rhkkmk

BH is the best!!!

mcbeanie

Hanuman: Tongtip and I are still in touch and have tentatively arranged to have dinner together, with our DHs in December. We just "hit it off" through the years and have kept in touch. Since she is in the USA so much we have trouble "crossing paths." But it looks like December is going to work!!!!!

With mutual friends like Carol Simpson and Tongtip, we will have to meet this December. DH and I will be at the Adelphi for 6 wks in Dec/Jan. ~~ maybe, Carol, too. So tentatively a mini-GTG at the PL? Hope to meet you there!

Sandra

Hanuman

Can do Sandra!

lcuy

Khunwilok, what hosptial would you reccommend over Bumrungrad?

rhkkmk

patpong general and soi cowboy medical center are among the tops in the world

khunwilko

Medical Malpractice in Thailand: Patient Rights in the Medical Tourism Industry
by Jason Armbrecht

25 August 2008

Read This Before Packing Your Bags

http://www.thailawforum.com/Medical-...hailand-2.html

Curt1591

What, if any, actual experience do you have with Bumrungrad?

My personal experience with the place has been exceptional. My personal experience with Stateside doctors has been downright scary!

But, after reading Jason Armbrecht's little piece, I may have to rethink. After all, who should know better than a travel writer?!

khunwilko

Isn't that rather a case of "shooting thee messenger"?

Kathie

As has been discussed before here on the Asia Forum, medical malpractice issues are very different in the US than anywhere else in the world. Some recommend buying an insurance policy stateside to cover you in case of medical errors, etc.

Elainee

I have experience with complicated surgical medical care only in US. Even here there is a need to hire private nursing assistance for the days right after release from hospital. We even hired nursing aides in the hospital planning to hire them for home care if we liked them. This is one time to "throw money at it" to make sure your medical experience works for you. Get all the help you think you could possible need, stay where you feel most comfortable, and recover excellently. All hospitals have a list of home health aids. Best to try them out before you leave the hospital.

khunwilko

JCAHO-accredited - Bumrungrad doesn't claim this on their web site - They state it is accredited by JCI a separate company set up by JCAHO to cater for medical establishments outside the US - it has different criteria and of course charges for this as well as passing over 90% of all institutions it examines.

I think one has to bear in mind too that this accreditation is developed by the very "deeming" system for the US healthcare that many medical tourists are fleeing from.

lcuy

I don't think any patients are fleeing from the US healthcare system because the health care is poor. They are going to Bangkok because the care is good and is much, much cheaper than in the US.

Curt1591

But you can't sue the crap out of the doctors!

Kathie

KW, I think you misunderstand hospital accreditation.

Yes, a few years ago, JCAHO decided to have a separate entity for accrediting hospitals outside the US. I used the acronym for the over-arching body as it is the one most familiar to people in the US.

All accrediting bodies charge for accreditation - it's an expensive process. The accrediting body requests vast amounts of information to be reviewed , first, to determine eligibility for accreditation, then, to prepare for the accreditation visit. A accreditation team then visits the medical center (usually 6-8 site visitors for about a week) to review the institution and see whether it meets criteria. Then a full report is written up, with explicit detail about any items that need improvement. BTW, JCAHO and its subsidiaries are all non-for-profit.

The vast majority of institutions reviewed should pass - the criteria are published, and medical centers are expected to strive to meet the criteria. A medical center shouldn't request accreditation if they don't believe they meet the criteria. Still there are medical centers that fail. And virtually every medical center is given some items to improve.

As Lcuy correctly points out medical tourism (at least from the US) is not about fleeing "bad" medical care. Indeed, the US has excellent medical care if you have the insurance to pay for it. But millions in the US do not have insurance, and without insurance the US healthcare system is prohibitively expensive.

If you are interested in this whole issue of medical care in the US, let me recommend T.R. Reid's book, The Healing of America.

khunwilko

So we're agreed that it is JCI that does the accreditation for Bumrungrad and several other hospitals in Thailand?

I'm don't agree that US has universally acceptable healthcare - if if that is what you are implying or that the JCAHO accredited hospitals are all "good". However if you take into account the cost of these hospitals "deemed" by JCI or JCAHO you have to agree that US patients- who are not the only customers here in Thailand - are fleeing from something - even if it is only the price.

i am familiar with accreditation but you seem to overlook how this is done elsewhere - and what monitoring systems are used in the Middle East, Europe Australia and of course Thailand.
Also you need to look at the percentages of hospitals that are accredited by various organisations.i think it's fair to say that the US has possibly the most fractured healthcare system in the "Western" world and you rally need to look carefully at why so many people come to Thailand as a result of the shortcomings of the healthcare system in their home countries - if their were no shortcomings they wouldn't ned to come ..........however, what I believe is overlooked by those who come here are the SERIOUS shortfalls in the Thai system.
I sometimes feel you are so desperate to prove or suggest that I'm wrong about something that you quickly jump on rather spurious half-hearted arguments - which in the end usually end up in the bin.

Curt1591

Beyond the ability to sue the hell out of them, what are the "shortcomings" of the system.

On I see is that if one wanders into a "big ticket" facility, the front desk will usually "diagnose" and send the patient to a specialist. This can, IMO, lead to a bit of myopia. Specialists often tend to restrict their diagnosis within their specialty.

But, there actually are GPs in many Thai hospitals. Most patients simply don't request to see them, choosing to go strait to the "expert".

Kathie

KW, I think you misunderstand my post as well as the whole issue of accreditation. Accreditation doesn't deem a hospital as "good" but as meeting certain criteria (for say, Infection control, electrical safety, documentation of medical procedures, peer review). You want any hospital you use to meet those kind of criteria. In the US, any hospital that loses its JCAHO accreditation can no longer bill insurance.

The US has the least equitable health care system of any first world country. If you have lots of money or excellent insurance, you can access the highest tech health care in the world. If you do not have either lots of money or insurance, one's access to health care is worse than many third world countries. Access to affordable care is why people from the US seek medical care in other countries. Take a look at the book I referenced above.

Guenmai

ttucker: McBeanie, her husband, and I had dinner together in Bangkok around 2006 I think it was. It was after she had had the above mentioned neck lift and eye lift and her husband had had his nose procedure done. So we talked about it at dinner and I even made a note of the doctor that they had used as a friend here in L.A., who goes to Bangkok regularly, was thinking of having a procedure done.

As for McBeanie and her husband the eye lift, neck lift and nose correction job looked so natural until I couldn't even tell that a procedure had been done. I remember commenting about it. They really looked good. Happy Travels!

khunwilko

Kathie - we are broadly in agreement.

Firstly accreditation does NOT mean a "good" hospital. (BTW - The criteria are not the same as those imposed by JCAHO...there is a lot of criticism as they appear to be very "close" to the very people they are accrediting)

and Mr Reid's book essentially tells Americans what everyone outside the States already knows.
(I've ordered his book on the EU)

mcbeanie

To All the Bumrungrad Fans!

We are scheduled for comprehensive physicals and dental work in December. I have NEVER been disappointed, and am looking forward to this year's visit.

I repeat: TONGTIP IS THE BEST! Enough said.

Sandra (McBeanie)