Need help around China -w/ 2 kids
 

Embarking on a 13-day trip to China on July 18 with 2 children ages 9 and 11 in tow. Visiting the classic cities of Beijing, Xian, Guilin/Yangshuo and Shanghai. We are experienced travelers and have gone abroad many times on our own, but never to China. Would love to go around China ourselves - we're pretty internet-savvy and can book our own flights. We even know what we want to see. We just don't know how we're going to go about seeing what we want to see. We've read posts about people traveling on their own by just taking a cab. But what does one do once one gets to his/her destination without a guide? Just wander around? And what about getting something to eat if one does not speak the language? Our children have food allergies.

Also, has anyone used China Guide and their Sleeping on the Great Wall option? Sounds intriguing.

Wanting to have a guide I can understand. But not knowing what to do without one boggles my mind completely. At the risk of suggesting the obvious, take a guide book? Look at a map? Read before you go to see what there is to see in a place? Read the signs and pick up a leaflet at the sights (neither reliable, but considerably cheaper than equally unreliable guides)? Reading material you bring with you will be far more reliable. In addition to visiting the obvious sights, some 'just wandering around' (back streets, supermarkets, public parks) is highly recommended. There's lots to see on China's streets.

Really, if you can tackle other places on your own, and that's how you prefer to travel, there's no reason why you shouldn't tackle China on your own, or indeed why you should be wondering you would do without a guide. What do you do in other places you've travelled without a guide? I'm sorry if I'm missing the point somewhere.

As for eating, your destinations are all mass tourism destinations, so foreigners are hardly a surprise. In these towns few the restaurants without picture menus and/or bi-lingual ones. Take a bi-lingual take-away menu from your local Chinese restaurant and use that to order familiar dishes (but be warned they will be dramatically different and much better than what you are used to). Take a guide book which describes key dishes at recommended restaurants and gives their names in Chinese characters, then show these to the waitress. This is your introduction to the marvellous and near-infinite variety in which Chinese food comes. Take a phrase book with key food ingredients and popular dishes listed. Go on-line (e.g. to nciku.com) and look up the Chinese characters for whatever it is to which your children have allergies. Paste into another document, print, and take with you. Look up 'We are allergic to..' in the phrase book. (我们对 X 过敏, where X is whatever causes the allergy. Don't try to say it, just show the characters.) if starting in Beijing, pick up a copy of Eileen Wen Mooney's excellent 'Beijing Eats', which introduces all kinds of Chinese regional dishes and many fascinating restaurants in great detail.

Realise, too, that all the cities you're visiting swarm with English-menu foreign restaurants, from the most awful fast food to those owned by Michelin-starred chefs, and there's absolutely no shortage of familiar (or, at least, wannabe familiar) dishes. Every single foreign-run hotel has a 24-hour coffee shop that will knock up a burger, spaghetti bolognaise, fish and chips, pizza, steak, or chicken curry. It would be an incredible mistake to be eating such things when in China, but in fact there's no need to eat a single mouthful of Chinese food if you don't want to.

See also this thread:

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...n-in-china.cfm

which gives more details of your options, as well as tackling why taking a guide in China will not provide the benefits you might expect, and really if you don't usually use them you're much better off without.

Oh, and don't book your flights however Internet savvy you may be. Buy your tickets when there. Also consider overnight trains at least once--surely this would amuse the children? Beijing to Xi'an would be the obvious choice, and one in which city centre to city centre travel is particularly convenient.

And consider, after doing some reading, a slightly more adventurous schedule which goes somewhere else other than Yangshuo and Shanghai after Xi'an. There's a great deal more to China than big cities, and there's a vast amount of genuine countryside beyond the made-for-tourists bedlam of Yangshuo.

Peter N-H

We went to China last May without a tour or a guide and had a great time.

Without a guide, you would have to read up on the history and background of the attraction to get some idea about the place. Some sights like the Forbidden City or Terra Cotta Army Museum, have audio guide that you can rent. There are also guides at the site that you can hire for a couple of hours.

For food a lot of restaurants have menus with pictures so that you can order.

I have prepared a list of attractions and common phrases in Chinese characters to show to people when necessary.

For taxis, I showed the hotel card with hotel address and names of attractions.

Beijing and Shanghai are very modern and well organized with excellent public system.

this is our China trip if you are interested:

http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...amily-trip.cfm

Have a great trip

Thank you for the responses. Why do I not want to buy my tickets before I get there?

Peter - can you please email me your Hutong Walk guide? Thank you very much.

[email protected]

HappyMom - can you please give us the contact info for Victor? Wonder if he's still around...how did you find him?

Also, what travel guides did you use? Thanks so much.

Hi Ainette

You can e mail Victor at [email protected] to get a quote, also shop around for quotes from other drivers too. Half day trip should be around 500 rmb, full day could be around 700-800 rmb. Guides will be separate.

On tripadvisor there are many drivers recommended and discussions about guide vs DIY.

I read up on China in different popular guidebooks Lonely Planet, D.K. Eyewitness, Fodors and researched for the logistics on forums like this and tripadvisor.

Have fun.

A half-day trip should certainly NOT be as much as ¥500 or a full day at much as ¥700 to ¥800, I'm afraid. These are dreadful rates. Booking drivers targeting foreigners over the Internet is always a mistake, and rates to various destinations will vary according to distance, tolls, and parking charges, and are best simply negotiated with taxis on arrival. If simply getting around town the last thing you need to be encumbered with is a vehicle when the metro system will get you round a great deal more quickly and for a tiny fraction of the price, with flagging down an ordinary taxi to get to sights not near metro stations also easy and cheap. See numerous accounts of independent travel here.

I'm sorry but Trip Advisor recommendations are completely unreliable, carefully manipulated by commercial interests, and amount to the blind leading the blind. Do not book drivers (self-) recommended there.

As for plane ticket booking, the best prices are generally only available two to three weeks before the flight, and within China are deeply discounted (not really--these are just the real prices all except those who insist on booking from overseas pay). The majority of Chinese domestic flights are not visible overseas. Booking with Chinese agencies such as Ctrip and eLong will get you close to real prices nearer the time of flying, but there can be difficulties with bait-and-switch, refunds, cancellations, etc. China is not a place where people plan a long distance in advance, most travel is purchased at short notice, and for many kinds of transport tickets are not even available more than a few days in advance.

Peter N-H

<<Half day trip should be around 500 rmb, full day could be around 700-800 rmb. Guides will be separate.>>

I would like to clarify that the above rates are for trip to the Mutianyu Great Wall. Within the city, we flagged down metered taxi or took the subway.

The Great Wall at Mutianyu can be reached for as little as ¥350 return by taxi. Drivers currently prefer it to Badaling as a destination because of lower road tolls and parking charges. Even with the meter on the cost would only be around ¥500, and about two thirds more than the average driver makes in a day. The point of negotiating for half-day and one-day hires, and return trips to specific destinations, is significantly to beat the meter rate. Drivers generally welcome a guaranteed day's work, often with time still remaining to cruise around for a few more fares, and the reduction of costs from spending much of the day cruising round empty.

Peter N-H

We did a similar trip with our three kids (then aged 14, 12 and 9) in 2007. In Yangshuo, which we absolutely loved and made me pleased we had not stayed in Guilin, we used a local guide Jesse, and she was amazing. The kids loved her, we did one day of biking and some other fun things. If you look around on different forums, you'll find her contact info.She was very, very good.

Peter, may I ask, if the prices for air travel within China are best 2 weeks prior to travel, what to do? I am planning only a 10-14 day trip to China for my first visit this fall, therefore it would be impossible to book 2 weeks ahead of time within China. Would it be better to book air travel online through airchina 2 weeks before my trip, or would it be better to buy at the ticket counter last minute in the Beijing airport once I get there? Do people at the ticket counters speak English, or do I need to go armed with my travel plans and dates written in Mandarin? Thanks so much. Your forum posts are convincing me to plan or rather un-plan my independent trip!

From two to three weeks before (with variations). Booking within China is still the best policy, and for most routes, for most of the year, there are still plenty of discounted tickets (i.e., tickets at real prices) remaining three to two days before. It's worth asking for prices at the airport just to get a benchmark, and you'll often get a fair price even there. But not usually directly from airline offices or airline websites, but rather from travel agencies in town, away from expensive hotels and expat ghetto areas. You can look on ctrip.com or elong.com to check prices nearer the time that are something near what you can pay in reality, and if you simply cannot handle booking as you go (I typically book merely two or three days ahead) you can always book there, although there can be problems.

As for booking in person, who needs English? Timetables are bi-lingual, dates are in Arabic numerals, destinations easily understood, the fact you want to buy an air ticket plainly obvious, and a calculator is used to display prices. You'll need cash (in almost all situations, although the airline ticket booking office at Xi Dan, with kiosks for all Chinese airlines, takes cards. In general any agency taking cards, and these are few, will charge a surcharge of up to 4%.)

Peter N-H