WillJame

Here's an itinerary suggested by the tour company V'explore Travel. We asked for something that included a beach vacation, and a total of 3-4 destinations within 2 weeks. That seemed to mean flying to/from HCMC rather than Hanoi. This is for the 2nd and 3rd weeks of March. We'd be flying to Vietnam on Aeroplan (Star Alliance) miles with ANA and OZ from Japan. We could choose Hanoi instead but that would put us on Thai Air, which we would prefer to avoid. The obvious compromise in asking for fewer cities, and being mostly in the south and central parts, is not getting to see Hanoi, Sapa, etc. this time. Except for Nha Trang--where I'll ask for a substitute--the hotels seem very good. The flights and tours (details omitted here) by private car for a couple in their 60s look excellent, and the whole package reasonable.
More details on request, but for now, how does this look?
Will
Day 1 Arrival in Saigon
Day 2 Saigon
Day 3 Saigon – My Tho – Can Tho
Day 4 Can Tho – Saigon
Day 5 Saigon – Flight to Nha Trang
Day 6 Nha Trang
Day 7 Nha Trang
Day 8 Nhatrang – Flight to Danang – Hoi An
Day 9 Hoi An
Day 10 Hoi An
Day 11 Hoi An – Hue
Day 12 Hue
Day 13 Hue- Saigon
Day 14 Saigon Departure

Craig

Just curious - we flew Thai Air from Hanoi to Bangkok and they were fine. We have flown them on numerous other occasions and never had a problem. Thai is pretty much on par with Asiana and ANA in my opinion...

Can't really comment on your itinerary but I would not miss Hanoi on account of what airline flies from there.

WillJame

I didn't phrase that well and there are other options for flying to Hanoi. It's only a partial reason. Let's say I do want to avoid Thai Air....
The thread on this board "Has Thai Air Lost Its Mind" has about 100 posts, some of them mine, relating to problems. Ten years ago I thought they were terrific; two years ago I reversed my view.
The last straw was on the day I was to leave BKK and was reconfirming the flight. Thai Air told me they'd scratched us from the flight because we were "no shows"on the inbound flight--patently absurd. And that I would have to re-bopk for the flight leaving that very evening--if there was space--by going back to Air Canada whose reward miles I was using. Imagine the hours spent proving we were indeed on that inbound flight, and then using a Thai-speaking hotel clerk to reticket us through Air Canada, etc etc.
I just about decided on that occasion that if Thai Air was the last airline left on earth, then my flying days would have at that point come to an end. As for being on a par with OZ and NH, check some of the online reviews.

Craig

I'm sorry you had such a bad experiences with Thai. I went back and read some of the other posts on the airline and I can see that you are not the only one that has been disappointed.

My putting TG on par with OZ and NH is based on my own recent experiences in April 2009 (HAN-BKK) and February 2010 (BKK-VNS and BOM-BKK). However, I was bummed when Thai eliminated its JFK-BKK flight a few years ago - that was a decision based on economics though.

Sorry to hijack your thread. Hopefully rhkkmk and others will chime in on your itinerary at some point.

Hanoihappyland

You can cut one day from Nha Trang and Hoi An or skip Hue to spend in Hanoi and Halong bay. It's worth to visit!!!

RedKite

Your itinerary looks fine to me WillJame. The transfers will take a substantial chunk from your travelling days, so if you tried to fit in any more destinations your holiday would be too rushed and your overall experience would suffer as a consequence.

WillJame

The last 2 posts above clarify what's at stake in the tradeoff we're making. Adding on Hanoi from Hoi An means another 800 km of travel in each direction, i.e., half the length of the entire country of Vietnam. Without doubt I believe that Hanoi is very worth visiting, but so are lots of places. It's just I can't see dropping in this time while we're in the neighbourhood.

Cicerone

While you asked for 3-4 destinations from your agent, you in fact have 6 places in 2 weeks, plus a lot of back and forth to HCM. That would break my own personal rule of no more than 4 places in 2 weeks, and it seems you would prefer to have fewer stops as well. I think you will find this quite a rushed pace.

I don’t understand so much time in HCM and also that you are going to HCM and not Hanoi. I would actually say to skip HCM as much as possible. A day if really necessary to see the main things, otherwise it really is not that interesting, esp. compared to Hanoi, IMO. Even skipping HCM entirely and doing a more northern itin would be perfectly acceptable, IMO.

I am not entirely sure that My Tho and Can Tho would be on my itin if I only had two weeks, esp the very small amount of time you have dedicated to them. I believe you will spend almost as much time on the road <i>getting</i> to and from those places as you will actually spend seeing them. You are looking at about 4 hours on the road for 1 night.

While Nha Trang is certainly pretty, there are also beaches in Danang (fairly world famous ones) and Hoi An. There are also beaches in Hue. I am not sure you need to go to Nha Trang just for a beach. If you include Hanoi, you could consider Halong Bay as another beach alternative (and perhaps a sort of substitute for My Tho and Can Tho.)

If you want to avoid Thai Air, the easy thing to do is go to Vietnam via Singapore on Silk Air. They have non-stop flights to Hanoi as well as to Danang (and of course HCM), so you could begin or end your vacation with time at the beach. Your post says you are coming from Japan, but unless your trip includes Japan as an itin stop rather than simply a flight connection, you might try to re-arrange miles to get to Singapore first (SQ is also part of Star Alliance I believe).

WillJame

Thanks, Cicerone, for these comments and observations. Actually, I'm sorry to have given in to the whim to take an unwarranted potshot at Thai Air. I just checked again and see that by juggling dates a bit we could just as readily fly from Osaka to Hanoi via Asiana, going through Seoul. Japan, is by the way, a destination for us--we'll be there from March through July.
The only dedicated time we spend in HCMC is Day 2. It is our arrival and departure point, and we transit through once from Can Tho to Nha Trang. I gather you don't think the Mekong Delta tour on Days 3-4 is really that worthwhile. Why not? Just the travel time to get there from HCMC?
We focused on the south rather than the north because of the beaches and temperatures in March. I see that the average high for Hanoi is 22, and for Halong Bay 17-18, compared with 27 at Nha Trang. (We're coming from Canada via Japan and want some warmth.)
In effect, you're suggesting, if we stick to our general plan, skipping the Delta and Nha Trang, and opting for most of the time in Hoi An, Danang, and Hue? Or going to Hoi An, Dalang, and Hue from Hanoi rather than HCMC? What about Phuo Quoc as an alternative beach destination?

sf7307

WillJame, we haven't been yet (our trip is early next year), but in planning, we were faced with the same choices as you. I think the primary question is how much time you want to spend at your beach destination, and whether you want to go to more than one beach destination. If you're going to spend a week at the beach, then of course, the rest of your itinerary will be different than if you only spend 3 days at the beach. We chose HoiAn (after looking into Phuo Quoc and Nha Trang, too) in part because it would be a good destination even without the beach, but also has the beach to add to its desirability. But we're only spending 3 days at the beach part-way through a 3-week trip (Vietnam, Siem Reap and Hong Kong).

Jen

As one who actually really liked Saigon, I have to agree with Cicerone and others that given a choice between Saigon and Hanoi, I'd pick Hanoi in a heartbeat. As for the beach, I thought the beach (Cua Dai)a couple of kms away from Hoi An was lovely. I'd skip Nha Trang and spend a couple extra days in Hoi An to get your beach time in- you could split your time there a couple of days in a hotel in town, and a couple of days in a hotel out on the beach.

CFW

That's what we're doing. Skipping Nha Trang and enjoying beach time in Hoi An. We had planned to go to Can Tho from Saigon and then fly to Hanoi from there to save the drive time back to Saigon for another overnight there, but the Vietnam Air flight from Can Tho to Hanoi is no longer operating so we cut out Can Tho. From what everyone on fodors & other travel sites have said, Hanoi is not to be missed.

Cicerone

If this were my trip, I would include Hanoi, Hue and Hoi An, and would include a few days beach time at Hoi An (see the Nam Hai hotel, http://www.ghmhotels.com/. You can drive or even bike into town, or stay in town first for a few days and them move to the beach.). But that is just me. I seriously could spend a week in Hue trying to get to all the tombs, riding up and down the river, and just enjoying the citadel area. I would also try to include Sapa, but you don’t have a lot of time, and it may be too cool for you in March in Sapa.

I don’t find the Delta area towns to be all that interesting. It is a longish drive to get there, and then things are kind of unorganized. There are not really any historical sights or temples that I can recall. (Hoi An and esp Hue have a lot to offer by contrast.) You can spend time looking at the little water side areas, but personally I don’t find a lot of interest in it. It’s not unlike many areas of Bangkok. If you spent time in remoter parts of HCM you would see much the same as well (not quite so much of a water focus though, but certainly the same ramshackle living conditions.) I think you will find My Tho and Can Tho to be far more built-up than the guide books may lead you to believe, they are not small villages by any means. (Can Tho has a population of more than a million.) I would not say there is a need to make a dedicated trip to see it. That may just be a personal prejudice on my part. But the main thing to me is that you are only doing this for 1 night, which seems like a lot of travel for limited sightseeing. You don’t seem to have time to take any boat trips up the river (an hour’s ride does not count, IMO, you would barely leave the town in that amount of time). If you want to see the Delta, then take the time to do it.

I can see your point on temperatures in south versus north for beach time, so Halong Bay may not be as attractive to you. But 22 C in Hanoi is <i>quite</i> a pleasant temp, IMO, and perfect for touring. I would agree that if you can get flights from HCM to Danang or Hue that may be a better option so you can skip HCM. Look at flight schedules for going from HCM and Hanoi to the central areas and see which works best for you.

The problem with Phuo Quoc is that it is a bit isolated. You have to fly, or take a combination of a long drive to/from HCM and then the ferry. Again, as you already plan to go to Hue and Hoi An, I don’t see the point of spending a day each way getting to Phuo Quoc, esp as you have a limited time. However, if you can get good flights and you want to do this, that is up to you. (I think there are flights from Can Tho to Phuo Quoc so if you keep a southern itin, that may work, see the Vietnam Air website. I still think it will take a day on each end to do this as to get anywhere else you will have to go via HCM. If you think Thai Air is bad, wait until you try Vietnam Air!)

WillJame

Many many thanks for the feedback. I've asked for a northern itinerary, with only 3-4 places,and this is what just came back. It's $864 per person plus $148 airfare (business class) for Han-Hui and Dad-Han. Except for the days when there are tours offered, the only meals are breakfasts. At a glance, it looks much less hectic, though I have yet to check the hotels. I'd be grateful for any comments. The ones to date are much appreciated.
Will

Day 1/ Mar 7th Arrival in Hanoi
(HANOI BOUTIQUE HOTEL II (3*) deluxe/www.hanoiboutiquehotel.vn
Day 2/ Mar 8th Hanoi easy day (B)
Day 3/ Mar 9th Hanoi city tour (B,L)
Day 4/ Mar 10th Ha Noi – Ha Long (B,L,D) with guide on board
(Oriental sails/ deluxe) www.orientalsails.com
Day 5/ Mar 11th Halong Bay – Hanoi (B)
(HANOI BOUTIQUE HOTEL II (3*)deluxe/ www.hanoiboutiquehotel.vn
Day 6/ Mar 12th Ha Noi – Hue (B)
(Romance hotel/ 3 star /Superior) www.romancehotel.com.vn
Day 7 /Mar 13th Hue (B,L)
Day 8 /Mar 14th Hue easy (B)
Day 9 /Mar 15th Hue - Danang – Hoi an (B,L)
(River Beach Resort/ 4 star/deluxe) www.river-beachresort.com
Day 10/Mar 16th Hoi An half day tour (B)
Day 11/ Mar 17th Hoi An easy (B)
Day 12/ Mar 18th Hoi An easy (B)
Day 13/ Mar 19th Hoi An easy (B)
(Vinh Hung Resort/ 3 star/Superior) www.vinhhungresort.com
Day 14/ Mar 20th Hoi An easy (B)
Day 15/ Mar 21st Hoi An easy (B)
Day 16/ Mar 22nd Hoi An easy (B)
Day 17/ Mar 23rd Hoi An - Ha Noi & departure (B)

Jen

That looks like a great trip to me. If it were me, I'd take a day, maybe two away from Hoi An and add it/them to Hanoi. Or maybe one to Hanoi and one more to Halong Bay? Can't comment on that really, I did not do Halong Bay on my trip. Enjoy!

CFW

Agree. Seems like now you are spending too many days in Hoi An. I think you can stay at a beach resort for the entire time in Hoi An as I understand it is only a few minutes from the beach into the town, and as Jen says you could add some time in Hanoi.

WillJame

Yes, as it is we only have two full days in Hanoi b/c we arrive very late the first night. Maybe one day could come off Hoi An to be added to Hanoi. An extra day on Halong Bay seems to be for adding activities like rock climbing or kayaking. Not sure if we'd go for that.
The present arrangement in Hoi An, which we didn't specifically request, fulfils Cicerone's idea to "stay in town first for a few days and then move to the beach." Both the Hoi An resorts look to be very good; not sure about Hanoi Boutique Hotel 2 in Hanoi.
The flight from Danang back to Hanoi leaves at 19:00, arriving at 20:10. Our return flight to Japan leaves Hanoi at 23:20. Can anyone speak to the reliability of Vietnam Air, even given it's a short flight and a three-hour connection?

CFW

I think you should do a little more research with guide books and websites. You can also get more info about hotels on TripAdvisor. The Hanoi Elegance hotels in Hanoi get great reviews on both tripadvisor and Fodors.

Jen

I will add this: you will be sorry if you don't spend more time in Hanoi than your original ititerary has allowed. You can see the "Things In The Guide Book" in Hanoi in 2 nights, but that's not what is great about Hanoi... Hanoi is about wandering the old quarter, getting lost in the wind-y streets, tasting the street food on offer... don't get me wrong, "Things in the Guide Book" are well worth your while, but Hanoi has much more to offer.

Ladouca

Jen is absolutely right IMO you need to add more time in Hanoi and another day in Halong Bay. Staying one night in Halong Bay for 7 hours travel time back and forth is too quick to appreciate - the bay is beautiful and very relaxing when you have the time to savour it.