Tipping a self-employed guide
 

Hi - we have hired a guide for a private township tour in CT for the two of us. It is his business and he's self-employed with his own website offering these tours. Do I need to tip him and why? Shouldn't his fee be sufficient? Thanks.

I should think in that situation no tip is necessary -- he has established a fee that he thinks is fair and reasonable.

I am generally opposed to the principle of tipping, preferring instead if institutions raised their fee and paid their workers a fair wage, but until that unlikely time, I recognize the need to tip certain employees, but I don't think there is the same need to tip an owner, like the person in your hypothetical.

We faced a similar situation recently, also in Capetown. The guide was fabulous, went out of his way and well beyond the call of duty. We really wanted to show him our appreciation, however he refused our tip. Somehow I wasn't surprised. Do what makes you feel best, sometimes knowing that you made the offer and that it was refused, makes an already positive experience even better.
Chuck

i would not go for the "regular tipping policy" but would hand out a gift and some cash if service and guiding was excellent!

why cut him out of the tipping thing as he dedicates his time, effort and car?

i am sure he will appreciate.

div

Thanks. I'm inclined to not tip for the above reasons, but Div, I enjoy your input (as always). You have so much to offer us newbies!

I would only tip if I felt that the service given was over and above that expected.

portlander
very much appreciated!
enjoy your travlles and happy landings!

ah, i just wanted to add: i would also differentiate between a "white" guide and a "black". i am much more hesitant to tip a white company owner than a black!
the blacks in africa are widely under priviledged and therefore we always are desperate to make a difference!

div

I am a guide/sole owner/one man tour operator and when doing what i consider a really good job on a days tour I am offered a tip my first reaction is to politely thank the guest and suggest that a gratuity is not necessary. However most visitors become quite insistent and under the circumstances it would be impolite to refuse but my personal opinion is using the example of a restaurant owner serving me my meal why should I feel obliged to give a tip. I am delighted when I am given sincere verbal appreciation for my work as it makes my effort so worthwhile and I certainly don't need cash to feel good.

iphela
i appreciate your input!

but just let us know whether you for how long you are in the business,colour of skin (not meant in any way racist but makes a HUGE difference - still! sad but reality!)and where are you working - area!

thx in advance!

div

Looks like no one's taking your bait, divine.

I wouldn't tip an owner but I probably would buy them a drink if out or send a note later for good service.

hi portlander,

I agree that a tip shoudn't be necessary, but sometimes, you want to mark very good service in some way. if that's the case, why not invite him/her for a drink or offer donation to charity of his/her choice?

regards, ann

thanks good cybor we are living in an (almost) free world where everybody is entitled to do whatever is considered appropriate or appreciative.

if a tóur guide makes hardly a living why shouldn't he be tipped? just because he "owns" a company?

i need solid reasons to refuse a tip.

div

Div.,
This business owner is hardly making a living and I don't accept tips.

Go bark or pi$$ up another tree.

I tip for good service. If they decline I suggest they donate it to their favorite charity.

If they were the owner of A&K or Wilderness or an operation of similar size, I would not tip. I figure most self employed tour operators can use a little extra.

Tips have made a difference for me in the past, though I was not the owner of the company.

I also try to show genuine appreciation and gratitude for the service I've been given and not just hand over a perfunctory wad of bills.

I agree with SafariChuck, "Do what makes you feel best" when its the owner of a company.

Div
I have been doing tours for 9 years, I am white and I cover Cape Town and the Western Cape.

Author: cybor
Date: 12/04/2008, 06:03 pm

Div.,
This business owner is hardly making a living and I don't accept tips.

Go bark or pi$$ up another tree.

cybor
it's sad that you obviously don't waste a chance to expose yourself as a true lady ;-)

you must have enjoyed an excellent upbringing and education.

do me a favour - just ignore my posts. i am for certain are not interested in your opinion.

div

thx iphela

div

<<if a tóur guide makes hardly a living why shouldn't he be tipped? just because he "owns" a company?>>

In that instance, wouldn't the tour guide/owner increase his fee? I assume an owner charges a fee that they deem acceptable, reasonable and appropriate. An owner sets the fee he charges.

Div,
Your right, I'll use more lady like terms next time when I refer to you as a silly little pot stirrer or an unsavory bigot.

I'll make sure to tell that to all the others who've you've perturbed and insulted with your unsavory details on numerous threads lately.
I'm sure the Jews, blacks, women, gays and Americans that you've taken pot shots at lately will be more than willing to tone it down for your tender ears.

Or maybe not......

Not sure what's happened in the past, I get the feeling I'm missing something, but in this post I found the original question about race to be relevant.

I for one do NOT think that race should make a difference! I tip my guidesbased on the service they provide....if it is above and beyond the "normal" or if I have a great time, I tip well! I don't care if the individual is the owner or the lowliest housekeeper. The race of the person is really not an issue- we/they all need to pay their bills and care for families!
Suzi

Hi Sherry,

I would think you are wasting your time reading and responding to Pippa/Divine's posts. My suggestion to you is to ignore.... that's what I propose to do having read all the insensitive postings of Divine54 in the Mumbai related threads in the lounge. They were very insulting/disgusting at a time when my whole country is shaken up and has left many of us thinking if life as we know it will be the same again.......

Agree with HariS about divine54, I learned a long time ago to ignore divine54 posts here on this forum. I do not reply to anything they write. Sad that new posters have to learn this themselves the hard way.

regards - tom

I agree with both Hari and Tom. If Div is ignored she would probably go away but come back as someone else. The solution would be to do what many forums allow, to selectively block viewing posts by certain individuals. This selective blocking allows each viewer to block post that they find offensive, from their own computers. In the meantime, Hari and Tom offer the best solution, ignore, ignore, ignore.
Ted

The original question has been sort of lost but I found the responses very interesting. We haven't been to Africa (yet - had to cancel our trip next month due to the market meltdown) but having used self employed guides all over Asia, South America and the Middle East I have to admit it never occurred to me not to tip them because they were self employed. We tip for great service and we received great service.

Good advise that I usually take to heart and will from here on in......
...... maybe, LOL.

I guess I'm still sore from the way this person recently and quite viciously attacked an entire group.

Just can't sit on my hands sometimes and allow her to get away with it.
As said above, the editors shouldn't allow this person and her multi handles to post.
Sorry for the hijack.
Peace all.

So sorry your trip had to be cancelled, Elizabeth S.

Hopefully you'll go in the future.

elisabeth,
that's exactltly what i posted.

guys - i am sure you knoew who i am responding to

I F you read my 2 first posts and your responses to it - based on the fact you are able to judge objectively which i heavily doubt - you yourself must come to the conclusion there is something terribly wrong with you.

but the cybor's "peace all" is just going over the top :=)

and hari, if you cannot stand if someone doesn't agree with you or doesn't burst into prayers (which especially here on fodors are mostly superficially seeming) as expected then you have got a problem.

but you forgot to mention my mumbai post which was in order to support the country.
BTW - i have got counterparts in india with which i have been working excellently and i dedicate a considerable amount of time to some projects. and i would stop immediately all of that if my business affiliates did show the slightest sign of the unreasoned hostility you are showing.
i don't consider you a true representative of the indian people.

div

"I'm sure the Jews, blacks, women, gays and Americans that you've taken pot shots at lately will be more than willing to tone it down for your tender ears."

cybor, by nature i have been and always will be with minorities or under privileged.
and jews and americans certainly don't belong to that group.
but you are right - i came across several americans who showed quite openly racism against black people. and of course i had to jump in!
and especially americans who think they are "the chosen people living in the chosen country" make me sick!
and yes, i cannot stand jews blaming and especially undifferenciated members of the muslim society around the world for being responsible for terrorism.

and yes - i state my opinion regardless whether it serves your ego, interests or opinion.

if you cannot stand the heat - don't join the kitchen team.

this whole thread is a perfect example for a low key crowd which tries to mob another member. but believe you me: you won't succeed!

div

<< will be with minorities or under privileged. and jews ...certainly don't belong to that group>>

This is probably better discussed in the Lounge, but Div, do you have figures on the number of Jews and Muslims in the world -- I'm sure Jews are substantially outnumbered and are a minority in every country, except one. Muslims, on the other hand, are the majority in many countries.

ATTENTION FODORS EDITORS (Katie, are you there?). I think it's time to close this thread and to take a close look at allowing divine54 to continue to post. Threads he/she particpate in deteriorate and are destroying this forum. Time to exercise editorial discretion.

temba

desperation? for what reason?

i am sure the editors use their common sense and won't serve the intention of a certain clique.

this forum get seriously hurt by professionals who are hiding under an alias and try to sell their services.

thit
you are right in view to numbers. but i don't just look at numbers but influential power especial in countries where these people have migrated to.

div

I am a non-white tourist guide in South Africa...as many are aware. I would like to think that people tip me for a job well done. All the tourist guides here are self employed.

Some nationalities do not have a tipping culture and others do. However, i am sure that most travelers are aware of the tipping rule. So, some people get the standard tour and others get the extra's. If you are booking a tour with a company then be assured that you are getting more than you paid for because the guides get ripped off by their companies about how much time they spend on tour and what time they get back to the depot

A guides day starts at about 7h00 and ends at about 19h00. Its seldom shorter than that. If there is a dinner in the evening it continues till about 23h00.

If you are traveling overland with a guide you have no idea of the amount of organizing that goes on behind the scenes not to mention when someone loses luggage during a tour. What about when people arrive late and the guide has to make up time on the road. What about the fact that the itineraries that are often so badly prepared by someone behind a desk that has never even been to the places they are recommending and the guide has to juggle things around to make the itinerary work. Calling up hotels because someone has special dietry requirements or wants a special room. All cell phone calls are at his own expense. THE LIST IS ENDLESS.....

So, what do you think

africanj
thanks for your input! very much appreciated.

when we travel we appreciate to speak with locals especially interact with our guides and drivers, barmen, waiters, security etc. in order to get an impression on their daily lives.
especially in south africa that's mostly a black person. we know that it's even 14 years beyond white apartheid ruling mostly the black guy who struggles being it the owner of a business which mostly means owning A van or A car. therefore we won't differentiate between owner and guide/driver.

we travel to south africa for far more than a decade and i don't think we need any guidance in that regard.
we want to have a good time and we simply feel good when we know we could make a difference.

div