I do not believe anyone should 'have to tip' anywhere, I also have never quite got the hang of top places aroound the world adding a service charge regardless.

Anyway this subject also came up in February, this is my take ( copied ):
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Date: 02/20/2007, 03:05 pm
Some "interesting" responses !

I tip when I have had good service or when I know that I am able to 'spread around a bit of happiness to those less fortunate than myself' any luck that life has been kind enough to give me.

Remember, that because someone in a hotel or restaurant is well dressed and neat, do not pressume that they head home at night or the early house to any other home or comforts that are even close to the level of where they work.

Salaries like anywhere differ, in Bangkok they are higher than outside, and of course they vary, but remember USD 250 ( about B 8,300 ) I would guess is around what someone working in a 'good' middle range position might be earning in Bangkok, for a month(!).
Many places pay the base minimum which varies from place to place, Phuket is about USD 175 per month, it is high there, other areas about USD 140 a month.

I don't believe anyone really should 'have to tip', anywhere, however, it is up to the individual, like I say, if on the path through life I can help a little here and there, well, who knows, just remember that when your room maid heads home to a couple of small rooms with a family to cook and care for, with bills to pay like anyone else, I doubt they love their work, it's a living, so decide yourself.

There is 'plenty for everyone', if it was just spread out a bit.
If I can help someone along the way then let it be so.
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as someone very wise once said:-

" If I can open my eyes and see, open my ears and hear, open my mouth and speak. I am blessed. If I can read a book and learn, if I can write some words and teach, I am blessed.
If I have food and shelter enough, and something more to spare for others, then I am truly blessed ".


Bottom line - when you know these people are getting perhaps USD 140-250 a month I think a few bucks would not hurt anyone! You don't have to even think of it as a tip, you are just helping someone out who is not nearly as well-off as yourself and whatever your beliefs are that is a 'nice thing to do'!

So, James, I should think of the tip as charity? Given to someone who has chosen to work not beg? Sorry, but I can't go along with that as a reason. How can it possibly be a good thing to propagate a system under which people are deliberately paid less than the job is worth in the expectation that the customers will make up the difference? You may think you're just helping out the person in front of you, but you're helping to change expectations, and the person behind you may be less able to meet them. Or chose to help others in a different way.

Certainly, there is a need for charity, but I choose to give to organizations that may change the need for charity, rather than to random individuals (except for the very worst cases). Outfits like www.villagebanking.org, www.Heifer.org, www.DoctorsWithoutBorders.org, or if you want something more personal, www.theplf.org or www.kiva.org.

this 'do as the locals do' concept should probably be amended to 'do as the locals do...if you can pass for local.' anyone who thinks 'farangs' can adopt local customs just because they're aware of them is leaving out the person on the other side of the transaction. what he/she sees is someone who is taking advantage of local customs (and let's face it, relatively cheap labor) to get out of paying for something that would normally (in the US, UK) get paid. as my husband puts it, paying more than everyone else who lives there normally is part of your job as a visitor.

ok, thursdayd, I was with you until you got to the part about whether or not it is a "... good thing to propagate a system ...".

It doesn't matter whether or not you agree - it is the system.

It doesn't matter if you strongly condemn tipping or would feel guilty by not tipping. Just follow the local custom.

It also doesn't matter that my opinion on this is the correct one ;) as we will just continue to disagree.

mrwunrfl - but the argument is about tipping in countries where it is not (yet) the system! I'm not suggesting that you not tip in the US, but that you not tip in Thailand.

James I think you make such a good point about how the employees in many of the international hotels may look neat and well presented, but go home to a very different standard of living. That said, I certainly don't always tip in Asia, especially if a service charge is already included. But I do tip people who stand out from the rest or go out of their way for me.
thursdays, it may be true that certain jobs in the US or other Western countries have low pay with the expectation that tips will make up the majority of their pay (waiters at the 4S NY can make 200k+ a year -- that's some serious tipping and may make some of us reconsider our current career choice) but I don't think that is always the case in Asia.
I tipped our waitress at the cantonese restaurant in Singapore because she basically orchestrated all our meal choices, ordered us an extra desert, talked to us a great deal about her life, and was going home to visit her family the next day. I didn't tip any of the spa treatment people as I knew from staff the service charge is really distributed among them. If I'd gone to a small local spa where the treatments were really inexpensive, I might have done differently.
BTW on the gift/tip giving topic -- did anyone notice one of Cyn's pictures that showed a sign that said give books, not candy? I think it was from somewhere in Laos.

My point of view is that whatever the country, I tip the people who gave me a good treatment apart from what their job is.
If I get a good service in a restaurant (hotel, spa, cab,etc) in New York I give a tip, if it is in Thailand , Africa, London I will also give a tip according to what I tip in my own country, Portugal. If I don't get a good service I don't tip. Why should I tip 10 or 15% to someone that has done only her/his job like a robot with nothing outstanding?
That's what I don't like.If they want us to pay a 10 or 15% tip, include the service in the bill.

lesm and tere,

This is always a controversial subject when it is asked on this forum. A lot of us get so emotionally involved in this question.

I agree with you tere totally, as I was a bartender in the US for years and I can tell you that most of the people from different countries and cultures tip according to their own countries culture, not the country that they are traveling in . Please note that I said most.

You do have the exceptions but for the most part people tip or do not tip as they are used to at home. Whether we like it or not we do spread or culture where we travel.

Tip as you feel you need to or not at all if you don't want to. It is your trip, do as you want and most of all enjoy your self!

Aloha!

Best tip:

Be kind to your mother and drink lots of milk!

Eek =)