"use it or lose it" say the airlines...
Aug 30th, 2002, 02:30 PM
#1
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"use it or lose it" say the airlines...
By the end of next week ALL the majors will have a "use it or lose it" policy in effect. USAIR initiated their policy last week..today AA matched. THe rest of the majors will soon follow. Get ready to rock and roll.....
Aug 31st, 2002, 03:36 AM
#3
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US isn't use it or lose it. You must cancel your reservation before your flight. The significant chamges are:
1. You can't fly standby on the same day on an earlier flight, and most important,
2. Whem you call the airline to cancel your reservation, you must make another reservation immediately and pay the $100. The problem is, you've must cahcelled your reservation, you may not know your new schedule. So you can pay a series of $100 penalties until you exhaust the value of your original ticket.
AA has adopted the same rules, but you can fly standby on the day of your original flight for $100. Big deal.
I think all the airlines will adopt this restrictive new rule. The airlines think that they can get business travelers who make the most changes to buy unrestricted, expensive tickets. We'll see.
1. You can't fly standby on the same day on an earlier flight, and most important,
2. Whem you call the airline to cancel your reservation, you must make another reservation immediately and pay the $100. The problem is, you've must cahcelled your reservation, you may not know your new schedule. So you can pay a series of $100 penalties until you exhaust the value of your original ticket.
AA has adopted the same rules, but you can fly standby on the day of your original flight for $100. Big deal.
I think all the airlines will adopt this restrictive new rule. The airlines think that they can get business travelers who make the most changes to buy unrestricted, expensive tickets. We'll see.
Aug 31st, 2002, 03:12 PM
#5
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I haven't heard anything down the pike about us implementing that, but I wouldn't be surprised if we did. To be quite honest, I think it would be great. You have no idea how many calls we get on a daily basis (heck, I don't even know how many) of people wanting to change or cancel their flights. Some folks, it would seem do it more often than I change my shorts. I can see it being ok in some cases, but there are a lot of people out there who are trying to scam all the way through their trip. You know who you are. This may cut down on some of the bull and leave us free to service customers who actually need it.
Aug 31st, 2002, 04:23 PM
#8
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COresBoy:
I feel your pain! Work would be so much easier if it were not for these damned, stupid customers!
Which proves to me again that the big US airlines (I mean their top management) have 3 enemies: The customer, the travel agents and their own staff.
You, being staff, need to wake up and smell the coffee! One day you will get it too, that you are on the enemy list.
I feel your pain! Work would be so much easier if it were not for these damned, stupid customers!
Which proves to me again that the big US airlines (I mean their top management) have 3 enemies: The customer, the travel agents and their own staff.
You, being staff, need to wake up and smell the coffee! One day you will get it too, that you are on the enemy list.
Aug 31st, 2002, 07:38 PM
#9
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Andreas,
I just gotta love these people who do not work for my company or in the industry even who tell me how things work. We are not the enemies of management. Our management has an open door policy, unlike a lot of other airlines or businesses. If I want to talk to Gordon (he prefers we call him by his first name) I can go to his office to see him about it. It's the same all the way down the line. Maybe your company does not place any value on their employees, but mine does. Very frequently, they take input from us and implement it. There is constant communication between us and the management via LED signs, company bulletins, quarterly magazine, Gordon's personal voice mail, CEO excahnges (where they go around the system and meet with the employees) to name just a few. I had a family emergency in July where I needed time off work to resolve the issue. I was able to talk to my manager and got the time off with no problems. Didn't have to make it up either. Oh, and if we were the enemies of management, I would guess that Gordon would not be calling the employees who won the Eddie Bauer Ford Explorers for perfect attendance. I would guess that you do not feel that you have the same feeling that your company actually values you and recognizes that they would not be anywhere without you and your co-workers. For that, I feel sorry for you. BTW, we are all Gordon's co-workers. Just ask him. I'll dial for you if you want.
"I feel your pain! Work would be so much easier if it were not for these damned, stupid customers!" I never said that all of the customers are stupid. You seem to have assumed that is what I meant. As I said there are the customers who are only interested in scamming the airlines. I give good customer service to all of my customers. Even to those who really don't deserve it and I will d*mn anyone who says otherwise. Despite what you have heard, the customer is not always right.
You seem to be a sad, frustrated person. No disrespect intended. I know that it seems fun to bash the airlines every chance you get, but it won't get you anywhere and it won't change the policies to complain on a message board. I know to those who think the new rules are a huge injustice, but hey, we are trying to run a business and desperate times call for us not to give away the store so much. There are things that we do that we don't like having to do.
Good luck to you and I hope that you find some glimmer of joy in your life and in your job. And please don't post a comment like that again unless you actually know what you are talking about.
Cheers!
I just gotta love these people who do not work for my company or in the industry even who tell me how things work. We are not the enemies of management. Our management has an open door policy, unlike a lot of other airlines or businesses. If I want to talk to Gordon (he prefers we call him by his first name) I can go to his office to see him about it. It's the same all the way down the line. Maybe your company does not place any value on their employees, but mine does. Very frequently, they take input from us and implement it. There is constant communication between us and the management via LED signs, company bulletins, quarterly magazine, Gordon's personal voice mail, CEO excahnges (where they go around the system and meet with the employees) to name just a few. I had a family emergency in July where I needed time off work to resolve the issue. I was able to talk to my manager and got the time off with no problems. Didn't have to make it up either. Oh, and if we were the enemies of management, I would guess that Gordon would not be calling the employees who won the Eddie Bauer Ford Explorers for perfect attendance. I would guess that you do not feel that you have the same feeling that your company actually values you and recognizes that they would not be anywhere without you and your co-workers. For that, I feel sorry for you. BTW, we are all Gordon's co-workers. Just ask him. I'll dial for you if you want.
"I feel your pain! Work would be so much easier if it were not for these damned, stupid customers!" I never said that all of the customers are stupid. You seem to have assumed that is what I meant. As I said there are the customers who are only interested in scamming the airlines. I give good customer service to all of my customers. Even to those who really don't deserve it and I will d*mn anyone who says otherwise. Despite what you have heard, the customer is not always right.
You seem to be a sad, frustrated person. No disrespect intended. I know that it seems fun to bash the airlines every chance you get, but it won't get you anywhere and it won't change the policies to complain on a message board. I know to those who think the new rules are a huge injustice, but hey, we are trying to run a business and desperate times call for us not to give away the store so much. There are things that we do that we don't like having to do.
Good luck to you and I hope that you find some glimmer of joy in your life and in your job. And please don't post a comment like that again unless you actually know what you are talking about.
Cheers!
Sep 1st, 2002, 08:11 AM
#10
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Andreas does work in the industry, as do I. Trust me COresboy I was a Res Agent for 21 years. The attitude toward the customer and travel agents has gone downhill. We feel your pain with airline management. They do not understand the customer is the only reason they are in business.
Sep 1st, 2002, 11:27 AM
#11
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I'll tell you one thing. If they ever pulled this garbage on me, I would seek restitution via the Truth in Lending law which says if a company fails to provide service you paid for, then on your claim the credit card company must charge the expense back to the merchant.
This is the direction we should all go against these imbeciles.
This is the direction we should all go against these imbeciles.
Sep 1st, 2002, 11:42 AM
#12
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Pretty much as expected, this is THE hot topic right now. And why not - it potentially hits all of us in the pocket book, and is particularly repugnant to the segment of travlers who can best be described as habitual scammers. There's an old adage that says "hit dog hollers" - i.e., the one whom the shoe best fits will scream the loudest. Look for most of the moaning to emerge from the scammer segment.
And while you're moaning, please don't paint with too broad a brush. I avoid American and Delta like the plague because of the consistently bad service / attitude I got over many years and miles. I will take a less convenient itinerary in order to fly Continental, because I know I can rely on efficient, responsive service.
And while you're moaning, please don't paint with too broad a brush. I avoid American and Delta like the plague because of the consistently bad service / attitude I got over many years and miles. I will take a less convenient itinerary in order to fly Continental, because I know I can rely on efficient, responsive service.
Sep 1st, 2002, 11:52 AM
#13
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COresBoy:
Thanks for your long and nice reply.
But-sad to say this- you are so indoctrinated by Gordon and his bull that you are not even aware of it.
Today you walk into his office, but you will be surprised about security at CO when you try that after you have gotten the pink slip, because they had to let you go, because they have to save the company... blahblahblah...
Your beloved Gordon just loves to blame everybody else outside the company for your losses, like the damned customers, who don't want to pay full fares, and - even more outrageously- these damned other airlines, who are so stupid as not to understand that all airlines must raise fares in order to make more money. That you will lose a lot of customer that way, and that the whole thing does not add up, that must be someone elses' fault also.
Dear Gordon has said a few weeks ago that some airlines' executives have and IQ of 40.
I have news for you: All major airlines' executives together (including Gordon) have an IQ of 40.
Just for contrast: Southwest has just lowered their full fares, and expect that will result in an additional profit of 20m/year. They know how the market works, and they make profits. Your company doesn't and Gordon whines like a colicky baby.
What I really resent, though, is the lies that your and other airlines dish out to the customers, and seem to get away with.
One example: Fine, make airline tickets nonrefunadble/nonchangeable, use-it-or-lose-it, like theater tickets, but then make them transferable and let the owner of the ticket sell that ticket to another customer.
You and Gordon will probably say, that that is against the law and FAA rules. Let me inform you: THAT IS A LIE.
The FAA wants to know who is on the plane, and you must check ID, but there is absolutely no rule that a ticket cannot be reissued in someone elses name.
Another thing: My seat that I bought, use-it-or-lose-it, number 11A for the Opera is GOING TO BE EMPTY, if I don't show up.
If you want to play the game use-it-or-lose-it then you better fly that seat empty, because I have paid for it in full, and you don't let me re-sell it to someone else.
To both keep my money, and you, the airline, sell the same seat to someone else, should be outlawed as being criminal.
The only reason why your and other airline companies have not been persecuted criminally for selling the same product to several people (unthinkable in any and all other businesses), is because your companies have contributed so many $$ to politicians, e.g. bought them off.
So: Please spare me your holier-than- thou attitude. Thank you.
Thanks for your long and nice reply.
But-sad to say this- you are so indoctrinated by Gordon and his bull that you are not even aware of it.
Today you walk into his office, but you will be surprised about security at CO when you try that after you have gotten the pink slip, because they had to let you go, because they have to save the company... blahblahblah...
Your beloved Gordon just loves to blame everybody else outside the company for your losses, like the damned customers, who don't want to pay full fares, and - even more outrageously- these damned other airlines, who are so stupid as not to understand that all airlines must raise fares in order to make more money. That you will lose a lot of customer that way, and that the whole thing does not add up, that must be someone elses' fault also.
Dear Gordon has said a few weeks ago that some airlines' executives have and IQ of 40.
I have news for you: All major airlines' executives together (including Gordon) have an IQ of 40.
Just for contrast: Southwest has just lowered their full fares, and expect that will result in an additional profit of 20m/year. They know how the market works, and they make profits. Your company doesn't and Gordon whines like a colicky baby.
What I really resent, though, is the lies that your and other airlines dish out to the customers, and seem to get away with.
One example: Fine, make airline tickets nonrefunadble/nonchangeable, use-it-or-lose-it, like theater tickets, but then make them transferable and let the owner of the ticket sell that ticket to another customer.
You and Gordon will probably say, that that is against the law and FAA rules. Let me inform you: THAT IS A LIE.
The FAA wants to know who is on the plane, and you must check ID, but there is absolutely no rule that a ticket cannot be reissued in someone elses name.
Another thing: My seat that I bought, use-it-or-lose-it, number 11A for the Opera is GOING TO BE EMPTY, if I don't show up.
If you want to play the game use-it-or-lose-it then you better fly that seat empty, because I have paid for it in full, and you don't let me re-sell it to someone else.
To both keep my money, and you, the airline, sell the same seat to someone else, should be outlawed as being criminal.
The only reason why your and other airline companies have not been persecuted criminally for selling the same product to several people (unthinkable in any and all other businesses), is because your companies have contributed so many $$ to politicians, e.g. bought them off.
So: Please spare me your holier-than- thou attitude. Thank you.
Sep 1st, 2002, 03:13 PM
#14
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Hooboy, Andreas, you do have some issues going on there, don't you? Was your mother frightened by an airline exec while carrying you, or what?
Actually, your discussion about what happens to your seat 11A at the Opera if you don't show is not accurate. The box office sells standing room admissions, and such buyers will stand in the rear of the auditorium until enough time has passsed to assume you are a a no show, then plotz in good old 11A. Should you indeed show up late, and have a valued ticket, the other guy just goes back to standing. Fairly universal practice, actually.
Actually, your discussion about what happens to your seat 11A at the Opera if you don't show is not accurate. The box office sells standing room admissions, and such buyers will stand in the rear of the auditorium until enough time has passsed to assume you are a a no show, then plotz in good old 11A. Should you indeed show up late, and have a valued ticket, the other guy just goes back to standing. Fairly universal practice, actually.
Sep 2nd, 2002, 03:02 PM
#15
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FlyBoy and CoresBoy,
I don't go to the opera that often, so I have not seen the the deal with the standby's. All I have seen is empty seats which I KNOW people had purchased tickets for.
Also, I do know that people have left at the intermission, after half the performance they had purchased, and I am not aware that any of these people have been penalized for this.
You know, like CO tells it's customers: You purchased 2 flights, but used only one, so now you owe us $300 more! Or- we'll take your frequent flyer miles away. Or-we send your travel agent a bill!
This is what our dear CoresBoy thinks are customer friendly policies. Good luck to you.
PS. I told the opera manager here in town, that he also could go after these "scammers" as you call them, who change, don't show up, leave early etc.
Baaaad people! Then his business will be as "successful" as CO's and the major airlines'.
I don't go to the opera that often, so I have not seen the the deal with the standby's. All I have seen is empty seats which I KNOW people had purchased tickets for.
Also, I do know that people have left at the intermission, after half the performance they had purchased, and I am not aware that any of these people have been penalized for this.
You know, like CO tells it's customers: You purchased 2 flights, but used only one, so now you owe us $300 more! Or- we'll take your frequent flyer miles away. Or-we send your travel agent a bill!
This is what our dear CoresBoy thinks are customer friendly policies. Good luck to you.
PS. I told the opera manager here in town, that he also could go after these "scammers" as you call them, who change, don't show up, leave early etc.
Baaaad people! Then his business will be as "successful" as CO's and the major airlines'.
Sep 2nd, 2002, 03:32 PM
#16
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I find it very interesting that my tax money just went to bail the airlines, Continental included ResBoy, out after 9-11 and they can afford to give away Eddie Bauer Ford Explorers for perfect attendance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
I guess not giving away plastic forks with inflight meals really did make the difference!!!!!!!!
God bless America...
I guess not giving away plastic forks with inflight meals really did make the difference!!!!!!!!
God bless America...
Sep 2nd, 2002, 04:38 PM
#17
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Your tax money didn't go to BAIL anybody out and you know that, the airlines know that and congress knows that, but it sounds good when you like to bash the airlines.
The deal with the Ford Explorers were set before Sept. 11th and the deal is being ammended post Sept. 11th.
The deal with the Ford Explorers were set before Sept. 11th and the deal is being ammended post Sept. 11th.
Sep 2nd, 2002, 05:23 PM
#18
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I wonder what would happen if CORes or some of the other airline apologists went into a restaurant and decided to change their order when the waitress told them it would be a $25 change fee, PLUS the price if the replacement item?
If she made him wait three hours for the meal, only to tell him that due to "mechanical problems" he was going to get deep-fried shrimp instead of trout-almondine. Tomorrow.
If she made him wait three hours for the meal, only to tell him that due to "mechanical problems" he was going to get deep-fried shrimp instead of trout-almondine. Tomorrow.
Sep 2nd, 2002, 09:56 PM
#19
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Fred,
Let's say that you owned this restaraunt and a whole bunch of customers everyday were changing their orders constantly? Would you just let them do it?
If I ordered the fried shrimp for say $6.99 and then decided after I placed the order that I wanted steak & lobster (which costs $10.99) instead. Would you let me have that for the $6.99?
Or let's say that I had th shrimp yesterday on a special which ended yesterday for $3.99. Would you still give it to me for that price?
Would you let me change my order as many times in a visit as I wished?
Let's say that you owned this restaraunt and a whole bunch of customers everyday were changing their orders constantly? Would you just let them do it?
If I ordered the fried shrimp for say $6.99 and then decided after I placed the order that I wanted steak & lobster (which costs $10.99) instead. Would you let me have that for the $6.99?
Or let's say that I had th shrimp yesterday on a special which ended yesterday for $3.99. Would you still give it to me for that price?
Would you let me change my order as many times in a visit as I wished?
Sep 3rd, 2002, 12:48 AM
#20
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If US tax payer money wan't used (and the media sure keeps saying it was) to bail out an industry that was failing before September 11 (oh, sorry that was beside the point wasn't it?) then what tax money was congress refering to?
And FYI, I don't hate the airlines I just hate the way most of them do business. Between customer service, problem solving, and the fact that it seems like there is one big airline, 2 excellent airlines stand out in my mind - Alaska and Virgin. At least they can think for themselves instead of playing follow the leader like Continental.
And FYI, I don't hate the airlines I just hate the way most of them do business. Between customer service, problem solving, and the fact that it seems like there is one big airline, 2 excellent airlines stand out in my mind - Alaska and Virgin. At least they can think for themselves instead of playing follow the leader like Continental.
