It's OK Matt, we believe you ;)

Hi Matt,

A bbit early to post thoughts - haven't been yet ;)

I promise to let everyone know though after I get back home.

Till now all I can say is that the correspondence was good, all questions answered immediately and helpful suggestions made.

Hope that the trip itself leaves as good a feeling as the pre-departure arrangements.

Thanks for posting the details Matt. It looks like a great trip.
J

So I've sent the same itinerary to Sunny Safaris and am not expecting a vast difference though I have also asked for them to quote for extra days in the SNP.

Now I wonder how much it would cost to buy a stretched and safari equipped Landcruiser and keep it garaged; if we each chipped in some dollars then we could all use it when going to TZ. That would reduce the cost of car hire anyway...

Matt

Hi Matt,

Thanks for starting a fascinating thread -- I'm amazed by how much you've managed to squeeze out of your budget. Your 60-year-old dad must be a hardy guy -- I don't think my parents would last a day!

Cheers,
Julian

Julian - he'll have to be hardy: I'm the one who'll be paying for it! ;-) Sorry but he's not worth much more LOL.

I just don't want to know how bad he'll smell after 7 days in the bush. After the same amount of time without a shower on Kili I was rancid!

Matt

OK now I have been thinking.......if this is a cheap safari (which sounds like an awsome trip I would love to be given to me for my birthday!) what would you all think would be a middle of the road price per person per night for a private safari in Tanzania??
J

I hope this thread is still going when we get back from Zambia/Zimbabwe in July. We're two "old people" combining 2 weeks of Habitat building in a town in the Copper Belt (no electricity but promised soon, pit toilet, sleeping bag, and solar shower)followed by our team stay at Fawlty Towers in Livingstone. Then my husband and I will go to Vundu Camp/Mana Pools, followed by Tafika/ South Luangwa. This thread just may be helping us plan our next adventure. Interesting ideas!

Okay so today I received back the itinerary and costs from Sunny Safaris - and I (like I'm sure you are) was suprised by the price difference at almost 500 dollars cheaper. Below what Sunny have returned I have listed some things in bold which differ to my original requirements and those of Roys It:

kindly find below itinerary and net rates.

Day 1
Pick up clients Kilimanjaro International Airport and transfer to Arusha. Depart with lunch boxes and drive to Lake Manyara National Park for afternoon game drive. Dinner and overnight at Twiga Campsite.

Day 2
After breakfast have morning game drive in Lake Manyara National Park with lunch boxes. Afternoon drive to Ngorongoro Conservational Area. Dinner and overnight at Simba Campsite.

Day 3
After breakfast descend down the crater tour for half-day game drive with lunch boxes. Afternoon drive to Serengeti National Park. Dinner and overnight at Seronera Campsite.

Day 4
After breakfast have morning and afternoon game drive in Serengeti National Park. All meals and overnight at Seronera Campsite.

Day 5
After breakfast have morning and afternoon game drive in Serengeti National Park. All meals and overnight at Seronera Campsite.

Day 6
After breakfast have morning game drive in Serengeti National Park. Afternoon drive to Twiga Campsite for dinner and overnight.

Day 7
Full day at leisure. (options given below) All meals and overnight at Twiga Campsite.

Day 8
After breakfast drive back to Arusha and transfer to Kilimanjaro International Airport.

END OF SERVICES.
Price 2 People US$ 894 Per person.

Price Includes: Vehicle 4wd, fuel, driver cum guide, park fees, camping fees, gamedrives, table, chairs, mattresses, pillows, tent.
Price Excludes: Tips, drinks, sleeping bags, available for hire $3/night), insurance, and all items of personal nature/use.

Options on Day 7:
Village walk
2-3hours US$ 35 per person

Mountain biking
2-3hours US$ 35 per person

Forest hike
2-3hours US$ 35 per person

Nature walk
1 hours US$ 15 per person.

Differences:
<b>Lists only a half day drive Crater on day 3
Day 5 again an overnight at Seronera as opposed to a special campsite in the Southern plains area. (And that would only be of great benefit should the migration be in that area anyway).
Day 6 No visit to Oldupai or Maasai interaction.
Day 7 No set plan but one can choose.</b> In this instance perhaps then another day could be spent in the Serengeti using day 7 for a morning drive in the SNP with an afternoon drive back to TWIGA in Mto.
<b>Also lists driver cum guide</b>

If I were to do this on my own, or wife Lizzy my wife this schedule would suit our requirements not wanting to return to Oldupai and likewise no Maasai interaction as this is something to be arranged privately as stated. If it turns out that it is the case that we only go alone then day 7 I would finish with Sunny's services and then arrange a further 5 - 7 days with my Maasai friends near Mto and arrange own transport back to Kili international. The fact of only having a driver cum guide does not concern me as I am as enthusiastic as any guide, though perhaps not as profficient ;-) However as this would be my 3rd safari trip my perogatives will be different to that of a first timer or group.

Things I wish to verify further with Sunny: does this include VAT/TAX, what type of vehicle and its condition, (my preference leans towards a Landcruiser having used one before), does it have CB and is there a seperate vehicle for the camping food equipment. If these answers are satisfactory then I will certainly be giving Sunny a lot of consideration as this budget brings the price down very close to that magic 100 dollars PPPN figure we have discussed. However it is my belief that my friend will be able to provide something lower and I will be happy knowing that any profits will be going straight to him rather than a company.

Eben, (climbhighsleeplow) posted an excellent list of questions to ask your outfitter on this thread:

&quot;Tanzania Experts - Advice on Tour Operators Needed&quot;

http://www.fodors.com/forums/threads...p;tid=34762374

(I won't cut and paste it to here as the original thread is of great interest when considering doing a budget safari and many things raised there I will have to take into consideration.)

Matt

Okay so I hope that I am not boring you with my cheap safari ramblings but I received today a reply from Sunny to my various questions. (I will also send this list to Roys but have not yet got around to it.) I have noted that Sunny are very quick to respond to emails and their customer service is good which is a positive sign. Anyway, see below their responses:

&quot;Dear Matthew,

Thank you for e mail. Kindly find below answers to your questions:

- The guides and cook work on salary but it recommended to tips them as follows:
Driver guide US$ 15-20 per group per day.
Cook US$ 10-15 per group per day.
- We shall use Toyota Land cruiser.
- The roof is pop up roof.
- All our vehicles have got Radio calls and the drivers have got mobile phones.
- Each vehicle care 2 extra spare tires.
- Incase of a breakdown the clients will be transfers to lodge or continue with the game drive with another vehicle within some few minutes and within 24hours they will have another vehicle.
- Normally there is no mileage for game drives, but in Serengeti they will be doing the game drives in central and not going to North or west.
- You can stop at shoprite to get the drinks. You don't require to consider about the guide or the cook.
- We provide 1 vehicle, the clients, cook and the driver guide with the equipments in one vehicle but I can assure you that they clients will have plenty of space.
- The cook will be setting up the tents and not the clients, When the clients are back from the game drive they will see the tents are pitched and they menu is on the way.
- If you require game drive on day 7, the supplement will cost US$ 50 per person each of 4.

In order to book and confirm trip we request you to send a 50% deposit of the total amount to our Bank Account...The balance can be paid here on your arrival by USD, cash and/or Travelers cheques. We also accept Visa/Master Card but with 5% surcharge.&quot;

Once more I wish to assure everyone that I have no business connections with any of the mentioned companies (I have enough work to do at with with my young family thankyou...) and have only contacted these two TZ based operators having read the positive reviews found within Fodors.

Matt

Matt -
Fascinating. And good food for thought for future trips.
Thanks.

Hi Matt,

Just a thanks for starting this thread. I have had similar discussions with a few operators, and it seems Sunny is a good option. Another operator I considered was Anderock tours, they wanted 1180$(4pax) for 9 day safari.

So there are options to do it a bit cheaper, which would hopefully enable us to go more often!

I must say the last weeks flood of excellent trip reports from Zambia, has made me curios if it´s possible to do a cheap safari there as well. If anybody has any input I would be grateful.

regards,
Tom

Tom, In South Luangwa, the budget options are Flatdogs Camp or Track &amp; Trail. For Flatdogs, you can tent camp for $20. pppn, game drives are $35 for the first, $30 for every other drive + $25 per day park fees and a $20 airport transfer fee. There is an inexpensive restaurant for breakfast, lunch and dinner, or bring your own food and cook it yourself. For full board (meals, tree house camping) it's $125 pppn + fees for activities and park entrance. Fully inclusive packages are $150pppn for chalet, $175 pppn for tree house camping. This includes all activities (2 game drives per day, all meals, laundry and airport transfer) + $25 pp park fees per day. Flatdogs is popular with the backpacking crowd and can get noisy on Friday nights, &quot;Party Night&quot;. It's in a nice location on the river, just before the gate into South Luangwa National Park. The airfare from Lusaka to Mfuwe is around $180 pp each way. One thing though, every time we passed a Flatdogs Rover, they were full-8-10 people in each.

Hello,

Thanks for the tips regarding Zambia. It does however not seem to have the right keywords for me... Party night and 8-10 per car does not make me really happy. What I think Matt is doing so nicely in his itinerary is getting maximum flexibility and privacy, but cutting the big costs for nice accomodation and food.

But it seems that there are different ways of safari in TZ and Zambia in the use of guide and veichle. I guess the TZ way of hiring one guide and vehicle makes it easier to go &quot;budget&quot; camping.

I agree, was just throwing it out there for you. with 8-10 in a rover, i wouldn't do it either.