Imelda,
My itinerary is FAR from comprehensive! I started out with a much more ambitious itinerary but decided to concentrate mostly on the areas to the south. Will save the rest for another trip. We're driving ourselves throughout, no internal flights involved.

If you're mainly interested in Okonjima and Etosha, that would be north of Windhoek, traveling in a totally different direction than my itinerary. If you look at a map of Namibia, you'll see that the places which are most popular with visitors (Etosha, Damaraland, Swakopmund, Sossusvlei) fan out in all different directions from Windhoek which makes for very long drives if you want to hit all of them on a short trip unless you fly.

We've decided to see a smaller area of the country and return to visit others if we like our first trip.

Preditor, you really are a mine of information!!! To be quite honest I don't really know very much about the effect of baiting on wildlife, mainly I suppose because I haven't 'met' with it in the past. While I adore seeing different species, there is NO WAY I want to put any of those animals at risk or in any discomfort just for my pleasure and I think you know that I stress greatly about animals being in any discomfort, so please tell me more about baiting (I have searched on the web but somehow am not coming up with relevant websites).

Patty, I should have read your last post more closely ... sorry, it was the link that made me think (incorrectly) that you had charters. I suppose what I meant by comprehensive is that you were covering a lot of different camps with different attractions - I love the look of Stiltz by the way AND Erongo Wilderness (but that would be a definate non-runner with hubby).

Anyways, Namibia may or may not be a non-runner yet .... I just got an e-mail from Kirsty in Cardboard Box and the news on Etosha isn't great. Here it is :

<font color="green">Dear Imelda,

Thank you for your patience with me. I would like to advise that Etosha National Park is a malaria risk but the highest malaria area is the Caprivi.

Thus you would definitely need to avoid this area. I mostly do not advise people to take malaria prophylactics due to the fact that one can still get malaria when they are on the pills and this just masks the symptoms.

In all honesty, Namibians never take malaria medication. The time that one would be at the highest risk is when there is a lot of water lying around and this is only during rain season. Our rain season is November to the beginning of April. By July and August it is in the middle of Winter and I really do not believe you should be at all concerned.

Obviously, there are certain precautions that you can take in that you can use mosquito nets, put mosquito sprays on and in the evenings wear long sleeves and trousers.

I do believe that you will be missing out on an incredible area if you do not go to Etosha.

As to travelling around Namibia - flying is an expensive option. You would be looking at no less than N$2500.00 per flight per person. While flying is a great in that it is incredibly fast but it is a beautiful country and driving around the country is also fantastic. You can always look at distances between lodges being no more than 4 hours rive. However, if this is not of interest then I will most definitely with pleasure quote a flying safari.

I look forward to hearing from you!

Thank you again,

Kirsty </font>

Now I'm not sure what to do. Would it still be worth doing just the southern part of Namibia OR Namibia plus Madikwe OR just South Africa OR would it be better to opt for something not within Africa??
I suppose what I'm thinking is that we won't see enough game if we don't see Etosha and I definately don't want Deck to get bored. Also, I suppose I'm thinking that South Africa has a better medical set up than Namibia (going on what I've read) but then again if we stayed in Southern Namibia it would be easier to get to a SA hospital if required. The other thing I'm thinking is, should we just wait until we can travel to say Etosha, Sabi Sands etc in a few years time .... I really am stuck now and need advice ... all things taken into consideration (ie the possibility of being pregnant, it being our last safari for a while, missing out on Etosha, medical facilities), if it were you, what would you do?

Again, sorry if I'm boring everyone with the 'same' questions with a different slant but you know when it comes to me planning I obsess a little.

Imelda

Imelda: since you are asking, I can somewhat put myself in your place as Mrs. PB and I are currently expecting and it kind of snuck up on us before we decided 'officially' to try. We have since said if we knew it was going to happen that easily (figured it would take a while) we both would have liked to have pulled off another big trip or two first since it will likely be a while before we go international again -- thus I would say definitely book a trip and go!

Namibia without Etosha is still wonderful with lots to see and do but I agree that your game sightings will be limited and that you should combine it with Madikwe for 4 days or so at the end to see the diversity of species that you are used to from safaris. I do believe that Etosha at the right time of year has nearly no malaria risk but it's not worth having to worry about. If you are pregnant you will want to be able to relax and enjoy, not be stressed about malaria so I'd skip Etosha (sad to say). You will be in quick reach of good medical care with a Namibia/Madikwe itinerary too, with the use of planes you are never very far from Joburg -- just make sure you get the medical evacuation coverage on your travel insurance. I think you will be very glad to get one last trip in.

As for the baiting that you asked about the quick answer is the catch phrase &quot;a fed animal is a dead animal&quot;. It's bad to have animals develop a dependency on human handouts for a number of reasons, most of which has to do with animals becoming habituated with people and that leads to trouble as they get into peoples things/or even dangerous contact with people and end up eliminated. Sometimes it leads to artificially high densities of the animals which can have all kinds of ecological impacts and some animals may lose the ability to survive on their own. That is a very quick run down on the topic. There is a big thread involving baiting leopards in east Africa that was floating around a couple months ago and has lots of good discussion but I don't know what its called. It's very ironic that Okonjima/AfriCat's specialty is removing cats from conflict with humans/livestock but then they have a tourist activity that draws other species into the proximity of humans. I would guess the animals being fed are fat and happy and no obvious suffering, the issues will come when they stop being fed or perhaps in the population dynamics that go unseen. I don't know that much about the organization and I do know that working with ranchers regarding predator issues is tough, impotant work so I don't want to torpedo anyone from staying there but thought it merited mention since you have concerns with wildlife treatment that you already voiced. I was torn as the honey badger is the African species I most want to see (that I haven't yet seen) and I talked to friends who saw 9 of them at the feeding station but I have decided I'd rather experience one in a natural setting whenever that may come.

Preditor, let me first say CONGRATULATIONS to you amd Mrs. PB !!!
Secondly, it's great to get a perspective from someone who is in my soon to be (hopefully) situation. While I would just LOVE to do Etosha, like you said, there is no way I would be able to relax as I'm a natural born worrier at the best of times ... however, SA AND Namibia sounds like it might just still be on the cards. AND hubby could sneak in his couple of nights in Sun City (again!). Now for one more question (just to be 100% on my decision :) ) - IF (and it's a big if now ;) ), you and Mrs. PB weren't expecting yet AND you hadn't yet visited Namibia AND you were trying to start a family, would you go ahead and book SA and Namibia or would you opt to stay closer to home (say for example bear watching or some other 'animal based' holiday ;) )??? I know it's a decision only we can make but I just need one more little nudge in the right direction (whatever that is) .... hope you don't mind me asking?!
Also, thanks for the insight on the wild animal feeding. I had read a little before about the leopard baiting on the thread you mentioned but hadn't followed it that closely. I was / am of the opinion that wild cat baiting isn't a good thing due to the habituation factor andthe unpredictability of the situation but when it came to honey badgers (an animal I too would LOVE to see as well as our obsession with seeing leopard) I wasn't too sure on the ethics of it and certainly had not thought of the effect on the ecology due to artificially high numbers. I still would LOVE to see those leopards and cheetahs ... it's such a pity Africat haven't just kept it to saving those beautiful cats and them being the tourist attraction as to me that really is a HUGE attraction in itself. I guess I will have to think very seriously about it but I certainly don't want to participate in anything that will be harmful in the long run ... guess I already know the answer I'm swaying towards ...

Again, Preditor, a BIG thank you for helping answer some of my never ending questions - hopefully we will be able to come to a decision very soon.

Imelda

Imelda: thanks for the congrats! Our travel situations are a little different because of your location in Ireland. For us I think we would definitely have done Namibia/S.A. because with the long flight from the U.S. and wanting to cover a lot of ground there you need more time for the trip. Polar bears and Alaska trips are high on my lists for things to do but since they are so much closer for us I think we can do them as shorter trips making them easier to do in a couple years when our kid can stay with the grandparents or they are easier to do with bringing a kid too. From Ireland I don't know since you have long flights either way, although the polar bear viewing I want to do is Svalbard Island off of Norway which could be easier for you than coming to Manitoba. You can't go wrong either way but I think you need more time for African travel so I'd go that route. It will be easy to bring your kid on a North America trip with you in the future, cheaper lodging, easy to feed them if they are picky, no shots or meds required, a big mix of activities. Africa can be done but more challenging and you might want to wait until your kid(s) are older.

BTW, I have a 12 year old and the last two summers we have done ecotrips, Vancouver Island orcas and grizzlies first and then whale watching in eastern Canada and sea kayaking. Over this last holiday we drove over the Grand Canyon and explored Utah's rock formations on horseback so you can be having fun and adventure with your kid after a few years. In her early years we mostly did drives to find wildife in our Western parks and camped. Some people may choose to stop exploring but there is no reason you have to stop. Luckily my daughter is into wildlife, currently wants to be a marine mammal biologist as well as a Disney Imagineer.

Plus, if Deck can be swayed by Sun City for an Africa trip you will have no worries getting him to come to North America when you want to. Just dangle Vegas as your bait -- wish I knew how to do that winky symbol.

here you go, PB :S-

you can find them here http://www.fodors.com/forums/smileys/

Ha ha, Pred, Deck has already discovered Vegas ... we've been there twice in the past 3-4 years!!! .. he snuck one visit in as an add on to our Alaskan cruise in 2005 (we missed the Orcas by the way :( so we'll HAVE to do Alaska again :D !). And there'll DEFINATELY be no problem getting him back to Vegas so all I have to do is say we're going to X, Y or Z AND Vegas ;)

I like your perspective on Africa versus the bears - you have done a very good job of helping me make up my mind and believe me that's no mean feat! I'm going to have to look into Norway for another trip now too - is it like in Churchill where the bears congregate for the freeze? It certainly would be MUCH easier to get there than Manitoba.
Your trips with your daughter sound like great fun (- I hope our future kids are as in to animals as we are - would make life much simpler ...) I like her career ideas too - Mammal Biologist AND Disney Imagineer :)

Pred, again, Thank You!

Imelda

Imelda: I'm very glad I could help, with no upcoming trip for myself the best thing I can do is help others find paradise:S-

Hopefully Deck has better luck in Vegas %%- than I do! On one trip I think I paid for one of the leather couches in the Bellagio Sports Book. Don't forget to include Colorado on one of your future trips, I'll guide you around and we are very &quot;kid friendly&quot;.

Big thanks to Sundowner for letting me know how to use emotioncons:-d

Cheers to Imelda and Deck with a new trip and family((D)) and to Sundowner for my education((b))

Preditor,
I think Deck paid for one of those beautiful chandeliers (sp?) in the Bellagio foyer :D !! Between you both we could have a private lounge!

Going on some of your 'office' wildlife shots (thread a while back), Colorado looks fab - would love to get a chance to meet up and see some more of the states :)


Now one more question - should I start a new thread on Namibia or just continue here? ... need to get those locations and camps sorted, not to mention to decide when exactly to go!

Imelda

Congrats, Pred!

Imelda,
Glad to hear you decided to go for it. Please make sure your trip report is finished before I leave ;)

Thanks Patty!

Imelda: I'll be happy to show you around the 'office' when the time comes.

You should probably start a new thread with Namibia in the title to draw out those with an interest in that area and get focused on your details.

Oh Patty, I still haven't posted the photos from my last trip so I'm not sure what the chances of having my trip report up before you go :)

Pred, you might just regret that offer one day ... would LOVE to experience some of the wildlife that you have!

Thanks everyone for helping me decide on Namibia, I'm going to start a brand new thread to try and figure out an itinerary and of course all advice will be greatly appreciated ;)

Imelda