Best Use Of 280,000 AA Miles?
 

I saw the thread about reduced capacity in the Lounge, which prompted me to ask this question.

I've about 280,000 AA miles. What do you think is the best way to spend it?

I've always thought that it's best to claim two first class tickets to Europe, say, because I'll probably never spend my own money on first-class tickets.

But clearly this is a knowledgeable crowd, so how would you spend 280,000 miles? It'd be great if you can suggest what you think is the best way for 1 person or for 2 people travelling together.

I don't think that I'm going to use my miles anytime soon, but who knows? If I like your idea, I may just steal it and spend my miles!

Thanks!

By the way, I also don't mind hearing ideas about how to spend X miles for X > 280,000.

I hope X is not too much larger than 280,000, however, since it may be impractical for me to wait until I have X. I'm accumulating at a much slower pace these days. It's regrettable, but I hope that that will change soon. Well, hope springs eternal!

Kinda depends on your taste in destinations. For us, we love southern Africa, so with 280K miles, and starting from the west coast, I'd fly on my own dime to Chicago, then use the miles to go Chicago - Madrid - Johannesburg - London - Vancouver, all in business class, for 130K miles each, using a Oneworld award.

Starting on the west coast instead of Chicago would bump us into the next OW mileage tier, requiring 150K miles each. In that case we'd probably just turn it into an RTW itinerary, and go Vancouver - London - Cape Town - Joburg - Hong Kong - Vancouver.

To us, business class is comfortable enough; don't need the caviar.

I've never been to Africa, so that can be interesting.

I should be going out of NYC, but then, well, one never knows!

I don't think I'm married to any destinations. As I said, if there's an idea that I like I'll think about doing it!

How much would these tickets be if you pay out of your own pocket? It'd be great if you can price (just approximately) the itinerary suggested in Economy/Business/First.

This would be useful to know if someone else makes other suggestions. I don't really have a good sense of ticket prices to destinations I haven't been to. :)

I still think about the 5-minute showers that Emirates is supposedly offering in First Class cabins. :)

If bargain hunting JFK-Europe RT in business can often be had in the $2000 range; figure $3000-$4000 RT for Europe - Africa.

Economy (skipping Europe - just straight to SA) is sometimes in the $1000 range; I'd probably budget $1500 to be safe.

For first, you're looking at upwards of $12K-$13K, but for that you're probably better off looking at a first class RTW ticket - much higher mile/$ yield.

I am quite adamant at not redeeming FF miles for anything less than 3c or 4c per mile in airfare savings; i.e. redeeming 100K miles should be for a ticket worth around 3 grand. Just my opinion; others place higher or lower value on their miles.

I agree with you, Gardyloo, which is why I've been mostly saving my miles.

So are you saying JFK-Europe-Africa is about $4000 in Business or $2000+$4000 = $6000 in Business?

And is the 12-13K for First JFK-Europe-Africa? I thought that I've seen tickets around $10000 for JFK-Europe alone.

Yes I definitely see the attraction of claiming something in First (in terms of $/miles), as I mentioned initially.

Part of what makes this interesting is if I claim economy tickets, I can potentially make more trips than in a higher class of service. But then I guess it's always tempting to want to splurge when you're not forking out cash to buy something.

In first, I found JFK-LHR-JNB-LHR-JNB on AA (using BA to JNB) for $13000 for next month. Delta and South African, which have direct service from the US to S. Africa (neither could be used with AA miles) don't offer FC. To me, the price/mileage penalty to go from business to first isn't usually worth it. YMMV.

The virtue of the Oneworld awards is that they're easy to configure to get multiple trips (within a 12 month period), provided you don't return to your origin point (or co-terminals like LGA or EWR.) Thus, say JFK-HEL-LHR-BOS (long layover, return to NYC then) BOS-DFW-EZE-JFK gets you two great trips - Finland and the UK, followed by Buenos Aires, can all be had for 130K miles in business class.

That's a really creative idea (I'd never have known something like this can work!). And Helsinki and Bs As are both new to me (you may remember that I had to cancel Bs As last year when all hell broke lose).

But there's something not so "elegant" about it. I mean, I can fly direct to EZE from NYC, but instead I've to get to BOS and then fly to DFW first before going to EZE? Time is also money. :)

Are there any other interesting combos that involve Asia (apart from the one that starts in Vancouver)? Anything that involve Egypt and/or the the Middle East (say Cairo and/or Amman -- the latter is on Royal Jordanian, so it should be OW).

Sure -

Go to the AA website and read up on Oneworld awards - http://www.aa.com/aa/pubcontent/en_U...s/oneWorld.jsp

Then go to the Great Circle Mapper - http://gc.kls2.com/ - and start playing around with itineraries that meet the Oneworld award requirements (2+ OW carriers besides AA, all segments count, max 2 connections and 1 stopover per city, no transiting point of origin, only one openjaw segment, 16 segs max, etc.)

Bingo. Have fun.

Thanks. I need to hire you for your services, Gardyloo. :)

But wouldn't you try to max out at 50,000 miles? The mileage usage to claim that award is much less than twice required for a 25,000 miles award. So if you had enough to claim a ticket that uses 50,000 miles total, wouldn't you do that instead? It seems like that's the best use of the miles.

But 25,000 miles is about the circumference of the globe. So 50,000 miles is roughly like circumnavigation twice. Maybe it's hard to conceive of a RTW trip that's like circumnavigating the globe twice and at the same time squeezes out the use of every mile in 50,000.

For example I can try a random itinerary like this one:

JFK-LHR-CAI-AMM-HKG-SYD-EZE-JFK

Let's ignore whether I can construct this with OW carriers, but the miles used total about 28000 miles (a little over one circumference of the globe), and I've already traversed six continents.

And what's the use of that Circle Mapper link exactly? I guess you can calculate mileage usage with it, but is there something else you need it for? It doesn't tell you whether your stops are actually covered by the OneWorld carriers, does it?

Actually now I think that I've asked this miles useage before, but I've probably phrased it differently. I guess I just can't wrap my head around this. I am afraid to dig in further right now. It's way past my bedtime. :)

We're booked to Tanzania in First Class for January 2010. The flight is nearly 30 hours travel time so FC is a must for me. I found tickets for 120,000 miles each on Delta/KLM.

We have always used our miles to make the really long haul trips as comfortable as possible -- Australia, Thailand, China, Africa.

<i>We're booked to Tanzania in First Class for January 2010. The flight is nearly 30 hours travel time so FC is a must for me. I found tickets for 120,000 miles each on Delta/KLM.</i>

Just to clarify, technically this is in business class, not first. Neither Delta nor KLM has 3 class service only 2 class - economy and business.

I would say that Africa or Australia would be a good use of miles for premium class awards. RTW even better.

following this thread closely. I assume that Delta does participate in the OneWorld?

No, I think OneWorld is something else.

According to link Gardyloo gave OW carriers are AA, BA, Cathay Pacific, Finnair, Iberia, JAL, LAN, Malev, Qantas, Royal Jordanian.

I guess Delta must have something similar but I'll leave someone else to figure that out. :)

Delta is part of the Skyteam alliance - Delta/NW, Air France/KLM, Alitalia, Korean, Continental for a little while longer (they're going over to Star Alliance) and several others. http://www.skyteam.com

You are right,Patty, NW/KLM's class is called "Business/First", so I guess it counts to me. I've flown them a lot (a million miles), so the bottom line is - I can stretch out and get some sleep and food and a glass of wine on the way. Well worth the miles to me. My point being, the OPs 280,000 miles can make a long, rough trip a bit more comfortable. Personallly, I never spend miles on a domestic ticket or a short hop International ticket. We use them to upgrade for the long hauls in comfort. Its all a matter of priority.

thanks! I was not sure if they had that round the world option..not that it will be an option for me :-? More curious I guess :)

I don't have that many miles with Delta, but out of curiosity, I looked to see if it has a RTW option. The details are at the end. I am guessing that a trick like what Gardyloo suggested (i.e. flying back to USA via Boston first and then going to EZE) can't work with a routing like this one. But then, what do I know?

Also it appears that you need a minimum of 60,000 miles to claim a ticket to Europe (whereas AA's minimum is 40,000). I'm not sure if I missed something. But I presume Delta has raised their mileage reqs since I mentioned that I used 50,000 for a ticket for Istanbul a few years ago on another thread. (Well, I think I used 50,000 -- hope I didn't go crazy. :) )

I guess I have more miles than I expected with Delta. I have about 100,000 miles. I guess it's not enough to do anything crazily interesting (certainly not the RTW below). :) Still I'm thinking that maybe I should accumulate another 20,000 or so if I can before I think about spending it.

--

Round-the-World Awards

Round-the-World routing must be in a continuous eastbound or westbound direction (i.e., backtracking is not permitted). Travel must terminate in the country of origin without extending beyond the point of origin. Flights operated by codeshare partners must permit local traffic between the stopover point and the destination; the most direct routing applies.

Mileage needed for Award Travel:

180,000 miles for Economy class
280,000 miles for Business class
340,000 miles for First class

TC,
I agree there's a huge difference between economy and business and that's what I use my miles for as well. But for the most part, I don't find the price or mileage differential between business and first worthwhile. I guess that's why I was trying to make the distinction.

MomDDTravel,
Delta does have a RTW award. It's valid on Skyteam plus Alaska and Avianca. It's not on the award chart but off the top of my head it's 280K in business now. I just wish I'd redeemed 2 of these when the mileage requirement was lower.

Looks like 111op beat me to it. Thanks for posting the DL RTW mileage requirements. I was too lazy to look it up :P And you are right. TATL Y used to be 50K. As long as they don't touch my beloved Africa J award I'm happy and will be redeeming my 7th pair shortly :)

Sometimes I'm hesitant to ask these questions here because I find that a feeling of jealousy invariably overwhelms me when I hear stories like yours, Patty. :)

I'm still curious to know if it actually makes sense to try to claim a ticket that involves 50,000 miles of travel on OneWorld (assuming you have the miles) -- if that's the best value for money. I'm also trying to imagine what that itinerary will look like (it's like peering into the fourth dimension! :) ).

There actually is a OneWorld planner here -- I haven't used it so I don't know how useful it is:

http://www.oneworld.com/ow/flight-in...your-itinerary

There's a lot of info on this Wiki page. I don't know if the info is accurate, but it's probably worth reading anyway:

http://wikitravel.org/en/Round_the_world_flights

There's also an interesting Frommer's article here with an interesting OneWorld routing:

http://www.frommers.com/articles/5778.html

It'd be great to find some sample itineraries like the ones Gardyloo posted (and the one in Frommers) and their costs so that you can figure out what you're getting when you redeem. Is there a website that does that? If not, maybe someone needs to build that website. :)

Sorry! ;)

Off and on over the years I've pondered taking the Continental Micronesia Island Hopper but the thought of 14 hours in a 738 has stopped me every time :D The reason I mention this is that you can still redeem DL miles on CO flights through Oct 24th and it's one of the more interesting trips I can think of.

I cashed in a lot of miles at the last minute to travel from ORD to BKK in Feb 08 in first class on UA. It was a much-needed trip at that point in my life. After that trip I can say that spending my miles to get a business class seat is just fine. I don't NEED first class. It just wasn't THAT much nicer. But I'm glad I did it once. I had wondered what that private first class lounge at NRT was like... you go up to it in a glass elevator... and there is a special invitation waiting for you when you get to the NRT red carpet lounge main floor and show them your first class ticket .... smile ...

Carol

<i>There actually is a OneWorld planner here -- I haven't used it so I don't know how useful it is:

http://www.oneworld.com/ow/flight-info/plan-and-book-your-itinerary</i>

Hold up for a second. Don't mix apples and Toyotas. The planning tool you mention is for <b><i>purchased</i></b> round-the-world tickets using the Oneworld Explorer RTW ticket product. It is NOT the same thing as claiming a "round the world" <b>award</b> using AA miles.

AA does not have a "round the world" award scheme, unlike some other airlines, e.g. United/Star Alliance or Delta/Skyteam.

Instead, AA has a <i>redemption (award)</i> scheme it calls a "Oneworld award" because it requires use of AA's Oneworld Alliance partners, and no other airline partners. (For instance AA has partnerships with Alaska Airlines and El Al, neither of which are members of any alliance including Oneworld. Neither of those airlines can be used with a Oneworld <i>award</i> itinerary.)

If you want to create a round-the-world itinerary using AA miles for a Oneworld award, you certainly can do so. However, if you want to figure how to fly 30 or 50,000 miles and <i>not</i> go all the way around the world - say by flying back and forth across the Atlantic a few times - you can do so with a Oneworld award.

With a paid RTW ticket, you have to travel eastward or westward, without backtracking between the 3 "regions" created by the airline industry - the Americas (including the Caribbean,) Europe and Africa (including the Middle East) and Asia and "Southwest Pacific" - meaning Australia, New Zealand and the Pacific islands. You're limited to a maximum number of miles (most RTW tickets) or by the number of continents you pay for (Oneworld Explorer) and can take no more than 16 flights.

Some of those conditions are the same for awards - 16 segments, a year to complete, etc. - but not the routing requirement.

This is interesting, thanks!

The going back-and-forth Atlantic itinerary comment is interesting.

So is it (theoretically) possible to fly

US1-EU1-US2-EU2-US3-EU3-US4-EU4-US5-EU5-US6-EU6-US7-EU8-US1?

There are 14 segments in this itinerary, so it should be almost 50,000 miles.

So the idea here is that US1, US2, ... are separate US cities.
EU1, EU2, ... are separate European cities.

It's just pushing your JFK-LHR-BOS idea to the extreme.

If you cash 7 trips at business class for 7x2K = 14,000, and the mileage requirement is 280,000, that's almost 5c a mile?

But I guess realistically, it's probably not a very interesting option because you've choose 6-7 US cities that are presumably pretty close together, and there's a limit to how far east you can go to Europe (JFK-FCO is about 4200 miles).

Actually you only need 220,000 miles to construct a OW award that uses 50,000 miles, so the redemption rate is even better than what I calculated.

But it's probably not possible to fit 7 r/ts in comfortably.

Must the OW award start in USA? Can you choose to fly between Asia and Australia a few times, for example?

When I've put together very ambitious (35,000 flight miles or more) itineraries, the controlling factors have always been running out of segments, and/or running out of stopover/connection points, and/or the time needed to complete the trips.

The rules must be observed, for example you can't stop over in the same city twice, and you can only connect through a city twice. So since Oneworld is pretty "hub" intensive, multiple trips across, say, the Atlantic become complicated due to a limited number of city pairs that can be used or connected through.

And like any mileage redemption trip, it all depends on award seats being available when you want to fly. Putting a dozen or 16 segments into one trip with availability on all of them being lined up in advance, over a period of several months, is no easy task. And once your itinerary is set, it's cement - date changes are allowed but NO re-routing allowed after booking.

No, the award can start and end anywhere. My most recent OW award was Tokyo-Vancouver-London-Stockholm; I used my one "open jaw" allowance in ending in a different place than where I started.

Yes I see your point about crossing over the Atlantic multiple times. I'm thinking it's theoretically possible, but it'd be useful to start with figuring out which US cities have non-stop flights on OW to Europe, since I bet that's the governing constraint rather than the one on the Europe side.

Maybe at one point you can consider posting your sample itineraries on a website somewhere? They would be interesting to look at. Your trips sound fascinating!

My itineraries typically entail four-continent purchased RTWs, which then allow me to accumulate so many FF miles that virtually all my (and my wife's) leisure travel is done utilizing awards. However this year I'm taking a break from paid RTWs, since business travel can be combined with award travel more easily, plus frankly our combined FF mileage balances (a little over 1 million miles) are enough that we're now starting to give away trips as presents to relatives.

Paid RTWs (we use the Oneworld Explorer - continent based, not mileage) have different prices depending on how many continents you're covering, which booking class (economy, business, first) you use, and most importantly, where you buy the ticket and where you begin and end the trip. For example, last year just before Oneworld changed the rules to reduce the number of allowed flights from 20 to 16, I bought a 20-segment RTW ticket in South Africa, which cost around US$4900 for a four-continent trip (Africa, Europe, N. America, Asia.) I started in Cape Town, flew to London and then to Helsinki. Back to London and then to Muscat (Oman), then back to London and on to LAX. I live in Seattle and American doesn't offer service up and down the west coast, so I used an open segment to travel on my own to Seattle. Then some time later I flew to Dallas and then to Anchorage, back to Dallas and back to Seattle. Then later I flew to New York and then to Dallas, then to Tokyo and on to Singapore. Then back to Tokyo, then to Hong Kong, then I completed the trip by returning to Johannesburg and Cape Town. I then used an award to get back to the US.

If I had needed to revise the paid RTW itinerary midstream (for example, in the one I did right before that, I "swapped" Australia/NZ for Asia, thus the four continents were revised from Africa/Europe/N. America/Asia to Africa/Europe/N. America/"SW Pacific") the cost to do so was $125 to have the ticket re-issued, plus any difference in airport taxes etc. that arose from going to Auckland, Melbourne and Sydney instead of Tokyo, Hong Kong and Chitose.)

The most recent itinerary (Asia, not Oz) traveling in business or first class (in the US where business class isn't offered on most flights, you travel in first class) and with my elite status in AA's frequent flyer program, I earned around 150,000 frequent flyer miles. Using a Oneworld award, those 150K miles could easily be used for another round-the-world trip in business class, so in essence the one purchased RTW ticket could leverage two RTW trips, all in business or first class, for an average of something like $2500 per trip - up to 32 flights over two years (one year validity for the RTW ticket, a second year to complete any award travel.) In my mind that's superb value.

Hi, so you paid 4900 for 4-continent in S. Africa (which I geuss in Business?), whereas 4-continent in USA would be double that?! That's clever.

http://www.oneworld.com/ow/air-trave...#fare-estimate

oneworld Explorer - 4 continent
Economy USD 4,400
Business USD 9,100
First USD 12,500

When I checked the fares, I was thinking that 3-continent (at least in Economy) at 3900+ would probably not be good value. It seems like I could just put something similar together by stitching together several r/t tickets.

But I guess the beauty of the Explorer is that you potentially save on having to backtrack? Also I guess there are all these other factors I didn't consider (like mileage accumulation, etc.).

I think that my big problem with this kind of planning is that I just haven't planned anything like this before. It seems impossible to know what my schedule will be like so far ahead of time.

Anyway here are some interesting itineraries to contemplate (along all the various "circle" options):

http://www.oneworld.com/ow/air-trave...he-world-fares

<i>I think that my big problem with this kind of planning is that I just haven't planned anything like this before. It seems impossible to know what my schedule will be like so far ahead of time.</i>

Exactly. Plus, of course, you can't book airline flights farther out then 11 months, so what I recommend to people is that they develop something of a travel "strategic plan" - call it a multi-year wish list if you want - in which they put into some kind of order destinations and time frames for travels that they (a) <i>would</i> like to do, or (b) <i>may</i> have to do, as far out as they can. Know ahead of time (roughly, of course) what the costs, or mileage requirements, or time commitments would be, then block out a savings plan, or a mileage accumulation plan, or a calendar plan, that <i>could</i> accommodate those potential travels. By doing so you can also look at things like weather conditions in your destinations, or what events you'd like to join (or avoid), so that you travel smarter, and most likely cheaper, when you get around to it.

The plan won't be precise, at least until the dates come closer, and it won't rule out unplanned travel - business trips, weddings, etc. - that always come up. But it gives a framework for looking ahead, and can help you start treating travel like any other recurrent expense.