Tanzania Help Please!
 

Hi
Well I think my hubby and I have finally settled on the reality of our next trip to Africa being in Feb 2007. After deciding this I thought I had a pretty good idea on what we wanted however when we were talking last night and my hubby was asking lots of questions I realized there are definate voids in our knowledge so I am hoping you folks can help us out. OK we have been to NTanz before but went on a pre set itin that we didn't really have input to. We want to go back to N Tanz but on a private safari. It seems the more I read the more confused I get! I a want to get together an itinerary I can send to at least one Tanz op and maybe to a US op also. So here goes

* realistically how far in advance do we need to be booking for Feb 2007
*it looks like we will have between12-14 nights to devote to safari.
* we are thinking
Tarangire 2 nights
Ngorongoro 1 or 2 nights
Serengeti the remaining nights
* we are thinking the Ndutu area in Serengeti??? Any other location for that time of year we should look at?
*where to stay in Tarangire for good access to park
*what is the story with N Crater for drives are you allowed to do a full day drive or do you have to split it to 2 half days and if so can these be done back to back?

We like camps a lot. Budget?? Good question Not luxury but we are willing to pay for location.
We will be going to Gorillas in Rwanda also.
Sorry for the long post but very much appreciate all your input and if I can supply more info that will be helpful please ask.
J

Jules:

We are going in Feb 2006. To give you an idea on how soon to book, I made my first inquiry--to Ndutu Lodge--on April 8th 2005 and they were booked. [Ndutu is the moderately priced lodge in the prime location for Jan., Feb., Mar.] So was Kusini [the expensive tent camp further south in that area.]

By the end of the next week I was being told by some operators that getting a crater rim hotel would be difficult. Because I wanted nights at a Nomad camp, I had to work my dates around their availability.

I would recommend that you look at the Ndutu Lodge's website. They will take a reservation with no deposit [unless they have changed their policy.] If you know your travel dates (or can guess them)you might want to make a reservation with them to hold the dates. You can always release it or turn it over to your tour operator when you decide with whom you will be booking.

Here is the itinerary I settled on. As I already indicated I was set on staying in Nomad camps for some of the time. I would strongly urge you to book some days with them or one of the other highly regarded seasonal camps. They are expensive but I believe they will be the highlight of our trip. Climbhighsleeplow is staying at a number of them on his trip there now and will be giving us a report on them.

Days
1, 2, 3 Arusha 3 nights (wanted 2 but wound up with 3 trying to coordinate FF flights and Nomad camps)

4, 5 Crater

6, 7 Olduvai

8, 9 Ronjo

10, 11 Nomad Masek

12, 13, 14, Nomad Piaya

We chose not to go to Tarangire because I understood it was not prime season. Since them I have read that it is a favorite park for some any time of the year. So if I were to do it again I might add Tarangire.

We are staying at Ronjo (a mid priced tented camp in the Seronera valley) to take the balloon ride and because climghigh recommended covering that area in addition to the short grass plains.

I think your idea of 2 nights Tarangire, 2 nights crater is good. The rest of the nights I would spend in 2 different locations with a seasonal tent company. [Nomad and Sayari, and perhaps others, have 2 camp locations for the same time period [i,.e 2 different locations appropriate for Jan, Feb, March and then a different 2 locations for June-Sept]. One is in the NCA/Serengeti and one in Loliondo. The Loliondo is a private concession so walks are permitted. That adds a nice change.

So I would split time between their 2 camps and then add a couple of nights in the Seronera valley.

Your choices in the Seronera valley are the lodges, temporary tent camps, or Mbuzi Mawe [the new Serena hotels permanent tent camp] Although it is my understanding that it is an hour's drive to the central game areas.

If the seasonal tent camps are too expensive for you to have 6 nights split between the two locations, you could consider some nights at Nudutu lodge and some nights at one of those camps.
The only other permanent accommodations choice is Kusini, which is further south. It has received good reviews here but it is very expensive in Feb.

Re the tours of the crater, it is my understanding that you are limited to 6 hours and I do not believe that you can do back to back. But I have not yet heard a very explicit description of how the new system will work. Remember that there are some nice walks in the area as well.

Re Tarangire, I know that Swala is in the park but I cannot remember with certainty which other ones. Have you been to climghigh's web site with google earth--his maps show the locations of all of the camps.

This has gotten really long! But one last thought. If you liked Oliver's Camp for Tarangire it is now part of the Asilia group which has the Sayari seasonal camps. You might get a discount for booking that combination.

Thanks bat it is good to know you were getting accomidations full in April that helps us get a move on! We decided on Tarangire because we were there in Feb and really liked it. Is there a web site for the Nomad camps? How expensive are they roughly. Is there a website for the Nomad camps? Who did you do your booking through?
Thanks again and sorry to reply with more questions?
J

No problem. I would add Tarangire if I had to do it over.

Here is the website for Nomad: http://www.nomad-tanzania.com/

The Nomad camps are costing about $470 pppn.

They do not book directly but many companies can book them. You can write to them and ask them for referrals of companies that can book them. What country are you in? Are you thinking about booking directly with a local company or a company in your country?

We booked through ATR--they promote the Mawe Ninga/Olduvai/Ronjo camps owned by Tanganyika and Mount Kilimanjaro Safari Club. So depending on which camp you want in Tarangire they might not be the right company for you. amfs recently reported about her stay and she gives the camps a mixed review, particularly for food.

Take a look at the Asilia group--they coordinate for Oliver's camp and Sayari. The Oliver's camp description of walks in the Tarangire area in Jan-March sound great.
http://www.asilialodges.com/
http://www.oliverscamp.com/
http://www.paul-oliver.com/safaris/s...s_olakira.html

If these camps are too expensive even for 2-3 nights, you could look at the "moderate" camping that means sharing a toilet tent between two tents. My friends went on a camping safari with Roy's this past summer and enjoyed it (dome tent, separate toilet tent) that was much less expensive. I do not want to leave my tent to use the bathroom. Africa Dream Safari and other companies also offer that kind of camping.

Jules39
Your itinerary looks good. Tarangire x 2, but you want to be at the Crater x 2 nts as the first night is basically your "arrival day"..then you need to allow a full day for the crater and yes you can spend the whole day in the crater. For the Serengeti you are very well informed..at this time of year the migration has settled into the Southern Serengeti right around the Ndutu area and I would certainly recommend three nights here. Rwanda Gorillas is a good choice.

Thanks everyone.
I am still reading conflicting reports about the time you are allowed in N Crater. Can't seem to find any solid info on the web.

Thanks again and would love anyone elses input.

J

Anyone else with any thoughts or info on Ngororo entrance?

Thanks J

jules,
I am thinking/daydreaming waaayyy ahead here, but are doing the gorillas before or after the Tanzanian portion of your trip? How did you decide this? And how are you handling the airfare?

My imaginary 2007 trip (August?) would probably involve a short and sweet Kenyan safari, maybe just the Mara and Samburu, and gorilla tracking.

Of course, I have to recover financially from the not-yet-taken 2006 trip.

jules -

Through '05, visitors have been able to do full days. For '06 they seem to be getting stricker and staying with the half-day crater floor tours. I'm booking clients with back-to-back - afternoon of arrival; then following morning... this works and is approved. After the morning tour, you continue onto towards the Serengeti (Central) the farthest or in opposite direction towards Manyara. No need for a second night here, unless you wish.

I guess we'll hear plenty more as the '06 season begins and what happens with these schedules as have been set by the Tanzania folks.

Leely,

Your Africa itineraries are stacking up like hotcakes! You probably even have mental notes for 08.

Leely I have a more recent post with the itin I have been getting quotes on for Tanz. The gorillas we are hoping to do after Tanz. It is basically what I have here though. Still investigating different flight options. We could possibly do KLM into JRO and out of NBO with an internal link JRO to Kigali via NBO and then back to NBO. I know when I get into trying to book this I am going to need the advice of some more knowlegeable than I. Needless to say this inter Africa flight is going to be pricy but to be able to do this is one of the reasons we decided to put the trip off until 2007 give us a chance to save some more pennies!
Sandie that is what we are pondering with the Ngoro back to back trip and as you say we will see haow things pan out once this year really gets going and by the time we head off we should(!!) know what we are doing.

Thanks, Jules. The flights-thing seems daunting to me, so I'll be curious to hear how you guys deal with this. One reason I'm thinking Kenya--other than really wanting to see some of Kenya!--is that I imagine connections to/from Kigali or Kampala would be easier out of NBO.

And Lynn, why yes of course I have some ideas about 2008: TZ Southern Circuit. If I win the Lottery between now and then I have some other ideas as well. ;)

HI jules39-

I was wondering if you had any further ideas on connecting a gorilla trek with a northern circut safari? I was curious to hear some ideas as my husband and I are considering something similiar for May 2007...fly into NBO or EBB and connect to Kigali for the gorilla trek. Getting back to Tanzania, I have noticed that on certain days you can depart Kigali at 6:45 am and be in JRO by around noon (connecting through NBO).
What are your plans?

Hello,

We just returned from a trip-of-a-lifetime to Tanzania using GOOD EARTH TOURS (www.goodearthtours.com). I cannot say enough wonderful things about this company and about the tour itself. Here's what we did:

Tarangire - 2 nights (Tarangire Safari Lodge/permanent tents)
Lake Manyara - 1 night (Kirurumu Tented Lodge/permanent tents)
Central Serengeti - 1 night (Serengeti Serena)
Western Serengeti - 2 nights (Kirawire Tented Camp/permanent tents)
Ngorongoro Crater - 2 nights (Ngorongoro Serena)

Each park had its own charm and each of the lodges/tents were unique and wonderful!

Our guide suggested we do one full day in the crater, so we left at 6am with breakfast and lunch box in hand and did not return until the late afternoon. There are no lodges in the crater area itself, so once you leave the area, you are out. That's why they recommend staying one full day instead of dividing it into 2 half days or going for morning drive, return to lodge and return for afternoon game drive.

Good luck!

Dunno if this is timely or not, but you asked about Crater access ... effective Jan 2006 the rules were changed by the NCA, the fee was raised to $100 per vehicle per day and you could go in morning or afternoon, but not stay all day. They said this was to cut down on crowding.

We were there in late January and the fee was indeed $100 but they would let you stay in all day, if you could handle the mid-day heat. You could also leave and return BUT you had to pay an extra $100 to do this. They told us this may change (ie, not allowed to stay all day and not allowed back in even for an extra $100) if it gets too crowded. We were there three days and first day sat out the noon heat (we were photographing and sun was too high for good shots until about 3 PM) ... this was no fun at all ... other days we went down early, shot until the light was poor, then went to Olmoti crater in the PM (there's another crater as well that you can visit further from Olmoti). This is easier to do if you are on the Sopa side, much longer drive if your lodge is on the other side with all the other lodges.

As far as Ndutu, it books up well in advance because the migration starts late Jan - Feb there and photographers in the know want to stay at the lodge, and there are not many rooms. They have a lot of cancellations because of their easy-going deposit rules so keep trying if you want to get there in Feb 2007 (it's been full for Feb for several months now). We were unable to book Feb 2007 but did book six nights late Jan 2007 after a cancellation and consider ourselves lucky to get that.

Anyway it's a great time to be there ... here are some photos we took Jan 2006 from the areas you mention (Tarangire, Lake Manyara, Ndutu, Crater) ... http://members.aol.com/bhilton665/ta...2006/index.htm ... we did not go into the Serengeti in Jan but returned in April to Serengeti and Manyara in rainy season ... http://members.aol.com/bhilton665/ta...2006/index.htm

Bill

Incredible photos! Thanks.

HI

We just came back from a 10 day private safari in N TZ with Naipenda Safaris. We booked our trip in Feb 06 for early June 06 (early June is still low season). We had no problems with lodging but many of the places we stayed at are on the small side, including Ndutu, so if you want a particular lodge, book as early as possible.

We did the following:
2 nites Tarangire (Tarangire River Camp, but this tented camp just got converted to a hunting lodge...There's the kikoti camp on the East side and you can do a night game drive there, which is pretty cool).

2 nites Lake Manyara (E'Unoto Lodge. Loved the lodge, great view. Very lush park. Saw lots of tree lions...)

2 nites Nogorongoro (Ngorongoro Farm House. Would probably recommend staying within the NCA since the drive is pretty punishing. We saw totally different animals on each day. Great rhino sightings on the first day but they were very far away second day. Saw a Serval on the second day)

4 nites Serengeti (Naambi Hills and Ndutu Lodge). 2 nites semi-lux Mobile camping at private camp site Naambi hills, very close to Simba Kopje...lots of lions and kills. Also saw two different Cheetahs and leopards. 2 nites at Ndutu Lodge, loved the location and resident Genets. Saw a Cheetah with 3 cubs make a kill on the turnoff to Ndutu lodge from main road in Serengeti.

For NCA, they extended the full day access so we were able to stay down there all day in June but no final date for when 1/2 day policy will actually start. Check with your safari operator.

I highly recommend the mobile tented camp. This was the highlight of my trip. We were at a private camp site (vs public camp sites) and it was great!!! Giraffes grazed very nearby and lions wandered by at night and a hyena stole an electrical cord from our dining tent the first night, so we had to dine by candlelight after that.

Have fun planning.

I don't think Tarangire River Camp is being converted to a hunting lodge. It was sold to Chimpanzee Safaris and the ex-owners, Tanganyika Wilderness Camps/Kibo Safaris told me that CS plans to run it just as it was before.

Tanganyika is building a new camp in the Tarangire area called Maramboi that is supposed to be nicer than the River Camp. It's on the east side of Lake Manyara, with a view over the lake. It's only 5 minutes further from the Tarangire Gate than River Camp, though.

Since the half-day Crater Floor visits and increased fees at Ngorongoro announced, it's been confusing the just about everyone. But, officially, the half-days on the Crater Floor are supposed to go into effect as July 1, 2006.

We were literally the last guests to stay the Tarangire River Camp before it changed hands. I was told by the camp staff that the new owners were going to turn it into a hunting lodge. But the old owner is building a new lodge nearby and will rehire all the existing staff at the new lodge, which was supposed to be ready in a month or so. You might want to check with your tour operator to confirm status.

The camp was very comfortable but the road out to the camp is a bit rough. My Naipenda guide, along with a Maasai that worked at the camp took us out both nights we stayed there for night game drives in the area. It was pretty cool. We saw genets, civets, Africa wild cat, vereaux owl, hyena (real close), giraffes and waterbucks. The food was also very good. Don't know about the new owners however.

Hope this helps.

Are there hunting concessions adjacent to Tarangire? Eben, do you know anything about the status of the camp?

It is untrue. Hunting will never be allowed so close to the main entrance of the park! Tarangire River Lodge is right across from the public camp site and minutes from the main gate!

I think some employees are unhappy with what happened and are trying to derail the new ownership. There are lots of stories about the transaction floating in Arusha.

BTW, the new lodge is not adjacent to Tarangire River Lodge. It is much further away. In fact, I asked 10 different people including the owner of the new lodge and all were vague/unsure about the new location!

Actually, I drove around and gave up trying to find it. It was not in the location indicated by the directions. I think it is actually much further away from Tarangire than the current marketing efforts would like us to believe! But I am unsure. I will check it out in about 5 weeks when it is closer to completion.

Eben, thanks for the info on the new camp, Maramboi. I've gotten some photos from Kibo of the new camp. It appears to be on the eastern shore of Lake Manyara and is surrounded by palm trees. I was told it was only 5 minutes further from Tarangire's park gate than River Camp. If that's not the case, I'd like to know, as I'm booking our group in there next year.

Thanks, Eben!

Here's a link to the photos that were e-mailed to me by Kibo Safaris of the new Maramboi Camp. It really does exist! The question is: where, exactly?

http://sharontaylor.smugmug.com/gallery/1617645

I think the camp is on the Manyara side of the road that goes from Arusha to Tarangire. There is a public camp site in the area called Wild Palm for obvious reasons!

This means it is several kilometers away from the park in an area more known for sunsets than wildlife and it is certainly not 5 minutes away from the River Camp (I looked and did not find it)! There are talks to open the wildlife corridor between Tarangire and Manyara (relocating the Maasai and other population) so animals can return to their migration patterns.

When this happens the new camp will be in a prime spot. At this time, however, it seems a bit far away for my liking, BUT:

A) I don't have its exact location and B] I have not stayed there so I am not qualified to comment on its game density.

Until I get a chance to see it I better stop commenting about it!

I was told that the camp was 5 minutes further away from the Tarangire gate than River Camp, not 5 minutes from River Camp. I've also been told that it is on the migration path for animals moving between Tarangire and Lake Manyara. It will be interesting to see what you find out.

Were you talking to Willy about the camp? I've been corresponding with Josiah at Kibo about it and I know that Allen Mnyenye is out working on the camp right now. He was also instrumental in building the current River Camp and Ngorongoro Farmhouse.

No, I talked to Julio Teigell (Director) at the Karibu Trade Fair. He is really excited about the new camp and I looked at all the pictures and we talked about the support work they are doing at the local villages. Quite a positive experience.

BUT

No-one could pinpoint the exact or approximate location on the map so I tried to follow their verbal directions with no success!

any one who ha stayed at Mawe Ninga?
I would like to get some info on that.
Thanks!

jolynsimms:
Leely stayed there. Here is the link to her report. (BTW, she booked through ATR--as did I. My report is in the East Africa Trip Index.

Leely's report

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34830142

Index
http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34725679

Another report that includes Mawe Ninga http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34837637