India--my husband is leery & comparison to other countries
 

I've been reading and researching and reading more and researching more for a potential trip to India this February. Obviously, if we are going to do this, it is time to buy plane tickets, get visas and move on with our plans. I've done a ton of reading and have a pretty good idea of what to expect in the country, and I've kind of decided on a very general itinerary that focuses on the lesser-visited northeast. We wouldn't spend any time in the huge cities--Dehli, Mumbai etc. The one major tourist city I do really want to visit is Varanasi. In the Golden Triangle area, if we'd add this in and make any stops at all, from the research I've done the places that I'd be most interested in are Udaipur and Jaisalmer.

We can take a month (or a bit more) if we need/want but are also a little leery about that because we have never taken a trip that long, and after about 2 1/2 weeks normally we are ready to go back home. And, our typical travel style is slow travel, renting a house or apartment for 4 or 7 days to use as a base and then moving on. This obviously, doesn't sound as though it would work for India. And, when we do this, it doesn't mean we just sit around and relax and veg out and read. We like to be quite active, and while a couple hours here or there sitting around relaxing and reading is fine, it is not something we make a habit of. It is just that we have learned that for us less is more, and we prefer to really get to know more about a place rather than blitzing through quickly hitting only the major tourist sights.

We enjoy interesting history and architecture, interesting small towns, more rural areas, parks and nature, and are interested in doing some active things like long walks or horseback rides or water-based activities as different ways to get a feel for a place, not as adventure sports junkies. Heavily touristed places with busloads of people and constant touts hassling us are not our thing. We like to wander around, stopping to take photos, eating in local places. I love to wander through local markets just to browse and take photos. We visit the major sites on our own without feeling we need a guide. We like to see the real culture and country and don't isolate ourselves in 5* hotels or just looking through bus windows. Our preference is for small locally-owned, moderatly-priced guesthouses or inns with just a few rooms rather than large anonymous places. We are in our early 60s and can afford to (and will) spend money on experiences that are memorable, but we don't throw money away. We aren't shoppers.

The only other Asian country we've visited is Vietnam, and there we definitely didn't do the typical tourist trip. We often visit more rural areas of countries and have been to these other developing countries--Mexico (not the Cancun-type scene), Peru, Guatemala, Nicaragua, Romania. And, if I remember correctly for nearly every one of those trips my husband started out by asking why in the world I'd want to go there. And, he really ended up liking all of these places because they were so different. We've seen and lived with absolutely horrible potholed dirt roads, litter strewn all over, irregular or non-existent electricity, strange or no toilets, very little tourist infrastructure, being driven around in terrifying traffic situations that would scare the pants off most Western people. So, we are not isolated, pampered or inexperienced travelers.

I think I've discovered some areas and things we could do in India that would meet our needs. BUT, now, after all of my researching and thinking, my husband is very leery of even taking a trip to India at all because he just talked with someone who has visited 5 or 6 times, and he says he was really turned off by what he heard. So questions for you:

Is all of India as packed with people as a Vietnam is? I remember being surprised that even the rural areas and countryside of Vietnam had tons of people?

Once you are out of the major tourist areas, is it more relaxing and peaceful? Do the constant hassles cease?

If we avoid the places that are on the itinerary of every tour company around for the typical 10 to 14 day once-in-a-lifetime trip to India, will it be more what we are looking for?

I am having a very hard time believing that all of India truly fits the stereotype of dirty, unsanitary, dusty, infuriating, full of touts and hassles, jam-packed with people. Thanks.

www.outsourcedthemovie.com

Funny and pretty realistic lots filmed around Varanasi

will give you an idea of the issues there are significant

cultural adjustment issues personally find it very pretty

in rural areas beyond the metro squalor...

I have traveled a lot in third world countries even Haiti

doing medical voluteerism but it does require a spritual

point of view beyond the material...

www.indiamike.com my be the best local board for specifics.

Trip Insurance and careful medical precautions wise.

mdtravelhealth.com India for a heads up.

Go by all means you will only grow spiritually

IF you keep and open mind and show universal respect...

Happy Travels...

I would say that pretty much all of India is unsanitary, dusty, infuriating and full of hassles. The new gated housing enclaves around places like Delhi and Bangalore would be more sanitary, but you're unlikely to see much of them. Really rural areas are not jam-packed with people, but have zero facilities for western tourists.

However, India does have compensations - it's also vibrant, incredibly diverse and endlessly fascinating. I would suggest heading for the south rather than the north, unless you can spend time in the mountains - Ladakh would be worth investigating. In the south I'd suggest time in the National Parks and the hill country - think Coorg and Coonoor - and Panaji (not the Goan beaches - although a bit further south you can find some emptier beaches). Pondicherry might be a possible base in the east, and I liked the Chettinad region.

I loved Jaisalmer, but if you're not doing anywhere else in Rajasthan (and given your outline I'd recommend skipping it) it is a long way from anywhere. Actually, it's a long way even if you are doing Rajasthan. I'd say that the one do-not-miss place in the north (aside from the Taj), is Varanasi.

Is it India or nothing? Or do you have a second country you are considering? India is one of my least favorite countries in Asia for all the reasons you list, but on the other hand, I'm not saying I would never return.

I do think 1 month would be a loooooong time!

If it's so terrible, why did the person he spoke to go there 5 or 6 times? Also, if your husband doesn't want to visit India, he will find excuses wherever he can. If the TON of information here from so many of us who have been to India isn't convincing enough, then I think he really doesn't want to go.

My question exactly about why the person went 5 or 6 times if it is so terrible.

I'll have to rent OUtsourced again to look at it from the perspectice of a prospective traveler. I remember really enjoying it as a movie, but now I'll have to take another look at it.

Maybe I should consider a second look at the south. Initially we'd considered that for a portion of out trip but gave it up after seriously understanding the distances and travel times involved and having read all of the advice to stay either north or south.


Thanks for your insights.

i in udaipur today and we just love it!! Is it full of hastles and filth, certainly.... are there touts--everywhere... would you love every minute---- Y E S!!!

We also love to stroll thru markets, back lanes, etc. But we don't do it alone in India---we mostly have a handler with us and we have a driver 24/7 to take us where we want to visit. I can't imagine taking a local bus, nor could you... you could do a tuk tuk however, but every ride will be a negioation... that is why we like the car and driver---its not a lux here!!

There are wonderful havelis (small heritage hotels) everywhere---look for the heritage hotel site..

we ate at Udai Kothi last night and it looks fabulous.
i can't imagine renting an apartment here--i don't know what you would find.

BTW, varanasi is interesting and a must visit for a couple of days but i find places like udaipur far more interesting. it is quite clean too.

beg your husband to go, it will be the experience of his life.

i forgot to add that we are 67 and are also in India for a month and do not find the timing any too long...

will we be glad to be home---sure we miss our grand kids and preparring for xmas--- and turkey next week

If you go to India do not even try to do it yourself. You can arrange a private tour/trip for very little and have a guide/handler and driver. Search through the postings and you will come across a number of recommended Guides/Companies. We used VP Singh, Legendsandpalaces.com, and recommend him highly.
I, too, was very hesitant about visiting India but found it to be one of the most memorable trips I have ever taken.

julies....look at it this way....if you go, do enjoy your trip to India. And you will know that if you can make it in India, then you can make it anywhere (something like New York---if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere---and New York isn't so bad).

It appears that you like new and adventurous places. Maybe, your husband not so much. Don't know what your budget is, but if you go to India, don't try to do it on the cheap because everything in India is SO INEXPENSIVE. Be sure to get yourself a good guide, like others have said. Stay in good hotels with AC, and get a car/driver with AC, and you'll be fine. Car with AC will keep the heat and dust away. Take normal precautions which you would anywhere, and you'll be fine.

Like others have said, trip to India is memorable, and you will savor it for a long time. So plan well, ask all questions, and go and enjoy. You can go in a tour group...I don't like tour groups myself. India is certainly doable in a private planned trip. Do not go without reservations made ahead...save your time in India for taking in great experiences, rather than trying to make hotel reservations etc.

I hope this helps. Good luck planning.

Well, I think my husband and I will have a long and serious conversation about this trip in the next few days. I think the secret is to figure out what appeals to us (and we know by now) and only do those things rather than the things that are the usual on the usual tours. I'm also going to give another hard look at the idea of visitng the south because we could do 2 weeks there in a small area and then fly to the northeast to do 2 weeks up there for totally different aspects of India. I doubt that we'll use an agent for the entire thing, but instead we'll piece together various parts using more local drivers and agencies. We've done this in the past in other trips to developing countries, and it has worked for us.

If we do take this trip, I am guessing it will be our only trip to India because it is so far away and so expensive to get to and because there are so many places in the world we still want to visit and we are growing older. It really is the pits to think about that, but it is the reality of how much longer one really has to take on major travel with all of its hassles (and rewards).

It is interesting that my husband has some apprehensions about India because I just returned a couple days ago from a fabulous two week stay in a Spanish language school (brief trip report needs to be written still) in Nicaragua, and I can tell he was jealous of my time there. I think he is jealous becasue really enjoyed the trip we took to Nicaragua several years ago. It is the second poorest country in all of the larger Caribbean/Latin America area after Haiti, but we really liked our time there and hope to return. There is not a lot of infrastructure, many places aren't the most sanitary, and there is a lot of litter as in all developing countries. But, there we were primarily in the more rural areas rather than the large, ugly capital city of Managua. S
o, I need to keep this is mind as I think about planning a trip to India. And, there people are very friendly and not in your face as I understand many people are in India. So, today, for me India isn't seeming all that different from the place I just was. There were horse drawn carts competing for a space in the traffic, people carrying firewood on their heads, some appalling poverty--many of the same things I hear about India.

Thanks again for all the assistance.

i use castle and king in delhi for help... contact arvind, the owner, and ask him for ideas. he and his team do a very good job.

My husband and I (57/63 yrs) went last year for just under a month. If you click on my name my trip report will come up. I could have stayed longer. I have travelled a lot in Asia, going again next month to Burma, but nothing compares to India. It is its own type of travel as far as I am concerned. I planned, with the help of fodors, our trip into India gently starting with Udaipur and ending in Varanasi and Agra. Had I gone to either of those places first I very well may have had a different opinion. Yes it is in your face 24 7 and the first week was a bit overwhelming for sure, but that is the beauty of staying a month. By week two you are used to it all, in some ways, and learn to just marvel in the beauty of the landscape and the people and enjoy it. The people are the nicest I have met anywhere and the history and forts blew me away.

I am planning on going back again next year. I hope that you can convince your husband. It is an amazing country.

I've just returned from a 2 week trip to India -- my first. We organized it through an American couple who live in India(tripsintoindia.com). It was a fantastic trip! As said in other posts, it's neverendingly fascinating, different from anything I've ever experienced before. We were 2 couples and, with a lot of help from Martin and Carol who own the comany I mentioned, and research on this forum and reading, developed our own tour. Udaipur is the cleanest city we saw while in India -- VERY beautiful. During our brief time in Rajasthan, I'd say it's the cleanest state we saw. We weren't in the south at all, but I'd love to go there for our next trip. Varanasi is amazing. We stayed at the Ganges View Hotel which is right on Asi Ghat and I'd highly recommend it. A couple of thoughts, even as fairly intrepid travellers: stay in the best hotels you can; and, handlers, guides and drivers are a must. India is one of the countries that's a "must see" because it's one of the places in the world that makes up the root of culture and religion. We went to the place (Sarnath outside of Varanasi) where Buddha gave his FIRST talk after he reached enlightenment. How amazing to be in that place! One thing that I found very different that other places I've travelled: just walking around isn't that easy. Ususally, we walk for miles every day. We didn't find that that was possible. I can't speak for the south. FYI: we stayed in Delhi, Varanasi, Khajuraho, Orchha, Agra and Udaipur. My advice: GO! and experience for yourselves.

i can appreciate your desire to be off the normal tourist track, but honestly you will miss a lot by not visiting some of the tourist places.

i do not think you can compare India to any central/south american country...they are just too different.

the centralized touristic companies all use small local companies to actually fulfill the touring requirements... it is all very local in the end.

the "real" India is all of India. it is a country stuck in the pasdt but yet moving forward at a lively pace.

You mention "parks and nature." That was the focus of my India visit and most of the trip had very few experiences that were "dirty, unsanitary, dusty, infuriating, full of touts and hassles, jam-packed with people."

There was an unruly herd of elephants that stirred up a lot of dust in Corbett, though, just before they crossed the Ramganga River.

In the cities and the trip to Agra did have elements of the things you mention. That's India, but that's not all there is to India by a longshot.

Hope you opt in and go!

Rhkkmk, Good to hear from you, while you're there (I'm jhealous!) and great that you are enjoyng your trip!!! You are right'"all very local in the end" so it depends on using a great (IMHO India-bsaed) company who know which locals (guides, etc) to call upon.

Julie, i think you and hubby would prefer "homestays" to hotels. There are really fantastic ones, some feel more like small hotels than someone's home, others are more of "welcome to our little house" feel. One I loved is Philipkuttys Farm, in the South. No trash, no dust!!

Yes, the trash and garbage is usually present in India, and pretty appalling. In beautiful Kerala--when you approach Cochin for the airport, you notice the plastic bags clogging the smal waterways--and much worse garbage, strewn everywhere, We raeched a town wher the garbage, instead of being scattered everywhere, was in neat mountain shaped piles. That town seemed fastidiously clean!

India--you get out of the airport, into a car, and in about five minutes have seen 100 amazing sites!! Girls balancing huge pitchers on their heads, guys selling hot food on corners, funny traffic signs, contrasts of rich and poor everywhere, graceful women with colorful saris, kids in school uniforms, etc etc etc.

For perfect cleanliness, i guess Switzerland is the place (I mean that seriously--but it reads like sarcasm) Places like that are beautiful but IMHO TOO much so. Give me the Indian version of Switzerland(Himachal Pradesh)-or Hawaii (Kerala). Picture postcard clean and perfect--nope. Fantastic and colorful and friendly and energizing and crazy-yes!

In some places (e.g. Ooty) there have been successful efforts to keep the towns litter free. You truly appreciate it after seeing most of the country

julies,
Trying to compare India with another poor country is a poor comparison. India is NOT a banana republic (south & central america). South East Asia is much hotter (unbearable hot), and countries are quite small, regional almost.

India is what you wish to see...full of life and culture. And you wish that they would just clean up a little. They are trying, I believe.

If numbers help...India has the 9th largest GDP in the world...it is the largest functioning democracy. And a secular state...welcomes all religions, races, and creeds. There is enough gold in India (held in private hands) that if you put it in the treasury, it would make India the richest country (maybe next to USA). Enough already...go to India and see for yourself....you will not be sorry.

This doesn't sound very articulate, but India is so much its "own thing" that it's difficult to compare it to other countries that I've been. I did find Vietnam easier--China, too, for that matter--but the experience of India is amazing and one that remains vivid to me.

Everywhere you go you are immersed in culture and practices that are thousands of years old, but of course the country is ever new and changing, as well. The colors and smells and tastes can be overwhelming at times, but they make jewel bright memories.

The south to me was more laid-back than the north; Varanasi is amazing and terrifying but I wouldn't want to have missed it. I did go on my own, but had a few local drivers associated with Delhi Bed and Breakfast in Delhi and Agra, and was escorted around by a local (church) family in the south. I loved Leh in Ladakh, but February wouldn't work for that. I was also looking into Shimla, which I'd love to visit someday. (By the way, Michael Palin's series, like Around the World in 80 Days and Himalaya are wonderful for watching about India; 80 Days is a bit old, but it is still wonderful.)

I like to travel much as you do, including spending a length of time in one place and getting about on my own (things like the bus from Poland to Druskininkai that left me off at a deserted station at 3AM) but India is a unique destination with unique demands. I was ready to come home after three weeks, but just as ready to go back again the next week. (But I couldn't.)

I think I've linked my trip for you before, but just in case, here it is again: http://www.fodors.com/community/asia...rip-report.cfm

PS: The Taj Mahal is one of the most touristed spots in the world. It's absolutely magical.