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Do you have suggestions on my first roadtrip South-West USA?

Do you have suggestions on my first roadtrip South-West USA?

Old Jun 20th, 2016, 05:32 AM
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Do you have suggestions on my first roadtrip South-West USA?

Dear Forum Users,
Next year I’m planning a trip to the Southwest of the Unites States.
I have already mapped out an itinerary but since I’ve never been to the States I could really use some help/tips. I would really appreciate it if you could tell me if this itinerary is doable or not at all. Suggestions would be a great help. Thanks a lot!!!

Type of trip:
-It’s our first time to the USA.
-We prefer nature over the city.
-We are fit but we are not used to hiking a lot.
-I also suffer from mild fear of heights. Because of that we are not planning on doing strenuous hikes.
-I do realize that the pace of this itinerary is pretty high (we are quite good at getting up early .
-We hope to have a good taste of the West in order to decide which places to come back to in order to experience them in detail.
-We only have 21 days to do this trip in.
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Day 0: flight from Europe to NYC

Day 1: morning flight NYC-PHX, get rental car, drive from PHX to Grand Canyon Village, stay in GC Village

Day 2: day in Grand Canyon NP: hiking Bright Angel trail or ? , stay in GC Village

Day3: drive to Page, guided walk Antelope Canyon, Marble Canyon (The Wave), horseshoe bend, a little boat trip on the Colorado River, stay in Page

Day 4: drive to Monument Valley, visit to Navajo National Monument + Monument Valley, stay in Monticello

Day 5: drive to The Needles Overlook Point, drive to Moab, horseback riding in Castle Valley, stay in Moab

Day 6: drive along scenic byway 128, drive to Island in the Sky (Green River and Grand river Overlook + hiking?) + visit Dead horse point state park, stay in Moab

Day 7: drive to Capitol reef NP(Fruita, Gifford Homestead, scenic drive, hiking?), stay around Capitol Reef

Day 8: drive to Bryce Canyon NP(viewpoints, hiking?, sunset) + horseback riding near Bryce, stay in Hatch

Day 9: drive to Zion NP (Weeping Rock Trail, Emerald pools trail, Riverside Walk)
+ after sunset: drive to Las Vegas, stay in LV

Day 10: day in Las Vegas, stay in LV

Day 11: drive from Las Vegas to Death Valley + visit Death Valley NP, stay in Amargosa Valley

Day 12: sunrise in Death Valley + drive to Bodie + drive to Yosemite NP, stay in Yosemite NP

Day 13: day in Yosemite NP, stay in Yosemite NP

Day 14: drive to Jamestown (railroad), drive to Virginia City (we’re Bonanza fans), stay in Virginia City

Day 15: drive to Lake Tahoe, drive to San Francisco, stay in San Francisco

Day 16: visit San Francisco + evening: drive to Monterey, stay in Monterey

Day 17: coastal drive from Monterey to San Luis Obispo, visit a mission church, stay near SL Obispo

Day 18: coastal drive from San Luis Obispo to Los Angeles, stay in LA

Day 19: visit Los Angeles, stay in LA

Day 20: hand over the keys of the rental car + flight LAX-NYC
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 06:04 AM
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When is the trip? Makes a big difference.

I just skimmed your plan and will come back later -- but this bit jumped out at me >>Day 14: drive to Jamestown (railroad), drive to Virginia City (we’re Bonanza fans), stay in Virginia City
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 06:19 AM
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Here are a few of my thoughs:

Day 4 - Don't plan to stay in Monticello. You really want to stay either at The View (first choice) or Gouldings. MV is at its best at sunrise/sunset and staying at one of those places allows you to view it when it is the most beautiful. The View Hotel allows you to see the formations from the comfort of your own balcony - every room has a balcony with an incredible view (hence the name .

Day 8 - similar to my comments above, why stay in Hatch when you can stay either in the national park at the Bryce Lodge or immediately outside the park at the Ruby's properties. We have stayed at both and they are great for easy access to the park. The in park cabins allow you to walk to the rim in 2-3 minutes. You can't beat it. Since this trip is next year you should be able to get your top choices in lodging. Don't stay in Hatch.

Do you not have an overnight for Zion? Most people recommend 2-3 nights for Zion. You definitely need more time here. You seem to not even have one full day here.

1 full day in Yosemite is similarly very short and not enough time to get a real feel for the park.

Driving after dark is usually not advised.

When is this trip? If it is in the summer, expect more crowds and hot temperatures but longer days in which to see more. Also, if this is a summer trip you may want to eliminate Death Valley. In my opinion, you need to remove a couple of locations so that might be a good place to start depending on when you plan to visit. I would cut out some locations, reduce the amount of driving, and increase the amount of time at the places you really want to see.
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 06:36 AM
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Too much driving and one nighters. I think you need to pick and choose and pare down your itinerary.
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 07:27 AM
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When you plan to do this trip will have a great effect on what you can do as has been mentioned. Some locations will be difficult/impossible to get to in the winter too. If you are planning for this year, you need to get lodging asap.

This has the been/there/done that feel to it with little time to actually see/experience the areas, ok if that is your style .


Day 2: Walk along the rim trail, and see how well you handle GC before you go down Bright Angel

Day 4: I agree with db6040, visit Navajo National Monument on the way to Monument Valley, stay nearby either the View or Gouldings or if they are not available then in Kayenta or Mexican Hat.

Day 6: Moab needs more days. Visit Arches NP, much more spectacular then your other choices although I would spend a day doing them too.
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 08:02 AM
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You have obviously put a great deal of thought into your itinerary (something we don't see often). However, I believe you will have a better trip if you focus your attention on a few highlights and be serendipitous about what happens between them: Grand Canyon, Bryce, Zion, Death Valley, Yosemite, San Francisco, and Highway 1 from Monterey to Malibu.

I suggest you stop to enjoy Sedona on your way from Phoenix to the Grand Canyon and that you visit the Valley of Fire on your way to Las Vegas. Also, when you go to Death Valley, stay at Furnace Creek Ranch rather than in Amargosa Valley.

HTtY
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 11:22 AM
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You are shortchanging both SF and LA IMO, both of which have a lot to see and do.
Trip sounds very rushed, I would drop a few places.
AFAIK you need permits for The Wave
http://www.thewave.info/
When is this trip? Death Valley can get up to 115F or more in summer.
Both Carmel and Santa Barbara have much nicer missions than the one in San Luis Obispo. I would stay in Pismo Beach instead or maybe Morro Bay.
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Old Jun 20th, 2016, 05:12 PM
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Don't miss Arches in Moab. Stay another day in that area. That whole region represents some of the best of the US Southwest.
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 04:14 AM
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Thanks for all this great advice everyone!!!

I'm going to add Arches NP to my plans and consider staying IN the national parks rather than around them.
I will also add a night in Zion and drive to LV the next day.
I will make a stop in Sedona before I go to GC Village.

I forgot to include that I'm making this trip in July. I hope this makes a difference in the amount of places I can visit .

I was surprised to read that driving after dark is not advised, since I found out that even in July the sun already sets at around 8:30 pm...

The difficult part now will be to decide which places to drop...
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 04:52 AM
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Whatever you do, don't remove Antelope Canyon from the trip!
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 05:49 AM
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The advice about not driving after dark is due to the danger of unexpectedly encountering deer and other wildlife on the road. Many of these roads are windy, and they will not be well lit; extra caution and attentiveness is required.
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 06:21 AM
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If the trip is in July, and you need to drop locations anyway, I would eliminate Death Valley right off the bat. It will be scary hot there in July. I didn't notice this when I made my original comments, but definitely look up the permit requirements for the Wave. It is not something you can just show up for and do. Only 20 people are allowed to go there a day. We have applied a couple of times and been rejected. Currently, they are accepting applications for October and the days all have over 600 applicants per day. It is very, very rare to score a permit for the Wave.
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 06:59 AM
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I don't see how you can add any places without cutting a lot of others. You are already stretching things way too thin.

And no, you really should not drive almost ANY of these roads after dark. Wild life, mountain roads/steep drop offs, no lighting -- just don't.
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 08:09 AM
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other than wildlife (which doesn't concern me as much) a lot of the roads just aren't easy. They're slower and more stressful to drive than you would expect. I drove into Yosemite in the dark. Would NOT do that again. And I definitely think you need more than one day in Yosemite.

Have you been on long trips before at home? What's your max per day driving distance without feeling too stiff or tired? Mine is 6 hours. That means that "long" days are six hours but MOST days are 2-4 hours of driving and the rest sightseeing or hiking.

I'd want a full day in Tahoe. If you cut anything, I'd cut the CA coast and focus more on the southwest. Good luck!
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Old Jun 21st, 2016, 09:44 PM
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Your schedule certainly sounds very hectic.

I highly recommend spending more than 1 day in Page, AZ. To see Horseshoe Bend, Upper Antelope, and Lower Antelope in 1 day will be a difficult task considering there's a lot of walking involved in all 3. Just to walk from the parking lot to see Horseshoe Bend is an uphill 1/2 mile walk on mostly sand (definitely wear hiking shoes here).

For Bryce Canyon, you will definitely regret it unless you spend a full day there. It is one of the most beautiful and unique place you will ever see and getting around to all the viewpoints takes several hours in driving time alone.

I'd skip Zion since it is mostly walking and requires a certain fitness level. Too see Zion properly, you'd need at least 2-3 days hiking deep into the park.

Yosemite is so pretty you'd need at least 3 full days to soak in all the views. This may very well be the highlight of the trip and spending more time here may be worth it.

If you are driving from S.F. to L.A., you should definitely visit Big Sur and also Hearst Castle (make sure you buy tickets in advance). Big Sur has the most beautiful coastal views in California (IMHO) and is worth stopping several times along the way just to take photos and watch whales passing by. There's a private ranch (El Sur) spanning 7000+ acres in the area and has some of the most beautiful views you will see.

Last but not least, you definitely need several days to see S.F. and L.A.. I'd spend more time in S.F. as it has more to see and easier to get around.
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Old Jun 22nd, 2016, 01:21 PM
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The Wave - Been there twice. This past May, I attended the raffle for ten tickets. There are at least 95 people waiting from Europe to China for that ticket. Your chances are very slim. Also, in July trail temp will be about 37-40 C. It is a 4.7 km hike one way Note: I did win a ticket, but let another person take it.
There are many other touring opportunities there. Suggest the Book: Vermilion Cliffs National Monument that is available on Amazon.

Antelope Valley - Yes, very attractive, but it is in Navajo Indian land without any tourist management - none. $$. Warning: There are four tour operators in Page. Each hauls tourist every 20 minutes to that narrow and relatively short slot. IT IS crowded. The first time I went there many years ago, only one Navajo woman was at the entry. No charge, no people. If you want to hike a slot, I suggest Buckskin Gulch near Moab. Largest slot in US. It is described in the suggested book above. IF you have 4-wheel drive, the White Pocket is stunningly beautiful. IF not, you can rent one in Kanab

Gotta run
All for now
Vaga
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Old Jun 23rd, 2016, 07:02 PM
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Ooops
Wrong: I suggest Buckskin Gulch near Moab
Correct: I suggest Buckskin Gulch near Kanab

Vaga
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Old Jun 24th, 2016, 12:47 PM
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I was about to say, don't do this trip in July. Phoenix, Death Valley, and Las Vegas in July are awful, and I live in Texas!
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Old Jun 25th, 2016, 08:06 AM
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I have to say I disagree with marveousmouse about not beong concerned about driving at night and possibly hitting a large animal!!

I live in Utah and visit our wilderness areas often, plus I live in Park City at a higher altitude where we have moose, elk and deer, plus nearly every other type of wildlife you could name. You DO NOT want to hit any of these animals. The animal usually ends up dead and you end up with either a totaled car or heavy damage. If you hit a moose or an elk, you could end up dead too.

The animals can be out even during daytime, but are most active from dusk to dawn. They are very hard to see at night in wilderness areas without lights. Deer especially, tend to jump out on the road in an instant.

One woman recently hit a moose on the freeway between SLC and Park City. The entire top of her sedan was torn off. Her survival was a miracle.

There are no moose south of the Wasatch, but there are free range cattle and horses.
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Old Jun 25th, 2016, 10:41 PM
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Oh, I did not mean that I'm not scared at all. It was more like- wildlife is very active at night, so that's a concern, but I have bigger worries. Yes, wildlife scares me- I don't ever want to hit a moose. OP- Be especially careful at dusk- that's when they seem to just stroll out into the middle of the road watch the sides of the road for deer especially!

However- I think I run a much higher risk of being hit by another driver or even misjudging the road conditions myself and going into the ditch. I do not have very good night vision and a lot of people do stupid things in the dark- many of the accidents I've seen on rural roads have been night accidents due to people speeding, or driving sleepy or drunk. So I'm more concerned about other drivers than the creatures of the night, if that makes any sense. I think a lot of tourists drive into an area at night expecting straight and easy highway- that just isn't the case in most mountain areas.
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