jahlie

When my husband and I travel to Tibet he wants to take the train from somewhere to Lhasa. I'd prefer to fly (bathrooms, food, trying to sleep at night) so I'll be happier if I don't have to be stuck on it for too long. Many people start in Chengdu, which is easy to fly into. From what I've read, the train from there takes as long as from Beijing - is Chengdu worth it? Does anyone have another suggestion for a good starting point? Xining? I've been to Beijing but haven't traveled through any other part of mainland China yet. I would love to visit Kunming but we'd have to fly or drive to Lhasa. Any suggestions?

Also, I'd like to be in Tibet for a festival or holiday. What is a good time of year to go? We will travel the Friendship Hwy to Nepal, then home. Any ideas?

thursdaysd

See http://seat61.com/China.htm#Lhasa%20&%20Tibet

Yes, Chengdu is definitely worth visiting - see my TR at http://wilhelmswords.com/rtw2004/index.html

There are also a few outfits running expensive tours using luxury carriages - check MIR and IRT. I would think that going up by train rather than plane might reduce the time it takes to acclimatize a bit.

rkkwan

There are about 4-5 trains a day that go into Lhasa.

T27 Daily from Beijing. 45 hours.
T23 Every other day from Chengdu. 44 hours.
T223 Every other day from Chongqing. 45 hours.
T165 Every other day from Shanghai. 49 hours.
T265 Every other day from Guangzhou. 54 hours.

Plus 1 or 2 trains a day from either Xining or Lanzhou (K9811/K9801/K917). 24 hours from Xining. Add two hours for Lanzhou.

Now, since all those trains pass through or depart from Xining, it is naturally a very reasonable boarding point. But there are a few issues. The ticket office there is very corrupt. During summer high season (June to September), it is next to impossible to get tickets from Xining to Lhasa without paying some agents a very high fee to get the tickets. Second, unless you get tickets on the "K" trains that start from Lanzhou or Xining, the trains will be fairly dirty by the time you board in Xining and your bedding has been used by somebody the night before.

Now, that is why some people would rather board the train at their originating point. Of the 5 "T" trains, the one from Chengdu has the best scenery on its way to Xining, as the Chengdu-Baoji portion part is a famous mountain railroad. The other trains mostly go through plains.

Besides Xining, all the "T" trains pass through Lanzhou (2 hours east of Xining), and all except T23 from Chengdu pass through Xian (10 hours east of Xining). So, those are also possible boarding points, though I have no idea how difficult it'd be to get tickets from those places.

BTW, while Chengdu is the traditional departure point for flights to Lhasa, there are also several flights a day from Chongqing now.

[I was in Tibet for 3 weeks in June. We flew in and took the train out to Xining.]

rkkwan

About acclimation, here's my opinion from my own experience and hearing from those who rode the train in. Elevation rose pretty quickly after Golmud (2,800m/9,200ft), and stays at about 4,500m (close to 15,000ft) for pretty long period of time. Despite the train having a system to increase the oxygen content (more about it later), many who rode the train in had mild altitude sickness. Usually not serious, but it takes out part of the fun of riding the train - especially for those who really looked forward to the train ride and had paid big sum to secure a ticket from Xining during summer.

In general, one will have less altitude sickness issues if you just fly in to Lhasa and do nothing for 1.5-2 days.

Anyways, while I was on the train, I looked at the display on the supplementary oxygen unit. The O2 content in the cabin is 21.9%, which isn't that much higher than normal. Some people mistakenly thought the cabins are pressurized, but they are not. If you really had problem, there are also pure oxygen vents throughout the cabin, but if you need to use that, you probably should go straight to the hospital or airport once arriving in Lhasa.

thursdaysd

Thanks for the info on acclimatisation, rkkwan. How was is taking the train the other way? I was thinking the scenery might be better heading towards the heights, but I suppose you could always sit backwards? Did you buy the tickets in Lhasa?

rkkwan

The scenery was great, but a bit anti-climatic, after 3 weeks in Tibet already. It is not about which way you're heading. It's about expectation and your previous experience.

Our Tibetian tour guide got the 4 soft-sleeper tickets (in same cabin) for us with no fee. Most agents in Lhasa want a 100RMB fee for each ticket heading out. Only issue is that on our day out, we can only get the 1:15p train (T224 to Chongqing). With an one-hour delay enroute, it started getting dark after crossing into Qinghai, so we miss part of the scenery (and possible wild-lives) up in Kekexili. An earlier train will be better in that regard. But we get to see Qinghai Lake before arriving in Xining the next morning.

jahlie

All the more reason to skip the train altogether. I might be able to talk my husband into flying to Lhasa but his heart is set on the train. We aren't able to go until 2012, so I'll keep at him. I would love to take in one of the horse races so it is possible to go in 2011. Either way, I have time to persuade.

In Peru I suffered mild altitude sickness, which lasted a day or so. The dry air was more problematic and I know Tibet is DRY. The oxygen offered by the hotels helped quite a bit. I don't know the O2 percentage, but it did help.

rkkwan

We didn't use any oxygen or even carry any oxygen for our 3 weeks in Tibet. Including over a week in Ali (average 4,500m/15,000ft), overnight at Mt. Everest Base Camp (~5,100m/16,700ft), or crossing 5,000m passes over 10 times. O2 is not the answer for altitude if you're going for significant amount of time, and not just a few days.

jahlie

How is the scenery on the train from Xining that takes 24 hours? Do you think Xining has more to offer than Chengdu? Any thoughts?

rkkwan

The scenery on the train is of course awesome. I won't get tired looking out the window throughout the trip.

Xining is a big modern city, similar to dozen others in China. The only worthwhile attraction is the Ta'er Monastery, one of the 6 most important monasteries of the Gelugpa branch of Tibetan Buddhism. It has more Chinese influence in its architecture than those you will visit in Lhasa, but it is also quite touristy. The other attraction is the Qinghai Lake, which you can also see from the train.

Chengdu has more interesting attractions in the city and near it.

jahlie

I know it's been a while but I'm getting serious about nailing down a trip to Tibet in 2012. The first thing I need to do is decide what time of year to go. Since we'll use frequent flier miles, I think we'll fly into Chengdu, then pay to fly to Lhasa. I like shoulder season travel because there are fewer tourists and discounted prices. I also want to be there during a festival. Losar is Feb. 22, 2012 and I'm wondering how cold will it be? I also want to travel overland to Kathmandu and am wondering if hotels along the way are heated. I've stayed in hotels in Nepal (November) that only had a space heater - burrr. Saga Dawa is June 4, 2012, which would be better weather but probably high season.

Also, I realize the mountains aren't always visible, I'd like to travel during a time of the year they're most likely to be seen.

Any suggestions?

rkkwan

I'd really worry about road conditions in Feb getting from Lhasa to Nepal. You'll need to cross a couple of 5,000m passes along the way.

June was fine for Tibet when we were there last year; not too crowded. September should be nice as well. Won't have issues with roads during those months.

jahlie

Yeah, you're probably right. I'll check out May/June when the airlines start to release frequent flier seats for those dates. I'd like to spend some time in Szechuan before Tibet so I'm going to start doing research on that area as well. Originally, I thought it would just be a stop-over, but unless my husband really wants to get down into India, maybe we'll see what Szechuan has to offer.

Thank you so much for sharing your experience and knowledge - it helps all of have more rewarding adventures.

jahlie

On the other hand, and to avoid politically sensitive times, if we travel to Tibet for Lhabab Duechen Nov. 6, 2012 and drive to Nepal for Diwali/Tihar Nov. 13, 2012, do you think the roads will still be passable? I realize there's no way to guarantee anything but a friend of mine visited Tibet during November and she thought the weather was just fine. I know November in Nepal was beautiful for us during the daytime (COLD at night) and Kathmandu was down right balmy. The BIG plus, besides a couple of festivals, is that the mountains tend to be more visible. What do you think? I suppose if the weather turns nasty we can always just fly to Kathmandu from Lhasa?

rkkwan

Don't know about weather, but keep in mind that there are only a handful of non-stop KTM-LXA flights a week. It's not that simple to fly from Kathmandu to Lhasa, since there are neither non-stops from KTM to Chengdu (CTU) nor from BKK to LXA. So, you may be looking at 2 connections if you can't get on the non-stop KTM-LXA.

jahlie

Thank you for pointing that out! Since I'd be flying FROM Lhasa TO Kathmandu, I checked out the possibilities. Keep in mind that this would only be necessary id there is a freak snowstorm or unseasonal weather. It looks like there are flights from LXA-KTM on Tuesdays and Saturdays (at this point - always subject to the whims of the travel gods) otherwise it's a convoluted itinerary. I'll take that into consideration - thanks again.