Japan itinerary: Hakone or not? Takayama?
 

Hi everyone,
In the midst of planning our Japan trip (first visit) in October and have a question about the Hakone area and the pass that lets you do the loop of the area via cable car / boat etc.
I am mostly wanting to go there in the hope of seeing Mt Fuji.
We have the time that we could stay overnight, which I'd prefer over a potentially rushed day trip from Tokyo.
My question is- is this area scenic / pretty and does it make an enjoyable trip? Is it worth 2 days of a 13 day itinerary? I have read the 5 Lakes area is also nice but perhaps not as accessible for tourists.
Also, Takayama looks like an interesting place to visit but would need to be at least overnight - can anyone offer advice as to whether this is a good spot?
We enjoy history, photography and short hikes (up to about 4 hours).
Cheers
Cathy

Keep in mind that Fuji is often clouded over, so go because you want to see Hakone, not to see Fujisan, and you will be less disappointed.

If you head up to Hakone in the morning, you can do the whole loop in one day. I would stay the night though, as otherwise it is a long day and a bit rushed. Leave the next morning after breakfast, and you can get at least a half day in your next destination.

Even though I love Takayama, I don't know that I'd do both Takayama and Hakone on a 13 day first-trip though. We spent a couple of days in Takayama my first time, and it takes quite a while to get there. There are several interesting museums, an park full of old Japanes homes, and some nice easy hikes, plus some good Japanese inns there.

You really can't go wrong in Japan. Any town you've seen mentioned on this site will be interesting and picturesque. It depends on if you like to hit a new place every day or two, your tolerance for traveling vs exploring smaller areas in detail, your budget, and the weather.

I loved Takayama, but think you might want to consider deferring your visit there until you can give the combination of Takayama and Kanazawa about 5 days -- and I would not give the area that much time on a first trip of 13 days. JMO.

Thank you both.
At this stage I am considering:
Day 1: Flying (arrive Narita 7pm)
Day 2 / 3/ 4/5 - Tokyo, leaving Tokyo late day 5.
Day 6/7 Maybe Hakone - not sure as yet though
Day 8/9/10/11 - Kyoto with a side trip to Nara (overnight?) and an evening in Osaka
Day 12/13 Back to Tokyo, flying home on the evening of day 13.
How does this sound?

Sorry -- just posted on your other thread. (I knew you had asked about Takayama on this thread, but didn't realize that you had posted a full plan here.) Please see my comments on your other thread.

Oh, now this is getting really irritating -- my post on that thread didn't show up, so I posted here (and let you know that I was going to add something to your other thread directing people to come here) ... and my post here disappeared, too! (Not your fault!) Trying again....

It really depends on your interests, of course, but you are spending MUCH more time in Tokyo that I wanted and LESS time in Kyoto / Nara than I wanted. (I spent 2 nights in Nara and 4 in Kyoto; many people only visit Nara as a day trip.) Your call -- but If you can find a way to switch a day -- or better yet, 2 days, to Kyoto / Nara, from Tokyo, I don't think you'd regret it, even if you have already paid for a hotel in Tokyo. (If you aren't familiar with the concept of "sunk costs," look them up to see what I mean.)

(Yay! This time my post showed up! :-) )

Hey KJA, sorry for the irritation and confusion! Certainly not meaning to- just had ppl helping in two spots.
It's easy to flip some time- could do 3 full days in Tokyo (the 4 nights booked includes the night we arrive) and then leave early on day 4- and then not have 2 days at the end. The more I read about the Kyoto area the more I am falling in love I think!!
Thinking of skipping Hakone in order to spend more time there and Nara as well. Just trying to decide!

No need to apologize, LakesideChick -- I appreciated that you gave a warning on the other thread and wasn't irritated with you at all! Something was going wrong at MY end, so I apologize for the weird and whining posts and regret if you thought I was complaining about you, which was certainly not my intention.

I think the ways you are thinking of shifting time from Tokyo to Kyoto / Nara make sense! I haven't been to Hakone yet, but it sounds wonderful and I think you have the time to stop there if you want. I'll be interested to see what others think.

I'm glad we've got that cleared up :-) Thanks for your advice, I really appreciate it!
We could go to Hakone early when we leave Tokyo, spend the day/ night and then the next morning go to Kyoto- I think that'd work!

I'll trust others to provide advice on that. I skipped Hakone, but not for lack of interest, just too many other priorities! It's high on my list for my next trip to Japan.

I'm going to be controversial and say that we didn't love Hakone as much as we've loved other destinations. This was our third trip to Japan, we finally visited Hakone and weer not at all blown away. I realise some of that is coloured by the lack of sighting of Fuji-san but not wholly so. We thought our accommodation at Hakone Ginyu lovely, but again, not as special as we expected for the price and in comparison with other high end ryokans we visited. Hakone is often cited as gorgeous in all seasons but during our visit on 1 April, that wasn't the case. Spring seemed yet to arrive, so lots of winter-bare trees and bushes. In the right part of winter, it's meant to be stunning with snow. In the right part of spring you'll get blossoms and greenery, that greenery will go through into summer. And autumn koyo must be spectacular. But for us, our timing meant it was just rather meh in scenery terms. I feel like a heretic even admitting it!!!!!!

Kavey - honesty is always appreciated! I know how hard it is to speak negatively about a destination loved by other, but it gives another perspective.

He very much enjoyed Hakone, but we had perfect timing. Fuji was very clear, we saw it from everywhere in Hakone, and we were there right at the end of koyo, so the scenery was lovely.

But more important than Hakone is Kyoto and making sure you have enough time there.

And Kavey, I think your post is exactly the kind of information other travelers need!

Thanks Kathie and Dgunbug! Hesitated to post it. We didn't hate Hakone of course, and we made the best of exploring it, but we just didn't get the best of it, and I'd certainly say it's not quite as much of an all-year-round destination as the tourist offices like to present it as!

Kavey, totally respect your post and it actually epitomises why I love this forum. Honest advice from people who have been there and want others to plan the best possible holiday. Thank you!
Kathie, the more I read, the more I agree re Kyoto. I am allocating more and more time to this area! Nara looks gorgeous too.

Nara IS gorgeous! If you have enough time in the area, also consider going just outside Nara, in an area called Ikaruga, to see Horyuji (which may be even older than Todaiji) and Chuguji (with its absolutely beautiful Miroku Bosatsu).

And BTW, if you are looking for a scenic area for just a day or so, you have lots of options other than Hakone and Takayama! Miyajima (perhaps combined with Hiroshima), Koya-san, Nikko.... None of these would give you a chance of seeing Mt. Fuji, though....

hakone is what I have as #1 memory from my first visit to japan. we loved it---the memorable day spent getting there via 4 different transportation modes, the views of mt Fuji (often), the hyatt hotel---worth every cent...

On day 13 you can travel to Narita Airport from Hakone or Kyoto.

I guess I'll be controversial as well, and say that we did both Hakone and Takayama on our first Japan trip (which was 13 nights) and were very happy with both. Our final itinerary was as follows:

Tokyo 4 nights
Hakone 1 night
Takayama 2 nights
Nara 1 night
Koyasan 1 night
Kyoto 4 nights

For detailed descriptions you can see my first Japan trip report. In brief, we loved both Hakone and Takayama, which were very different from each other, and they gave us some sense of small town and countryside outside the major cities. I think that 1 night is plenty for Hakone, but would not do Takayama with less than two nights. We did Kanazawa on our second trip and also loved it, and didn't regret not doing them together on the same trip. Have a great trip!

We did Hakone as a day trip and Takayama (2 nights)and Kanazawa (3 nights) on our 3.5 week trip to Japan. I posted a TR if you are interested in details. We found all three places wonderful and worthwhile. Since you don't have the time to "do it all", I suggest that whatever you decide, you'll have a wonderful time. We are returning for our second trip to Japan in Nov.

<<Day 8/9/10/11 - Kyoto with a side trip to Nara (overnight?) and an evening in Osaka
Day 12/13 Back to Tokyo, flying home on the evening of day 13.
How does this sound?>>

You don't need to double back to Tokyo for an overnight on Day 12. You can just hop a shinkansen from Kyoto and then travel to Narita/Haneda all on the same day. The shinkansen average missing their schedule by 36 SECONDS per year. A shinkansen that misses its schedule by a minute is a shock. One that misses the schedule by an hour is unheard of.

I agree that traveling back to the airport from Kyoto on the day of your flight is easy. Just leave yourself plenty of time so you don't feel rushed. I sent my luggage ahead to the airport minus a small bag, and picked it up when I arrived. That would leave an extra night in Kyoto.

I agree to just head back to Narita from Kyoto on the day of departure. On our second trip, we traveled back from Matsumoto to Narita on the day of departure. This was more complicated than the Kyoto to Narita trip would be, and we had no problems. We also sent our luggage ahead to the airport which was super easy. You just need to do it a day or two before. Your hotel can help you to do this.

Hakone is easily one of the most beautiful areas in Japan. Fujigoko (Fuji five lakes)region just above Hakone is also beautiful and less populous. If you love lakes as your name suggests then I would recommend two nights in Hakone probably near Ashiko (Lake Ashi). BTW ko is Japanese for lake so every lakes name will end in ko. Just as yama is mountain thus Fujiyama. Anyway there is a lot to do and see in Hakone and for two days you'll just brush the surface. We will be going back to Hakone for four nights, our fifth visit, with rhkkmk next April and can't wait. See this site for some info on the area.

http://www.hakone.or.jp/en/

Aloha!

We stayed at the Fujiya hotel 2 nights back in 2002. Great historic hotel and easy access to sights.
We did the cable car/ropeway /pirate ship, then hiked along the old Tokaido road through cedars stopping at Amazake Chaya Inn for refreshments, then on to Hatajuku town for the wood crafts. Then took bus back to station,train to hotel, a great day.
http://www.japan-guide.com/e/e5205.html

Thank you so much everyone for your ideas and comments.... so appreciated and so much to think about!!!
I'll let you know what we decide!

Seeing Mt. Fuji with it's snowcap was not only the one single highlight of my first trip to Japan, but is also one of the top travel highlights of my life. Having said that, it took a return trip to Hakone near the end of my first trip, after the weather had greatly improved for me to be able to see Fuji-san.

My vote would be to keep your schedule flexible enough so that if weather is good while in Tokyo, you then make a day trip to see Fuj-san. A day trip will be busy but in good weather, will allow you to take the full transportation circuit (funicular, gondola and Lake Ashi boat cruise), see Fuji-san from multiple viewing sights, and visit the Owakudani (sp?) boiling valley. Granted, keeping this flexibility would likely preclude you from doing an overnight in Hakone but if your top preference is to see Mt. Fuji, you'll need to maintain this flexibility due to the variability of the weather. One other thing to consider--if you are traveling in October, it's quite possible Fuji will have no snow cap, which to me, would greatly reduce the classic view of it that you probably have in your mind.