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Hanoi questions including question on day trips: Perfume Pagoda or Tam Coc/Hoa Lu??

Hanoi questions including question on day trips: Perfume Pagoda or Tam Coc/Hoa Lu??

Old Dec 20th, 2007, 02:09 AM
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Hanoi questions including question on day trips: Perfume Pagoda or Tam Coc/Hoa Lu??

I will have 5 days in Hanoi next month (January). My plan so far includes one day trip to Perfume Pagoda. (I am also doing an overnight on Halong Bay) How difficult is the climb up to the site..Frommer's says a "hearty climb" of 30 minutes. The same book also says that the scenery around Tam Coc ("The Halong Bay of the rice fields") is more beautiful.

Looking for opinions on these day trips; I do not think I want to take both. Did you feel that one or both was essential?

Also, has anyone visited the small craft villages outside the city..known for silk weaving, wood carving, etc.?? Opinions of these??
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 03:25 AM
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Ekscrunchy,

We just came back from Hanoi and we visited the Perfume Pagoda. They've installed a gondola lift so only a minor climb to get to the station and another minor climb down(and out) into the cave. Two way lift tickets is 60,000 VND and I highly recommend it instead of climbing. Who said it will only take 1/2 hour? I've talked to my guide and she said it would take about 2 hours! It will be a whole day trip to go to the Perfume Pagoda and back to Hanoi.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 03:55 AM
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Thanks, Hanuman:

Did you feel it was worth the investment in time away from Hanoi itself?
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 04:54 AM
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Truthfully I got bored of Hanoi after just a couple of days so for me it was worth it. Two hours drive, 1 hour in a row boat, 1 1/2 hour at the pagoda, 10 minutes motorized boat back(something that you will have to arrange for your self) and another 2 hours back to Hanoi.

It was very misty and visibility was only perhaps 1 mile so we didn't get to appreciate the limestone outcrops that much. I'll post some photo for you in a few days, I have to convert them from raw to jpeg first.

For me the must do in Hanoi are the usual tours to the temple of literature, Ho's mausoleum, art museum, old quarter shopping and last, but not least, the water puppet show.

Found some nice local seafood restaurant so if you're interested let me know.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 05:07 AM
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Yes yes..very interested in the seafood restaurant and also in seeing your pics!

I did think about the effect the rain or fog would have on the scenic excursions..it really does not seem to be the best season to visit Hanoi and the north...
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 05:36 AM
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Ekscrunchy,

We asked our guide for a local type of seafood restaurant that was within a 5 - 10 minutes walk from the Sofitel Metropole(our hotel) and she, our guide, took us to Pho Bien seafood restaurant. 99% of the customers were well heeled locals and the seafood was very fresh, most alive from their tanks, and delicious. My favourites there were the mud crabs, oysters cooked with cheese, lobster(crayfish) and the morning glory wasn't bad either. Wine was cheap, compared to Thailand, but the food was the most expensive of our trip with exception to the $250++ a person for a meal with a 3 starred visiting Michelin chef at the Metropole.

http://www.phobien.com.vn/lienhe.asp

I'll let you know when my pictures are ready.

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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 05:58 AM
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Hanuman- Just out of curiousity, who was the visiting 3 star chef and how was the meal for $250++?

Eks-I will be following the Vietnam portion of your trip with interest as I'm still hoping to go this summer. However, I don't have my FF tickets yet so it may not happen!
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 06:28 AM
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eks - this was my post on a previous thread on Tam Coc:

I also did this as a day trip from Hanoi, but I went with a tour arranged by one of the travel agencies in the old town. Minibus ride, then a visit to quite a nice temple and an indifferent buffet lunch. The ride in small wooden boats took about 2 hours out and back, and there was fairly heavy pressure to buy souvenirs, both from one of the women rowing the boat, and from other boats at the turnround point. Although the scenery was interesting, the trip was disappointing after Halong Bay. It's advertised as Halong Bay among the paddy fields, but we didn't see any paddy fields. I'd recommend skipping it in favor of more time in the city, especially if you're already fitting Halong Bay into a four day visit.

Spend the time in the old town in Hanoi.

$250 for a meal in Vietnam? Unbelievable...
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 06:30 AM
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Hanuman..I made a note of PhoBien in my book. I will give it a try. I m wondering about these small craft villages outside Hanoi, in particular Bat Trang (ceramics) and Van Phuc (silk)...both south of Hanoi.

Kristina...I certainly hope you can take the trip! Your website is fantabulous! I hope I can be of some help to you...!!
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 06:33 AM
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They have a lift to the Perfume Pagoda?? I was there several years ago, and it was a good (or bad) two hour+ climb. We enjoyed it, but I don't think it is a must do. I think one out of town trip from Hanoi is a must, choose one, and it sounds like you are going to Halong Bay.

I really enjoyed Hanoi and five full days in Hanoi (plus one outside of Hanoi) was just right - we didn't get bored, but there were still things on our list we didn't see or do.

In addition to the items on Hanuman's list, (although we did not go visit Uncle Ho) I would add the Ethnographic Museum as a must. Hanoi is a city of lots of fascinating small museums, and we visited the History Museum, the Museum of the History of the Revolution, the Women's Museum, and several others.

Do visit CraftLink when you go to The Temple of Literature and Fine Arts Museum. A fair traade crafts store, we bought lots there and at the branch at the Ethnographic Museum.

There are several restaurants we loved, and we hear from others that they are still excellent: Club L'Opera, across the street from the Metropole, Brother's Cafe, a buffet where they grill you fresh seafood, meat or poultry located in the courtyard of an old monastery, and Cau Cau, in the DeSyloia Hotel.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 06:40 AM
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The chef was Regis Marcon, I've not heard of him before but the food was good but not the best I've had for a 3 star chef. The $250 with tax and service came out to $287 per person but at least it was with wine pairing.

The ceramic village and silk village took about an hour driving and it was not my cup of tea. The best souvenirs we got was from "Craftlink" which I found by searching Fodor's trip reports and the best silk, design and quality wise, was from Khaisilk.

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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 06:49 AM
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Kathie,

Yes a gondola lift built by an Austrian company! They would not run the lift unless there's enough customers to fill at least 2 gondola's worth! They have 3 stations, one at the bottom, one half way up and the top station.

I've read your report and we visited craflink because of you - great advice my wife really like the place! Is the "Ethnographic Museum" the one next to the Temple of Literature? If that is the one they have some great arts.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 07:19 AM
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Thanks again to both of you. Hanuman..what were those villages like? Total tourist traps?

At this point I am leaning toward not doing any day trips from Hanoi. Unfortunately, I have already paid for one in the package I worked out with the travel agent..so instead of doing the scheduled Perfume Pagoda daytrip, maybe I can try to work out an out-pf-town trip that would be more ineresting..even if just for a few hours..what do you all think about this? I can decide on the spot..depending on the weather, etc...
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 01:14 PM
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I was in Hanoi late last January. I didn't go to Perfume Pagoda, but did go to Tam Coc (as well as Halong Bay). Halong Bay was great, but it was really overcast and I didn't get very many good pictures. However, I got better pictures at the Tam Coc area due to the better weather. The scenery isn't as spectacular as Halong Bay, but it was still neat. The rice paddies were just being planted when we were there, so it wasn't as green as I suppose it could have been. There's also a neat old temple (can't remember the name) near Tam Coc that I really liked.

As the other poster (thursdaysd) says, the pressure to buy stuff from the tour boat guides and others is high. The tour boat rowing ladies were the only people in Vietnam to ask me for a tip during our 2 weeks in Vietnam.

The area seemed to be the poorest area we visited in Vietnam. It had a bit of an off-the-beaten path feel to it, even though other tourists were there. I'd recommend going there, but it won't be the highlight of your trip.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 01:28 PM
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Hanuman, the Ethnographic museum is in a different area of town, quite a ways from the Temple of Literature area. I had read wonderful reviews of it, so we visited there the first day when I was less oriented to Hanoi, so I can't tell you much about where it is.

I'm glad you and your wife had good finds at CraftLink - I loved the place. I bought some really unusual textiles for a friend who is a collector as well as some wonderful Khmer double ikat.

eks, we did visit the "silk village" - remember it is not at all a village, but a collection of shops. They also did not have any silk weaving going on there, just lots of (mostly) Chinese silks. We did purchase fabulous reversible silk bathrobes there as gifts - they were beautiful and very inexpensive. It was by no means a must-see place.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 02:50 PM
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I enjoyed walking around the rice fields of Tam Coc more than the row boat ride.

Thursdaysd is right about the sales pressure, it's not like you can wander away from the rowboat, you're pretty much a captive audience! I did buy a small token from our lady, decided not to bargain. I was rather taken aback by her request for a tip at the end, wished I hadn't bought then.

In spite of this, I found Tam Coc to be more enjoyable than Halong Bay which was pretty overcast. We did not visit the Perfume Pagoda.
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 03:05 PM
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We were going to go to Halong Bay as well but the weather wasn't very good and decided to stay around Hanoi instead.

As Kathie have said the "village" are not really villages and in hindsight we could have bought the same things from in Hanoi. There are some looms, about 10, in the silk village but they were there for show only.

Regarding the food in Hanoi. There's a chain of restaurant call "Pho 24" and it's a very clean, inexpensive and a/c place to eat Pho. Do drop by if you happen to pass one and try a bowl of either chicken or beef pho. They also have very good creme caramel for dessert!

http://www.pho24.com.vn/index.php
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Old Dec 20th, 2007, 08:08 PM
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If you have to choose between Tam Coc and Perfume Pagoda, I'd pick Tam Coc, as some other posters have recommended. Though I went ten years ago and it was pretty tranquil, without the aggressive selling or demands for tips people have mentioned. That would be pretty aggravating. I didn't think Perfume Pagoda was really worth the trip. It had rained that morning and the hike up was hard and slippery. Even if you take a gondola up, the payoff at the top is pretty limited.

The Museum of Ethnology is in a western suburb of Hanoi called Cau Giay. Ask your hotel to write it down the museum in Vietnamese for your taxi driver. They are closed Mondays.

Pho 24 is good pho (and it's clean and air conditioned), but southern style (the chain started in HCMC), so make sure you go to a local place as well. I love the beef pho at Pho Tinh at (#11?#13) Lo Duc, south of Hoan Kiem Lake, because they have a rich dark broth there that's less typical.

bk


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Old Dec 21st, 2007, 03:00 AM
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Since the Perfume Pagoda trip is not generating any enthusiasm I will see about substituting Tam Coc, if the weather is decent. Or maybe just take a pass and spend time in the Ethnography Museum!

Now I am seeing one of the downsides to using a travel agent to book a trip like this; all of these details that one would normally just decide on the spot have to be discussed so far in advance..

I remember eating at Pho 24 in Saigon; will try both that and the more local spots (Pho Tinh) since I will not care about a/c in Hanoi..

Thanks, everyone!!
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Old Dec 21st, 2007, 07:41 AM
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eks, I'm not clear whu you need to make all of these decisions in advance with a travel agent. Is you agent setting up full day guides every day and telling you you must book excursions through them? Why can't you ask for a guide for a day or two in Hanoi and wing the rest?
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