mary_m

I would really appreciate some advice on planning a two week trip to China with my boyfriend (we are both 27) during the last two weeks of this September. This trip will follow a two week trip (also in China) with my parents (both in their 60s).

I have already booked the trip with my parents through Abercrombie & Kent (travelled with them to Egypt years ago and loved it) during which we will visit the following cities:

Beijing (3 nights - Peninsula)
Xian (2 nights - Shangri La)
Shanghai (3 nights - Four Seasons)
Hong Kong (4 nights - Peninsula)

After my parents depart, my boyfriend will be flying in to join me for 13 nights (Sunday-Saturday) for a much less expensive, though still moderately luxury, trip than the one I will take with my parents. We would like to travel on our own, but would certainly like to take some guided day tours. We plan on visiting the same cities as I did with my parents (though I might convince him to change things up a bit). Right now I think our itinerary will look like this:

Beijing (3-4 nights - Novotel Peace Hotel)
Xian (1-2 nights - Sofitel or sheraton)
Shanghai (3-4 nights - Sofitel Hyland, Westin, or Le Royal Meridien)
Hong Kong (3-4 nights - hotel completely up in the air, but might splurge)

I'm a little nervous about travelling by ourselves in China (I took Mandarin in college and still speak some, but not much) and would love if all of the brilliant Fodorites could help me with some of my questions:

1. How does the itinerary look? Is there any place I really should go that I am not?Guilin? Chengdu? Maybe another country? Do the hotels seems like good choices for the mid-high end of the market?

2. Is there any problem with an unmarried couple travelling together in China? I haven't seen anything that would make me think there is a problem, but I would like to make sure.

3. What are the best companies to arrange day tours? I would especially like to arrange tours to see the great wall and the terrra cotta army.

4. What is the best way to arrange flights? Have people been satisfied with wacts.com?

5. My parents will be departing on a Friday and my boyfriend will be arriving on a Sunday. I think I would prefer to begin in Beijing and end in Hong Kong (begin with heavy touring and end with a bit more relaxation). Should I be at all nervous about travelling by myself from Hong Kong back to Beijing? I am also considering having my boyfriend meet me in Hong Kong first and then going Beijing-Xian-Shanghai and splurging a bit in Shanghai (where we can afford it more)?

Sorry for the barrage of questions. Thank you in advance for your help with this.

ekscrunchy

I don't know the answers to most of your questions, but I can tell you that it is very easy to travel on your own in China and that, having just returned from a 5 night stay, the Meridien in Shanghai is an asbolutely wonderful hotel in a great location.

lynclarke

First of all,if you answer a few questions i think more people can help you. Have you traveled independently before? Are you a flexible person? How much luggage will you have?

mary_m

Thanks ekscrunchy, good to hear.

Lyn, great advice. I have travelled independently several times in Europe, my boyfriend and I are certainly flexible, and I should not have much luggage (I think purchases in China could be the only problem).

To all, I know I asked a lot of questions and I certainly don;t expect any one person to answer all of them. Any help you have with any of the above inquiries would be awesome.

I am most concerned about whether there would be any problem with an unmarried couple sharing a hotel room. I found some sites that intimated that it was illegal but not enforced.

baaj

mary m

here's my take on your itinerary
Beijing (3-4 nights - Novotel Peace Hotel)
Xian (1 nights - sheraton)
Shanghai (2 nights Westin)
Guilin/Yangshuo (2 nights TBD) Yangshuo is much nicer than Guilin
-or- Lijiang (Yuannan) (2 nights TBD)
Hong Kong (2-3 nights - Peninsula or YMCA if harbor view is available)

-You'll be fine traveling to these destinations independently, so don't worry.

-Unmarried couples definitely wont be a problem at any of the more upmarket hotels, so no problem here. There's usually no problem for foreigners anyway.

-maybe someone else can help suggest day topurs for you.

-try elong.com or ctrip.com for travel arrangements

-Hong Kong is a great way to wrap up a China trip.

Lastly, plan to spend as little time in Xian as possible. See the Terracotta army - then move on.

Enjoy!

thursdaysd

"plan to spend as little time in Xian as possible" - totally disagree! See the Shaanxi Museum, the Great Mosque and the Taoist temple to the Eight Great Immortals, then wander round the Muslim quarter for somewhere to eat. Wandering around the back streets in other parts of town can also be interesting.

mary_m

Wow. Thanks for all of the excellent feedback. Yangshou seems like a fantastic idea.

karinkz

I would skip Shanghai entirely, and add a night in Xian--plus at least two nights in Guilin or Yangshou. I've been to China three times, and we've always traveled independently. Most of the people dealing with tourists speak English, so you should have no trouble. Knowing a little Mandarin is a big bonus! We were able to arrange English-speaking guides or taxi-drivers just by asking at the front desks of our hotels. You should have a great time! Karin

baaj

thursdaysd,

If you have a limited time in China, and are traveling as a tourist, the general consensus is that there are much better destinations to spend your time. And if you have the time, I would recommend Urumqi (Xinjiang) over Xian. Though you are absolutely right about the Muslim quarter to eat - the 'yangrou paomo' (a Xian specialty)is just amazing. I always looked forward to traveling to Xian on business, mainly so I could have the chance to eat the authentic stuff!

thursdaysd

baaj - if you "have the time" to make it to Xinjiang province, there are better places to spend your time than Urumchi. Kashgar, for starters. But getting there is half the fun (i.e. not flying), and the OP doesn't seem to be looking for that kind of trip.

Shanghainese

Baaj: I share your taste for "yangrou paomo", it warms your soul, you know most shanghai people look down on it as peasant food. Have you found it served anywhere in the U.S.?

asprilalee

"it warms your soul, you know most shanghai people look down on it as peasant food."

laughing, a typical saying by some shanghai people (sorry, I don't wanna say SHANGHAINESS).

baaj

You are right Shanghainese, there were only a few places in Shanghai where I could buy it (and although they would satisfy my craving, they weren't nearly as tasty as I could get in Xian). Most of the world's best food originally came for the peasants. French cuisine, for example. As the Shanghainese (the Shanghai people, not you) get wealthier and more cultured, I'm sure that they'll be more open to all of the great regional foods around China.

I haven't found it here in the US yet, but then again, I haven't really been looking for it. Maybe I'll have to head down to Chinatown and do some research!

mary_m

Thank you all for your excellent feedback. We have decided not to got to Xian and to go to Yangshuo and Guilin instead. Also, my boyfriend is going to meet up with me in Hong Kong and we are going to end our trip in Shanghai.

Our trip now looks like this:

HONG KONG (September 16-18) - Kowloon Hotel or similar

September 18: Evening flight to Guilin, transfer to hotel

GUILIN/YANGSHUO (September 18-20) - Hotel of Modern Art (Has anyone stayed here? It looks amazing)
- arrange rive cruise.
- might add a day here and see the Longsheng rice terraces

September 20: afternoon car to Guilin, plane to Beijing

BEIJING/Great Wall (September 20-25)

Hotel (20, 21, 22): Novotel Peace, Wangfujing Grand, other 4 star near Forbidden City
- arrange day tour to Summer Palace. Do you need a guide for the Forbidden City?

Hotel (23, 24): Commune by Kempinski
- Once again, this place looks awesome. Has anyone stayed here?

September 25: Overnight train to Beijing? Has anyone done this? Was it a pleasant experience? We would definitely get a deluxe soft sleeper.

SHANGHAI (September 25-29) (my boyfriend has a friend from college in Shanghai, so we will be spending more time there than we otherwise would, but wee might subtract a day and add it to either Yangshuo or Hong Kong)

Hotel (25, 26, 27, 28): Westin, Le Royal Meridien, or Grand Hyatt (We would like to splurge a bit here and are looking for a hotel with a fairly modern feel and a great spa. The Westin is in the lead right now.)

- What would be a good day trip from Shanghai?

September 29 - 4pm flight to US

We are thinking of waiting to arrange tour guides until we get there. Would anyone advise against this?

Once again, thank you all for your help.

thursdaysd

You don't need a live guide for the Forbidden city - pick up an audio guide on the way in - make sure it's the Roger Moore one, though. For info on deluxe soft sleeper on the Beijing-Shanghai train, see ekscrunchy's recent trip report. See www.seat61.com for general train info in China.

SeeSee

Here's my take on your questions:
1. Itinerary/Other locations:

Beijing: I feel you really don't need another 4 nights to see Beijing itself w/boyfriend. But there are some great side trips from Beijing:
a) Eastern Qing Tombs (3 hours East), which houses the crypts of Dowager Empresss Cixi and many other Qing Emperors. Each tomb built like a mini-forbidden city and not crowded with tourists. You can combine this with a visit to the Huang Ya Guan section of the Great Wall. We hiked this part of the wall and were the ONLY people there.
b) Datong - I highly recommend visiting this location. This would be an overnight trip from Beijing (4+ hours west of Beijing). It has several UNESCO heritage sights with lots of buddha carvings at Yun Guang Grotto and Hanging Monastery. Once out this way, you can continue onto Heng Shan, one of teh fame mountains in China. For Datong sights, I have a great local guide Anna Ling, you can make arrangements with her via email at([email protected]), she's a local English teacher that takes tourist around on the side and she speaks great English and really knows the history and stories of the sights.

Shanghai: Side trips must is the Yellow Mountain, this is quite fabulous and would be overnight trip from Shanghai. Daytrips can include Suzhou, Hanghzhou or water town of Nanxun.

2. Is there any problem with an unmarried couple travelling together in China?

No problem really unless you go far west, where there is a large muslim population. People in China are too polite to say anything otherwise.

3. What are the best companies to arrange day tours? I would especially like to arrange tours to see the great wall and the terrra cotta army.

For great wall, I'd recommend buying this guide book "The Great Wall of China: Beijing & Northern China (Bradt Travel Guide)" This discusses in detail all the different parts of the wall you can visit, so you can choose. I would say if you want to see the ones near Beijing, Simatai section is great.

As for tour companies, I don't really like the day tours, they tend to limit your time at sights to 2 hours or less and require a stop at a tourist trap "factory" for trinket shopping and food is not so good.

Both Terracotta soldiers and Great Wall are close enough to its respective towns that you can economically rent a private car and driver to take you for the day. You can try negotiating with a taxi but they're not always honest so for peace of mind, try using the concierge at the hotel you're staying.

4. What is the best way to arrange flights? Have people been satisfied with wacts.com?

The major airlines are China Eastern, Air China and Dragon Air (out of HK) for flights inside China. While you can see these airlines fligghts on say Orbitz, I believe you can only book them from the US in conjunction with flight originating from the US (ie if you want to just book flights within China, can't do orbitz type). However, airfare is regulated in China and only discounts are group discount offered by travel agents. So the easiest way is to use a travel agent for this.

5. Should I be at all nervous about travelling by myself from Hong Kong back to Beijing?

No problems flying from HK to PEK. All large modern airports and safe. China is generally very safe except for petty crimes.

As for splurge, the most expensive hotels will be in Hong Kong, hands down. Anywhere else in China, you'll be able to find cheaper.

6. Hotel Options:

a) Shanghai: I highly recommend JC Mandarin (it's a lovely hotel right across the street from the Ritz Carlton, at a very central location) and moderately priced at around US$185

Another great option in Shanghai if you'll be staying at least 5 days is the Shanghai Centre (it's attached to the Portman Ritz Carlton), it's the expat apts that you can rent a studio apt with kitchen for US$115-150/night and includes breakfast. You can book through their website or call to talk to an English speaking reservationist. This is the best value.

b) Beijing - Generally modestly priced also. We stayed at the Pennisula for US$195/night with breakfast via an internet rate directly booked on their website. The head Concierge there, Ms Echo is also fantastic.

c)Xian - Your 2 options are great choices. I'd add the Hyatt Xian. We stayed at this hotel at less than US$150/night including breakfast and the buffet breakfast there was one of the best I had anywhere in China.

d) Hong Kong: Since you'll be at the Pennisula in Kowloon with your parents, I'd recommend staying on HK island with your boyfriend. I like hotels in Causeway Bay, Admiralty or Wan Chai for modestly price, centrally located hotels. Admiralty - Conrad or Marriott; Causeway Bay - Langham or Park Lane.

As for travel direction, try to minimize flights, it just eats into your itinerary as China is a very BIG country. Also, since you'll be in China for an extended period of time and the Chinese prefer cash for everything, I suggest you open a bank account either with Citibank or HSBC and get an ATM card to access cash. Both banks have an abundance of location in HK and Shanghai. In Beijing, each has one ATM in downtown Beijing.

Independent travelling in China is not hard, just requires patience if you don't speak Chinese. Just remember to buy a tourbook (frommers) and tourist maps that have Chinese Characters on them so you can just point to where you need to go. But on an extended trip like yours, you will likely get tired trying to communicate with your hands. Also, print your HK and China hotel names from websites (go to the local sight to print the China name) and carry it with you, will come in handy to show tax driver at the airport.

Have Fun!

Marko_80

I just returned 4 days ago from traveling in Beijing, Xi'an and Shanghai. I highly recommend Xi'an. I wish I had more time than the 2 days I spent there.

Let me recommend the following to you: rent a bicycle and take a ride on the city wall. This was by far one of the best things I did throughout the whole trip. Keep in mind there is an entry fee to the city wall, a fee to rent the bikes and a deposit for the rental, which you will receive back when you return the bikes.

zengeos

I agree with those enjoying Xian.

Least expensive shopping I found in China.

The Old City wall and bell and drum towers were highlights, along with the Muslim Quarter, as others have mentioned. There are a number of interesting site to visit and things to do within 100 km of Xian. Xian was my favorite stop and, as several others have mentioned, I wish I had more than the 2 das I allotted for Xian back in 1999.

Mark-

Paulchili

Mary_M - your head must be spinning by now.
Just a couple of comments on your itinerary
1 If you do go to Guilin, DO NOT miss the Longsheng rice fields ( " a small great wall of China" in grandeur - awesome)
2 A great day trip from Shanghai is Suzhou; Tongli is a wonderful water town near Suzhou. If you have to chose between Suzhou & Hangzhou , I vote for Suzhou.
Good luck - you will love it, whatever you decide to do

mary_m

Though I imagine Xian is great, I think we are going to pass on it this time around and spend time in Guilin/Yangshuo instead.

Paul, sounds like great advice for both places. The rice terraces look amazing. How long of a trip is it to get to there from Guilin (we will likely be staying south of Guilin, so the trip will be longer, I assume)? I would love to see them, but we will likely only be in town for two nights.