100 to 108 days (Crandall, 1864) & 95 to 107 days (Abramov, 1962). The two litters were therefore conceived in about early August and early November, respectively”.
Imo, it would be extremely rare & difficult, if at all, for the tigers to copulate in the hottest months of May / June when the mercury soars to over 40c.
Just FYI.
I quote at length from George B Schaller, Director, WL conservation society, NY; who worked in central India for a number of years, “ According to Inverarity (1888), Brander (1923) and others, the tiger in India has no definite mating & birth seasons. Sanderson (1902), for example found newborn young in March, May, October and November, and Burton (1933), in March, April and December. Brander (1923), noted however, that most young are born in November & April, and Rice (1857) stated that the small young are most prevalent in late June…At Kanha certain aspects of the tiger behaviour indicated that the peak of sexual activity was from November to about February, with some mating probably occurring throughout the year. One litter of cubs was estimated to have been born in November, the other in February. The gestation period of tigers has been variously given as 98 to 109 days (Eckstein, 1956), 100 to 108 days (Crandall, 1864) & 95 to 107 days (Abramov, 1962). The two litters were therefore conceived in about early August and early November, respectively”.
Imo, it would be extremely rare & difficult, if at all, for the tigers to copulate in the hottest months of May / June when the mercury soars to over 40c.
Just FYI.
Jul 22nd, 2009, 04:40 AM
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vp - now we consider ourselves extremely lucky to have had the chance see a couple on honeymoon!
What we know from all cats incl. big cats - they get into estrus as soon as the cubs are independent/the mother has stopped lactating. And that can be at any given time.
(Human) mammals are as sexually active as other mammals - they don't stop having sex just because it's hot ;-)
Over and above that - visitors to Bandhavgarh for the festive season might have a pretty good chance to witness cubs
SV
What we know from all cats incl. big cats - they get into estrus as soon as the cubs are independent/the mother has stopped lactating. And that can be at any given time.
(Human) mammals are as sexually active as other mammals - they don't stop having sex just because it's hot ;-)
Over and above that - visitors to Bandhavgarh for the festive season might have a pretty good chance to witness cubs
SV
Jul 22nd, 2009, 04:54 AM
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Spassvogel: like you, I've had some wonderful, stunning sightings at those CCAfrica camps over many years...
What you've described at Bandhavgadh seems completely horrible in comparison - not the sightings - but the WAY they are conducted. Am I correct...?
What you've described at Bandhavgadh seems completely horrible in comparison - not the sightings - but the WAY they are conducted. Am I correct...?
Jul 22nd, 2009, 05:30 AM
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The andBeyond lodge in Bandhavgarh is every bit as fine as the ccAfrica lodges in Africa. The andBeyond naturalist/guides were excellent, the safari vehicles comfortable and well maintained. The problem is the other vehicles in the park.
If the park isn't crowded and you come upon a tiger you're in luck. You can view it as long as you want, there's no calling in of sightings like in Africa though guides talk to each other when they pass. Unless you're discovered, by chance or skill, you're alone with your tiger(s). Obviously that's what you want.
If the park is crowded, say with 450 school children, the chance of a "private" sightings is greatly diminished. A tiger attracts an unruly Indian mob and you know what that means. Even our polished guide told us to stand up in the vehicle for a better look. Imagine doing that in Africa!
Besides the find-your-own-tiger experience, there's also the "come look at the tiger we found" experience. Every morning a mahout and elephant go in search of tigers. If they locate one and it isn't engaged in undisturbable activity (mating, young cubs, tigers with kills, etc.) you can get on an elephant's back and go look at it for 5 minutes or so. This is a real mob scene.
If the park isn't crowded and you come upon a tiger you're in luck. You can view it as long as you want, there's no calling in of sightings like in Africa though guides talk to each other when they pass. Unless you're discovered, by chance or skill, you're alone with your tiger(s). Obviously that's what you want.
If the park is crowded, say with 450 school children, the chance of a "private" sightings is greatly diminished. A tiger attracts an unruly Indian mob and you know what that means. Even our polished guide told us to stand up in the vehicle for a better look. Imagine doing that in Africa!
Besides the find-your-own-tiger experience, there's also the "come look at the tiger we found" experience. Every morning a mahout and elephant go in search of tigers. If they locate one and it isn't engaged in undisturbable activity (mating, young cubs, tigers with kills, etc.) you can get on an elephant's back and go look at it for 5 minutes or so. This is a real mob scene.
Jul 22nd, 2009, 11:59 AM
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Dogster
I did a trip report on our June "14 days meant to be a tiger safari".
YES Marija is right regarding the lodge (it's an older former Taj lodge). Since andBeyond took over the staff has been trained and aménities added to get it up to andBeyond standard.
The safari itself is disgusting - I don't mean the andBeyond vehicles and guides.
I did Ranthambore, Panna, (since 2005 Panna lost more than 40 tigers to poaching!), Bandhavgarh, Kanha and Pench in order to evaluate the destination for tiger safaris for VIP clientele.
Let's put it that way:
If one desperately wants to add the tigers to the big cat map and being able to compromise it is an absolute MUST. It's worthwhile to visit Ranthambore and Bandhavgarh - to witness these gracious cats before they are gone forever.
One MUST appreciate whatever comes along - crowds which can be avoided when travelling between Nov and March and also the weekends. If one doesn't like crowds avoid even Xmas and NY.
Indian crowds are different (generalization is always bad but here unavoidable) from others: Loud, cars overcrowded (foreigners are not allowed more than 6 pax in the gypsy but locals are allowed as many as the car can squeeze in!), route system and arbitrariness by the park personnel if a park or government official shows up. Then ALL (I stress ALL) cars must leave any sighting (happened to us in Bandhavgarh!) so that they can show off themselves as efficiently monitoring staff.
Imagine: We were watching the honeymoon couple. male and female seperated by maybe 10 m. the female went up on to a rock. Perfect vista. The male followed, jumped onto the rock, sniffimng and then rubbing his head against hers ready for action..........Then the park staff showed up, jumped out of the cars (2 cars 6 staff), ran around chasing us off. The male immediately stopped smoosing with the lady and watched these guys running and giving commandos. It seemed he was evaluating whether these guys would make an easy meal (despite big cats don't eat when on honeymoon; but such a treat was tempting obviously. We had the cams ready ........
Due to the cars shifting and driving off and these guys running the female disappeared behind the rock and the male followed.
I could have killed these guys - for sure.
I was so hoping to catch a tiger jumping on to one of them - selling the pics to national geographic ;-)
It's really as I say - tigers in the wilds is an awesome sight. And just swallow what comes with it as long as you see them.
I was so miffed when we returned and said "never ever again". But now with some kind of gap since we returned I think I'll do it again.
In Kanha they block off a sighting and force people on to the elis for making some extra money!
In Pench the waterholes in the tourism zone were empty (no deer, tiger nothing except peacocks) and only fillied in the none-tourism zone where they do the tiger show.
And who ever travels to India in order to see the tigers make sure your travel agents asks for the closing dates of the particular park/s. They regularly close the parks for up to a week (Ranthambore did this even last year over Xmas!) in order to execute the tiger cnesus. Don't ask me how they do it..........it's loughable!
SV
I did a trip report on our June "14 days meant to be a tiger safari".
YES Marija is right regarding the lodge (it's an older former Taj lodge). Since andBeyond took over the staff has been trained and aménities added to get it up to andBeyond standard.
The safari itself is disgusting - I don't mean the andBeyond vehicles and guides.
I did Ranthambore, Panna, (since 2005 Panna lost more than 40 tigers to poaching!), Bandhavgarh, Kanha and Pench in order to evaluate the destination for tiger safaris for VIP clientele.
Let's put it that way:
If one desperately wants to add the tigers to the big cat map and being able to compromise it is an absolute MUST. It's worthwhile to visit Ranthambore and Bandhavgarh - to witness these gracious cats before they are gone forever.
One MUST appreciate whatever comes along - crowds which can be avoided when travelling between Nov and March and also the weekends. If one doesn't like crowds avoid even Xmas and NY.
Indian crowds are different (generalization is always bad but here unavoidable) from others: Loud, cars overcrowded (foreigners are not allowed more than 6 pax in the gypsy but locals are allowed as many as the car can squeeze in!), route system and arbitrariness by the park personnel if a park or government official shows up. Then ALL (I stress ALL) cars must leave any sighting (happened to us in Bandhavgarh!) so that they can show off themselves as efficiently monitoring staff.
Imagine: We were watching the honeymoon couple. male and female seperated by maybe 10 m. the female went up on to a rock. Perfect vista. The male followed, jumped onto the rock, sniffimng and then rubbing his head against hers ready for action..........Then the park staff showed up, jumped out of the cars (2 cars 6 staff), ran around chasing us off. The male immediately stopped smoosing with the lady and watched these guys running and giving commandos. It seemed he was evaluating whether these guys would make an easy meal (despite big cats don't eat when on honeymoon; but such a treat was tempting obviously. We had the cams ready ........
Due to the cars shifting and driving off and these guys running the female disappeared behind the rock and the male followed.
I could have killed these guys - for sure.
I was so hoping to catch a tiger jumping on to one of them - selling the pics to national geographic ;-)
It's really as I say - tigers in the wilds is an awesome sight. And just swallow what comes with it as long as you see them.
I was so miffed when we returned and said "never ever again". But now with some kind of gap since we returned I think I'll do it again.
In Kanha they block off a sighting and force people on to the elis for making some extra money!
In Pench the waterholes in the tourism zone were empty (no deer, tiger nothing except peacocks) and only fillied in the none-tourism zone where they do the tiger show.
And who ever travels to India in order to see the tigers make sure your travel agents asks for the closing dates of the particular park/s. They regularly close the parks for up to a week (Ranthambore did this even last year over Xmas!) in order to execute the tiger cnesus. Don't ask me how they do it..........it's loughable!
SV
Jul 22nd, 2009, 12:01 PM
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oops forgot - the tiger show itself is circus and I hope many if not all foreigners will boycott these! Not because of the extra money. Because how they treat the elis/calfs! And by the way - who on earth would go into that kind of basquet with at least 4 more people to approach a tiger and takes pics for 2 minutes and leave............It's beyond me!
SV
SV
Jul 22nd, 2009, 03:40 PM
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This is all very helpful information - thank you all. I can't say whether its made me more inclined or less inclined to go to India, however. After being to multiple places where the animals are seen in a much more "peaceful" setting (Botswana, Galapagos, Antarctica), this may leave a bad taste in my mouth.
Jul 23rd, 2009, 02:26 AM
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mis - It did when we visited and especially the elephant circus drove us made.
But face it - as we did:
IF you want to see these cats than you have to sacrifice. Just don't participate in the tiger show.
There are conservationists who bet that tigers in the wilds will be gone by 2015 or 2020 at the latest.
Despite you cannot compare tiger safaris to the African safaris I must say I am so glad we did it and saw them.
Now you are warned and can cope!
Go for it!
SV
But face it - as we did:
IF you want to see these cats than you have to sacrifice. Just don't participate in the tiger show.
There are conservationists who bet that tigers in the wilds will be gone by 2015 or 2020 at the latest.
Despite you cannot compare tiger safaris to the African safaris I must say I am so glad we did it and saw them.
Now you are warned and can cope!
Go for it!
SV
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