RTW tickets, Swiss, Lufthansa, BMI or US Airways?
 

My dilemma -

Getting from ZRH to LAS in the most comfortable way possible, taking full advantage of my Business Class RTW (Star Alliance) tickets. I'm trying to find flights with flat bed seats and personal entertainment. I'm also trying to avoid a longish connecting flight in the US as I've discovered some airlines (like UAL) no longer offer First Class on some of their domestic routes (is this really true?) Examples - ORD-LAS, IAD-LAS

BMI has a direct flight from MAN to LAS (flat bed), which is very enticing, but it only flies twice a week which concerns me. It flys the day we need it, but if our connecting flight from ZRH on Swiss is late....

US Airways has a flight from ZRH (767 - lie flat seats) to LAS via PHL (A320), but seat guru mentions that the lie flat seats aren't conducive for sleeping, which we'd be doing.

I've never flown US Airways, so this is new territory, but they do offer First Class on the US domestic portion. Any comments on this airline/routing?

There are several options on Swiss and Lufthansa, but they also have the lie flat seat with the awkward angle (is this really that big a deal?) and most of the Lufthansa flights connect with UAL flights in ORD, which don't offer First Class to LAS. We don't mind flying coach on a short route, say LAX to LAS, but since we're paying for Business Class seats, we'd rather fly First if the flight is longer.

The more I look, the more confused I get, so thought I'd ask the airline experts for some advice.

Any thoughts?

Just read the reviews for the bmi flight from MAN-LAS. Seems those lie down seats are problematic. This flight is also being discontinued in April. Think I've talked myself out of bmi.

UA uses their new lie-flat business class 767s for ZRH-IAD.

As for IAD-LAS, UA had relegated most (all?) of their flights to LAS to their Ted division, which had no first class, but they're phasing out Ted. So, it depends on when you're going and if UA would be offering regular mainline service on IAD-LAS.

Thanks Eric. That's actually the flight we originally planned to take, but we were put off by the five hour flight from IAD-LAS in coach.

We're flying in April. Any idea when those TED flights will be completely phased out?

I've since talked myself out of US Airways after reading some pretty scathing reviews on Skytrax. Still plan to fly them from LAX-PHX-COS as they offer direct flights. If the reviews are to be believed US Airways is pretty dismal.

That leaves Swiss and Lufthansa with the best options.

Swiss has a direct flight from ZRH to LAX, then it's only a short hop on UA to LAS. Decent connection too.

Lufthansa from ZRH-FRA-DEN-LAS would work too, but don't really relish the extra flight and it gets in pretty late.

Can anyone compare Swiss to Lufthansa on these routes in Biz?

United has started repainting the Ted planes, but it hasn't started the interior changes yet (or is starting soon). So, I think in April your chances of getting a Ted plane into LAS are still pretty high.

I've flown Lufthansa in business but Swiss only in economy. I like the "angled flat" seats for sitting (adjusted accordingly, of course), but I have had some difficulty with sliding while trying to sleep with them fully reclined. The last time (on Qantas actually, which has similar seats), I adjusted it so it was just short of being 180 and that seemed to work better for me.

I haven't been in LH long-haul J, but have been on Swiss' product. I'm not crazy gaga about the seat - angled flat, but the service is excellent. Swiss' setup on the 343s to LAX is 2-2-2 in business, v. 2-3-2 on LH's 744s. A couple of pictures for comparison:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Swiss...13X/1352254/L/

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Lufth...30M/1360990/L/

The lower-density cabin plus being able to skip the FRA connection would be big pluses in my book.

As to LAX-LAS, some if not all of the USAir flights on that route carry first class, assuming your RTW ticket books into FC on US domestic flights not carrying business class (Oneworld's do, not certain about Star Alliance RTWs.) That route was one "inherited" by USAir when it merged with America West Airlines a couple of years ago, so the equipment is undoubtedly America West planes with new livery. Those planes were quite comfortable, and on such a short hop it's of little consequence anyway.

I'd go with the ZRH-LAX-LAS option.

Lufthansa has some other options too, e.g. ZRH-DUS-ORD-LAS.

Lufthansa's Business Class is excellent. The seats are angled lie-flat, but you sleep comfortably. The Lufthansa Airbuses which are used for the DUS-ORD and the FRA-DVR flight are extremely noiseless.

Of course, you have personal entertainment with a selection of more than 50 movies etc. You get noise-cancelling Sennheise headsets. You get (real) champagne, good beverages and decent food. Service is good.

The Lufthansa Business Class lounges at the European airports are also excellent (with complimentary food and full bar).

I can't tell about the SWISS Business Class, but I expect that they have a similar standard as their parent company Lufthansa. The Swiss/Star Alliance Business lounge in ZRH is also very nice. From the pictures, the seats appear somewhat lesser than the high-tech Lufthansa seats.

Generally, European airlines treat Business Class passengers much better than American airlines treat Business Class passengers (I learnt this from experience, and it was confirmed by fellow Fodorites.)

Appreciate the comments.

traveller1959 -

We're trying to avoid ORD, as it would be a longish flight to LAS on Ted.

Gardyloo - After all I've read about US Air, I think we'll just fly from LAX to LAS on Ted in coach. Yes, Star Alliance puts RTW Busines Class customers in First Class if it's available. It's such a short flight that it really doesn't matter though.

I've actually flown Lufthansa long haul many times, both in business and coach, but not for a few years.

Haven't ever flown Swiss Int'l, although I did fly the original Swiss Air a few times.

I think we've decided to go for the Swiss flight, to avoid the stopovers in FRA and DEN.

I did a ton of research on this yesterday and it seems both Swiss and Lufthansa have the lie down seat, and I've read comments about passengers having trouble 'sliding down' the seat on both of them.

Actually USAir is pretty good to use between LAX and LAS. Being at T1 is convenient (for a local) and they have a USAir Club there. There is a USAir Club at LAS, streetside, which is very convenient. Small but comfortable. With carryon only I've gone there to get my bp.

The USAir first class on the route is quite comfy, as Gardyloo said. US has operated smaller aircraft on this route that don't have first class. But it would be maybe 1 or 2 out of 10 flights in a day.

United has some widebody 3-cabin aircraft flying between IAD and LAX. The business class seats on those (777) are more comfortable than F on the single aisle flights.

IAD-LAX-LAS on UA/US could be a nice trip. Only thing would be the change of terminals (from T7 to T1). The Ted flight to LAS usually is more convenient to you (if you arrive LAX on UA), of course. Usually it is at 71A, across from the RCC.

The 3-cabin LAX-LAS flights have flight numbers in the 900s (the are continuations of Europe flights).

I meant the 3-cabing IAD-LAX flights on UA are numbered 9xx

I don't think the flight numbers mean anything. I pick a random date late Jan IAD-LAX.

867: 2-class 763
49: 2-class 752
209: 2-class 319
967: 2-class 320
<b>947: 3-class 772</b>
925: 2-class 319

I didn't say all the 9xx flights are 3-cabin flights. I said the 3-cabin flights are 9xx. I would love to know differently.

The 9 usually means the flight is to/from Europe, so there is a chance that it is a 3-cabin flight. UA 947 comes from Amsterdam. Maybe 946/947 are the only widebodies.

When I am booking IAD-LAX I look for a 900 number and then check the aircraft type. One time I did get on a 9xx flight from IAD to LAX and was surprised that it wasn't a 777, but was a 757. Maybe it was UA 925 that originated in London and which was a 757 yesterday for IAD-LAX.

Now I'm really confused.

It <b>doesn't matter</b> if a flight has a continuation number from Europe. It means zilch. All it matter is whether the flight is a 3-class plane. So, 947 is good for IAD-LAX, other flights are not good. That's all it matters.

It matters to me because I look for those flight numbers first to see if it is a 3-cabin flight. The reason 947 is a 3-cabin flight, I was told by United, is because they wanted to offer the same type of seating for the entire flight from AMS to LAX.

Melnq8, all I was suggesting is that you can get international business class seats when flying across the USA on United. Those seats are better than domestic F.

Look for a 9xx flight number first (sure check other flight numbers if you want). ORD-LAX also has 3-cabin aircraft (935, I think).

Going via LAX would add a stop and the final leg on UA to LAS would still be all-economy. But it is only a 48 minute flight from LAX.

Up to you to decide if a Ted nonstop is better than a connecting flight, mostly in biz class.

mrwunrfl - If that's how you want to look at it, that's fine. I'm just pointing out that only <b>one out of three</b> 9xx IAD-LAX flights are 3-class. I don't want anybody to pick a 9xx flight thinking it has 3-class, but doesn't.

And the continuation explanation makes little sense. Why AMS has a 3-class continuation with 947 but LHR doesn't with 925? Or 967 doesn't get one from FCO?

Melnq8, I think you get the point that there are UA transcons that offer international business class seats. IAD-LAX is one example. Look for flights numbered in the 900s, in particular. Taking one of these would require a connection to get to LAS.

I figure that you are bright enough to take it from there.

Yeah I get it.

As it stands now, here's our itinerary:

SQ 226 - PER-SIN

SQ 26 - SIN-FRA - waitlisted
LH 791 - SIN-MUC (if above doesn't clear)

LH 3722 - FRA-ZRH (if above waitlist clears)
LH 5062 - MUC-ZRH (if above doesn't clear)

LX 40 - ZRH-LAX

UA 336 - LAX-LAS

US 53 - LAS-PHX

US 2922 - PHX-COS

UA 6492 - COS-LAX

NZ 1 - LAX-AKL

NZ 175 - AKL-PER

Waitlisted the above SQ flights, as given a choice, I prefer SQ over LH.

Any comments on these particular flights/airlines/aircraft welcomed.

PS -

At one point we considered flying South African Airlines from PER-JNB, and then JNB-ZRH on Swiss.

We've heard very nice things about South African on long haul flights, but this routing, tempting as it was, added quite a bit of mileage. Not an issue as far as the RTW tickets were concerned, but we suspect me may be screaming to get off the plane as it is.