Nikao

While still debating whether to go for a self drive in Namibia or go on a safari to Tanzania (see my topic here http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...or-namibia.cfm) I already got some ideas put into itineraries to be able to make a better choice. (and of course it is very much fun to do! )

The things that are important to me are:
- remoteness, the 'real' experience
I don't want to be in a situation where there are 10 cars around 1 group of lions,
encounter to many vehicles, etc.
- wildlife
my main priority is watching wildlife
- photography,
my main interest is photography, so I want to be out on a game drive when the sun
comes up and when the sun sets, preferably spending a lot of time patiently waiting
- wild dogs
since I saw wild dogs in action in the piyaya region in tanzania im in love with these
creatures, would love to be able to see (and photograph) them again

Considering these things and the fact I went to the northern part of Tanzania twice already I thought it would be interesting to go to Selous and Ruaha.

I've requested 4 nights selous and 4 nights ruaha itinerary, and also still considering a group trip that is slightly different.

Itinerary 1 - Solo trip to Selous + Ruaha (itinerary from several companies, Liking Tanzania Odyssey the best currently)

Day 1
Met on arrival into Dar off the Egypt Air flight and flown to Selous (08:30). Met on arrival and transferred to Lake Manze Camp
Day 2 - 4 Lake Manze Camp
Day 5 - Fly from Selous to Ruaha, met and transferred to Mdonya
Day 6 - 8 Mdonya old river camp
Day 9 -
Fly to Dar es Salaam, met and given complimentary Dar tour before being transferred to the airport for your Egypt Air flight departing 0100 on 17th

I think I'll choose Air Egypt over KLM since it is almost half the price and it arrives at 5am in the morning and leaves at 1am at night, so no overnight needed in Dar es Salaam

The other (slightly cheaper) option is:
Intinerary from BMS-travellers, a dutch agent, forgot the ground operator theyre using
Day 1: Fly Amsterdam -> Dar es Salaam, overnight in Golden Tulip Hotel
Day 2: Dar es Salaam > Mikumi National Park, overnight in Vuma Hills Tented Camp
Day 3: Mikumi -> Ruaha, overnight in Tandala Tented Camp (outside! ruaha)
Day 4 + 5: Ruaha, overnight in Ruaha River Lodge
Day 6: Ruaha -> Mikumi, overnight in Vuma Hills Tented Camp (again?!)
Day 7: Mikumi -> Selous, overnight in Sable Mountain Lodge
Day 8 + 9: Selous, Selous Riverside Safari Camp or Rufiji River Camp
Day 10: Selous -> Dar es Salaam -> fly to amsterdam

Im inclined to go for option 1, also because the price is not that much different and im staying in better camps i believe. But im wondering if Mikumi is worth going to (twice) and how the other camps are.
Furthermore Im curious to hear opinions about flying with Egypt Air? Apart from the fact you have a stop (and transfer on other plane) in Cairo, why is it 'standard' to go with KLM?
Any other opinions / suggestions?

atravelynn

You've certainly done some homework. Never been to S. Tanz, so I don't have much input, but I wonder how likely is it to see wild dogs in Ruaha and Selous?

I heard from someone in Kenya that Mikumi had the worst tse tses of anywhere they had ever been. You're probably going there 2x for logistical reasons.

I like #1 because your time seems to be better spent in the places you want to be and you are inside not outside Ruaha.

Have you seen this thread, which focuses on S. Tanz pricing?
http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...ame-safari.cfm

Please let us know how this comes along. Looks very promising.

Nikao

thx atravelynn, It seems to be very likely to see dogs in both Ruaha and Selous. One of the camps even had the den of the dogs nearby in 2009 I believe.
I saw that thread indeed, I even came up with Tanzania Odyssey there and contacted the other 2 firms as well.
Mikumi seems indeed logistical, since we're not flying and have to drive but not sure if it indeed is not that interesting, or if it is worthwhile. Considering it has a tarmac road running through I would guess it is not so much something for me

mcwomble

I think you are deluding yourself if you think seeing wild dogs is predictable.


I've been to Lake Manze twice, but I would suggest Kwando lagoon in Botswana is a far better bet for seeing wild dogs (but still not guaranteed).

They've had a den for 9 out of the last 10 years. The dogs in Selous are much more unpredictable, although more numerous.

Anyone who pretends you will see wild dogs is liable to disappoint you.

Sorry to be harsh, but its true. You may well get great sightings at Selous (I have), but don;t go there EXPECTING them....

ShayTay

I don't think we had tsetses at Mikumi, but lots at Katavi. I wasn't sure what to expect at Mikumi, but was pleasantly surprised by the amount of game, especially elephants. We spent some time at a waterhole that had lots of visitors. Vuma Hills was a nice camp.

Nikao

@mcwomble you are absolutely right, and i don't have the mindset that I definately will see wild dogs. In the end im interested in the 'real' experience and that means even less predictability. However, I know there are dogs in both parks, so just that knowledge atrackts me to that area even more

Treepol

Nikao,

I like the first itinerary and I think that Ruaha and Selous offer a remote safari experience. We had memorable sightings in Ruaha and saw a small pack of wild dogs twice in Selous. I've heard good things about Mdonya Old River Camp and have been to Lake Manze but not the Lodge.

One of my most vivid memories of Ruaha is a lion on a buffalo kill that we watched being devoured over a period of 3 days by a variety of predators. My trip report is here, including a photo link, http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...ly-2008.cfm?26 and my comments on Ruaha River Lodge are here, http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...-please.cfm?17

Have a great safari wherever you choose,

Pol.

Nikao

thx pol! enjoyed reading your trip report! Do you remember how much you payed for the private vehicle/guide? Im still exploring that possibility, but the latest reply was that this would only be possible at 1 camp, but since you are talking about this I wonder...
Furthermore, how did you enjoy the shared game drives? And were you able to express your wishes? You mention start times of 8am, but I really would want to be out there at sunrise if possible! (best light for photography)

sandi

Prices for exclusive use of guide/vehicle can vary from $250-$500/day. Should be pre-booked to be assured camp can accommodate you.

Treepol

Nikao,

we paid $170 US per day for the private vehicle which was well worth it.

I didn't like the one shared game drive at Ruaha River Lodge, hence the private vehicle for the rest of the trip. It was impossible to hear what the guide was saying in the middle seat and those in the back seat had no chance. Nor did the guide hear questions from backseat passengers. By the time we had heard why the vehicle stopped, the bird or animal had usually gone and the guide was passing a field guide to show us what had been there.

Foxes load their vehicles to capacity, nine passengers I recall. We saw the main camp vehicle once when we were out in our private vehicle and the 9 seater was jam-packed.

Rufiji River Lodge used smaller vehicles and we did shared game drives here and I don't think we had more than 4 people per vehicle on any of the drives while we were there.

Regarding the start times, Foxes staff claimed that the game at Ruaha moves from the woodland to drink at the river when the sun comes up and the day is warmer. We did leave at 7.30 when we had the private vehicle. This was my 3rd safari and at all other camps except those in Southern Tanzania the guides try to be out between 6 and 7 am.

An experienced Botswana mobile operator later told us that regardless of the location, early starts are the best chance to catch the last of the nightly predator action before they lay up for the day. I've had some memorable sightings in diverse wildlife areas like CKGR, Moremi, Etosha, Masai Mara and Mashatu on early morning game drives.

I don't know why Foxes are different, put it down to the same logic that has the power on in the morning while the guests are all away from camp on game drives!



Cheers,


Pol

Nikao

Im going for the first itinerary,with 1 change; I have 1 night extra in either Selous or Ruaha, which would you recommend?

Nikao

nevermind the 1 night extra, it will have to be 2 nights.... either that or pay 500 euro's more for my ticket (might as well spent more nights on safari then )

So... 2 nights extra; make that 5 nights selous and 5 nights ruaha in those 2 camps, or would you recommend a travel in between to a third camp?

Treepol

Nikao,

I'd split the time between 2 night stays which is a good length of time at a lodge. I really like Ruaha for the terrific wildlife sightings we enjoyed. However, I also liked Selous as the Lodge offered frequent boat trips on the river which was cool during the heat of the day and provided a break from routine game drives.

If you are considering a 3rd camp, maybe a split of nights between Lake Manze and Rufiji River Lodge? Sorry, I have no knowledge of other camps that I would recommend in these parks.

Have a great time in Southern Tanzania.


Pol

Nikao

thx pol, but I was confusing myself with the flightdates and the days from the 2010 itinerary, in the end it is indeed 1 night extra. Probably going to spent it in selous because of the boat trips ....

TC

Hi Nikao. We spent 22 days in Ruaha and Selous this past January. It was amazing. My screen name here will lead you to links for my trip report and my photo web site. I think you will love Southern Tanzania. If you stay deep inside the parks, there are few other vehicles -- really no other vehicles. We loved Ruaha -- Mwagusi Camp has THE BEST guides and you can sit forever watching animals. There is never a rush. Selous is where we saw the wild dogs quite easily. However, some parts of Selous are close to hunting areas and the game is more easily frightened and not easy to sit and watch at leisure. For that reason, I preferred Ruaha. Happy to answer any question you might have about our trip.

Nikao

Just booked my trip!; 5 nights Selous and 5 nights Ruaha in september (Lake Manze camp and Mdonya Old River)

I will post my experiences with the different travel agents in a seperate topic later today .. thx all for your help and input!