Sand River Pride wiped out by community outside SSGR
 

It is with much sadness that I post this topic. Link to full report: http://www.leopardhills.com/blog/index.php?itemid=217

Wasn't there another incident outside the Western fence a few years ago? I remember our ranger mentioning that while at Exeter in 2006 - so, sometime prior to that!

hari,
it's referred to in the article: "Immediately we had a sense of déjà vu, and remember clearly the shooting of seven member of the Sand River Pride three years ago having also broken out of the Reserve under very similar circumstances." how very tragic...

Very sad indeed...there must be some very trigger happy people out there.

This is tragic news. I certainly wish that things could have been handled differently.

Here are shots of some of the cubs taken in 2007 when they were about 6-8 weeks old.

http://www.pbase.com/mytmoss/lionesses_and_cubs

This article is saddening at one hand and make me furious on the other.

Why isn't it possible to MAKE SURE these gracious animals can't escape?

Is it correct that the Sabi Sand lodges are responsible for making sure the fences are in proper condition to prevent such incidents?

These Lodges earn an awful lot of money because of these animals. Shouldn't they be blamed for that tragedy?

The information on the website mentions their devastation that incident causes and responsibility in view to the communities. But it does not state who is responsible for the fence maintenance.
These people live in that environment for ages and so they of course know that after torrential rains they have to check fences. They do check-ups on regular basis and so i would think especially during heavy weather.

Here again the animals pay for human stupidity.

SV

The report states that the lions got out through a section of fence broken by recent flooding. Fencing in a water course is practically impossible even if the fence line is maintained, which in the sabi sand it is. The SS has an over population of predators (IMO), which would account for the reason these lions left the reserve in the first instance. Sad that they were destroyed, but that folks is the reality when livestock is your economy & livelihood.

Displaced by perhaps a stronger pride, sacrificing their genetic line to improve the overall dna strength of those that remain, that is the positive outcome, so please don't leave your heart on your sleeve, it is not as bad as you feel.

mkonzo

All what you say might mirror reality. But then predator management has failed.
If there are too many lions in the reserve then they should be relocated.
That would mean responsible "conservation" to me.

On the other hand - SS is open to kruger. It would have been easy for them to head for the park.

There was no means to rescue the lions involved. I think they just opted for the easiest and cheapest solution.

SV

I believe the cubs were sired by the Mapogo males. I do not think there is a stronger DNA strain there at the moment. The Mapogos have been destroying males and other cubs from different pride in that whole area.

I do not consider this action natural that strengthens DNA. However it is was it is, and it cannot be undone.
Time will tell how this changes the lion population in that part of the Sabi Sands.

Mike

Tragic, once again a parks authority have made an idiotic decision at the expense of animals and in favour of an overpopulated human settlement.

Simple truth is that it is easier, cheaper and less time consuming (this seems to be a common denominator with most Parks Boards these days)to shoot the lions.

Mkhonso, perhaps you live or have lived in a human settlement such as this which is why your view is so typically slanted or maybe you were one of the layabouts who pulled the trigger? If there are too many predators in an area they will starve or get killed by the opposition predators(not get shot!)I don't think nature factored bullets into account with regard to natural selection and dna strength!

I would love to know upon which lucky packet you get your facts. "Don't wear your heart on your sleeve" - which movie taught you those lines? It is because of people with big hearts and solid minds that we have the Parks we do!

The lions could have been darted and either returned to the Sabi Sands or relocated somewhere else, there is absolutely no excuse for what transpired.

Oh my what a crew... are you travelers or storybook writers where the end is always sweet with a "they all lived happily ever after" type conclusion?

If predator management has failed, why is there an over population of predators in the Sabi Sand?

I take that as a resounding success, maybe too much of a success. You suggest that the lions should have just turned and headed for the Kruger.. duh, what's with that? Do you really believe that the Kruger is a magic fairy land with a super "lion black-hole" just waiting to welcome the destitute, displaced territoryless lion prides? Come on, apply some thought to the issue and get your heart back where it needs to be and engage some common sense.

Yes: I know of these communities that live along side the park and I also know of the tough existence that the have. Droughts, floods, poor soils, no running water, wood for energy etc. They have an old value system that equates cash with cattle... and when that, their very foundation of wealth, is threatened by wildlife they react in ways not dissimilar to the way you would if the bank threatened your savings.

Was I a layabout that pulled the trigger... no, I live on another continent right now. Are there other means of taking care of escaped lions? I guess so, but just perhaps the park authorities have had experience with this in the past... just perhaps a pattern of behaviour ,such as this, is irreversible, therefor returning/relocating has proved to be fruitless and a waste of money?

And one last comment for you to chew on.... in the natural order of things, while nature hadn't factored on bullets... (mmm you obviously don't believe that man is part of the natural order...) neither did "nature" figure on fences.....

"(mmm you obviously don't believe that man is part of the natural order...)"

I consider man the reason for the problems!

SV

Ja well then take yourself out of play too.

mkhonzo your last post clearly states to all here who have read your thread on how exactly to take your previous comments. I think now you have gained respect from us all.

Mike

I think it a little pointless and counter productive hurling insults at each other, we should concentrate at the problem at hand.

I would like to point out that it is not the Lodges that are responsible for the fence and its maintenance. Secondly, I must point out, and we must be very careful about this point, the Local Community are not to blame for this tragic occurrence, their safety and security must always come first. I am however, in a personal capacity, blaming the local provincial authority that sanctioned the shooting without giving the Lodges an opportunity to help and get the Pride back into the Reserve, something I believe we could have done, knowing the role players who would have all been involved.

SandRivers--it's not the lodges' responsibility to maintain the fences? I just assumed that they were responsible as it seems they have to most to lose if a fence goes down. Do you know who is responsible for maintenance?

Regardless of who is responsible for maintenance, I don't think that they should be blamed for this. I would think that it takes a good deal of time to fix a fence like this and it sounds like the fence came down very recently.

Some of the comments here and in other places regarding the human population outside Kruger are concerning. Logically, humans are part of "nature" regardless of one's worldview.

Gritty Hi.

I think the debate regarding the fence, and the standard of it is relevant, and I can inform you as we speak that the the entire fence line is being addressed.

The elements were against the structure as there has been an unusual amount of rain over the last couple of weeks, and one can debate this issue for ever. All I can tell you is that the Lodges are bringing to bear the full force of their authority to make sure that the authorities concerned ensure they do everything in their power to make sure another breach does not occur in the future.

My problem, and I stress this is a personal opinion, lies with the Provincial Authority outside the Reserve who have the jurisdiction of the animals should they breach the boundary fence. The Lodges were not notified of the breach and the decision to destroy the Pride until after the fact, I strongly believe the Lodges could have used their combined efforts to bring them back, with no threat to the Community.

We do support and agree with the principal that the safety of the local Community must always come first, the Lodges work very closely with them on a number of issues, and I must stress here again that they are in no way to blame with what transpired. Given the choice I have no doubt that they would have gladly worked with the Lodges to rectify this, and it would have resulted in a win win for everyone.

how easy is it to relocate a pride of lions? Would that pride have difficulty finding and holding on to territory elsewhere? How many of the lions would be hurt, and die slowly, in the fights that might very well ensue?

If someone can translate Afrikaans, here is an article about the incident.

http://www.news24.com/Beeld/Suid-Afr...458858,00.html

It would not be possible to relocate these animals into another Area/Reserve under natural circumstances, unless there were no other Lion Prides in the new location, but there are many other factors to take into consideration. To re-locate them would have taken darting the whole pride, and my point being, if the Lodges had been informed and were given a chance to submit knowledge and man power, I believe the entire Pride could have been darted and relocated back into their existing territory.

I have translated the article below.

Cattle killing lions shot

Jan 25 2009 10:13:24:370PM - (SA)

Buks Viljoen

Six lions that killed a cow on Friday night near Hazyview in Mpumalanga were shot yesterday.

Officials of the Mpumalanga Tourism and Parks agency started searching for the lions in thick bush adjoining the Sabi Sands Game Reserve on the weekend.

The lions escaped from the reserve on Friday night after it is alleged that a dominant male attacked and drove the animals from the reserve.

During the course of the night they caught a cow near one of the tribal chiefs “kraal” at the Dumphries C-settlement near Nkuhlu.

The fleeing pride of lions consisted of 7 animals – two adult females and five young males between the ages of 18 months and 2 years.

All but one of the young males was located and shot said Mr. Jan Muller of the Mpumalanga Parks Agency.

It is alleged that the pride of lions left the reserve on Friday after the perimeter fences was damaged in a flood the past week. The river remains in flood up to 200m wide in places.

Muller said that their efforts to chase the lions back into the reserve were unsuccessful.

“The bush in the area is very thick and because large numbers of people live in that area our department feared for the loss of human life.”

A decision was made to shoot the lions. Two years ago another pride of lions were shot under similar circumstances.

A pride of 11 lions left the reserve in the same area in April 2007. On this occasion the pride of lions killed 36 head of cattle belonging to the Dumphries community. Most of the pride members were then also shot.

Link to report:
http://www.news24.com/Beeld/Suid-Afr...458858,00.html