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-   -   Spin the Magic Wheel. Where will we go next? (https://www.fodors.com/community/asia/spin-the-magic-wheel-where-will-we-go-next-1083462/)

filmwill Jan 16th, 2016 03:44 PM

Carol,

I had a really nice, long chat with Dhamey last night. Thanks for the referral. He was nice enough to take time out of his trip to NY to catch up and talk about what we're looking for. Right now it's between 3 agencies and he's quickly making his way to the top of the list, based on personality alone. Of course, it'll all be about price at the end of the day since everyone so far seems to be super helpful.

I'm curious to see what he comes back with. He knows the places we want to hit, the amount of day hikes we want to do and the kind of accomodations we're looking for (a mix of boutique and high-end, with one Aman along the way) -- he also understands that we abhor guided travel, lots of Western tourists and, most especially, buffets. ;) One thing he brought up (that no one else has) is the current work being done on the roads in central Bhutan so he was very big on flying between Paro and Bumthang given the relatively low cost of doing so (vs 9 hours on the road)...but, again, that's all up-in-the-air and may net out in driving one way and flying back. I do feel confident that he, especially, understands exactly what we'd like on this trip. So very curious to get his plan. I'll share once he sends it to me.

And, yes, we'll absolutely be traveling alone and not in a group.

Craig Jan 16th, 2016 04:36 PM

Are you able to fly to/or from Bumthang? As far as I know, the airport has been closed on and off (mostly off) for years and has not opened yet and is not going to open anytime soon. The work being done on the roads has also been going on for years, so your guy is not telling you anything new. We actually had to time our trip back from Bumthang to avoid the construction. But if you are completely sure about the airport, rearrange your itinerary, eliminate Gangtey and add an eastern tour of Bhutan if you can. As far as guided travel, tourists and buffets, Kencho surely gets it - we spent a lot of time with her and she is very opinionated about the backwards tourist industry in Bhutan and how she attempts to deal with it. She took us to a couple of great restaurants in Thimphu and was a wonderful hostess. I assume you have met robbietravels (your LA neighbor) and know that Kencho actually came to visit her at her home in Pasedena. Have you been in touch with Robbie?

Craig Jan 16th, 2016 05:01 PM

Billy, sorry if I've come on strong here (see above post) - I'm just overly passionate about one of our best trips ever. I reread Carol's report and can see the appeal of her great experiences and not only that, she has traveled to Bhutan more recently than we have. I'm sure whichever agency you choose will provide you with a remarkable experience.

filmwill Jan 16th, 2016 05:59 PM

Craig, no worries. We all have our passions about our own unique experiences. Totally understand.

Just so you know, we haven't decided on a tour outfit yet...this guy is definitely not "my guy"--just the most recent one I've spoken with. All 3 companies are still in the running, including Kencho.

As for Bumthang, I can only go on what I'm being told: that DrukAir is running flights from Paro to their very open airport. As for the news about the roads, it wasn't so much the revelation about the construction on the roads but rather the suggestion to be able to fly and avoid a ton of time on the roads in order to maximize time and see potential other places that I thought differentiated these guys from the pack. No one else had suggested that. So, is the airport open in December? I have no idea until I have a ticket booked on DrukAir (which is obviously way too soon to do). If it is, I think that opens a whole other world for us.

All I can take away from my experiences talking to people is that EVERYONE I've spoken with knows how to plan (and has connections within Bhutan to plan, since they are all local operators) a wonderful trip. I think what it's going to come down to is overall price and something that's more unique than what anyone else is offering--or at least someone I feel who understands us best.

No decisions yet until all bids are in! ;)

As for Robbie, no--I haven't heard from her I think since the last LA GTG. I was so pleasantly surprised to see her back on Fodor's a few months ago and planning her trip to Japan. Was hoping she'd chime in on this thread...but, other than that, I don't have a way to contact her.

Thanks, as always, for the continued advice!

cmstraf Jan 17th, 2016 12:52 AM

Hi filmwill,
Yes, the road construction was a problem. It was a LONG drive that our guide Lakey called a full body massage from Phobjika (bad spelling) to Trongsa (sorry it's 1 am and am too tired to look correct spelling up) with all the construction. But the SUV was comfortable, we got turns in the front seat, and Bhutan needs to expand its one and one-half lane roads in order to survive economically. That said, I am glad we got there before full-size buses become the standard mode of travel.
The Bumthang airport was running just fine in late November and we were VERY glad not to have to backtrack to Paro on it, having already done the road once.
I'll be very curious to hear about the Aman. Whoever you end up traveling with, I can't help but reiterate my strong recommendation of the Zwiwaling in Paro. If you can have the Aman experience someplace else, try this hotel.

I have a good friend and colleague whose taste I respect who went with Snow White and was happy with it. My hunch is you can't go wrong with your choice. We would have gone with Snow White based on Craig and my friend had it not been for the strong recommendation of Dhamey we got from a friend who is an expert on the Himalayas. I don't know if it was the tour operator, our great luck in guides and driver,or the beauty of Bhutan and something special about the Bhutanese people, but there was a feeling of the juxtaposition of magic and home that's made us aim for a 2018 return.
Have you been to Dwarika's in Kathmandu?

Craig Jan 17th, 2016 11:40 AM

Billy, I can either PM you on Facebook with Robbie's e-mail or I can e-mail her and ask her to check out this thread, if that would help. Let me know.

I have been able to confirm that flights between Bumthang and Paro are operating 3 times weekly. That of course, requires some planning since they are not operating every day. For the agencies that did not mention the flight, the obvious reason is that it is not good business to commit to a flight that might not be there several months from now, as has been the case historically. Because you are not booking in high season, you could quite reasonably wait and see how things shake out before committing to a firm itinerary. Do reserve your flights in and out of Paro though and rough out a couple of itineraries based on the time you have allotted.

karenclang Jan 17th, 2016 04:45 PM

Here are few suggestions for day hikes based on experiences I've had:
1. Around Haa: On the way to Haa: Cheli la. You can hike up to the top of the mt 4,000 meters (13,000 + ft). You can also take a side trip to the Kila nunnery. About hour from Paro.
Juneydrak hermitage (about mile north of Haa) . The path is narrow and steep. To visit the temple, see the footprint of the yogini Machig, and sacred spring, you'll need the assistance of the caretaker yogi who lives there.
2. Around Paro: Taktsang-- If crowed (less likley in December) you can hike higher up above the temple to the yogini Magcig's temple. Take a picnic lunch and eat it by the waterfall and then come down to visit Takstang after 2pm when the temples reopen after a hour's lunch break. There will be fewer tourists then. Chumphu Ney An all day hike--an hour's drive outside of Paro (not far from the town but the road is very bad). Nice 2 hour easy hike along river & through the forest--the last 45 minutes (all uphill) to the temple, waterfall & small lake, are more strenuous. A small temple with a beautiful statute of Dorje Phagmo (Vajravarahi).
3. Around Thimphu--From Thimphu: the short hikes to Tango and Cheri monasteries are worth doing. About an hour's drive outside Thimphu, You can also take a leisurely nice 3 hour hike uphill from the Dochula pass to the Lungchutse temple, which has a fine image of Guru Rinpoche and great mt views in December).
4. Around Punakha & Wangdue : it’s an easy walk to Chimi Lhakang. Drukpa Kuenley was a wild & crazy 15th century yogi, the inspiration for the many painted penis images on Bhutanese buildings (If you have a Kindle, you can download the Carpenter's ebook on Drukpa Kuenley exploits from Amazon). Unfortunately the Wangdue dzong burned down in June 2012 and hasn’t yet been rebuilt and the old town of rustic houses has been replaced and moved to a charmless new town across the river in Bajothang. Bey Langdra Ney--about an hour's drive up a rough road off the main road from Wangdue to Punakha and a hour's hike up to the temple (like Takstang hanging from cliffs). The yogis can show you the sealed portal to treasures hidden by Guru Rimpoche.
5. Around Gantey: nice nature hikes along the valley--but take binoculars to see the black necked cranes.
6. There's plenty to see in Bumthang valley(both Lonely Planet's and Francoise Pommaret's guide have ample information). On the way to Bumthang, The Trongsa museum is the best in Bhutan and you can also stop for tea before the 2 and half hour trip to Bumthang.

As others have mentioned, try and see a traditional festival (the Trongsa festival is usually in late Decembr or early January). The dates vary except for the newly organized festival at Dochula on Dec 13th. In mid-December, did see a local festival in Wangtsa (a short walk from Haa's Risum Lodge).

Thimphu isn't an attractive city--especially with all the construction going on but it does have good restaurants. After two weeks of traveling you may well get tired of Bhutanese food. If you want a good cup of coffee, there's the ambient Cafe and decent pizza at the Zone.

filmwill Jan 18th, 2016 10:19 AM

Unfortunately we will miss seeing a festival. Dochu La is on the 13th of December and Nalakhar's festival is from the 13th to 15th December. There is no possible way for us to be in Bhutan that early in the month, so, as much as it saddens me, it seems we will miss out on participating this time.

Haven't read or seen anything about the Wangtsa festival, karen, so not sure if it's just smaller and not as advertised or not.

Craig Jan 18th, 2016 11:00 AM

I can't see going all the way to the Bhumtang Valley, if you can't schedule around the December festivals or unless you plan to continue further east. Perhaps you will find something that appeals to you, but we definitely went to Bumthang for the festivals. By the time you get there, you will have had your fill of dzongs and monasteries and will want to do something different - maybe an extended hike or overnight trek?

karenclang Jan 18th, 2016 01:46 PM

The Wangtsa festival was local and not advertised. I heard about it from a Japanese traveler who had heard of it from her guide, who was from Haa. If you're traveling later in December, there is the 5 day Dagana festival (Dec 19-23 2016) but it's a 5-6 hour drive from Wangdue (7 hours if you star from Thimphu). You would certainly be off the beaten track and no doubt the only tourist there! The Bhutan Tourist Council has been trying encourage travel to this area (http://www.visitbhutanyear.com/categ...ctions/dagana/). I've never been this far south so I can't say how bad the roads are. Also, some 5* hotels arrange to have traditional dancers and musicians come in to entertain their guests.

There's still a lot to see and enjoy in Bhutan even if you don't see a festival. Doing a trek in December is more difficult because of the cold nights. The 3-4 day Samtengan trek is possible since it's much warmer in the Punakha area. But it's more scenic in spring when the rhododrendons are out. It is possible to do the Druk trek--see this account for what you would experience http://www.tripadvisor.com/ShowTopic...nt-Bhutan.html There is the overnight Bumdra trek (above Taktsang in Paro) but it's at high altitude (ca. 12,500 feet) and probably too cold at night for a December trip. I'd stick to day hikes, if I were making the plans.

With 2 weeks you do have time to get out to Bumthang (plenty of hikes plus old temples). It's a 3 and half hour drive from Wangdue or Phojibka. And you could fly one way if Druk air is running flights from Bumthang to Paro.

cmstraf Jan 21st, 2016 05:22 AM

If you do go to the Bumthang Valley, ask your tour operator if it is possible for you to stay at Swiss Guesthouse. Excellent food and interesting story of Swiss owner married to Bhutanese woman who helped teach the valley how to make cheese. The spaghetti was al dente and my Italian DH had seconds.


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