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November/December--17 days in Northern India

November/December--17 days in Northern India

Old May 2nd, 2010, 06:41 PM
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lol lol lol - yup, I agree - it didn't make sense at all. But I'm glad you heard me, just the same. It's totally easy to just do as you say and extend a day everywhere. Problem solved. Here's another easy option.

You're focussing on the cities and the Big Four; Agra, Jaipur, Udaipur and Jodhpur. BUT there is a lot of India in between these places - and you now have the time to break up your drives with a night in the country en route to each city. Do that.

Sawday's suggestions are good, but tend to be on the Anglo-centric side. Many of their properties are geared to tourists who want to pretend they are in India but really would prefer they were in England. So be aware. That may just what you want to do. That's fine by me.

If you think that might be a good idea to explore tell me and I'll give you a list of places to look at - say between Udaipur and Jodhpur, Jodhpur and Jaipur etc. There are some great heritage places.
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Old May 2nd, 2010, 07:17 PM
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oh lordy--here we go--after I wrote our decision, I started reading Kathie's and your exchange about Darj/Sikkim--and your strong recommendation of Glenburn--which is the place Ajay of Yatrik fame had for his alternate option of flying to Darjeeling for the last three days of our trip 12/10--12/13--which when I had originally looked at it appeared to smack so strongly of the colonial experience, it turned me off. But you speak so highly of it, the possibility of the toy train ride is appealing--AND good walks--and the Himalayan views--

And then you wrote this!! So now decisions confront us again.

As long as we don't have to do an overnight train, husband is okay w/Darjeeling--

I do need to get back to Ajay--trying to set up the trip has gone on overly long and we're both responsible--

Anyway, it'd be terrific if you'd give us a list of places to look at between the cities--I think you've gotten the drift that we DO like to see places beyond the cities--almost all of our trips include a significant time alloted for outdoors/off the beaten track exploration.

So many thanks!
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Old May 2nd, 2010, 07:45 PM
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Lol - you gotta be specific. There are about 1000 places. Strange tho' it may seem, I'm not a travel agency... India's a bi-i-i-ig place. But, if you're thinking of Darj, then you don't need them. I think I'll let you settle for a day or so.

The Toy train ride is great - altho' flying to the other side of India does seem a little extreme in your search for oddities. Would you fly from NY to L.A. to see the scenery? You're planning the equivalent. Go to Kathmandu. Oddity aplenty there.

Don't worry about pleasing your TA. He'll be used to people changing their mind. It's your trip. Take all the time you want, if he doesn't like it - well, tough. BTW, trust no travel agent. Remember, they'll be promoting the places they get the biggest commission from. Trust no one - particularly me.

Out of Udaipur there are some great places, too. Nth Gujarat is really close. Go here and click around:
http://thedogster.wordpress.com
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Old May 2nd, 2010, 08:20 PM
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I loved the toy train, but you can't count on it running, and it really isn't very comfortable. See my description here: http://wilhelmswords.com/asia2001 - Into India and Steaming to Darjeeling.

I'd be inclined to recommend your idea of adding days to your main destinations - you were pretty rushed before. You could also look at the Shekhawati region near Jaipur (see the Deserted Kingdoms piece on my website).
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Old May 4th, 2010, 06:16 PM
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Well, I'm taking some time to look into possible detour(s) from the very basic itinerary--or just use the extra days to go more slowly. Thanks for the suggestions.

Not really looking for oddities, but for stopping somewhere outside of cities, a teeny bit away from the madding crowd (highly unlikely in India, I'm sure) yet won't require us going so far afield it doesn't make sense....

So far I have no reason not to trust Ajay/Yatrik--he hasn't pushed me or any particular choice at all; has been exceptionally helpful and made interesting suggestions. I've been impressed by the high praise everyone on this form who's used him continues to give him.

Hard to travel through life not trusting anyone--
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Old May 4th, 2010, 08:07 PM
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It's not so hard in india!
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Old May 4th, 2010, 08:13 PM
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I see there's a learning curve coming up. lol. No matter. That's what India is for.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 08:42 PM
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Just look here 520. It'll give you an idea of the kind of things I'm talking about. There's stuff down the bottom of the list that you could do. Well, there's stuff everywhere. This will doubtless confuse you even more. lol lol lol.

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...-treasures.cfm

I must expand this list.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 09:55 PM
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Aha! I've just found the file you need. I've added a Rajasthan map with some pss driving routes. Just click on the map and then increase your viewing size.

Look for Jaipur, you'll find Udaipur and Jodhpur. There's your driving route. Obviously you'd pick a place kinda half-way. Google an appropriate name - or find it on the list below [if I've added it].

This is two years old. I have to tweak and add to it but it's more than a start. Have fun. Stop sobbing. lol lol lol.
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Old May 4th, 2010, 09:58 PM
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Oh, lol - I forgot to say 'Click here:
thedogster.wordpress.com/dogsters-list-of-secret-treasures/

I've just added it all to the Dogster website.
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Old May 16th, 2010, 04:27 PM
  #31  
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So, I've taken more than a day or two to decide what to do with the extra days available to us by not going to Kumaon--and agreeing with Dogster's observation that trying to go to Darjeeling doesn't make sense given the distance (which is why we had initially decided against going that route)and looking at the various possibilities on the sites Dogster so helpfully put together along with a couple of other sites that I checked out, it all came back to our not wanting to rush from place to place, and that if we stopped at many other places, we'd be crowded for time.

We will be spending one night in Chhatra Sagar, between Jaipur and Jodhpur which is a campsite on a dam; maybe a bit weird, but seemed to be the best location for a stop. It is halfway between the two cities--and gets uniformly good reviews on Trip Advisor.

As it now stands, our itinerary is the following:

11/27--29--Delhi/The Imperial--went back and forth between it and the Shangri La, and chose The Imperial mainly because it's not a chain hotel and seems to have a very distinctive character. (I've read the many comments about saving one's splurge for the Agra Oberoi Amarvillas) but we're only staying one night in Agra and it's way too high.)

11/29--drive to Agra/ITC Mughal

11/30--drive to Jaipur/Samode Haveli

12/1, 2--Jaipur--one full free day

12/3--Jaipur/Chhatra Sagar

visit villages/settlements around area--and there's supposedly abundant bird life around the reservoir

12/4--drive to Jodhpur/ratan vilas

12/5--Jodhpur

12/6--Jodhpur/Udaipur/Leela Kempinski

12/7, 8, 9--Udaipur

12/10--Fly Udaipur/Delhi/Varanesi/Taj Nadesar Palace--two nights

12/12--Palace on the River or Palace on the Ganges or the Alka Hotel so that we have at least one night on the river--

Apparently the rooms in Palace on the River start on the 3rd floor and the restaurant is on the 6th, and my dh although quite fit isn't supposed to do a lot of stairs; there was a very specific description on Trip Advisor about this, while none of the reviews for other hotels/guesthouses on the Ganges included that information. We decided it probably wasn't a good idea to risk trying any of the hotels/guesthouses along the river for the three nights we're in Varanesi...but a one night stay should be all right.

12/13--fly to Delhi/London/New York

And, of course, there are many many other details in Ajay at Yatrik's itinerary. We will have a free day in each place--except in Delhi and Jodhpur where it'll be half-a-day free in each. The main reason for spending more time in Jaipur than in Jodhpur is that we'll have done quite a bit of travelling/driving by the time we get to Jaipur and it'll be nice to have a more leisurely pace there.


My questions:

The flights from Udaipur/Delhi/Varanesi seem very expensive--the quotes are higher than what the Kingfisher website has in Economy(Jetair flights don't work);is there another airline that I'm missing? is there a premium for reserving this far in advance?

It would be great if any of the very experienced India travellers had any restaurant suggestions for any of the places where we'll be staying. Ambrai in Delhi is one that I wrote down from some of the contributors, but would be so appreciative of suggestions for other cities so that we don't wind up having all our meals at the hotels--unless, this is what others recommend.

Any shops that anyone can recommend in any of the spots we're travelling through also will be very appreciated--and just generally, any specific suggestions of a particular sight that may not be in all the guidebooks but any of the experienced India hands think is worth trying to get to.

I've read most of the trip reports for Northern India from the past year and they've been very helpful. Contributors are very generous with their time and so many of the reports are quite thoughtful and well written.

Would that one had the time to wander and follow the many different roads.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 03:00 PM
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Although we didn't stay at the Samode Haveli in Jaipur, we had a lovely lunch there. Very quiet with a musician playing the tabla in the courtyard. When it came time to pay the bill, MP pulled out his credit card. When he reached the "tip" line, the waiter leaned over anxiously. MP said, "If I put the tip on this receipt, will you get it"? The waiter said no, so MP gave him a cash tip. Things to consider while traveling in India . . .

Ratan Vilas is a very pleasant hotel, kind of out of the mainstream, but that's not a bad thing sometimes. The raja is very gracious and his dog, Mallet, is a dear old thing. There are lovely bowls of water with bougainvillea floating on the surface as well as interesting Hindu designs painted on the floors and walls each day. The fort in Jodhpur is the best! Go to Ossian for a day. And get your driver to take you to Gypsy for lunch or dinner --- one of the best -- and cheapest --- places we dined in India.

You don't say where you're staying in Udaipur . . .
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Old May 18th, 2010, 03:28 PM
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Hi S20!. I think that itinerary looks great. I'm delighted you're stopping at Chhatra Sagar. The hotels ALL look good.

Flights: If you are finding cheaper flights on the web, simply book them yourself [or threaten to - lol] There is no premium or anything; maybe they booked you in Business Class? Either way, simply put your quiote from the web next to theirs and tell them to match it. No big deal.

I hated the Imperial. lol. Stormed out at vast expense - but I'm [I discovered] kinda allergic to that smelly incense spa oil in a burning thing with a candle they insist of stinking up the corridors with. Be aware, death-trap central for smelly incense and spa pong is at the end of the corridors. There is also a pong-trap hidden in your bedside table; some kind of electrical smell machine. I checked out.

I wouldn't let my Imperial; adventures scare you. Everybody else thinks it's great.

As for eating/restaurants; just be aware that you'll be traveling a lopt - frankly, the reality is that you'll be too tired to launch out very far and may find those hotel restaurants very attractive. If you see a buffet - don't eat it. Not 'cos you'll die from botulism, just 'cos the food will be spiceless, watered down tourist food. The magic words are 'A'la Carte'.

Many of the restaurants will simply be at another hotel. Of course, if you're in the country, then you'll eating at the property. No real way [or particular need] to avoid it. Some of this will depend on how comfortable you are with Indian food. You need to express yourself and ASK for what you want. They will assume you want everything non-spicy. Maybe you do - in which case ignore my advice .lol. Actually, the BEST restaurants cost about $1.50 a meal - but you may not feel like braving that adventure just yet.

I bet some of the others have suggestions, tho.

I must say, I think it's a good trip you've planned.

Varanasi: here's a short piece set in the hotel you're going to:
http://thedogster3.wordpress.com/17-top-dog/
Yup, the stairs are a killer. I mean it. Arghhh. But the location makes up for it. You'll see. Get to the Palace around midday. Go out wandering that afternoon, with or without their guide; you'll find all kinds of wonder close by. Wander again in the evening. Eat at the hotel, it's fine and Varanasi doesn't have anywhere much good to go. Next early morning, do your boat-ride, spend the morning wandering... great plan.
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Old May 18th, 2010, 09:13 PM
  #34  
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Thanks, Dogster. I take your approval of the itinerary and our hotel choices as high praise! (And thanks for the warning about the incense collecting corridor corners.) Now, of course, we have to hope that all the hotels are available; I gather a lot of them start to be booked up about six months in advance, and that's just where we are.

Having read your terrific piece about your stay at the Rashmi Guest House I am very glad we're not staying more than one nights. The stairs sound like a killer--and three nights there could make them all too literally one! Will try to follow your suggested agenda. Varanesi seems to stir just about everyone's soul--the images of it from that wonderful INdian film, "Water" certainly have stayed with me.

Flights: I think I got it wrong; the column with the advance fare was VERY reasonable--I just misread it as being an additional levy on top of the full price economy fare.

Restaurants: Guess we'll be dining at the hotel restaurants; a chef friend said that's what a culinary tour he went on did--he also said the best food was in Kerala; another trip. Should be fine--and easier. I DO like spicy--husband doesn't--we'll work it out. I may be tempted but we probably won't be tryng the $1.50 restaurants this trip....although the only time I got sick in Vietnam was from a meal at a very fine hotel--and had food poisoning not that long ago from a salad at one of NYC's finest. Share the bacteria.

Indianapearl: Glad to hear of your positive impressions of Samode Haveli and Ratan Vilas. Several of the posters here mentioned Ratan Vilas positively, and a few the Samode Haveli...and, again, they both get pretty good reviews on TA. We're staying at the Leela Kempinski in Udaipur. We got a pretty good deal; it gets uniformly high praise on Trip Advisor, and although probably over the top, didn't look as stiff as the Udaivilas or Lake Palace--and was definitely not nearly as pricey.

Some information that may be of interest to others: After booking our frequent flyer tickets in January, AA coach to London,stay over one night, then BA Business to Delhi--and returning First Class through London same day to NY/coach... we did NOT select trip insurance w/i 15 days after booking and paying the fees on our flights as we had no firm idea of the cost of the trip. We, however, could have done so--just taking a policy to cover the fees and then ADDING to it once we got the costs for the trip worked out. By doing that you assure that you'll have the medical precondition waiver included in the policy along with the cancellation for any reason option; also, if we'd done that, we would have been covered for any trip interruption due to volcanic ash clouds since it was an unknown in January. Now as it's a known possibility, none of the travel insurers will cover any delay caused by the eruptions....we'll try to get booked out of Chicago, but given our dates (Thanksgiving and returning close to the Xmas holidays) and how late it already is, it's pretty unlikely.

So it goes.

So many eruptions these days!! Scary times in Bangkok--fascinating reporting in that thread.
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Old May 19th, 2010, 01:10 AM
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Ooo 520i'm envious!
I'll be staying at ITC Mughal in a few weeks and will report back to you on it. One thing's for sure--in 110 F heat, we'll be using the swimming pool!
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Old May 19th, 2010, 07:50 PM
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Thanks, CaliNurse.

When it hits 110o F I stay indoors with the A/C on high!! Be careful about sitting outside--even in a pool--in that kind of heat! (I grew up in the desert of the southwest where you stay indoors during the heat of the day.)

You're going to the foothills of the Himalayas this trip, aren't you? Now that's definitely enviable.

Look forward to hearing about it.
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Old May 19th, 2010, 09:06 PM
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Introduce your husband to the glories of 'Raita', 520. This is the Dog solution to those curry moments. Ahhh - AND the thali. Verry important, the Thali. Solves everything.

Cali, I was in India this time last year thru the heatwave. Pray that the monsoon has already arrived. I found the heat simply impossible. I couldn't do anything, bar an hour in the morning and one late afternoon. No fun.
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Old May 20th, 2010, 12:48 PM
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Thanks for the encouragement, and the advie from your personal experience 520. Yes, i am looking forward to the cooler foothills--although both Shimla and Dharamsala are currently over 90 F temp! Looks like we'll have to wait 'til Manali to "chill" literally.

Dogster, much appreciate your realistic warning of "no fun." Forewarned is forearmed. (But I thought mad *dogs* and Englishmen went out in the midday sun? )
So, we'll plan for near-sunset visit, then early morning visit, to Taj Mahal. I'd have skipped it this trip, but daughter has never been, and really, really wanted to go this time.

Luckily, the Golden Temple in Amritsar is open 24/7 so we'll do a nighttime visit. As for the rest of New Delhi, we'll heed you both, avoid midday, and probably tour mainly the inside of the ac hotel's spa! For Wagagh border closing, which I think is about 5 pm, we'll bring parasols--quaint, no?
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Old May 20th, 2010, 03:01 PM
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You will L-O-V-E the Golden Temple. If you don't, I don't want to know.
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Old May 20th, 2010, 03:03 PM
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Wagah border ceremony is sparsely attended at this time of the year, but it's wonderful nevertheless. Take bottled water, parasols, large hats.
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