Fodor's Travel Talk Forums

Fodor's Travel Talk Forums (https://www.fodors.com/community/)
-   Asia (https://www.fodors.com/community/asia/)
-   -   Sikkim, Darjeeling and Kolkata: an Unusual First Trip to India (https://www.fodors.com/community/asia/sikkim-darjeeling-and-kolkata-an-unusual-first-trip-to-india-869153/)

Kathie Dec 14th, 2010 06:27 AM

Cali, Darlene isn't at Glenburn, she's in the administrative offices. I, likewise, had good interactions with her.

Karen, glad you enjoyed the photos. The monasteries are so colorful! The tea in Darjeeling had finished it's fall flush, so you're right, it isn't as lush as Sri Lanka.

Marija Dec 14th, 2010 10:48 AM

Thanks, Kathie (and Cheryl)!

Craig Dec 14th, 2010 01:15 PM

This is by far the best set of photos Cheryl has taken. Maybe it is the colorful people and architecture or maybe it is the new camera. Whatever it is, bravo - job well done. I've enjoyed these so much and have forwarded the link to Jeane as I know she will appreciate them as well...

Kathie Dec 14th, 2010 01:57 PM

Thanks, Craaig, I will pass on your feedback to Cheryl. She does feel like the new camera has made a difference, but you are so right about how colorful this trip was.

Mara Dec 14th, 2010 03:39 PM

Great photos, Cheryl! It is so colorful there - all the architecture, little shops, etc.
Kathie - I so enjoy your trip reports and Cheryl's pictures particularly as the places you go are not really on my to-do list - maybe 20 or 30 years ago they might have been. ;-)

vp_singh Dec 14th, 2010 09:07 PM

Excellent report, Kathie! I have read every word of it, it is so interesting. I am familiar with Calcutta & Darjeeling. Sikkim is on my radar for a trip at the earliest & see how it is different from our hills up north west-central India!
Now, let me take a look at the pictures, as well.
Merry Christmas!

rivet Dec 16th, 2010 10:22 PM

Excellent detail, Kathie. Please be sure to give Cheryl the thumbs up on the photos too!

Reading along I realized how little I know about the history of Sikkam so will be sure to followup on that; someone else made a comment about the history being fascinating as well.

Smiled when I pictured you doing Tai Chi with a lovely view to look at. Inspiring isn't it? Did you find though that you were more focussed on the view or more focussed on your practice?

Kathie Dec 17th, 2010 06:26 AM

rivet, we're beginners at Tai Chi, so I had to concentrate on my practice, but at the end of a sequence it was lovely to rest my eyes on that view!

rivet Dec 17th, 2010 02:00 PM

Ah the reward system....Tai Chi looks to be an ambitious practice. Good for you both.

Kathie Dec 19th, 2010 07:08 PM

For those of you who are considering following in (some of) my footsteps, I have some book and movie recommendations.

Sikkim: A Traveller’s Guide, Photographs and Essays by Sujoy Das, Text by Arundhati Ray. Permanent Black, New Delhi, 2001. This is the book most often recommended for travelers to Sikkim.

The most fascinating book I read was Memoirs of a Political Officer’s Wife in Tibet, Sikkim and Bhutan by Margaret D. Williamson. Wisdom Publications, London, 1987. Her descriptions of living in Gangtok in the 1930s, and traveling overland by foot and pack animals to Tibet were amazing.

Another first-person account of life in Sikkim comes from Hope Cooke in Time Change, Simon and Shuster, New York, 1980. While the first part of the book rather lags, her description of living in Sikkim the worries of being invaded by either China or India were vivid and fascinating.

For practical matters, we used Lonely Planet’s Northeast India

The movie I most recommend is The Lion’s Roar, a documentary about the 16th Gyalwa Karmapa filmed in 1985

We also watched a number of movies on Tibet, as the history of Sikkim and Tibet are so intertwined.

vp_singh Dec 19th, 2010 11:10 PM

Excellent pictures. That early morning snap of the eternal snow capped mountains, is stunning. I wonder if the footbridge over the Rangeet is the replacement for an amazing Bamboo bridge, as recorded by Bourne & Shephard (1869c). The picture of that bridge appears in 'The Last Empire'by Clarke Worswick.

Kathie Dec 20th, 2010 06:40 AM

Thank you, VP.

I have seen the photos of the bamboo bridge, but I don't know if this bridge was a replacement for it or not. The bridge in our photos is 109 years old and still feels as solid as can be.

dogster Dec 20th, 2010 07:22 AM

Indeed it is.

Quite why anybody wanted to build a bridge, not once, but <i>twice</i>, going from nowhere to nowhere still remains one of the enduring mysteries of Sikkim.

This remarkable structure holds even more resonance for a certain pooch. You may have noticed a small golden cairn hidden on the path on the Glenburn side, shaped uncannily like a Shiva lingham. Chiselled into one side are these words:

<i>This shrine marks the crossing of Mr. Dogster during the celebrated bandh of 2008. All roads were closed yet somehow a way was found... </i>

Fate led you to The Secret Way from Sikkim to Darjeeling, used only in case of strikes, mayhem and canine emergency. Now you can look at those photos again and imagine the dogster carried across that famous bridge on a palanquin, led by a small army of men in green Glenburn uniforms carrying his suitcases.

I've forgotten the name of my Hostess with the Mostess at Glenburn. It was a different woman - but she was just as scary as yours. I wonder if the plantation manager was the same guy...?

The above guff out of the way, now that I'm out of Azamarapurdah, let me just congratulate you on a wonderful report. I'm really delighted you enjoyed Sikkim. Shame about Bossyboots from Glenburn. You showed great restraint. I would have bitten a chunk out of her throat.

Kathie Dec 20th, 2010 08:11 AM

We thought about you being sneaked over the border during the bandh when we crossed that bridge. That must have made for a dramatic entry!

Indeed, the plantation manager is the same guy. I again showed great restraint by not writing about him here.

shelleyk Dec 20th, 2010 08:29 AM

Kathie-Forget about restraint. Give us the low down on the plantation manager.lol Even if you decline, I want to let you know how much I enjoyed reading your very interesting trip report. I spent 16 days in northern India a few years ago and plan to return to see parts of southern India and Sri Lanka next year. You have now put Sikkim on my raidar for possibly a third trip to India.

magical Dec 20th, 2010 12:36 PM

Great report, Kathie.

I am putting Sikkim on my list just so I can cross the bamboo bridge someday. First the dogster and now you crossing this bridge.

And the hostess at Glenburn is fascinating...such gumption and from a supposedly calm and quiet place among the serenity of the Himalayas!! I wonder if she reads fodor's or knows how her guests feel about her.

I am with shelleyk...give us the lowdown....on everything.

vp_singh Dec 20th, 2010 07:56 PM

Even if Najma does not, Darlene Khan is certain to read the report!
Who could ever put you in a 'Purdah', Dogster...great to have you back, pop up like a bad penny!!

m_bran Dec 20th, 2010 10:24 PM

Kathie,

Hurray - I was so glad to see your trip report posted! I just came across it.

Your trip reports are always a such a delight to read.

This corner of the world seems very special. I’ll have to move Sikkim up my very long wish list.

Cheryl’s photos are wonderful!
Thank you for sharing all,

Mary

Kathie Dec 24th, 2010 03:15 PM

I have received an email from Glenburn in response to my report, and I am glad to publish their response here.

Dear Kathie and Cheryl,
As the owner and conceiver of the Glenburn Experience, it was with great sadness that I read your report on your visit. I can only sincerely apologize for your less than perfect experience, and I have passed the feedback straight back to Najma who has graciously taken full responsibility for all you mention. She has been with us only since October and is trying her best to manage things to the best of her ability. In her defence, she does not know what or where Tea Trails is, so I believe this was a genuine misunderstanding (or case of Chinese Whispers?). Until 3 months ago, she had lived in Assam all her life as a Tea Planters’ wife, and her husband died a few years ago and she has been living alone there every since. She has a tough act to follow, given our reputation over the past 8 years, and she was very nervous when she began but I do feel she has the ability to manage Glenburn once she settles in a bit more. Many of our guests have enjoyed her company at Glenburn and she works hard to ensure things run smoothly and at the high standards set in the past.

The fixed seating at Dinner is by no means a “rule”…..most guests find it fun, and many request to shift around once they reach the dinner table, or even to dine alone (which we are happy to organise, and do so on many occasions). For her “take control attitude”, she apologises, and I believe it is only her attempt to organize and balance everyone’s programs so that all are happy. She has accepted that she needs to be more sensitive to everyone’s needs, and knows she has a lot to learn. Constructive criticism is always helpful, and we learn from it.

In her defence on the “organising activities front” however, we were having problems organising transport/guides and other arrangements for the subsequent day as when she first joined us in October, as she wasn’t being able to get this information from the guests on arrival, and then it was becoming too late (by dinner) for us to organise certain things for early the next morning with a house full of guests and everyone wanting to do something different. We are very proud of our “complete flexibility” when it comes to activities at Glenburn, but when you have airport pick ups, airport drops and also in-house activities, day trips to Darjeeling and Kalimpong, we do have to plan these at least by early evening the previous day. So I had requested her to try and get this information from the guests over tea when they arrived, however, if a guest is not sure, and wants to relax and decide later, this is not a problem at all but some guests do want to “fit in as much as they can”, often in just a few days, and we do have to keep this in mind so we can cater to everyone’s requirements.

Our price reflects only what we spend on each guest, from the unlimited transport, high maintenance costs due to being remote and having terrible roads, and the almost 50 staff members hired to look after just 16 guests. We did try to include Alcohol last year but were almost drunk out of business (!), but I will look into the pricing if guests are finding it steep. However, our wine does cost more than $10 per bottle and often needs to be transported to Glenburn from Calcutta as we refuse to serve cheap Indian wine brands that are more locally available. Sula Wine is a good Indian Wine, and 8 years of guest feedback has confirmed this and hence we continue to serve it. If you felt the staff “pushed” you to drink, again, I can only apologise but I do believe they were trying to be hospitable.

Regarding the credit card machine, we do have major problems with this because of the limited telecommunication network in the region. We still do not have land line phone connections at Glenburn and operate only on mobile phones. If the tower in Darjeeling is down, then we get no connection to operate the credit card machine. It’s as simple as that, and we cannot foresee these periods to warn guests to carry cash. When we did not have a machine, guests complained that we needed one. Now that we do, and the majority of the guests do get to use it, we cannot do anything about the periods when it does not work! Luckily this affects less rather than more of our guests.

I also would like to copy an email I received from other guests who visited Glenburn recently. By no means should this take away from the apology, which is as sincere as it can be, but in our defence, many people do continue to appreciate what we offer.

[I am not reproducing that letter here as I do not have permission from the writer to do so.]


And in general, and to other members of the forum responding to your review,….I would suggest that these sorts of review always be sent back to the hotel for feedback as I only stumbled upon it when a guest about to book with us read the review and questioned our fixed seating arrangement. I will now take positive action and make sure no guest has to suffer this again should they not want to, but had I not found your review, this may have continued! As so many people have commented positively about how “fun” and “quirky” it is to sit near someone different every evening, we will continue this but we will make it a point to check that everyone is happy with this, and has the choice to shift around or dine alone.
Sometimes people make mistakes, but if we are happy to take remedial and positive action, then surely a hotel should be given the chance to improve and win back positive guest comments! In this spirit, I hope everyone who has commented on your review and decided NOT to visit Glenburn will also read this! Regarding 5 days at Glenburn being too long, our recommendation on the website is based on guest feedback, and if you read other genuine guest reviews, you will see that most of them say that 2-3 nights was far too short given the time it takes to get all the way out to us, all there is to do, and also the fact that they needed time to rest and relax. So this is certainly not a ploy to get more business!

I believe many of Najma’s shortcomings were a reflection of her trying to “do a good job” in light of our previous 8 years of Glenburn hospitality. Her trying to be “efficient” and stick by the way we have run Glenburn in the past, and received great reviews from guests…..(the only ones I read regularly are the Trip Advisor ones and Thank You letters sent back to us, and I do believe these are genuine sentiments!). This feedback will help her improve her manner with guests and I am sure will help future guests at Glenburn. None of our staff at Glenburn are from the “officious travel industry” or have any training in hospitality, but are encouraged to look after our guests as they would in their own homes.

My biggest fear at Glenburn is always that we will become “complacent”, and I will strive never to let this happen, as Glenburn is not just another hotel, but the passion and commitment of my entire team who strive to make each guest experience the exceptional.

I am currently in a remote part of Assam where the internet connectivity is not very good. I tried to register with Fodors and paste this comment on the forum but wasn't able to. Perhaps you could do so on our behalf so that guests who did read and comment on your review will also see our reflections on your comments.
Sincerely,
Husna-Tara Prakash

Kathie Dec 24th, 2010 03:19 PM

And this is my return email:

Dear Husna-Tara Prakash,

Thank you for your email. I was just preparing to send my report to Darlene Kahn, as she is the only person affiliated with Glenburn with whom I have had email correspondence. I do want to provide clear and direct feedback to Glenburn about our experience there. I will be glad to publish your email to me on Fodors. I will omit the letter from the German/Belgian couple as I do not have permission from them to publish it.

Glenburn is a lovely place. We do understand that Najma is new to the job and I do believe she was earnestly trying to do the best she could. But to do one’s best job, one must be open to feedback and input from guests. What is missing at Glenburn is communication. Simple things like publishing in your notebook in the rooms what the alcohol policy is, letting guests know before they arrive at Glenburn that they are not assured of being able to use a credit card to settle the bill would help in alleviating misunderstandings. And if the assigned dinner seating is optional, perhaps Namja could say at dinner that seats have been assigned in the spirit of helping people get to know each others, but guests are free to change seats as they wish. That would give an entirely different atmosphere to the experience.

By the way, nowhere did I say that 5 days at Glenburn is too long. Indeed, I agree that it is just the right length of time.

I’m sure it is difficult to read the critical points I made about Glenburn, but please don’t ignore the praise I have for Glenburn. I appreciate your wish to improve the Glenburn experience and I hope my comments will help in that endeavor.

Sincerely,

Kathie


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:08 AM.