Predator Biologist to explore some of Botswana's independent camps
Aug 7th, 2007, 08:10 AM
#21
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Are any of us doing much for conservation and the environment by flying half way round the world. There are plenty of people who would tell us we are contributing to the problem far more than we are helping.
Aug 7th, 2007, 12:31 PM
#22
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,064
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
napamatt, tourism is a too much important money generator for conservation that we better shouldn't stop it. However, we can try to improve the CO2 balance - other ways of regional/local transfers, improved eco-footprints of accommodations, etc. In Zambia Robin Pope Safaris and Norman Carr Safaris have just started reforest projects, IMO a good start.
Aug 7th, 2007, 06:41 PM
#23
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,528
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Aug 7th, 2007, 11:44 PM
#24
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 813
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I agree with Nyama here.
The thinking of those people you refer to is a bit flawed, Napamatt. I mean; what are they saying exactly? That we shouldn't donate to wildlife projects because the CO2 from our airplane disrupts the balance with nature anyway?
Not that they don't have a valid point, mind you. But global warming is just one threat. There are some other, perhaps even more important threats at this time. And any effort made to tackle those (be it by actively participating in some program or by donating money) should be applauded.
If you want to comensate for the CO2 of your air ride, look here: http://www.climatecare.org/
Hari, thanks for bringing up my thread again. That thread contains some other "hot issues" about conservancy. To be more specific; that thread is about the fact that we should be cautious towards NGOs with their headline grabbing projects.
To quote "Das" (co-author of "In Search Of The Pangolin"
from one of the latest interviews on safaritalk.net: "Large conservation organisations are large businesses with million-dollar revenue. They have professional management and speak the language of business. They also seem to arrange and attend many, many conventions and meetings".
Apparently, a huge amount of the funds raised goes to the payroll and to advertising, and only a small part to the conservation effort. And then not even the right efforts, sometimes (like WWF being pro-hunting).
But of course; that's another discussion. This one is about non-top-$ lodges and camps in and around the delta. I suggest we stay on topic. LOL.
Ciao,
J.
The thinking of those people you refer to is a bit flawed, Napamatt. I mean; what are they saying exactly? That we shouldn't donate to wildlife projects because the CO2 from our airplane disrupts the balance with nature anyway?
Not that they don't have a valid point, mind you. But global warming is just one threat. There are some other, perhaps even more important threats at this time. And any effort made to tackle those (be it by actively participating in some program or by donating money) should be applauded.
If you want to comensate for the CO2 of your air ride, look here: http://www.climatecare.org/
Hari, thanks for bringing up my thread again. That thread contains some other "hot issues" about conservancy. To be more specific; that thread is about the fact that we should be cautious towards NGOs with their headline grabbing projects.
To quote "Das" (co-author of "In Search Of The Pangolin"
from one of the latest interviews on safaritalk.net: "Large conservation organisations are large businesses with million-dollar revenue. They have professional management and speak the language of business. They also seem to arrange and attend many, many conventions and meetings".Apparently, a huge amount of the funds raised goes to the payroll and to advertising, and only a small part to the conservation effort. And then not even the right efforts, sometimes (like WWF being pro-hunting).
But of course; that's another discussion. This one is about non-top-$ lodges and camps in and around the delta. I suggest we stay on topic. LOL.
Ciao,
J.
Aug 8th, 2007, 01:56 PM
#25
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,064
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Another off-topic.
Hari, I just read that other thread with your Kafue statement. My answer: I don't see much changes there, just because a new operator has overtaken some old operations. There was already a strong presence of tourist operations in northern Kafue before 2006, and many of those local operators did a lot to avoid the worst (as local people told me, with the notably exception of the most-upmarket one - hopefully that has changed now). The main problem remains: an under-staffed and under-funded ZAWA unit that can't fulfil its task, the protection of the park.
Hari, I just read that other thread with your Kafue statement. My answer: I don't see much changes there, just because a new operator has overtaken some old operations. There was already a strong presence of tourist operations in northern Kafue before 2006, and many of those local operators did a lot to avoid the worst (as local people told me, with the notably exception of the most-upmarket one - hopefully that has changed now). The main problem remains: an under-staffed and under-funded ZAWA unit that can't fulfil its task, the protection of the park.
Aug 8th, 2007, 05:10 PM
#27
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
J.
Irony. I employ it perhaps too much, particularly when writing.
Nyama
I read the report, quite interesting. It seems one of the biggest issues was the lack of education of the people handling the funds generated for the communities, so that the money was essentially squandered. A more paternalistic approach might work better, but then I'm sure that would have issues, not least of which would be the charges of racism.
I have been to several camps with non white management run by WS in Botswana, ultimately its a question of education and training, at the current time I'm sure this is a fairly limited pool of local talent, which hopefully is being nurtured and developed.
My industry has been white and fairly male for a long time, that is changing, but it takes a while for the talent pool to diversify to the point that populations become markedly different and diverse within an organization.
As for other recommendations of the report, that there is not enough cultural tourism and everything is about wilderness and wildlife, I quite frankly don't care. I go to africa to see wildlife, my passion. That's why I spend considerable amounts of money there.
At the risk of getting a tirade, I enjoy luxury lodges, I like the comfort and the privacy they usually afford. They have their downsides, often obnoxious guests, not always american, but when travelling with other people you dont notice that as much.
Irony. I employ it perhaps too much, particularly when writing.
Nyama
I read the report, quite interesting. It seems one of the biggest issues was the lack of education of the people handling the funds generated for the communities, so that the money was essentially squandered. A more paternalistic approach might work better, but then I'm sure that would have issues, not least of which would be the charges of racism.
I have been to several camps with non white management run by WS in Botswana, ultimately its a question of education and training, at the current time I'm sure this is a fairly limited pool of local talent, which hopefully is being nurtured and developed.
My industry has been white and fairly male for a long time, that is changing, but it takes a while for the talent pool to diversify to the point that populations become markedly different and diverse within an organization.
As for other recommendations of the report, that there is not enough cultural tourism and everything is about wilderness and wildlife, I quite frankly don't care. I go to africa to see wildlife, my passion. That's why I spend considerable amounts of money there.
At the risk of getting a tirade, I enjoy luxury lodges, I like the comfort and the privacy they usually afford. They have their downsides, often obnoxious guests, not always american, but when travelling with other people you dont notice that as much.
Aug 8th, 2007, 06:32 PM
#28
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,147
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If silk duvets, or whatever, get more Americans, or anyone else, to Africa to see wildlife, experience the people, and begin to care about African countries, don't scoff at the luxuries. Higher end places appeal to first-time Africa visitors who don't know what to expect. Like many here, we got hooked, and next time we'll do more isolated tented camps. Perhaps we'll try the independants the next time 'round. And now we've become rather pushy missionaries, spreading the gospel of Africa and wildlife to everyone we run into. The true Spa Girls won't be back. This reverse elitism ("I'M NOT A TOURIST, I'M A TRAVELER, YOU PHILISTINES!"that snubs people who want a little comfort along with their adventure is what's really obnoxious.
Leslie
that snubs people who want a little comfort along with their adventure is what's really obnoxious.Leslie
Aug 8th, 2007, 10:00 PM
#29
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,715
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Lots of interesting things added to the thread. I also read the research posted by Nyama. This is all very relevant to my visiting these camps as Footsteps in Africa seems very committed to these issues and from what I can tell have worked with these camps to deliver with action - I'll know much more of course once I experience it but Mapula Camp, Delta Camp, and Oddballs (lower cost alternative to Delta Camp that I will likely visit but not stay at due to lack of time) all have community ownership and every employee including the camp managers consists of locals. On my last two trips I have made it a point to stay at some lodges with community ownership and this trip continues that theme. At Delta Camp they only utilize bio-degradable products, fly out all rubbish, and encourage visits to a local village that the employees are from. At Deception Valley Lodge I have already seen first hand how involved and supportive they are with the bushmen community and that disappearing way of life. Footsteps in Africa has an alliance with Delta Air, an airline owned completely by locals for all their transfers. Thus, based on my early research it seems that this alignment of independents is already advancing on a lot of these important issues and I'm a big believer that all the companies need to work hard in that direction. If they don't things are going to turn bad in the future. Hopefully I will find on my visit that this is all working well, I defintitely like the sound of it and those are all important reasons for why I want to experience this circuit of camps.
NapaMatt: I totally agree that better education and training needs to be incorporated to prepare locals to succeed. What's hard to understand is the high end low tourism model has been established for a good 15 years now and that should have been ample time to build the local expertise to a competancy level that would have produced many capable managers rather than the small handful that seem to have made it to date.
As for only caring about the wildlife and that being your passion, I think its cool that you know what you want and focus on it, but realize that it is well accepted at this point that local communities need to have a stake in the tourism and reap sufficient benefits or conservation of wildlife will fail. Thus, you may choose not to ever partake in a cultural visit but if more benefits do not start accruing to the locals the quality of wildlife that you enjoy will likely become compromised, since that is your passion it seems logical to care about the development of cultural toursim even if you will not want to use it. Of course there are many people that relish mixing in cultural interaction on their safari, and at this point many of them probably prefer east Africa. I feel that Botswana could create more area for safaris by tapping into that market of people who come for the mixed experience and do not mind less than Mombo viewing when combined with a village stay, or for that matter they can still go to Mombo but miss another camp to take in some local culture. Over time this could add more quality habitat for wildlife to expand into as the community places camps closer to their villages and gets more direct benefit from encouraging the presence of wildlife. It could also create a new lower price point for N. Botswana tourism without changing the very high end existing in the better established wildlife areas. This brings more money to locals and to the country, and that is all great for wildlife conservation. It could even end up being more profitable than cattle which could ultimately lead to removal of large areas of the vet fence and thus allow for re-establishment of important migratory patterns. Bottom line is wildlife is my passion too but it has become clear that lasting conservation only comes with improving the lot for the locals and having healthy wildlife be a source of pride and most importantly revenue for them.
NapaMatt: I totally agree that better education and training needs to be incorporated to prepare locals to succeed. What's hard to understand is the high end low tourism model has been established for a good 15 years now and that should have been ample time to build the local expertise to a competancy level that would have produced many capable managers rather than the small handful that seem to have made it to date.
As for only caring about the wildlife and that being your passion, I think its cool that you know what you want and focus on it, but realize that it is well accepted at this point that local communities need to have a stake in the tourism and reap sufficient benefits or conservation of wildlife will fail. Thus, you may choose not to ever partake in a cultural visit but if more benefits do not start accruing to the locals the quality of wildlife that you enjoy will likely become compromised, since that is your passion it seems logical to care about the development of cultural toursim even if you will not want to use it. Of course there are many people that relish mixing in cultural interaction on their safari, and at this point many of them probably prefer east Africa. I feel that Botswana could create more area for safaris by tapping into that market of people who come for the mixed experience and do not mind less than Mombo viewing when combined with a village stay, or for that matter they can still go to Mombo but miss another camp to take in some local culture. Over time this could add more quality habitat for wildlife to expand into as the community places camps closer to their villages and gets more direct benefit from encouraging the presence of wildlife. It could also create a new lower price point for N. Botswana tourism without changing the very high end existing in the better established wildlife areas. This brings more money to locals and to the country, and that is all great for wildlife conservation. It could even end up being more profitable than cattle which could ultimately lead to removal of large areas of the vet fence and thus allow for re-establishment of important migratory patterns. Bottom line is wildlife is my passion too but it has become clear that lasting conservation only comes with improving the lot for the locals and having healthy wildlife be a source of pride and most importantly revenue for them.
Aug 8th, 2007, 10:27 PM
#30
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,715
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Leslie: that's a good point to bring up, just to be clear I am firmly in the camp that is concerned and disappointed in the over-luxurising of Northern Botswana but that is not because I have disdain for people who like luxury or want the highest end lodge. In fact I am all for some very luxury camps, I think its great that Mombo, Jao, and King's Pool were out there to deliver the finest in tented luxury. Only once have I chosen a lodge strictly for the luxury and I savored it to the fullest, other times I have chosen high end luxury due to a significant wildlife decision and that was supposed to be the best place. The concern I (and I think many others) have is that camps that we already consider amazing and have had repeat visitors for many years are being 'upgraded' and pricing quite a few of their supporters out. High end is fine to have but eliminating (or severe narrowing) the diverse character and corresponding pricing of camps is a hard development to watch and cause for great concern as the more affordable quality options morph to higher luxury and leave the stretch to afford Botswana crowd behind.
Aug 8th, 2007, 11:09 PM
#31
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 3,528
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
RE East Africa and the ease of combining safari with cultural visits...that is possible there as the Maasai and the wildlife share common space, isn't it. The wildlife is always at risk here.....isn't it one of the reasons that the wild dog packs died from disease?... you only find the random packs in the Serengeti now which are on the brink.....
Aug 8th, 2007, 11:16 PM
#32
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 813
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
@ Napamatt; sorry I missed your irony there. Guess I don't know you well enough yet. 
@ Leslie; you do have a point there. For example; for my first visits I sticked (or tried to stick to) brick walls and real showers, etc etc... I just paid a lot, just to be sure to get the right amount of comfort. Butfor an upcoming trip, we'll be in non-permanent tented camps with bucket showers, and I'm not the least bit affraid about this as I found out I do not need silk duvets and shiny silverwear etc... I guess I'll be trading 5 star with a thusand stars next time, LOL.
However, just like Bill, I'd like to point out that I am not looking down on people who book these lodges. At least not when they are there for the right reason; the wildlife. And most of them are.
As I stated before, I'm still on the fence on this "benefits for local people".
On one end, I see that private concessions sometimes have very little to do with local communities, but their budgets are high enough for what's really important; making sure wildlife stays the way it is by keeping people out, and by sticking to minimum number of guests at maximum prices. However... I have a personal problem there too, as I cannot afford these lodges, yet would love to see the wildlife there. But I have no trouble saying; the well-being of the animals is far more important than my visiting them.
Om the other hand, I see community initiatives that I really like (Chipembele Wildlife Education Centre near South Luangwa comes to mind, but it does not have to be as "big" as that: even the Maasai walking safari in Kirurumu lodge was great stuff for me).
However... I read a lot about those initiatives going the wrong way. (I guess this ismore fuel to the fire again If you just read the last two issues of Africa Birds & Birding for example; recently, it seems like every time the magazine speaks of an initiative like that, there's a mail in the next issue of somebody saying: "we found the place to be abandoned, camp stuff stolen, animals gone, etc etc...
To me, a lot lies in the definition of "local communities". These tend to grow, in part because of people flocking in from elsewhere. There's no way any community initiative can keep on supporting all those people. And there's bound to be an impact on wildlife too, if more people keep on settling near the parks.
Ciao,
J.
@ Leslie; you do have a point there. For example; for my first visits I sticked (or tried to stick to) brick walls and real showers, etc etc... I just paid a lot, just to be sure to get the right amount of comfort. Butfor an upcoming trip, we'll be in non-permanent tented camps with bucket showers, and I'm not the least bit affraid about this as I found out I do not need silk duvets and shiny silverwear etc... I guess I'll be trading 5 star with a thusand stars next time, LOL.
However, just like Bill, I'd like to point out that I am not looking down on people who book these lodges. At least not when they are there for the right reason; the wildlife. And most of them are.
As I stated before, I'm still on the fence on this "benefits for local people".
On one end, I see that private concessions sometimes have very little to do with local communities, but their budgets are high enough for what's really important; making sure wildlife stays the way it is by keeping people out, and by sticking to minimum number of guests at maximum prices. However... I have a personal problem there too, as I cannot afford these lodges, yet would love to see the wildlife there. But I have no trouble saying; the well-being of the animals is far more important than my visiting them.
Om the other hand, I see community initiatives that I really like (Chipembele Wildlife Education Centre near South Luangwa comes to mind, but it does not have to be as "big" as that: even the Maasai walking safari in Kirurumu lodge was great stuff for me).
However... I read a lot about those initiatives going the wrong way. (I guess this ismore fuel to the fire again
If you just read the last two issues of Africa Birds & Birding for example; recently, it seems like every time the magazine speaks of an initiative like that, there's a mail in the next issue of somebody saying: "we found the place to be abandoned, camp stuff stolen, animals gone, etc etc...To me, a lot lies in the definition of "local communities". These tend to grow, in part because of people flocking in from elsewhere. There's no way any community initiative can keep on supporting all those people. And there's bound to be an impact on wildlife too, if more people keep on settling near the parks.
Ciao,
J.
Aug 8th, 2007, 11:19 PM
#33
Guest
Posts: n/a
I am pleased that this thread now appears to be back on line. I had thought we were looking for less luxurious wild life viewing, or at least less expensive.
To this I would like to suggest Santavani in the South Moremi it is a community run camp and fairly basic, I have not tried it so cannot comment in depth.
http://www.santawanilodge.com/
I have heard that there are Wild Dog in the area.
To this I would like to suggest Santavani in the South Moremi it is a community run camp and fairly basic, I have not tried it so cannot comment in depth.
http://www.santawanilodge.com/
I have heard that there are Wild Dog in the area.
Aug 9th, 2007, 08:33 AM
#34
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Pred
As always you make very good points. I am I think very cynical about the human condition and how things will be in ten, twenty, fifty years from now.
I think that if there is a significant negative response to continued upgrades and price increases then you will see a switch in emphasis back to more basic options.
Maybe Selinda and Zib will suffer with much higher prices, if so maybe Kwando will always be full, as a slightly lower priced alternative.
As always you make very good points. I am I think very cynical about the human condition and how things will be in ten, twenty, fifty years from now.
I think that if there is a significant negative response to continued upgrades and price increases then you will see a switch in emphasis back to more basic options.
Maybe Selinda and Zib will suffer with much higher prices, if so maybe Kwando will always be full, as a slightly lower priced alternative.
Aug 9th, 2007, 09:17 AM
#36
Original Poster
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 1,715
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Matt: I think I largely share your cynical view of people, which is a big part of the sad realization that they have to be compensated because its too rare for people to be stewards of wildlife just because it is special or should be our responsibility. Pixel makes great points about the danger of as you create benefits for people more show up and Hari is correct that there are always more issues as wildlife and people come closer together such as domestic dogs passing diseases. Right now the scales seem to be tipped to where human needs have to be addressed to keep the wildlife advancing but at some point that tips again if the people are not managed well. It's all very complicated and I'm glad we have this forum where lots of people contribute and want to discuss these enormous issues. It will certainly never be perfect and these issues will always be in some degree of flux but hopefully good sustainable balances are developed that mostly work well.
Kwando is at a rack rate of $850 pppn during high season so its right up there too. Luckily their green season deals are outstanding. WS used to have very good green season too when I first travelled, I stayed at Mombo and other camps for about 40% less than high season but the growth in Botswana tourism and reputation of the WS camps has eliminated most of those deals.
Sniktawk: thanks for posting that link. I want to learn about all of these lodges that are under the radar. That appears to be a very good community project and its nice that it can be done on a self drive circuit, combining Moremi area with Chobe, the pans, and the Kalahari would be an outstanding way to experience Botswana on a tighter budget for confident independent travellers.
I would urge anyone that knows of other indpendent camps or good community efforts post them here. I'm sure there's many more that most of us are unaware of. I will look for more in the future but I'm all set for this go-round -- if only I could take a couple months to visit camp in the area.
Kwando is at a rack rate of $850 pppn during high season so its right up there too. Luckily their green season deals are outstanding. WS used to have very good green season too when I first travelled, I stayed at Mombo and other camps for about 40% less than high season but the growth in Botswana tourism and reputation of the WS camps has eliminated most of those deals.
Sniktawk: thanks for posting that link. I want to learn about all of these lodges that are under the radar. That appears to be a very good community project and its nice that it can be done on a self drive circuit, combining Moremi area with Chobe, the pans, and the Kalahari would be an outstanding way to experience Botswana on a tighter budget for confident independent travellers.
I would urge anyone that knows of other indpendent camps or good community efforts post them here. I'm sure there's many more that most of us are unaware of. I will look for more in the future but I'm all set for this go-round -- if only I could take a couple months to visit camp in the area.
Aug 9th, 2007, 02:28 PM
#39
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 20,145
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hello PB,
Good and timely info. for me, as I'm trying desperately to find something somewhat inexpensive and interesting in the desert area (see botswana desert/camp thread)- sorry can't post link.
Anyhow, does Makgadikgadi fall into the 300. range? I've only been able to find TA sites with any info. and it appears higher priced.
Do you have a direct link?
Good and timely info. for me, as I'm trying desperately to find something somewhat inexpensive and interesting in the desert area (see botswana desert/camp thread)- sorry can't post link.
Anyhow, does Makgadikgadi fall into the 300. range? I've only been able to find TA sites with any info. and it appears higher priced.
Do you have a direct link?
Aug 9th, 2007, 02:32 PM
#40
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,147
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OK, I'm really confused. What I was responding to is the genaralized anti-American post by someone (sniktawk?). Was I posting on the wrong thread or was all that back-and-forth removed from this one?
Pred, I didn't for a minute think you (or you pixel) are against safari-goers looking for comfort. I believe the world has gotten over luxury-ized and would far prefer modest comforts and the best wildlife viewing and guiding in interesting surroundings. I look forward to bucket showers in the Kalahari in November (admittedly at Jack's Camp, the fanciest of the options) And, as napamatt suggests, the pendulum may swing the other way if enough tourists want it to. It's partly about what the market will bear, and partly about profit taking. I'm not educated enough about the business aspects of safari companies to know how much of a stake the stock market has in these places, but I'd bet it's growing. If that's true the pressures will be on companies to increase their margins, and luxury properties are a good way to do that. And I ignorantly presume that the biggest piece of the safari travel pie is the first-time Africa goer. As I said, this trepidatious market (I included myself in it when planning that first trip) was to feel safe and, these days, pampered. Among Americans at least, they work very hard, get little time off, and want to get the most out of their vacations. In a booming (well, until a few days ago!) economy where there is money to spend, this is to be expected.
Napamatt, I share your world view cynicism. But I do generally hope that my dollars will somehow trickle down to the locals. When booking my first trip, I specifically asked for camps where the money wouldn't go straight back to the pockets of giant corporations, and that some community help was involved. I was told that I had only two choices: Wilderness or CCA. They are both big, they both spend lots of money marketing, but at least they appear to have some hand in the community. And CCA clearly is training and educating locals about wildlife as you rightly point out is imperative. (Though I fear, from what I saw, the younger generation is not too interested in this profession). As I learn more, perhaps I can make more intelligent choices, which is why I look forward to Pred's experiences.
Leslie
Pred, I didn't for a minute think you (or you pixel) are against safari-goers looking for comfort. I believe the world has gotten over luxury-ized and would far prefer modest comforts and the best wildlife viewing and guiding in interesting surroundings. I look forward to bucket showers in the Kalahari in November (admittedly at Jack's Camp, the fanciest of the options) And, as napamatt suggests, the pendulum may swing the other way if enough tourists want it to. It's partly about what the market will bear, and partly about profit taking. I'm not educated enough about the business aspects of safari companies to know how much of a stake the stock market has in these places, but I'd bet it's growing. If that's true the pressures will be on companies to increase their margins, and luxury properties are a good way to do that. And I ignorantly presume that the biggest piece of the safari travel pie is the first-time Africa goer. As I said, this trepidatious market (I included myself in it when planning that first trip) was to feel safe and, these days, pampered. Among Americans at least, they work very hard, get little time off, and want to get the most out of their vacations. In a booming (well, until a few days ago!) economy where there is money to spend, this is to be expected.
Napamatt, I share your world view cynicism. But I do generally hope that my dollars will somehow trickle down to the locals. When booking my first trip, I specifically asked for camps where the money wouldn't go straight back to the pockets of giant corporations, and that some community help was involved. I was told that I had only two choices: Wilderness or CCA. They are both big, they both spend lots of money marketing, but at least they appear to have some hand in the community. And CCA clearly is training and educating locals about wildlife as you rightly point out is imperative. (Though I fear, from what I saw, the younger generation is not too interested in this profession). As I learn more, perhaps I can make more intelligent choices, which is why I look forward to Pred's experiences.
Leslie
