A grouchy old man’s trip to Japan and China
Nov 17th, 2007, 09:26 AM
#21
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Monica, the weather was perfect the entire time we were in China and Japan. During the day time I often wore a short sleeve shirt and then a long sleeve at night. Hong Kong was short sleeve weather every day. I wore a sport coat some nights but not necessarily because it was cool, but because I like to dress up a bit when we go to the fancier restaurants. The only time I took out my light weight jacket was the day we went to the Wall in Beijing and even then I probably didn't need it. Our trip started in early October and went for about 3 weeks.
Nov 18th, 2007, 09:13 AM
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On with the story. If anyone has read this thread it seems like its getting long so I will try to shorten it for the balance of our trip. We arrived in Shanghai at the domestic airport, not Pudong Airport. If at all possible this is the way to go. Just a short taxi ride as opposed to a very long one. A long taxi line though so a hotel limo would have been a better bet. On the ride in one sees many modern buildings. Not a real surprise. I was expecting that. We arrived at the JW Marriott and were very pleased with our selection. A beautiful hotel. Views from the lobby (20+ stories up) are great. Great rooms and concierge lounge. Best hotel of my trip. And the location was perfect. There are probably numerous other hotels with good locations but I think ours was the best suited for us. We were on Nanjing Road and loved walking to the East on it which turns into a pedestrian mall. Wow, what a difference from Beijing. In Beijing it seems to be all about image. In Shanghai its all about business. In Beijing we never experienced street vendors or beggars. In Shanghai you can’t walk 10 paces without encountering 5 vendors approaching you, lightly touching your arm trying to stop you. And very persistent. They will not take no for an answer. They will walk for you for 5 minutes or so. At first we enjoyed the vendors. But after 30 minutes of walking down the street it does become annoying. Everyone is selling knock offs. Most have catalogues of Coach or other fancy purses or Rolex or Cartier or other watches. But they don’t sell them right there on the street. They try to get you to go with them down an alley or a side street where they pull out the actual merchandise. I don’t think this is unsafe, but apparently the government tries to maintain a token control over the counterfeit trade. And of course there are numerous vendors set up on the street selling all sorts of items and junk. But what really stands out is the huge number of beggars on the street. In Beijing we never saw a homeless person (that we knew of) or a beggar. Here they are everywhere. And not just panhandlers, but the most pitiful disfigured people imaginable. I could not resist digging into my pockets for them. But after a while I realize that I can’t give to everyone I see. There are just too many of these poor souls. That part of it aside it was a great first afternoon of walking the street. After about an hour we came to an area where there is a tram that traverses the pedestrian area and we took that back to virtually where we started. That night we ate at an Italian restaurant recommended by the hotel in a redone area not far from the hotel. A neat area with lots of restaurants and a few shops. The restaurant was just fair.
The next day we took a half day tour booked by the hotel concierge. Not badly priced. With a driver and an English speaking guide. Pamela Shaw. Sounds American but she is Chinese with perfect English. It was a good tour. I highly recommend a tour in Shanghai. We went to one of the Temples there and then saw a good part of the City, including going over the river to Pudong. Amazing. While Shanghai has been an international business center for many years, its been less than 20 years that the Chinese government started encouraging foreign investment and ownership there. And Pudong is evidence to what can happen when capitalism is allowed in. Huge modern buildings everywhere. And not just a few. Its like a whole new City built in under 20 years. What a boon to the economy this must have been. As you already know from my earlier posting I am more entranced about business than most normal tourists, so I loved being in Shanghai. We toured for about 3 ½ hours then had the guide drop us off at an area that housed many artists. That was kind of disappointing to us. As advertised there are many modern artists, but I guess we were expecting a different look to the art. We like modern art but their art was showing Mao and other figures in a modern manner. But art is in the eye of the ….well you know. When we left we both felt like it was a waste of time. But quite honestly the area reminded us of Chelsea in NYC, which we also did not care for. So its us not the area. But this was one time where DW agreed with my boredom.
We got back to the hotel in time for the Saturday lunch buffet at the Marriott. Boy, that was a buffet. Everything you could ask for. Chinese, American, Japanese. And all of it was excellent. We were so filled that we canceled out on the one dinner reservation we had made that I was looking forward to. M on the Bund. We did take the taxi over to the Bund area and walked up and down it for a while. We went into many of the elegant shops there, not to buy, just to see them. And we peeked into many of the fancy restaurant there. So that was enough for us. We did not cross over to the actual Bund, or walkway, right on the River. We did that later that night, after going back to our hotel for a rest, and that was lots of fun. At night time the Bund lights up and even more spectacularly you see the lights on the tall buildings in Pudong across the river from the Bund. It is quite beautiful to see. We walked along the water and of course there were vendors everywhere, but they were not as aggressive as on the street. After a while we stopped at a small dumpling restaurant overlooking the water for a snack. While we were eating we saw most of the people seeming to leave the area. We could not figure out why until a few minutes later I looked out and realized that all of the building lights were turning off. It was just 11PM, but apparently either from a conservation effort, which I doubt, or from an effort to make sure the population does not enjoy itself too much (maybe that’s too cynical?), the lights are turned off then every night. By the way this night was a Saturday night and most of the people on the Bund at that time appeared to be local young couples and other locals having a good time. Anyway, we soon left the restaurant and headed back to the hotel.
The next day was devoted to my wife shopping for presents. We walked to the West on Nanjing Road for a ways then walked back and stopped at a building just a couple of blocks west of our hotel. A friend had told us about this building. I think it was 350 or 380 West Nanjing Road. It is 4 or 5 stories filled with small shops, or rather packed with small shops, selling all the knock offs and other inexpensive Chinese goods. My wife was in heaven. Now I’ve go to tell you, I saw on this site recently someone saying how can any self respecting person buy and wear a fake watch. I have to tell you that my wife has a Rolex but she loves to wear her $50 fake Rolex that she bought in NYC many years ago (and that watch keeps better time than the real Rolex). Now I would never wear a knock off because it’s a knock off, but I did buy a couple of ties, not because they said Hugo Boss on them, but because they appeared to be good quality and I liked the design of them, and the $5 price (after negotiating down from their asking price of $20) was appealing also. My wife got the watches and scarves she wanted for gifts. By the way her $50 NYC Rolex was priced at about $25 here (but then again that $50 was paid quite a few years ago so maybe it would be much higher today in NY.) We spent several hours there, and even came back the final day before we left for the airport.
The next day we took a tour of the Jewish Ghetto area with an Israeli guide by the name of Dvir. This was an excellent tour. It was about 4 ½ hours long. My wife loved every bit of it; I thought it was maybe 2 hours too long. But we both found it very educational. Not only from the Jewish aspect of it but because the guide was so knowledgeable about his subject and about the more recent history of Shanghai dating back to World War II and thereafter. From him we got what we felt was a more unbiased look at recent history of the country and especially Shanghai. Don’t forget that while guides in China are relatively free to speak their opinions, they are trained in local universities that are government controlled and I doubt that those establishments encourage free thought the way that Western Universities do.
All in all Shanghai was a wonderful city to visit. It was interesting to see the contrast with Beijing. I know that there have been a lot of designer stores opening in Beijing as well, but we never visited any commercial centers like that while we were there. But in Shanghai you can’t avoid seeing the huge influx of fancy stores. Where is all this wealth coming from that supports these stores. And car dealerships. Not only Mercedes, BMW and Jaguar, but Maserrati and Rolls as well. Both here and especially in Hong Kong. Another difference I saw between Shanghai and Beijing was that in Shanghai more people seemed to speak English. Even the vendors on the street had picked it up. And the staff at the hotels and restaurants spoke much more English than in Beijing. Even the guides we dealt with were much more fluent in English.
Next stop was Hong Kong. We were again in a JW Marriott. It was also beautiful and well run. The concierge lounge there was very disappointing. Unbelievably small for such a large and fancy hotel. The room while somewhat small was lovely and had a great view. Service was excellent throughout. I thought the location was good. I think being on the Hong Kong Island side as opposed to Kowoloon side is definitely the way to go. Although the Peninsula and some other hotels are in Kowoloon, that area just seemed to be the poor side of the tracks compared to where we were.
Once again, its business, business and more business (but this time with tailor shops all over interspersed with designer shops everywhere). We never took a tour here. Probably didn’t need it. We went up the cog railway (I guess that’s what it is) to the top of the mountain overlooking Hong Kong. We ate at a restaurant there called The Peak Restaurant. It was ok, the view of the City from there was not much, but going there was a good experience and the view from the shopping center can be spectacular if you happen to be there on a clear night, which we were not. In fact let me digress here. In all the cities in China we were at there seemed to be a haze or fog or smog. Especially at night. In Beijing the only day we did not experience that was the first day we were there. The day we went to the wall we killed some time early in the day as Konglin thought it would clear up later, which fortunately it did. While we saw many people wearing face masks in Beijing, Shanghai and HK, we never experienced any tearing or burning sensation. In fact we were never bothered by the weather and still don’t know if it was just fog we were experiencing or not. We were just sorry it limited the views from the Bund and in HK from the peak. DW managed to do some shopping here as well, but this time she was buying better (and more expensive) pearls and other jewelry. Kowoloon had a lot to offer in that regard. I wanted to eat at the fancy restaurant at the Peninsula but the times I could get a res there were not good so we took the advice of our concierge and booked at a restaurant in Kowoloon called Hutong (no relationship at all to the Hutong area of Beijing. Great advice. It was an excellent restaurant. Lots of attention. Good extensive (and expensive, but everything in HK is) menu. And it had a great view of HK. At 8pm or so there is a light show coming from the buildings on HG that are viewable from many spot in Kowoloon. Its not enough to warrant a special trip for, but if you happen to be going to this side of the harbor you might as well plan your night to see it. And the view from this restaurant is probably one of the best available. It was a very pleasurable meal. Later we went up to another floor where there is a club/restaurant that seems to cater to a younger crowd. We just wanted to see it and left soon. We walked a short distance from the building we were in over to see the Peninsula Hotel. It is a grand old hotel. But I would not have wanted to stay there. Not just because I would not have liked staying on that side of the water, but because the hotel seemed stuffy. I like modern bright hotels. And this one is old style, which if you like hotels like the Plaza or Waldorf in NYC then this one would attract you. We went up to the top of the hotel to see the fancy restaurant and to have a drink at the bar there. That was very disappointing. The view from there is nothing special and the bar was very small and crowded so we soon left and went back to our hotel. While we took a taxi both back and forth to our dinner that night, when we came back over to Kowoloon to shop we took the Star Ferry. That was very convenient, efficient, fast and the way to travel during the day.
On our final night in HK we went to an area that other posters will recognize, but I cannot come up with the name. But it was THE area to be in for a fun night. It is a pedestrian area filled with street front restaurants and bars of all sorts. Just packed with people, mostly tourists I guess. It was a don’t miss area that I did not know about and somehow missed even with all the postings I had read on Fodor’s. Or maybe I just didn’t pay attention to the postings and didn’t realize what a fun place it would be. It was actually my daughter who suggested it to me. She had been in HK several years earlier and of course the young people seem to know about fun places all around the world. But even old people like us enjoyed it.
We stayed in HK 2 nights and then left our luggage with the concierge and just took a carry on and took the jet boat to Macau for one night. There we stayed at the new Venetian. I’m glad we went as I wanted to know what about Macau was making it the gambling capital of the world, totally eclipsing Vegas in gambling revenue. Well, I still don’t know. Obviously the great Asian wealth is the main reason. I didn’t see much that would be a tourist attraction other than the casinos. In reading the guide books I didn’t see anything that made me want to take a tour so we just stayed in the hotel. While the hotel is big and virtually the same as the Vegas Venetian, something about it just seemed not as nice as Vegas. Certainly the mall area and the casino area are large, but it just didn’t have the same quality feel to it. I will say that the guest room was as nice if not nicer than Vegas, but the restaurants and other facilities were not the same. It was a nice trip and certainly satisfied my curiosity about Macau, but I could have left it off my trip
After our one day and night stay there we took the jet ferry back to HG. That was the night when we went to that neat area I mentioned above. The next day we began our long trip back. Again we got to the airport early, but had to wait over an hour before the counter people even showed up at the Continental counter. So we were in the airport for over 4 hours before we began our 25 hour trip back home.
All in all it was a great trip. I wish I had cut out a few days (Kyoto and Macao). I think the amount of time we spent in the other cities was just about right. We originally wanted to go to see X’ian, but I think that for us eliminating it was the right decision. Packing, unpacking, taxis to and from the airports and the hassle of finding the right counter to stand in line at – that might have made this grouchy old man even more grouchy.
I would be happy to answer any questions, but more knowledgeable people like Shanghainese, Rkwan, Hawaiiantraveler, travelgirl, ekscrunchy, Stutower can give you much better information than I can. I used their reports and postings for preparation for my trip and I thank them and others for that.
The next day we took a half day tour booked by the hotel concierge. Not badly priced. With a driver and an English speaking guide. Pamela Shaw. Sounds American but she is Chinese with perfect English. It was a good tour. I highly recommend a tour in Shanghai. We went to one of the Temples there and then saw a good part of the City, including going over the river to Pudong. Amazing. While Shanghai has been an international business center for many years, its been less than 20 years that the Chinese government started encouraging foreign investment and ownership there. And Pudong is evidence to what can happen when capitalism is allowed in. Huge modern buildings everywhere. And not just a few. Its like a whole new City built in under 20 years. What a boon to the economy this must have been. As you already know from my earlier posting I am more entranced about business than most normal tourists, so I loved being in Shanghai. We toured for about 3 ½ hours then had the guide drop us off at an area that housed many artists. That was kind of disappointing to us. As advertised there are many modern artists, but I guess we were expecting a different look to the art. We like modern art but their art was showing Mao and other figures in a modern manner. But art is in the eye of the ….well you know. When we left we both felt like it was a waste of time. But quite honestly the area reminded us of Chelsea in NYC, which we also did not care for. So its us not the area. But this was one time where DW agreed with my boredom.
We got back to the hotel in time for the Saturday lunch buffet at the Marriott. Boy, that was a buffet. Everything you could ask for. Chinese, American, Japanese. And all of it was excellent. We were so filled that we canceled out on the one dinner reservation we had made that I was looking forward to. M on the Bund. We did take the taxi over to the Bund area and walked up and down it for a while. We went into many of the elegant shops there, not to buy, just to see them. And we peeked into many of the fancy restaurant there. So that was enough for us. We did not cross over to the actual Bund, or walkway, right on the River. We did that later that night, after going back to our hotel for a rest, and that was lots of fun. At night time the Bund lights up and even more spectacularly you see the lights on the tall buildings in Pudong across the river from the Bund. It is quite beautiful to see. We walked along the water and of course there were vendors everywhere, but they were not as aggressive as on the street. After a while we stopped at a small dumpling restaurant overlooking the water for a snack. While we were eating we saw most of the people seeming to leave the area. We could not figure out why until a few minutes later I looked out and realized that all of the building lights were turning off. It was just 11PM, but apparently either from a conservation effort, which I doubt, or from an effort to make sure the population does not enjoy itself too much (maybe that’s too cynical?), the lights are turned off then every night. By the way this night was a Saturday night and most of the people on the Bund at that time appeared to be local young couples and other locals having a good time. Anyway, we soon left the restaurant and headed back to the hotel.
The next day was devoted to my wife shopping for presents. We walked to the West on Nanjing Road for a ways then walked back and stopped at a building just a couple of blocks west of our hotel. A friend had told us about this building. I think it was 350 or 380 West Nanjing Road. It is 4 or 5 stories filled with small shops, or rather packed with small shops, selling all the knock offs and other inexpensive Chinese goods. My wife was in heaven. Now I’ve go to tell you, I saw on this site recently someone saying how can any self respecting person buy and wear a fake watch. I have to tell you that my wife has a Rolex but she loves to wear her $50 fake Rolex that she bought in NYC many years ago (and that watch keeps better time than the real Rolex). Now I would never wear a knock off because it’s a knock off, but I did buy a couple of ties, not because they said Hugo Boss on them, but because they appeared to be good quality and I liked the design of them, and the $5 price (after negotiating down from their asking price of $20) was appealing also. My wife got the watches and scarves she wanted for gifts. By the way her $50 NYC Rolex was priced at about $25 here (but then again that $50 was paid quite a few years ago so maybe it would be much higher today in NY.) We spent several hours there, and even came back the final day before we left for the airport.
The next day we took a tour of the Jewish Ghetto area with an Israeli guide by the name of Dvir. This was an excellent tour. It was about 4 ½ hours long. My wife loved every bit of it; I thought it was maybe 2 hours too long. But we both found it very educational. Not only from the Jewish aspect of it but because the guide was so knowledgeable about his subject and about the more recent history of Shanghai dating back to World War II and thereafter. From him we got what we felt was a more unbiased look at recent history of the country and especially Shanghai. Don’t forget that while guides in China are relatively free to speak their opinions, they are trained in local universities that are government controlled and I doubt that those establishments encourage free thought the way that Western Universities do.
All in all Shanghai was a wonderful city to visit. It was interesting to see the contrast with Beijing. I know that there have been a lot of designer stores opening in Beijing as well, but we never visited any commercial centers like that while we were there. But in Shanghai you can’t avoid seeing the huge influx of fancy stores. Where is all this wealth coming from that supports these stores. And car dealerships. Not only Mercedes, BMW and Jaguar, but Maserrati and Rolls as well. Both here and especially in Hong Kong. Another difference I saw between Shanghai and Beijing was that in Shanghai more people seemed to speak English. Even the vendors on the street had picked it up. And the staff at the hotels and restaurants spoke much more English than in Beijing. Even the guides we dealt with were much more fluent in English.
Next stop was Hong Kong. We were again in a JW Marriott. It was also beautiful and well run. The concierge lounge there was very disappointing. Unbelievably small for such a large and fancy hotel. The room while somewhat small was lovely and had a great view. Service was excellent throughout. I thought the location was good. I think being on the Hong Kong Island side as opposed to Kowoloon side is definitely the way to go. Although the Peninsula and some other hotels are in Kowoloon, that area just seemed to be the poor side of the tracks compared to where we were.
Once again, its business, business and more business (but this time with tailor shops all over interspersed with designer shops everywhere). We never took a tour here. Probably didn’t need it. We went up the cog railway (I guess that’s what it is) to the top of the mountain overlooking Hong Kong. We ate at a restaurant there called The Peak Restaurant. It was ok, the view of the City from there was not much, but going there was a good experience and the view from the shopping center can be spectacular if you happen to be there on a clear night, which we were not. In fact let me digress here. In all the cities in China we were at there seemed to be a haze or fog or smog. Especially at night. In Beijing the only day we did not experience that was the first day we were there. The day we went to the wall we killed some time early in the day as Konglin thought it would clear up later, which fortunately it did. While we saw many people wearing face masks in Beijing, Shanghai and HK, we never experienced any tearing or burning sensation. In fact we were never bothered by the weather and still don’t know if it was just fog we were experiencing or not. We were just sorry it limited the views from the Bund and in HK from the peak. DW managed to do some shopping here as well, but this time she was buying better (and more expensive) pearls and other jewelry. Kowoloon had a lot to offer in that regard. I wanted to eat at the fancy restaurant at the Peninsula but the times I could get a res there were not good so we took the advice of our concierge and booked at a restaurant in Kowoloon called Hutong (no relationship at all to the Hutong area of Beijing. Great advice. It was an excellent restaurant. Lots of attention. Good extensive (and expensive, but everything in HK is) menu. And it had a great view of HK. At 8pm or so there is a light show coming from the buildings on HG that are viewable from many spot in Kowoloon. Its not enough to warrant a special trip for, but if you happen to be going to this side of the harbor you might as well plan your night to see it. And the view from this restaurant is probably one of the best available. It was a very pleasurable meal. Later we went up to another floor where there is a club/restaurant that seems to cater to a younger crowd. We just wanted to see it and left soon. We walked a short distance from the building we were in over to see the Peninsula Hotel. It is a grand old hotel. But I would not have wanted to stay there. Not just because I would not have liked staying on that side of the water, but because the hotel seemed stuffy. I like modern bright hotels. And this one is old style, which if you like hotels like the Plaza or Waldorf in NYC then this one would attract you. We went up to the top of the hotel to see the fancy restaurant and to have a drink at the bar there. That was very disappointing. The view from there is nothing special and the bar was very small and crowded so we soon left and went back to our hotel. While we took a taxi both back and forth to our dinner that night, when we came back over to Kowoloon to shop we took the Star Ferry. That was very convenient, efficient, fast and the way to travel during the day.
On our final night in HK we went to an area that other posters will recognize, but I cannot come up with the name. But it was THE area to be in for a fun night. It is a pedestrian area filled with street front restaurants and bars of all sorts. Just packed with people, mostly tourists I guess. It was a don’t miss area that I did not know about and somehow missed even with all the postings I had read on Fodor’s. Or maybe I just didn’t pay attention to the postings and didn’t realize what a fun place it would be. It was actually my daughter who suggested it to me. She had been in HK several years earlier and of course the young people seem to know about fun places all around the world. But even old people like us enjoyed it.
We stayed in HK 2 nights and then left our luggage with the concierge and just took a carry on and took the jet boat to Macau for one night. There we stayed at the new Venetian. I’m glad we went as I wanted to know what about Macau was making it the gambling capital of the world, totally eclipsing Vegas in gambling revenue. Well, I still don’t know. Obviously the great Asian wealth is the main reason. I didn’t see much that would be a tourist attraction other than the casinos. In reading the guide books I didn’t see anything that made me want to take a tour so we just stayed in the hotel. While the hotel is big and virtually the same as the Vegas Venetian, something about it just seemed not as nice as Vegas. Certainly the mall area and the casino area are large, but it just didn’t have the same quality feel to it. I will say that the guest room was as nice if not nicer than Vegas, but the restaurants and other facilities were not the same. It was a nice trip and certainly satisfied my curiosity about Macau, but I could have left it off my trip
After our one day and night stay there we took the jet ferry back to HG. That was the night when we went to that neat area I mentioned above. The next day we began our long trip back. Again we got to the airport early, but had to wait over an hour before the counter people even showed up at the Continental counter. So we were in the airport for over 4 hours before we began our 25 hour trip back home.
All in all it was a great trip. I wish I had cut out a few days (Kyoto and Macao). I think the amount of time we spent in the other cities was just about right. We originally wanted to go to see X’ian, but I think that for us eliminating it was the right decision. Packing, unpacking, taxis to and from the airports and the hassle of finding the right counter to stand in line at – that might have made this grouchy old man even more grouchy.
I would be happy to answer any questions, but more knowledgeable people like Shanghainese, Rkwan, Hawaiiantraveler, travelgirl, ekscrunchy, Stutower can give you much better information than I can. I used their reports and postings for preparation for my trip and I thank them and others for that.
Nov 18th, 2007, 07:23 PM
#25
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Thanks again Larry for taking the time to write this stellar report.
You help out more people than you know when you take the time like you did to tell us all of your adventures.
Where are you off to next?
Aloha!
You help out more people than you know when you take the time like you did to tell us all of your adventures.
Where are you off to next?
Aloha!
Nov 18th, 2007, 07:23 PM
#26
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I'm sorry, but did you visit the historic center of Macau, which is now listed as UNESCO World Heritage site? Any of its temples, museums and churches? Did you walk around the old Taipa and Coloane villages?
Cicerone and I have been telling people here that those are the things to see in Macau, not the casinos.
Anyways, the area in Hong Kong where you find the bars and restaurants is probabaly Lan Kwai Fong or Soho; both just up the hill from Central and not too far from each other.
What you see in the air in Hong Kong and elsewhere in China is the smog. Air pollution is horrible in all of eastern China for the past decade. Well, all the stuff we buy from Wal-Mart and Best Buy are made there, and environment regulations are largely absent in the area. What you see is the result.
The Peak Tram in Hong Kong is technically a funicular or incline. Two cars hooked up to the same cable, driven by power at the top station. The two cars pass each other halfway. But several things make it different from most funiculars or inclines:
- the track is not straight,
- the grade is not even,
- the cars themselves are configured like a normal single-level vehicle, and two-three stacked levels. So at grades, you sit angled upwards.
Cicerone and I have been telling people here that those are the things to see in Macau, not the casinos.
Anyways, the area in Hong Kong where you find the bars and restaurants is probabaly Lan Kwai Fong or Soho; both just up the hill from Central and not too far from each other.
What you see in the air in Hong Kong and elsewhere in China is the smog. Air pollution is horrible in all of eastern China for the past decade. Well, all the stuff we buy from Wal-Mart and Best Buy are made there, and environment regulations are largely absent in the area. What you see is the result.
The Peak Tram in Hong Kong is technically a funicular or incline. Two cars hooked up to the same cable, driven by power at the top station. The two cars pass each other halfway. But several things make it different from most funiculars or inclines:
- the track is not straight,
- the grade is not even,
- the cars themselves are configured like a normal single-level vehicle, and two-three stacked levels. So at grades, you sit angled upwards.
Nov 19th, 2007, 05:18 AM
#27
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Yes. Definitely Lan Kwai Fong. Thanks, RK. It was great fun. And really unexpected because I don't recall reading about it here on Fodors or in the guide book. As I mention frequently I am not one for notes so I sometimes don't list the correct (or any) name of some of the areas we visited. By the way, just to remain true to my grouchy nature, the escalator that goes up the peak from Central, while a very interesting concept, was not much of an attraction for us after 10 minutes or so. I know that it is a functional way for locals to get up the peak but it seems to have been pretty much taken over by tourists expecting, well, I don't know what we were expecting.
No, I did not go into the World Heritage area in Macao. By that time I was not interested in any more churches. And the designation of "World Heritage" does not turn me on. I have visited UNESCO sites before that held no interest for me.
The funicular was great fun.
Finally, even tho there may be smog all over China, it really never bothered us and it should not prevent anyone from going there unless they are really sensitive. As I said in an earlier post we were not even sure if it was smog or just a fog.
BTW, I left out a great lunch we had in HK at the City Hall Restaurant. That is a huge place with dumplings and a huge assortment of other Chinese foods being wheeled by in various carts. While I did not eat a lot of the food served I thoroughly enjoyed what I was able to chose and throroughly enjoyed the restaurant.
Next trip, Hawaiian? Well, I really want to see St Petersburg and Moscow. I am doing some early thinking about it for next summer. Probably on a cruise with stops in Denmark and Sweden, tho I have to figure out how to include Moscow before or after the cruise. And, no, before you suggest it, I would not consider a river cruise between the two cities. Boy, can you imagine how much weight I will lose after a Russian trip with my peculiar food tastes?
No, I did not go into the World Heritage area in Macao. By that time I was not interested in any more churches. And the designation of "World Heritage" does not turn me on. I have visited UNESCO sites before that held no interest for me.
The funicular was great fun.
Finally, even tho there may be smog all over China, it really never bothered us and it should not prevent anyone from going there unless they are really sensitive. As I said in an earlier post we were not even sure if it was smog or just a fog.
BTW, I left out a great lunch we had in HK at the City Hall Restaurant. That is a huge place with dumplings and a huge assortment of other Chinese foods being wheeled by in various carts. While I did not eat a lot of the food served I thoroughly enjoyed what I was able to chose and throroughly enjoyed the restaurant.
Next trip, Hawaiian? Well, I really want to see St Petersburg and Moscow. I am doing some early thinking about it for next summer. Probably on a cruise with stops in Denmark and Sweden, tho I have to figure out how to include Moscow before or after the cruise. And, no, before you suggest it, I would not consider a river cruise between the two cities. Boy, can you imagine how much weight I will lose after a Russian trip with my peculiar food tastes?
Nov 19th, 2007, 06:16 AM
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Larry - I think you'll enjoy Macau a lot more if you've visited its historic center instead of hanging out at Venetian.
You're right about the smog. That's what I'm been telling people. You won't have a problem for at least 10-14 days. After that, many do though.
About the Mid-Levels escalators. I totally agree with you. <b>I can never understand why so many people here on this board care so much to see or ride it.</b> Except to go up to Soho. There's really nothing special technically about it at all. If one wants to know this older area of Hong Kong (which is somewhat interesting) better, then walk on the street level instead.
You're right about the smog. That's what I'm been telling people. You won't have a problem for at least 10-14 days. After that, many do though.
About the Mid-Levels escalators. I totally agree with you. <b>I can never understand why so many people here on this board care so much to see or ride it.</b> Except to go up to Soho. There's really nothing special technically about it at all. If one wants to know this older area of Hong Kong (which is somewhat interesting) better, then walk on the street level instead.
Nov 19th, 2007, 04:25 PM
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A big big thank YOU for sharing, Larry, knowledge is all relative and I thoroughly enjoy your candid observations. I too share your feelings about the beggars in Shanghai, there is a huge increase of them this year (I went late Oct/early Nov) from when I was there last year, and those disfigured ones are so so pitiful. My family/relatives/friends just say "ah ya", shake their heads and don't want to talk about it.
Nov 19th, 2007, 04:58 PM
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Larry, I will only comment on Japan because I haven't been to Bejing. You hit the nail on the head about Kyoto in one way. I don't think it is the best Japanese city for western-style service. The Hyatt, The Westin (which is not in the same league as the Westin in Tokyo), the Okura, the Granvia, and maybe one other hotel I am blanking on, are the best there is to offer there in the way of western-style hotels. And those do not match to the level of western-style service that you can get in Tokyo.
mrwunrfl, I was thinking the exact same thing about the business card protocol. I recall that before my first trip to Japan I was worried about that and how to do it. Larry must have known enough not to offend and to make an impression.
If I can ever talk my husband into accompanying me to Japan, I will take him to Casita. This is the first I have heard of it and it sounds grand. I wonder how you found out about it, was it recommended by your concierge?
I also thought Ginza was disappointing. I can do better in NY re shopping if I want to go upscale. And the neon in that area looks most impressive from Tokyo Tower, way up, for me.
I would be very interested in your wife's take on the trip also. Did she enjoy Kyoto, and what did she think about Tokyo? I think the charm of Kyoto reveals itself to you if you are of the mind to let it do so. It is not a big city w/big city sights, as much as I like those too. The best things about Kyoto sneak up on you, when you least expect it, and if you are open and listening for them.
Thank you so much for your report! I have gotten back into travel in Mexico and Latin America lately after a 20 year lapse, and have neglected the Asia board here. But this trip report has really brought me back.
mrwunrfl, I was thinking the exact same thing about the business card protocol. I recall that before my first trip to Japan I was worried about that and how to do it. Larry must have known enough not to offend and to make an impression.
If I can ever talk my husband into accompanying me to Japan, I will take him to Casita. This is the first I have heard of it and it sounds grand. I wonder how you found out about it, was it recommended by your concierge?
I also thought Ginza was disappointing. I can do better in NY re shopping if I want to go upscale. And the neon in that area looks most impressive from Tokyo Tower, way up, for me.
I would be very interested in your wife's take on the trip also. Did she enjoy Kyoto, and what did she think about Tokyo? I think the charm of Kyoto reveals itself to you if you are of the mind to let it do so. It is not a big city w/big city sights, as much as I like those too. The best things about Kyoto sneak up on you, when you least expect it, and if you are open and listening for them.
Thank you so much for your report! I have gotten back into travel in Mexico and Latin America lately after a 20 year lapse, and have neglected the Asia board here. But this trip report has really brought me back.
Nov 20th, 2007, 10:30 AM
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Emd, to answer your question about my wife's take on the trip - she loved it. Not necessarily every single detail of it, but more than I because she doesn't have the strange eating habits I have. But I rarely have never not liked a restaurant because of its limited (for me)menu. As I've said if it has ambiance, service, good drinks and just a salad or something for me to eat then I can totally enjoy it. I don't think she particularly cared for Kyoto either. She loved Tokyo. And especially China. I don't know where I got the rec of Casita. Definitely not from the concierge (Strangely, Rizzuto, I now remember you are correct, there was a lounge. I don't know why I didn't go there after the first day we were at the hotel). I could have seen the name in one of my restaurant trade journals, or a travel magazine, or here on fodors. Hope you make it back to Japan one day, emd. Sounds like you sometimes take trips w/o DH? Good for you if you do. If grouchy old husbands like me won't go on a trip, go without them.
Nov 23rd, 2007, 04:48 PM
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Sorry, I just don't remember the fee. However, I did think it was reasonable for Tokyo. And I think she did a good job in giving us an overview of Tokyo. We might have seen more on a large tour bus (and paid less), but not being ones to like group tours, this tour was just prefect for us.
Nov 25th, 2007, 02:08 PM
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Question about the Great Wall: are there other ways of getting on the Wall except for the ski lift thing and coming down by sled? I'm not very fond of amusement rides and these sound somewhat like that. I'm okay with elevators that are enclosed with glass but not thrilled with open heights. I definitely plan to walk on the wall but would prefer a less intimidating way to arrive and leave if possible. Any suggestions?
Nov 26th, 2007, 11:46 AM
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I agree with mrwunrfl, going up the ski lift is really not that intimidating. And I think that the sled coming down would be a lot less scary than the lift. When you are going up the lift you just are looking up a gently (relatively) sloping mountain. But coming down you are seeing a long way down. But if you take the sled, it is controlled by a hand brake so you can creep down it, and as long as you are not bothered by the people behind you yelling at you to speed up, it is not scary at all. There are many curves that slow you down and you never are looking straight down. I would suggest telling the starter at the top that you are going slowly so that he doesn't bunch people up right behind you. I do not do amusement rides at all and found this to be great fun and not like an amusement park ride.
Your alternative is to go to a different part of the wall and walk up. That seems like a bad idea to me, but if you are young and in good shape you might prefer that. I'll let others comment on that suggestion tho.
Bottom line, don't miss the wall!!
Your alternative is to go to a different part of the wall and walk up. That seems like a bad idea to me, but if you are young and in good shape you might prefer that. I'll let others comment on that suggestion tho.
Bottom line, don't miss the wall!!
Nov 26th, 2007, 03:35 PM
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Great report Larry.
What about the bathrooms?! What about the toilets?!
We stayed at the Intercontinental in Tokyo Bay and the toilet did everything but talk!
Heat, vibration, various bidet settings (like a shower massager) in different locations...and more - it had a control panel on the side (I was actually scared of it). A huge sunken tub with jets and a steam shower.
Rkkwan- The mid-level escalator was an enormous hit with my teen. He thought it was the coolest thing he had ever seen!
What about the bathrooms?! What about the toilets?!
We stayed at the Intercontinental in Tokyo Bay and the toilet did everything but talk!
Heat, vibration, various bidet settings (like a shower massager) in different locations...and more - it had a control panel on the side (I was actually scared of it). A huge sunken tub with jets and a steam shower.
Rkkwan- The mid-level escalator was an enormous hit with my teen. He thought it was the coolest thing he had ever seen!
Nov 27th, 2007, 07:50 AM
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To Traveling Gal:
I had to respond to the Great Wall up and down ways. Just returned (early Nov) and took the ski type lift up and the sled down - I was not looking forward to coming down that way but it was so much fun...not terrifying at all. I went at my own pace and no problem. If I had to crawl down, I would have - just to have the experience of being on that great structure!
I had to respond to the Great Wall up and down ways. Just returned (early Nov) and took the ski type lift up and the sled down - I was not looking forward to coming down that way but it was so much fun...not terrifying at all. I went at my own pace and no problem. If I had to crawl down, I would have - just to have the experience of being on that great structure!
