1st timers-Kenya & Tanzanic
 

Have been reading the forum and everyone's suggestions and must admit I am a little...no a lot overwhelmed. What we are looking at right now is:
Day 1 - Vancouver to London
Day 2 - London
Day 3 - London
Day 4 - London
Day 5 - Nairobi Naiobi Serena Hotel
Day 6 & 7- Samburu - Samburu Serena Lodge
Day 8 - Mount Kenya - Mountain Lodge
Day 9 - Lake Nakuru - Flaming Hill Camp
Day 10 & 11 - Masai Mara - Mara Serena Lodge or Siana Springs Camp
Day 12 - Nairobi - Serena Hotel
Day 13 - Lake Manyara - Lake Manyara Serena Lodge
Day 14 & 15 - Serengeti - Serengeti Serena Lodge or Kirawira or Mbuzi Mawe
Day 16 & 17 Ngorongoro - Ngorongoro Serena Lodge
Day 18 Arusha and home from Nairobi
Would really appreciate your thoughts

What time of year are you travelling? Robin

We are looking at travelling the end of September beginning to end of October 2010.

It appears you have plans for London up front.

To evaluate your itinerary, we need to know your goals for the trip.
-Most variety of animals?
-See the Wildebeest/Zebra Migration?
-Certain species you hope to see?
-Want to visit 2 countries--both Kenya and Tanzania?
-Don't mind missing views of Kilimanjaro?
-Want to see World Heritage site of Ngorongoro Crater?
-Is your preference to drive or fly or both?
-Are you looking at a private trip for just your party or is this a group trip?
-Would you like to included some tented camps? This itinerary has mostly lodges and could have all lodges if that's what you choose.

End of Sept-Oct, I would spend at least one more day up to several more days in the Maasai Mara. Given your 2 choices, I'd go with Mara Serena for location.

If you must fit your trip into the given time frame, you could take the days spent in the Mara away from the Serengeti. The land mass of the Serengeti in Tanzania and the Maasai Mara in Kenya are the same and the herds migrate between the 2 countries. Sept-Oct the herds are likely to be more in the Mara than Serengeti.

If you want to include the Serengeti, I believe you'd want to be in the Northern part at the time of year you are going. Kirawira is West so I wouldn't choose that. Serena amd Mbzui Mawe are pretty much Central, which is fine year-round due to the permanent water sources. But ideally, you would choose farther north where the herds may be returning from the Mara at a place like Lobo Lodge, Migration Camp, or Sayari Camp, to name just a few places. The problem with going so far north in the Serengeti is that it takes time to drive there and two nights might not be enough. Of course you could stop in Central Serengeti along the way, but that's adding even more days.

In Sept the Tanzanian park, Tarangire should be really good and it has lots of elephants, plus interesting baobab trees. Tarangire would be at its wildlife peak, while Manyara is not in Sept. But most itineraries spend 2 nts Tarangire because it is a bigger park than Manyara. Tarangire is also a little more out of the way than Manyara. You can enjoy the hippo pool and monkey action in Manyara any time of year.

Once we know what is most important to you and if you make a few tweaks, this should be a really nice trip. Very similar to my first trip, which got me hooked on Africa.

For late-Sep/early-Oct, the Migration is still in the Masai Mara in Kenya, though some of the herds might be heading back to Serengeti where the very north would be the place to visit. Bear in mind that with over a million animals they don't all move at the same time and even if some head south, the next day they can turn around back to the Mara... wildies are strange animals.

Whether in the Mara or Serengeti, both deserve at minimunm 3/nts (more if you can).
As you don't indicate, it seems this is a mostly driving safari and there are some very very long drives on many not very good road in there. See (#/hrs) below:

Day 5 - Nairobi Naiobi Serena Hotel
Day 6 & 7- Drive (6/hrs) NBO/Samburu - Samburu Serena Lodge
Day 8 - Drive (3/hrs) Mount Kenya - Mountain Lodge
Day 9 - Drive (3/hrs) Lake Nakuru - Flaming Hill Camp
Day 10 & 11 - Drive (5-6/hrs) Masai Mara - Mara Serena Lodge or Siana Springs Camp
Day 12 - Drive (5-6/hrs) to Nairobi - Serena Hotel - the reason you have o/n here is that you can't possibly drive to Manyara in 1/day... waste and not necessary. What you pay for o/n hotel you could fly to Tanzania (Kilimanjaro/JRO).
Day 13 - Drive from NBO (4.5/hrs) to border; drive (1.5/hrs) to Arusha; lunch ((1/hrs); drive (2.5/hrs) to Lake Manyara - Lake Manyara Serena Lodge
Day 14 & 15 - Drive (3.5-4/hrs) to Central Serengeti - Serengeti Serena Lodge (or Kirawira*) or Mbuzi Mawe
Day 16 & 17 Drive (4-5/hrs) to Ngorongoro - Ngorongoro Serena Lodge
Day 18 Drive (4.5/hrs) to Arusha; lunch (1/hr); drive (1.5/hrs) to border; drive (4.5-5/hrs) to NBO for homebound flight.

*Kirawira is in the West and not ideal for Sept.

Would suggest instead:
Day 5 - Morning sightseeing in NBO: Blixen Museum, Giraffe Manor, Sheldrick ellee orphanage; lunch; drive (2.5/hrs) to Mt. Kenya - o/n Serena Lodge
Day 6 - Drive (3/hrs) to Samburu - o/n Serena Ldg or Larsen's Camp
Day 7 - Samburu - o/n
Day 8 - Drive (3/hrs) to Ol Pejeta pvt conservancy - o/n Sweetwater's
Day 9 - Drive (3/hrs) to Lake Nakuru - o/n Lion Hill, Nakuru Lodge or Flamingo Hill Camp
Day 10 - Drive (5-6/hrs) to Masai Mara - o/n Serena or Keekorok or Simba Lodge or Sarova or Kichwa Tembo Camps
Days 11, 12 & 13 - Masai Mara
Day 14 - Transfer to airstrip for flight to NBO; connect to flight to Kilimanjaro; met and transfer to Arusha - o/n
Day 15 - Drive (2.5/hrs) to Manyara, game drive; drive (1/hr) to Karatu (an area of coffee plantations/farms) for lunch at Gibb's Farm; afternoon leisure or visiit elephant caves, trek the highlands, visit school/orphanage, spa - o/n Gibb's Farm
Day 16 - Drive (2.5/hrs) to Ngorongoro Crater; afternoon crater tour - o/n Serena or Sopa Lodge
Day 17 - Ngo - option: morning crater tour; afternoon leisure or crater rim walk - o/n
Day 18 - Drive (4.5/hrs) to Arusha; day-room here; evening transfer to JRO for homebound flight OR flight to NBO for homebound flight.

Obviously, I've omitted the Serengeti as unless you have the time to drive to the farthest north where most properties are in the lux category; or fly up to add to your costs, and when the majority of the herds are in the Mara... it's not "a must" to visit, or if you wish a stop in Serengeti not any farther than Central. This option would be (omitting Lk. Manyara):

Day 14 - Drive (4.5/hrs) to Ngorongoro Crater; afternoon crater tour - o/n Serena or Sopa
Day 15 - Ngo - option: morning crater tour; drive (45/min) via Oldupai Gorge w/stop; continue game drive (3+/hrs) to Central Serengeti - o/n Serena Lodge, Mbuzi Mawe or Medium Camps
Days 16 & 17 - Central Serengeti - o/n
Day 18 - Transfer to airstrip for flight to Arusha; day-room here; evening transfer to JRO for homebound flight OR flight to NBO for homebound flight.

Hope this helps.

Sandi,the only flight on this trip is on Day 12 from Nairobi to Arusha and then we drive to Lake Manyara. Would you recommend that we go mid October to the end of October instead of the beginning?? The trip that I have laid out is a package that I have found for $5363 not including airfare. The only tented camp they offer in the package is the Flamingo Camp. Atravelynn, we would like to see the Ngorongoro Crater and the Wildebeest Migration. Thanks to you both for taking the time to answer me.

The problem with most packages is that they try to include too many locations given the amount of time with lots of long drives. I would suggest coming up with an alternative itinerary and emailing some of the recommended tour operators here for quotes. If there are at least 2 of your traveling, the cost of a private, custom itinerary may not necessarily be more.

If you're looking at the end of Sep to end of Oct and interested in the migration, I'd go as early as possible during that time frame and specifically to the Masai Mara (spend at least 3 nights here, 4 would be better). Skip the Serengeti as it's too much travel time but you can still include Ngorongoro and Tarangire and/or Manyara in Tanzania. That would free up the days you need in the Mara and you'd spend much less time traveling from location to location.

Go earlier in Oct. And, try to get in the extra time in the Mara. Also, consider asking tour operator with whom currently working or others (many can be found on this site or LyndaS' "New East African Trip Report Index" for some permanent tent camp options. These don't all necessarily have to cost more than lodges. That's not taking away from the Serena properties which are nice, but tend to be larger. Besides, there's nothing more "truly safari" than sleeping under canvas and perfectly safe.

You've got a set itinerary and price to fall back on. Despite the shortcomings we all mentioned, if you went, you'd come back raving about the wonderful trip you had.

To be fair to yourselves and make sure you are getting the most bang for your buck, email some of Sandi's examples (or tweak them to include more of what you want) to several Africa specialists* and see what a private trip would cost.

Can't hurt, every interaction with those in the know teaches you something so you'll learn more, and you can go on your trip knowing you have the best deal.

*I'll list some later or others can. Gotta go now.

*
Africa Adventure Company in Ft. Lauderdale
Africa Serendipity in NYC
Eastern & Southern Safaris in Kenya
Go2Africa in South Africa
Good Earth in Tampa and Tanzania
Kiliwarriors in Tanzania and Virginia
Premier Tours in Philadelphia
Roy's in Tanzania

These are some that have been used with success by those on the forum. There are many more.

hi,

we just came from a 6 day safaris in Kenya and a 5 days safari in Tanzania, after a lot of consultaion and recommendations on the internet we finally settled on steenbok safaris, i am very proud saying that the company lived up to the recommendations, our safari was organized by George( he is the owner) he personally met us at the airport and the safari was very exciting with Isaac the guide showing a lot of knowledge in his work we saw all the big five and the lions climbing trees, after our Tanzania trip we were given a private transfer from Arusha to Nairobi as a complimentary for our flight back home....the journey back was very interesting, George sent one of his staff named paris with the driver to make sure that we had a good time. we want to come back especially in kenya to experience and visit the other parks that paris suggested even though we have already been to masai mara it is still our number one park and we will include that to her list, and my husband wants to climb kilimanjaro too. i would recommend you contact, there email address is [email protected].

<b>kDamico</b>
OK we've understood!! - no need to copy and paste that message over and over again...
we prefer a dialogue type of conversation that cannot be seen as an aggressive advertisement
thanks
aby
P.S. thre's no Steenbok in the wild in either Kenya or Tanzania

lizann

i agree with the other ladies' suggestion about dropping serengeti in favour of more days at the Mara
You've been quoted a Serena-based itinerary; in serengeti their properties are not in best location for your timing, In Mara it is perfect
assuming this is a very good deal, it'd either staying with it
(& in Serengeti forgetting about the migration and concentrating on other things (e.g. leopard hunting in Seronera area...)
Or, look for a deal in Kenya alone, then buying a shorter tour in TZ which ends at Ngorongoro - it may be close in price

i meant leopard-"hunting"

another point:
your itinerary is indeed a "squeezed" one. most fodorites on a private tour stay longer at fewer parks. since, i personally, have done numerous tours at such a squeezed pace, i can say it is doable, though it is intensive with relatively lots of time spent travelling <u>on the way </u> to attractions

lifesavernumberone - is constantly touting villlagelifesafari in every one of his posting. If he read the Fodor's Rules/Regs he'd know this is not permitted.

I have emailed off your itinerary that you suggested Sandi. I was wondering if we should perhaps be flying in one more spot on our trip. Also, it has been recommended that we see Tarangire instead of Lake Manyara. Thoughts anyone.
I would like to thank each and every one of you for helping to make our trip very special. It's our 10th anniversary present to ourselves.

The reason I omitted Tarangire (an "elephant" park) is that you've already visited at Samburu (another "elephant" stop). Of course, if you wish to replace Manyara with Tarangire, this should be at minimum 2/nts, but you can do 1/nt and then next morning, continuing onto Ngorongoro late-morning. But having carter tour next morning as you arrive the crater too late for a full 6/hrs that day. Realize that the drive from Tarangire to Ngorongoro will be at minimum an additional hour than if from Manyara.

There are so many "variations on a theme" - why not wait for the info from agent/price and then you can tweak from that starting point.

Following is the itinerary I received from Eastern and Southern Safaris Ltd. Could I please get thoughts on this trip?
Day 1: Arrive Nairobi
Sarova Stanley Hotel

Day 2: Nairobi site seeing/Mt. Kenya
Serena Mountain Lodge (tree hotel)

Day 3: Larsens Tented Camp

Day 4: Samburu
Larsens Tented Camp.

Day 5: Samburu/Sweetwaters Game Sanctuary

Day 6:Flamingo Hill Tented Camp

Day 7: Lake Nakuru/Maasai Mara
Sarova Mara Tented Camp

Day 8, 9 & 10: Maasai Mara
Sarova Mara Tented Camp.

Day 11: Fly Nairobi-Kilimanjaro/Tarangire
Another early morning game drive in Maasai Mara at 06:30hrs, returning to the camp for late breakfast. Then transfer to the airstrip for scheduled flight to Nairobi departing approx 10:15hrs and arriving approx 11:45hrs where you will connect to scheduled flight to Kilimanjaro departing at 12:45hrs and arriving at 13:35hrs.
You will be met by our agent and transfer to Arusha for lunch, then drive on to Tarangire National Park with game viewing en route to Tarangire Sopa Lodge for dinner and overnight.

Day 12: Tarangire/Karatu
Gibb's Farm

Day 13: Karatu/Ngorongoro
Ngorongoro Serena Lodge.

Day 14: Ngorongoro
Ngorongoro Serena Lodge.

Day 15: Ngorongoro-Lake Manyara/Arusha
Depart the lodge after breakfast and drive to Lake Manyara National Park for game viewing, departing at the time of your choice to Arusha for an optional day room or transfer to the airport for your homebound flight. End of our services.
Approx transit time to Lake Manyara: 4½ hrs
I think that I have pretty much followed your suggested itinerary Sandi.
Also has anyone used this company and what is your feedback on it.
Thanks again, Liz

Comment re: Day 11
- you won't arrive JRO till 1:35pm, then Immigration, Baggage Claim and drive (45/min-1/hr) to Arusha for lunch (approx 1/hr) = about 4pm.
- it's a 2/hr drive to Tarangire, arriving at dusk with game drive direct to lodge for o/n.
Then on day 12, game drive out of park to Karatu.

Suggest you consider, instead to o/n in Arusha (will be less expensive than stay at a Nat'l park with lodge and park fee); then on Day 12, drive (2.5-3/hrs) out towards Karatu, stop at Mto-wa-Mbu village (outside of Manyara) and/or maybe a school/orphange onto Karatu; balance of day and o/n at Gibb's.

At Samburu, staying at Larsen's is a great option, but with the recent flooding and damage to this camp and others along the river, who knows when the repairs will be completed. Hopefully in time for the season opening as June, but it might be later and maybe not till 2011. Consider an alternative at a property not damaged. Or get advise from S&E status of repairs and keep on top of that. It's a difficult time for all concerned with the recent force of nature!

You can still consider Amboseli as your "elephant" experience (Serena or Ol Tukai Lodges), or use Tarangire in Tanzania for this, but for 2/nts. minimum (Kikoti or Tarangire River Camps, would be good here).

Here's the thread on the Samburu flooding in case you haven't seen it http://www.fodors.com/community/afri...in-samburu.cfm

All of the lodges and camps along the Ewaso Ngiro river were damaged. Hopefully the damage will be repaired by September but it's something to keep an eye on. I would try to keep Larsens as it's a nice camp but if you want to sure thing, the Sopa (on a hill away from the river) is a sure thing.

I would see if the Serena is available in the Mara. While the Sarova is a tented camp, it's a very large one so probably not that different from a lodge in atmosphere and the Serena is in a better location for that time of year.

I might also choose the Sopa at Ngorongoro for its own access road into the crater. How many crater descents are you planning? If you're only doing one, I might stay another night in Tarangire since you'd be arriving fairy late on Day 11 and skip Gibb's Farm but if you're planning to do 2 descents (Day 13 and Day 14), it may be better for you to spend the evening of Day 12 in Karatu.

I've used Eastern & Southern many times and have been happy with their services.

Good luck with your planning!