Planning Rim2Rim Hike at Grand Canyon

Old Jul 25th, 2016, 06:16 AM
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Planning Rim2Rim Hike at Grand Canyon

Our family (myself, wife, 2 kids ages 16 and 13) are planning a Rim2Rim starting at North Rim on Aug 25 over 4 days. Given the very high heat, we plan to hike ~7-8 miles in early morn, then get to our destination, set up camp, rest, and do some short walks around the area. We are all fit and active, and the kids are used to long mountain hikes, although in fairness, not in this sort of heat. We are in no rush and want to enjoy this at a relatively leisurely pace.

Our Itinerary is as follows:
- Aug 25: hike from North Rim to Cottonwoods Campground. Then visit Ribbon Falls
- Aug 26: Cottonwoods to Bright Angel CG. Lunch at Phantom Ranch. Short walk on Clear Creek Trail to Tonto Platform. Ranger program at Bright Angel CG.
- Aug 27: Bright Angel CG to Indian Garden CG. Walk to Plateau Point for sunset
- Aug 28: Indian Garden CG up to South Rim

A few questions:
1. We are planning to start by ~5am each morn and reach our destination by 10am. Is this early enough, or should we be looking to start even earlier? The two days where I am thinking earlier might be necessary are Day 2 (when we will across the Canyon through the Box) and Day 4 (when we are hiking up Bright Angel Trail).

2. We are taking 2 tents - I know many folks do not, but given we are camping at the North Rim the night before we start, we don't really have a choice. We have purchased 2 fairly light tents (around 4-5lb each). And a bunch of other hiking accessories like Camelbak Water bladders, pocket stove, collapsible vessels, etc. Aim is to keep each backpack to 20lb max. Does that sound reasonable?

3. Aside from the side trips above (Ribbon Falls, Clear Creek Trail, Plateau Point) and dipping in the Creek, are there any other things we can look to do while in the Canyon? e.g. other small hikes, activities, etc.

4. We are not staying at the Phantom Ranch, but I am assuming we can buy lunch at the cafeteria - is that correct? Do we need a reservation?

5. I expect to take a lot of video in this "trip of a lifetime". I have a couple of spare batteries for my camcorder, but do you think we could recharge at the Phantom Ranch? We are not staying there, but (say) do you think the Front desk could help us if we left our camcorder and charger with them while we have lunch there (subject to [4] above)?

6. Anything else we should be aware of?
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Old Jul 25th, 2016, 06:55 AM
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Sounds like a good plan. Not sure you need all 4 days, but if you have the time great.

Do you already have camping permits?

20lbs sounds light - good. you don't need a lot of gear, and you can always rinse out clothes in the river at PR. Have you included water & food in that weight? You'll want to plan on 2-3L water per person for each leg.

Camcorder. I would not carry that. A small point & shoot weighing only a few ounces can take reasonable videos - Get one with 2AA batteries and carry a few more spares. I would not count on being able to charge a camcorder battery.

For hikes at the river/phantom ranch area, make sure you add in a loop that goes over both foot bridges.

5am start sounds like a nice plan on paper - not sure it is realistic or even needed. An hour or 2 later and you'll still be fine. The climb out will be harder, but the heat gets less as you ascend too.

Wish i could go - rim to rim is on my bucket list.
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Old Jul 25th, 2016, 10:37 AM
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1) I think 6 am would be fine on Day 1 and 4. After Day 1, evaluate the forecasted temps and factor in how your group did on day 1 to determine a start time for day 2. Do the same for day 3. The Box is supposed to be hellish if you don't get through before it really heats up so I would make sure you get that done early. Likewise, you have a 2 mile hike in sand along the river to start with on day 3. Get that done sooner rather than later. It would not be fun to do it in full sun/heat with the hike up to Indian Gardens still to come.

Day 4 - I wouldn't worry about start time so much. You aren't in full sun the whole way, the temps drop as you go up, and there are good places to stop and rest along the way (with water).

2) 20 lbs. seems light unless you are not factoring in food/water. Generally a gallon of water per person per day, so that adds 8 lbs (unless you are comfortable taking water filters and filling up as you go).

3) Phantom Canyon is a small slot canyon a mile (?) or so from Phantom Ranch. I would do Clear Creek trail in the evening and just relax after lunch. Maybe check out the Tonto Trail once you are at Indian Gardens (assuming the temps are reasonable).

4) You need breakfast/dinner reservations at Phantom Ranch. They do have sack lunches for sale.
http://www.grandcanyonlodges.com/din...ranch-canteen/

5) I 'think' there are electric outlets in the campground bathrooms as well. Use them at your own risk. I wouldn't spend a lot of time on video (afterall, much of the time you are surrounded by canyon walls so your view is fairly restricted).

6) Spend some time reading as much as you can on this website, there's a lot of good info there.
http://www.hitthetrail.com/
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Old Jul 25th, 2016, 03:39 PM
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The temps in the places you are going can be extraordinary. Be sure you understand the need to always be hydrated - and how much water that is in these circumstances.

Also be sure you can recognize the early signs of heat sickness, never mind heat stroke. It can happen quickly and you need to focus on avoiding it.
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Old Jul 26th, 2016, 06:57 AM
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Thanks for all the very helpful responses. Yes 20lb (or 80lb between the 4 of us) is aspirational - we will have to do some hard arithmetic over the next few days to figure whether it is truly realistic.

Do you think we need a tent down in the canyon? We definitely need for our nights camping at the North Rim and South Rim, but wondering if we can do without at the 3 campgrounds? What are your thoughts?
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Old Jul 26th, 2016, 07:26 AM
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There are people who don't use a tent in the Grand Canyon. Just roll out a sleeping pad/mat - you don't even need a sleeping bag at those temps.

It all depends on your comfort level with being that exposed to the elements and critters. I would not be comfortable without a tent wall between me and the insects/reptiles. And rodents....
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Old Jul 26th, 2016, 07:57 AM
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Hi, I did this trip two years ago, including all the excursions you mentioned: Ribbon Falls, Clear Creek Trail, Plateau Point. All were fantastic. Your plan is solid.

But this was October and weather was cooler plus we spent two nights at Bright Angel Campground so had more time to enjoy down there.

You've been given great advice above. I'll add my $0.02: the Clear Creek and Plateau Point trails are mostly in full sun as I recall, so late afternoon / early evening is definitely the time to hike these.

Ditto on leaving the camcorder behind and using the video on your camera. I would not count on getting batteries charged anywhere. You just have to carry enough, plus an extra few. A sad fact of backpacking with electronics.

It would would really suck if a battery decides to up and die on you. I carry some extra cards for the same reason - I did have a card stop working while hiking around Mount Rainier. I had extras.

You can buy beverages at Phantom Ranch in the afternoon before dinner, no reservations needed.

You should have the tent at all camps. After all, it could rain!

We saw a great ranger programs at both Phantom Ranch and Indian Gardens. At Phantom teh ranger wound up at our tent and spent a long time talking about the Kolb brothers. Fascinating stuff.

There are many excellent Grand Canyon books to read before / during your trip. I carried this one with me and thought it was superb:
https://www.amazon.com/Emerald-Mile-...dp/1439159866/

I have some photos here:
http://nelsonchenkin.zenfolio.com/p474373362

Have a great trip!
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Old Jul 26th, 2016, 11:28 AM
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Count on drinking a quart of water per person per hour. Bring an electrolyte or salt mix--you will sweat so much. Wear a cotton t shirt, Dip it in the stream, wear it and as it dries, it will cool you. I left Phantom Ranch at 5:30 am to hike out Bright Angel in April. I sure as heck would be leaving that early in August!!! The issue with August is that it is monsoon season, so it can rain. Otherwise, I wouldn't bring a tent. I think your tents are too heavy--you can rent tents that are only 2 lbs. Keep your tent zipped and don't unroll your sleeping bag until you get in it. Scorpions like to hide in them.

You can absolutely get your backpack down to 20 pounds. You are only going for 4 days. Bring freeze dried food. Make reservations to eat your meals at Phantom Ranch. You just need one change of undies and socks. Bring a pair of running shorts and a t shirt to change into at camp. Otherwise, you can rinse out everything and it will dry instantly. Or just wear dirty stuff for a few days--not an issue.
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Old Jul 26th, 2016, 09:00 PM
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The best question was asked by J62

DO you have permits?????????????????

People have died on this trail from heat exhaustion. Memorize the symptoms as the victim is usually not aware. Monitor each other constantly.

Google Rim to Rim for more advice.

Bottom Canyon heat is equivalent to Phoenix, Az

Stantonhyde is right, especially at Phantom Ranch. Small scorpions are the devil and they are everywhere. If interested, bring a UV light. All scorpions glow at night. I saw dozens of them down there.

Vaga

PS Mules have the right of way. Besides, they are bigger.
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Old Jul 27th, 2016, 04:11 AM
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I've done Rim to Rim to Rim twice in the past three years.
Once in June, once last October.

The heat is BRUTAL. Well over 100 F at the bottom, and in the 90's on the Rim. At night it 'cools' to the upper 80's. I remember seeing the thermometer at Phantom Ranch show 98 at 7 pm.

I can't imagine 4 days in that heat. It really limits daytime activities. Our activity at Oak Creek was sitting for hours in the creek.

It is beautiful; but you may want to be flexible in leaving the canyon earlier if the heat becomes unbearable.
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Old Jul 27th, 2016, 04:13 AM
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I'm sorry - I meant Cottonwoods campground, not Oak Creek
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Old Jul 27th, 2016, 12:47 PM
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>>You just need one change of undies and socks.
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Old Jul 31st, 2016, 07:08 AM
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Your planning to hike around 7 miles each day for 4 days in Arizona in August in high heat?

Why?
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Old Aug 1st, 2016, 07:57 AM
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To me this trip needs no justification. The Grand Canyon, and I mean IN the canyon, not standing at the rim looking at the big hole in the ground, is one of the few truly magical places I've ever been.

If they were planning a 1 day rim-to-rim hike (which is my idea of fun, btw, travel fast and light) I'd question doing that in August. But 4 days to cover 22miles while tough, is ok in my book.

By the way, you can see the entire hike on google maps, street level view. I suspect you can also find it in on youtube.
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Old Aug 2nd, 2016, 01:39 PM
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Sounds like a great trip. I have hiked to Phantom Ranch 3 times, one of which was R2R. I also worked (volunteered) for about 5 summers as a PSAR ranger.

I took my then 15 yo niece. We left the N rim at 5:15am and arrived at Phantom at 11:30 am. We carried 2 litres of H2O to Supai, 2 to Cottonwood and 4 from Cottonwood to Phantom. It is quite cool at the N rim in the am so you won't need to carry much water at first (do hydrate early). You can look up the distances and water availability here:

https://www.nps.gov/grca/planyourvis...-distances.htm

As noted above, you will need permits to camp at all 3 campsites. Also, you cannot actually buy lunch at Phantom. They only serve breakfast and dinner. You can get a sack lunch if you order it (way) ahead of time, but it is picked up in the morning for the hike out. They do have snacks and drinks available, so that might have to suffice for your lunch that day.

We left Phantom at 5:30 and were at Indian Garden at
about 7:30. left there about 8 and were done about 11:30- 12noon.

The places you need to beat the heat so to speak are the "box" on the North side, Devils corkscrew on the south, it is between the river rest house and Indian Garden, it does not get real hot there til after about 10 am or so and is REALLY hot in the afternoon. You will also want to leave IG by about 8 am. It stays cool enough fopr you to be safe if you leave by then as long as you can make about 1 mph pace. That doesn't seem too hard, but it is all uphill.

Hope this helps some and have a great time, I loved hiking to Phantom Ranch.
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