Just starting to contemplate a safari--pointers please
May 31st, 2017, 08:15 PM
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Just starting to contemplate a safari--pointers please
I am hoping some of you can steer me in the right direction to start research. We have never been to Africa.
We have done safaris in India and Nepal, places I understand are nothing in comparison to African safaris.On those we have seen leopards, hyenas, gharial crocodiles, elephants, a tiger sighting for a half an hour, rhinos, lots of monkeys and lots of birds. These sightings have been made at lodges and a private home where we spent 3 or 4 days as part of much longer (six week) trips to the area. These trips were made in Jan. and Feb or March when we were escaping our cold winter climate. We are open as to when we could go but really prefer to stay at home in the US for the beautiful summers where we live.
So, since we've already seen some of the animals that many people go to see, we'd probably be most interested in places where we can have sightings of other animals. And, this is not the only thing we'd want to do. If we are making the trip there, we'd plan to spend some time seeing other places that would also interest us. We are not just interested in animals.
We are retired and pretty fit for our ages. We can kayak and enjoy doing water-based activities, and we can hike. So, we are not limited to just jeep-type game drives. We are former campers, so we don't need luxury. When we visited the Amazon rainforest we purposely chose a very remote lodge. There was no electricity, cold water for showers came right from the river we were on, and we described our experience as summer camp for grown-ups. We had a great time there.
We'd probably prefer more off-the-beaten path and smaller, more intimate type options rather than large lodges that cater to tour groups. Our focus would be on quality guides in a more pristine environment. We see no point in paying for luxury lodging and food and amenities.
When we have visited all of these other places I have made all of my arrangements on my own and typically do that unless there is a really good reason to go through an agent.
What suggestions can you give me for starters? Thanks much.
We have done safaris in India and Nepal, places I understand are nothing in comparison to African safaris.On those we have seen leopards, hyenas, gharial crocodiles, elephants, a tiger sighting for a half an hour, rhinos, lots of monkeys and lots of birds. These sightings have been made at lodges and a private home where we spent 3 or 4 days as part of much longer (six week) trips to the area. These trips were made in Jan. and Feb or March when we were escaping our cold winter climate. We are open as to when we could go but really prefer to stay at home in the US for the beautiful summers where we live.
So, since we've already seen some of the animals that many people go to see, we'd probably be most interested in places where we can have sightings of other animals. And, this is not the only thing we'd want to do. If we are making the trip there, we'd plan to spend some time seeing other places that would also interest us. We are not just interested in animals.
We are retired and pretty fit for our ages. We can kayak and enjoy doing water-based activities, and we can hike. So, we are not limited to just jeep-type game drives. We are former campers, so we don't need luxury. When we visited the Amazon rainforest we purposely chose a very remote lodge. There was no electricity, cold water for showers came right from the river we were on, and we described our experience as summer camp for grown-ups. We had a great time there.
We'd probably prefer more off-the-beaten path and smaller, more intimate type options rather than large lodges that cater to tour groups. Our focus would be on quality guides in a more pristine environment. We see no point in paying for luxury lodging and food and amenities.
When we have visited all of these other places I have made all of my arrangements on my own and typically do that unless there is a really good reason to go through an agent.
What suggestions can you give me for starters? Thanks much.
May 31st, 2017, 09:32 PM
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Hello Julies to me i could suggest some country in Africa that is Uganda, mostly known as the Pearl of Africa. Its really the pearl of Africa and since you have watched some of the animals, this time round expect much of animals you haven't seen for example mountain gorillas, chimpazzes, baboon, the eland found in lake Mburo National Park, families of lions to mention but a few. here the also have beautiful sceneries of landscapes, a great deal of crater lakes in the western part of the country and a lot more. If you love hiking, camping and mountain climbing still a lot of place for such activities for example Mountain Elgon in the east is good for hikes, the Rwenzori Mountains with its snow capped peak makes it appear like a corn of ice cream. Putting that a side the prices here are the lowest compared to the surrounding countries.But still basing you main trip in Uganda, you still have chance to move to all East African countries easily and cheaply but being given the best services so please if you pick interest in Uganda, I can recommend some best operators out there. In case of any other questions about East Africa feel free to ask me.
kindest regards,
Atidu
kindest regards,
Atidu
May 31st, 2017, 11:54 PM
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Hi JulieS,
Great decision!!!
Apologies for this rather disorganized reply, which will hopefully be one of several you get. Unfortunately, this forum gets very little traffic, so don't limit your queries to Fodors.
Any idea of where on the continent? Are you thinking E Africa? South Africa? Do you want to trek to the gorillas in Uganda?
Actually, I was going to recommend Uganda in any case. It reminds me of India in its down to earth open welcoming wonderful people and ...for lack of a better term...less "polished" atmosphere. There is a huge variety of possible experiences there beyond classic safari. It and Rwanda are the only countries where you can see the mountain gorilla in its natural home. (other than Congo, which you probably do not want to go to.) Otoh, you will not see the sheer number of big cats that you see in Kenya. RE: elephants, the ones in Africa are larger than those in India. To say safari in India is different is a huge understatement. Your experience of that animal in Africa will be different, even if name of that animal is the same
No need to visit during your USA summer weather. For example, Kenya and indeed most of Africa in January is warm and gorgeous. You can escape your winter snow!! The equator goes through Africa, so the seasons are reversed in any of the places (e.g. South Africa) below the equator.
As for camping, many smaller camps are in "luxury" tents (bed, bathroom, bucket shoer) in Kenya, Tanzania, and South Arica You will actually pay MORE per night for these than in many of the safari lodges in Kenay. Be prepared for sticker shock when you first see the prices.
I highly recommend that you do use a planner for your trip. If not already done, read some of the other entries, e.g. for Kenya planning, on Fodors and you'll see similar recommendation. Inquest, who you'll recognize from the Asia Forum, has a current trip report about Uganda, including a very reasonably priced lodge in Buhoma (village at edge of Bwindi ) that sounds like the kind of place you like.
For trekking and hiking, check Nkuringo in Uganda. You can have a one day, or multi day trek through the Bwindi jungle, or even a multi day journey including a lake crossing https://www.mountaingorillalodge.com...ari-vacations/ Their main website: https://www.mountaingorillalodge.com
I stayed in one of the cabins only for a night/day. It is beautiful there, as is so much of Uganda, and the people are terrific. Wish I'd had time for the walk from there to Buhoma! There are a few private cabins and smaller, less $, attached motel type rooms.
Another idea for a trek, as the post-er above mentions, is Mt Elgon in Uganda. You can start your trek from near Sipi Falls. I stayed there a couple days in a place with a waterfall 20 feet away.It really felt like the garden of Eden. https://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Re...rn_Region.html There are beautiful cottages, and "budget" bandas--very nice and clean-- along the river there.
Or there's Jinja town. You can stay along the Nile!! I think there is some camping there..and many small local b and bs. You can raft on the river. See this for some ideas: http://raftafrica.com
Have fun, wherever you choose. You're starting on a great adventure!!!!
Great decision!!!
Apologies for this rather disorganized reply, which will hopefully be one of several you get. Unfortunately, this forum gets very little traffic, so don't limit your queries to Fodors.
Any idea of where on the continent? Are you thinking E Africa? South Africa? Do you want to trek to the gorillas in Uganda?
Actually, I was going to recommend Uganda in any case. It reminds me of India in its down to earth open welcoming wonderful people and ...for lack of a better term...less "polished" atmosphere. There is a huge variety of possible experiences there beyond classic safari. It and Rwanda are the only countries where you can see the mountain gorilla in its natural home. (other than Congo, which you probably do not want to go to.) Otoh, you will not see the sheer number of big cats that you see in Kenya. RE: elephants, the ones in Africa are larger than those in India. To say safari in India is different is a huge understatement. Your experience of that animal in Africa will be different, even if name of that animal is the same
No need to visit during your USA summer weather. For example, Kenya and indeed most of Africa in January is warm and gorgeous. You can escape your winter snow!! The equator goes through Africa, so the seasons are reversed in any of the places (e.g. South Africa) below the equator.
As for camping, many smaller camps are in "luxury" tents (bed, bathroom, bucket shoer) in Kenya, Tanzania, and South Arica You will actually pay MORE per night for these than in many of the safari lodges in Kenay. Be prepared for sticker shock when you first see the prices.
I highly recommend that you do use a planner for your trip. If not already done, read some of the other entries, e.g. for Kenya planning, on Fodors and you'll see similar recommendation. Inquest, who you'll recognize from the Asia Forum, has a current trip report about Uganda, including a very reasonably priced lodge in Buhoma (village at edge of Bwindi ) that sounds like the kind of place you like.
For trekking and hiking, check Nkuringo in Uganda. You can have a one day, or multi day trek through the Bwindi jungle, or even a multi day journey including a lake crossing https://www.mountaingorillalodge.com...ari-vacations/ Their main website: https://www.mountaingorillalodge.com
I stayed in one of the cabins only for a night/day. It is beautiful there, as is so much of Uganda, and the people are terrific. Wish I'd had time for the walk from there to Buhoma! There are a few private cabins and smaller, less $, attached motel type rooms.
Another idea for a trek, as the post-er above mentions, is Mt Elgon in Uganda. You can start your trek from near Sipi Falls. I stayed there a couple days in a place with a waterfall 20 feet away.It really felt like the garden of Eden. https://www.tripadvisor.com/Hotel_Re...rn_Region.html There are beautiful cottages, and "budget" bandas--very nice and clean-- along the river there.
Or there's Jinja town. You can stay along the Nile!! I think there is some camping there..and many small local b and bs. You can raft on the river. See this for some ideas: http://raftafrica.com
Have fun, wherever you choose. You're starting on a great adventure!!!!
Jun 1st, 2017, 05:00 AM
#4
Julies, first, welcome to the insane world of African safari. Be warned, it's ridiculously addictive. My one "bucket list" safari is about to become my fifth in 5 years.
For your first, I'd really consider hiring a safari planner, or booking through an agent who handles a lot of safaris and knows the lay of the land (Gamewatchers and African Travel Resource come to mind). There's just too much you don't know going to Africa the first time, and there's a lot of misinformation on the forums. It generally does not cost any more than doing it on your own, because many have access to rates or deals you can't find on your own. They can also answer a lot of value/logistic questions that you aren't aware of. I see a lot of people stumble around doing this themselves. It wasn't until my 4th safari I felt like I knew everything I needed to to do it myself, and I'm largely independent everywhere else in the world.
Second, go log on to Safaritalk forums. There's a trip planning forum there and thousands of very detailed trip reports covering all over Africa with pictures, lodge and camp descriptions etc. This forum is ok, there are a handful of helpful folks here but the knowledge and experience of Safaritalk is unsurpassed. Plus, you won't get inundated by companies and unknown agents like you will here. Safaritalk is unadulterated truth with no one trying to make a sale. I wouldn't think of going anywhere in Africa that I hadn't read about on Safaritalk.
I've done four traditional safaris all over Kenya, one in Tanzania and one gorilla trekking experience in Rwanda. All were unique and special in their own ways. But if you do consider Kenya, please consider staying in the conservancies. The benefit to you is less crowded, vastly improved game driving conditions than the national reserves (which you can still day trip into). The benefit to them is the ongoing preservation and conservation of the ecosystem. Less trafficked areas generally mean more wildlife. In two conservancies in the Maasai Mara, I've seen over 50 different cats in less than a week, right outside of camp. My saying was "you can't swing a cat without hitting a cat" and usually it's not just one, but several to a dozen cats at a time. My safari in February, we saw 68 cats in 6 days, including just our own vehicle on a pride of lions on a hippo kill, a lioness and two cubs on a topi kill, a cheetah making her first kill as an independent adult and two African wild cats, right outside our camp, which is very very rare. And to be completely alone watching all this was like our own private wild kingdom!
All that said, the gorilla trekking was intense. There's a lot to be said for coming face to face with 16 or so gorillas and being within arms length of a silverback!
You're just scratching the surface here. Do your research and come up with a wishlist first. What you want to see and do. Then start reading what others have done and what piques your interest in terms of lodging (bricks and mortar lodges or tented camps with bucket showers and no electricity?) You can run the gamut based on budget and interest.
For your first, I'd really consider hiring a safari planner, or booking through an agent who handles a lot of safaris and knows the lay of the land (Gamewatchers and African Travel Resource come to mind). There's just too much you don't know going to Africa the first time, and there's a lot of misinformation on the forums. It generally does not cost any more than doing it on your own, because many have access to rates or deals you can't find on your own. They can also answer a lot of value/logistic questions that you aren't aware of. I see a lot of people stumble around doing this themselves. It wasn't until my 4th safari I felt like I knew everything I needed to to do it myself, and I'm largely independent everywhere else in the world.
Second, go log on to Safaritalk forums. There's a trip planning forum there and thousands of very detailed trip reports covering all over Africa with pictures, lodge and camp descriptions etc. This forum is ok, there are a handful of helpful folks here but the knowledge and experience of Safaritalk is unsurpassed. Plus, you won't get inundated by companies and unknown agents like you will here. Safaritalk is unadulterated truth with no one trying to make a sale. I wouldn't think of going anywhere in Africa that I hadn't read about on Safaritalk.
I've done four traditional safaris all over Kenya, one in Tanzania and one gorilla trekking experience in Rwanda. All were unique and special in their own ways. But if you do consider Kenya, please consider staying in the conservancies. The benefit to you is less crowded, vastly improved game driving conditions than the national reserves (which you can still day trip into). The benefit to them is the ongoing preservation and conservation of the ecosystem. Less trafficked areas generally mean more wildlife. In two conservancies in the Maasai Mara, I've seen over 50 different cats in less than a week, right outside of camp. My saying was "you can't swing a cat without hitting a cat" and usually it's not just one, but several to a dozen cats at a time. My safari in February, we saw 68 cats in 6 days, including just our own vehicle on a pride of lions on a hippo kill, a lioness and two cubs on a topi kill, a cheetah making her first kill as an independent adult and two African wild cats, right outside our camp, which is very very rare. And to be completely alone watching all this was like our own private wild kingdom!
All that said, the gorilla trekking was intense. There's a lot to be said for coming face to face with 16 or so gorillas and being within arms length of a silverback!
You're just scratching the surface here. Do your research and come up with a wishlist first. What you want to see and do. Then start reading what others have done and what piques your interest in terms of lodging (bricks and mortar lodges or tented camps with bucket showers and no electricity?) You can run the gamut based on budget and interest.
Jun 1st, 2017, 10:21 AM
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Dear Julies
How exciting that you are considering a trip to Africa. Based on the information you provided, I would suggest looking at South Africa as a destination. The reason I would recommend SA is because you mention not wanting to focus purely on game viewing/safari but rather including other aspects into your itinerary.
South Africa is phenomenal for wildlife, however the country has so much more to offer. Many tourist only come and do the cookie cutter types of itineraries which include Cape Town and a safari in the Kruger Region. I would suggest looking deeper into the country for a more “off the beaten path” type of experience.
You mentioned that you enjoy hiking, Tsitsikamma for example is home to the world famous Otter Trail but this area also offers many other unique hiking options, both long and short in duration. http://www.tsitsikamma.info/ The Garden Route in itself is home to so many magnificent areas where you can do black water tubing, kayak, cycle, hike just to name a few and explore such a rich part of the country. If you enjoy a good craft beer, this area has many options to choose from. Most people only visit the winelands area surrounding Cape Town, but there are gems to be found if you look deeper. Knysna is a wonderful town along the Garden Route to explore. The Circles in the Forest trail (Dalene Matthee http://www.dalenematthee.co.za/engli...s/circles.html) Great read – is was written about this area, the trail is a beautiful hike. Amazing sea-food.
I would then suggest looking at areas further along the Eastern Cape, which would include the Valley of Desolation outside Graaff-Reinet. http://www.sa-venues.com/attractions...desolation.htm The breathtaking views and sunsets here are unforgettable. The area is made up of sheer cliffs and precariously balanced columns of Dolerite rising 100+ meters from the valley floor. Small village towns along this route include Nieu Bethesda, a mecca for insanely talented artist like world renowned sculptor Frans Boekkoi. You find fascinating people and history in small towns like this, the Owl House just to name one http://theowlhouse.co.za/ Hogsback is another hidden gem, this small town located high up in the Amathole mountains, where some claim JRR Tolkien (who was born in South Africa) got his inspiration for Lord of the Rings, is another fantastic hiking spot. You can travel all the way to the Drakensberg mountains getting your fill of scenic beauty, hiking and various cultural influences including the battle fields (both Zulu and British history) along the way.
I could carry on and on about South Africa, I am somewhat bias as I was born here. However I do think it is worth investigating the country if you are considering a trip to the continent. The other added benefit here is that the rand is quite week against the dollar, making it a very affordable place to visit!
I hope this helps, Marguerite Smit
How exciting that you are considering a trip to Africa. Based on the information you provided, I would suggest looking at South Africa as a destination. The reason I would recommend SA is because you mention not wanting to focus purely on game viewing/safari but rather including other aspects into your itinerary.
South Africa is phenomenal for wildlife, however the country has so much more to offer. Many tourist only come and do the cookie cutter types of itineraries which include Cape Town and a safari in the Kruger Region. I would suggest looking deeper into the country for a more “off the beaten path” type of experience.
You mentioned that you enjoy hiking, Tsitsikamma for example is home to the world famous Otter Trail but this area also offers many other unique hiking options, both long and short in duration. http://www.tsitsikamma.info/ The Garden Route in itself is home to so many magnificent areas where you can do black water tubing, kayak, cycle, hike just to name a few and explore such a rich part of the country. If you enjoy a good craft beer, this area has many options to choose from. Most people only visit the winelands area surrounding Cape Town, but there are gems to be found if you look deeper. Knysna is a wonderful town along the Garden Route to explore. The Circles in the Forest trail (Dalene Matthee http://www.dalenematthee.co.za/engli...s/circles.html) Great read – is was written about this area, the trail is a beautiful hike. Amazing sea-food.
I would then suggest looking at areas further along the Eastern Cape, which would include the Valley of Desolation outside Graaff-Reinet. http://www.sa-venues.com/attractions...desolation.htm The breathtaking views and sunsets here are unforgettable. The area is made up of sheer cliffs and precariously balanced columns of Dolerite rising 100+ meters from the valley floor. Small village towns along this route include Nieu Bethesda, a mecca for insanely talented artist like world renowned sculptor Frans Boekkoi. You find fascinating people and history in small towns like this, the Owl House just to name one http://theowlhouse.co.za/ Hogsback is another hidden gem, this small town located high up in the Amathole mountains, where some claim JRR Tolkien (who was born in South Africa) got his inspiration for Lord of the Rings, is another fantastic hiking spot. You can travel all the way to the Drakensberg mountains getting your fill of scenic beauty, hiking and various cultural influences including the battle fields (both Zulu and British history) along the way.
I could carry on and on about South Africa, I am somewhat bias as I was born here. However I do think it is worth investigating the country if you are considering a trip to the continent. The other added benefit here is that the rand is quite week against the dollar, making it a very affordable place to visit!
I hope this helps, Marguerite Smit
Jun 1st, 2017, 08:27 PM
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Thank you all! This is fabulous information and exactly the type of info I was hoping to get. You have all given me lots to think about and investigate. It is time to do lots more investigation through books, trip reports, other forums and here. This is overwhelming, and I can see why it takes time and expertise (and the recommendations of using an agent) to sort through all of the various options.
As I said, this is a first tentative step into the entire idea. My husband has always said he was not interested in ever visiting Africa, but then he just spent a morning with someone who had just done a safari. He was quite intrigued by the friend's experience. So, I decided to start investigating the entire idea. Since I know absolutely nothing about the topic I decided to ask my friends here. I really appreciate the in-depth info you have given me.
I am guessing that my first big surprise after I start narrowing things down somewhat will be sticker shock. I have read that these experiences are definitely pricey. But, as my husband commented, it wouldn't be nearly as expensive as attempting an Everest summit.
Travelbeyond--Many people have recommended South Africa as an overall great destination even if one is not interested in animals. So, your info on options in-country are quite helpful too. I know if we would decide on a safari(s) we would also want to experience other parts of the areas too.
As I said, this is a first tentative step into the entire idea. My husband has always said he was not interested in ever visiting Africa, but then he just spent a morning with someone who had just done a safari. He was quite intrigued by the friend's experience. So, I decided to start investigating the entire idea. Since I know absolutely nothing about the topic I decided to ask my friends here. I really appreciate the in-depth info you have given me.
I am guessing that my first big surprise after I start narrowing things down somewhat will be sticker shock. I have read that these experiences are definitely pricey. But, as my husband commented, it wouldn't be nearly as expensive as attempting an Everest summit.
Travelbeyond--Many people have recommended South Africa as an overall great destination even if one is not interested in animals. So, your info on options in-country are quite helpful too. I know if we would decide on a safari(s) we would also want to experience other parts of the areas too.
Jun 2nd, 2017, 04:37 AM
#7
julies, the one thing I've learned is that all my costs for safari are paid up before I land in Africa, except for tipping, which is a minimal expense. I take maybe $600 in cash and always come home with money leftover. I compared a 2 week safari to 2 weeks in Italy in 2015, and while I paid for everything up front for Kenya, my costs (hotel, food, entertainment) were spread out over two weeks in Italy, but they came out very close, within $500.
Jun 2nd, 2017, 05:32 AM
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Julies, I know you like to organize your own trips but I completely agree about working with a local agent to book. If there are any glitches, especially when traveling between places, you really need a local contact person who can help sort things out. However, I disagree about tips being quite such a minimal expense as amy described. The guide, drivers and staff are highly dependent on tips. Closer to $50 per couple per day would be appropriate at a good quality safari camp, more at a top place.
Jun 2nd, 2017, 08:21 AM
#9
>>Closer to $50 per couple per day would be appropriate at a good quality safari camp, more at a top place.<<
$50 a day is not minimal? Compared to what you'd spend on the ground in a day in Paris, Rome or London? Hmmmmm...for a 10 or 11-day safari, which most of mine are, $50 a day is covered by my $600 spending money, unless math has changed?
$50 a day is not minimal? Compared to what you'd spend on the ground in a day in Paris, Rome or London? Hmmmmm...for a 10 or 11-day safari, which most of mine are, $50 a day is covered by my $600 spending money, unless math has changed?
Jun 2nd, 2017, 09:06 AM
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$50 x 14 = $700. You wrote that you came back with change from $600 from 2 weeks of safari. Yes, the math is different if it's only 10 days. But in any case, it's apples and oranges to compare the cash amounts with a trip to Europe where there are lots of out of pocket expenses and where cash is easily accessible vs. all inclusive and no ATMs, limited credit cards. Tipping is one of the things that TAs don't often discuss, just trying to give Julie specifics. We took a lot more than $600 cash and definitely spent more out of pocket. I agree, it isn't a large amount relative to the cost of the entire trip, of course.
Jun 2nd, 2017, 09:34 AM
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I am quite amazed to hear from amyb that a safari could come anywhere close in price to two weeks in Italy. Amy, maybe you travel much more high end than we do in Europe. Having done safari-type adventures in the Amazon and India and Nepal we are definitely aware of the need for tipping and how that factors in to the eventual overall price.
I haven't had time yet to do much in-depth reading, but I did skim through a couple current threads here and already know what we are not interested in and what would turn us off. Mass tourism-type safaris. I read comments about 70 jeeps trying to circle around the same sighting. No thanks!
I haven't had time yet to do much in-depth reading, but I did skim through a couple current threads here and already know what we are not interested in and what would turn us off. Mass tourism-type safaris. I read comments about 70 jeeps trying to circle around the same sighting. No thanks!
Jun 2nd, 2017, 10:23 AM
#12
My point is that almost all of your expenses are paid for when you leave on safari: lodging, meals, entertainment. Do you not agree that's the case, FromDC? When I leave for Italy, I have to bring gobs of money to eat, to go to museums, theater, shows, shop, train or taxi or metro fares, take tours, etc. Safari is all-inclusive. Once you get there, you don't pay or buy anything. Other than tipping and top shelf spirits not included in the price of the camp, I cannot imagine what else you'd spend money on in the savannah!
As I only pay for myself on safari, I bring $500-600 and always come back with cash leftover. There's just nothing else to spend money on there.
julies, I travel mid-range budget in Europe, 200-250E per night hotels and coach airfare, but spend my money on meals and experiences. If I'm only there once, I'd doing everything I want to without hesitation. I certainly don't travel 5-star. I worry where you're getting your prices if the safaris you're finding are that much more for you to have such sticker shock!
As I only pay for myself on safari, I bring $500-600 and always come back with cash leftover. There's just nothing else to spend money on there.
julies, I travel mid-range budget in Europe, 200-250E per night hotels and coach airfare, but spend my money on meals and experiences. If I'm only there once, I'd doing everything I want to without hesitation. I certainly don't travel 5-star. I worry where you're getting your prices if the safaris you're finding are that much more for you to have such sticker shock!
Jun 2nd, 2017, 03:44 PM
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This the kind of "sticker shock" I am referring to.
https://www.porini.com/kenya/porini-...ini-lion-camp/
Julie, what ddid your husband's friend say about ht cost of his safari?
I don't know what others' standards are (choosing private camps was a huge amount compared to my usual budget). For me, it was worth it for flying in, and being at one of the small conservancy camps in Kenya. But surely you spend way more than 250 euros or USD /per person/night, and even with flights and meals taken into account, it is big bucks. Porini (above) is one of the lower priced in the conservancy small-tented groups.
Yes, there are less expensive alternatives, as well as much higher priced ones. But it is better to be prepared. The cost of safari with a company like Kicheche or Porini or Naboisho or andBeyond camps (in Kenya/TZ for example) IS going to be a surprise if comparing it to cost of other "average' level stays, in other travels, in other parts of the world.Even with early bird discounts, 4 nights for price of 3 etc, youre talking big bucks/
Whether it is worth is another topic. I thought it was, for all kinds of reason.
Good news is there are lower priced tented camps (and lodges) in the Mara, and elsewhere in Kenya, if you search...and of course, other countries have different priced options. Eg see below for Meru in northern Kenay, nr Samburu:
https://www.ikwetasafaricamp.com
JulieS, having seen your choices in other places, I know you will find some fantastic and "economical" places in Africa!!!
https://www.porini.com/kenya/porini-...ini-lion-camp/
Julie, what ddid your husband's friend say about ht cost of his safari?
I don't know what others' standards are (choosing private camps was a huge amount compared to my usual budget). For me, it was worth it for flying in, and being at one of the small conservancy camps in Kenya. But surely you spend way more than 250 euros or USD /per person/night, and even with flights and meals taken into account, it is big bucks. Porini (above) is one of the lower priced in the conservancy small-tented groups.
Yes, there are less expensive alternatives, as well as much higher priced ones. But it is better to be prepared. The cost of safari with a company like Kicheche or Porini or Naboisho or andBeyond camps (in Kenya/TZ for example) IS going to be a surprise if comparing it to cost of other "average' level stays, in other travels, in other parts of the world.Even with early bird discounts, 4 nights for price of 3 etc, youre talking big bucks/
Whether it is worth is another topic. I thought it was, for all kinds of reason.
Good news is there are lower priced tented camps (and lodges) in the Mara, and elsewhere in Kenya, if you search...and of course, other countries have different priced options. Eg see below for Meru in northern Kenay, nr Samburu:
https://www.ikwetasafaricamp.com
JulieS, having seen your choices in other places, I know you will find some fantastic and "economical" places in Africa!!!
Jun 3rd, 2017, 12:09 PM
#15
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As I said, we are just starting to think about this; whether we'll do it is another story and will depend on our research.....
I have not had much time to research pricing, but in a quick search saw this from a bespoke company--The Wild Source:
Since we do all custom safaris the cost is highly dependent upon your personal choices. For most a safari is a significant investment, and that is why the planning process is critical. Our philosophy is to focus on quality of guiding and locations. These are areas most important to having an exceptional safari and cutting cost on them will compromise your experience. One of the largest cost components where you have flexibility is your accommodation. In some areas (like Northern Tanzania) we have a wide range of choices to work with, while in others like Botswana, there is often no quality budget or rustic option that meets our quality standards.
Because trip lengths vary a nightly cost is more useful. Keep in mind that almost all of our safaris are inclusive of meals, drinks, and activities so there are not extra daily costs as many holiday destinations have. Here are some general ballpark figures:
"Our safaris start around $400 to $450 per person per night. In that range it is possible to do a very high quality safari that is in the low or shoulder seasons.
The average of all our safari guests in a year would range between $650 to $800 per person per night. In this range is a wide range of high quality possibilities.
For luxury camps in Botswana in peak season the cost can easily average $1,000 per person per night. The same safari in the green season could average between $450 and $550 per night. For ultra-luxury camps like Abu, Mombo and Zarafa the costs can be doubled.
Special opportunities often add large costs beyond our control. For example each gorilla trek requires a $750 per person permit cost."
We do not spend $1000 per night (for the two of us) on our trips, ever. So, a comparison to Italy in that category is way off base for us.
What do you have to say? Is the above quoted info fairly in line with your experience? Thanks.
I have not had much time to research pricing, but in a quick search saw this from a bespoke company--The Wild Source:
Since we do all custom safaris the cost is highly dependent upon your personal choices. For most a safari is a significant investment, and that is why the planning process is critical. Our philosophy is to focus on quality of guiding and locations. These are areas most important to having an exceptional safari and cutting cost on them will compromise your experience. One of the largest cost components where you have flexibility is your accommodation. In some areas (like Northern Tanzania) we have a wide range of choices to work with, while in others like Botswana, there is often no quality budget or rustic option that meets our quality standards.
Because trip lengths vary a nightly cost is more useful. Keep in mind that almost all of our safaris are inclusive of meals, drinks, and activities so there are not extra daily costs as many holiday destinations have. Here are some general ballpark figures:
"Our safaris start around $400 to $450 per person per night. In that range it is possible to do a very high quality safari that is in the low or shoulder seasons.
The average of all our safari guests in a year would range between $650 to $800 per person per night. In this range is a wide range of high quality possibilities.
For luxury camps in Botswana in peak season the cost can easily average $1,000 per person per night. The same safari in the green season could average between $450 and $550 per night. For ultra-luxury camps like Abu, Mombo and Zarafa the costs can be doubled.
Special opportunities often add large costs beyond our control. For example each gorilla trek requires a $750 per person permit cost."
We do not spend $1000 per night (for the two of us) on our trips, ever. So, a comparison to Italy in that category is way off base for us.
What do you have to say? Is the above quoted info fairly in line with your experience? Thanks.
Jun 3rd, 2017, 01:18 PM
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I can speak to the Botswana portion as I returned a few days ago. I went in shoulder, not the highest season, and stayed 9 nights in what the writer termed "ultra" camps, including three nights each in two of the camps mentioned, above. I would say the pricing is about accurate, but there are many other camps. Botswana tends to be very pricey for various reasons.
Mombo (Botswana Okavango Delta region) is undergoing renovation and the forseeable future might be a chance to stay at one of the most renowned camps in Africa for somewhat of a discount, as guests are lodged in a temporary camp on the concession.
I adore South Africa and there must be incredible values there now due to the fallen rand. See the tons of posts here on Sabi Sands and the other private reserves near Kruger Park.
I'd certainly plan this with an agent versed in the region.
Mombo (Botswana Okavango Delta region) is undergoing renovation and the forseeable future might be a chance to stay at one of the most renowned camps in Africa for somewhat of a discount, as guests are lodged in a temporary camp on the concession.
I adore South Africa and there must be incredible values there now due to the fallen rand. See the tons of posts here on Sabi Sands and the other private reserves near Kruger Park.
I'd certainly plan this with an agent versed in the region.
Jun 4th, 2017, 05:47 AM
#17
A first trip to Africa is a big undertaking, and you are to be commended for taking on the planning well in advance. The distances are great, the costs potentially very high, and the choices can easily become bewildering. Doing X sometimes means that doing Y becomes difficult or impossible, even though both X and Y would be incredible, even life-changing experiences.
The only answer we discovered is to start planning the second trip in the middle of the first. If you're like the majority of us that post here, a second trip will be a given, even if you don't think so right now. As they stay on Star Trek, resistance is futile.
I know this might sound like heresy on this board, but - in my view - you might look at limiting the animal-viewing-safari part of a first visit to just a few days, maybe in more than one location. It's VERY intense. Our first couple of game drives (or on a boat in Botswana for one of them) left us so dazzled that we missed details on the second one. Your head feels like it's on ball bearings - you're swiveling and peering and squinting, hypnotized by lions ten feet from your nose, being close enough to elephants to smell them... and then having a ranger or guide point out a dung beetle or a centipede or a deadly snake over there at the edge of the track, or owls hiding in tree trunks... it can quickly become overload, and repeating it for more than a couple of days at a time can result in diminishing returns.
But believe me, the first safari day on the <i>second</i> trip is the payoff. It's like getting your sea legs, or visiting a favorite restaurant a second time - you know the menu, where to sit, etc. The preliminaries are behind you, your eyes and senses more in your control than they are the first time, when - honestly - you can't believe what you're seeing. Hope that makes sense.
So then it falls to what to do with the rest of the time, the days when you're NOT encountering crocodiles or watching hyena pups or whatever.
Here's where your choice of countries and budget comes into play. I am an unabashed advocate for South Africa in this regard. It's NOT for the animal viewing, although SA has an enormous range of habitats and parks/reserves that make it quite compelling on that front, it's for everything else.
- Culturally, what can you say? Dozens of cultures and languages, a history that's tragic, uplifting, incredibly complicated and colorful beyond words. Artistic traditions that are both ancient and modern, remarkable style, architecture. Food traditions and modern expressions that will blow you away - some of the most exciting food and drink in the world.
- Scenery that will stop your heart. Mountains plunging into the sea. Deserts and snow-covered alpine peaks. Beaches that would make lovers of the Caribbean weep, River-carved canyons like something out of Utah, an hour's drive from hippos lurking in ponds. On the west coast, beaches that consist of millions of four-inch mussel shells, bordered by restaurants selling incredible seafood, while ten minutes away are fields of wildflowers that you think you're imagining.
- Affordable, luxurious hotels and bed and breakfast places held to incredibly rigorous standards. Restaurants and cafes selling incredible food, wineries in stunning natural settings producing fabulous vintages. Cities that are exciting, historic, colorful and thought-provoking centers for one of the world's most dynamic human stories.
Enough gushing, but you get my drift, and I'll stop here. My recommendation is to plan a trip that features safari experiences to be sure, but also one that gives plenty of time - I'd argue the majority - for the other things. We've done it all independently and never had any difficulties, and I'd recommend that as a course for investigation in your case. But don't pooh-pooh the idea of a second visit. I'd bet money you'll join the rest of us addicts.
The only answer we discovered is to start planning the second trip in the middle of the first. If you're like the majority of us that post here, a second trip will be a given, even if you don't think so right now. As they stay on Star Trek, resistance is futile.
I know this might sound like heresy on this board, but - in my view - you might look at limiting the animal-viewing-safari part of a first visit to just a few days, maybe in more than one location. It's VERY intense. Our first couple of game drives (or on a boat in Botswana for one of them) left us so dazzled that we missed details on the second one. Your head feels like it's on ball bearings - you're swiveling and peering and squinting, hypnotized by lions ten feet from your nose, being close enough to elephants to smell them... and then having a ranger or guide point out a dung beetle or a centipede or a deadly snake over there at the edge of the track, or owls hiding in tree trunks... it can quickly become overload, and repeating it for more than a couple of days at a time can result in diminishing returns.
But believe me, the first safari day on the <i>second</i> trip is the payoff. It's like getting your sea legs, or visiting a favorite restaurant a second time - you know the menu, where to sit, etc. The preliminaries are behind you, your eyes and senses more in your control than they are the first time, when - honestly - you can't believe what you're seeing. Hope that makes sense.
So then it falls to what to do with the rest of the time, the days when you're NOT encountering crocodiles or watching hyena pups or whatever.
Here's where your choice of countries and budget comes into play. I am an unabashed advocate for South Africa in this regard. It's NOT for the animal viewing, although SA has an enormous range of habitats and parks/reserves that make it quite compelling on that front, it's for everything else.
- Culturally, what can you say? Dozens of cultures and languages, a history that's tragic, uplifting, incredibly complicated and colorful beyond words. Artistic traditions that are both ancient and modern, remarkable style, architecture. Food traditions and modern expressions that will blow you away - some of the most exciting food and drink in the world.
- Scenery that will stop your heart. Mountains plunging into the sea. Deserts and snow-covered alpine peaks. Beaches that would make lovers of the Caribbean weep, River-carved canyons like something out of Utah, an hour's drive from hippos lurking in ponds. On the west coast, beaches that consist of millions of four-inch mussel shells, bordered by restaurants selling incredible seafood, while ten minutes away are fields of wildflowers that you think you're imagining.
- Affordable, luxurious hotels and bed and breakfast places held to incredibly rigorous standards. Restaurants and cafes selling incredible food, wineries in stunning natural settings producing fabulous vintages. Cities that are exciting, historic, colorful and thought-provoking centers for one of the world's most dynamic human stories.
Enough gushing, but you get my drift, and I'll stop here. My recommendation is to plan a trip that features safari experiences to be sure, but also one that gives plenty of time - I'd argue the majority - for the other things. We've done it all independently and never had any difficulties, and I'd recommend that as a course for investigation in your case. But don't pooh-pooh the idea of a second visit. I'd bet money you'll join the rest of us addicts.
Jun 4th, 2017, 11:32 AM
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I agree that SA is fabulous beyond belief! Great first trip. But be forewarned: Hopefully malaria will not get into your bloodstream. But Africa certainly will.
I just returned, as I mentioned, from my third trip to SA (with Botswana) and my head is filled with ideas on where to go next.
There are many qualified agents, I am sure, but I was thrilled with the help I received from Southern Destinations.com, based in CapeTown.
I just returned, as I mentioned, from my third trip to SA (with Botswana) and my head is filled with ideas on where to go next.
There are many qualified agents, I am sure, but I was thrilled with the help I received from Southern Destinations.com, based in CapeTown.
Jun 4th, 2017, 04:43 PM
#19
@thursdaysd, my only out of pocket expense before I leave for Italy is airfare from here to Italy. I have to bring either cash or a credit card for everything after that. When I pay for safari, everything is paid for up front long before I leave: airfare from here to there plus everything on the ground in Africa. The only thing I need to bring cash for is tips and alcohol that may not be included in the base price of the camp. When I added up my airfare + hotels + out of pocket costs (food, entertainment, hotels) of my last 2 week stint in Italy and compared it to Kenya Feb 2015, they were very close to being equal. That was my point to Julies, that while the per day camp cost at a place like Porini appears high, that includes everything for that day except the tip. If, as you say, the only thing that matters is what you spend before you go, then Italy is at bargain basement prices $600 all in! For me, Porini at $430 per day is close to on par with to Italy. There's little chance I'd get by on that there when you tally transportation, meals, museums and hotel. A mediocre hotel in Florence or Rome is going to cost $200 at a minimum then factor in three meals and 8 hours worth of entertainment and transportation....
Jun 4th, 2017, 05:05 PM
#20
@amyb - My point was that you only seemed to be counting the costs after you arrived. What matters is the total cost per day, whether you pay all or some of it before or after you arrive. And I certainly expect to handle western Europe, London included, on $200/day or less not counting TransAtlantic flights. Last trip I did Japan, generally considered an expensive country, on $171/day.
