I love great pizza. I have been spoiled by the great options in Chicago. St. Louis has nothing in the way of great pizza...that is, national caliber memorable pies.
Imo's is often recommended.
Nothing wrong with it, but it's very ordinary IMO.
Maybe someone knows a non-chain local joint I'm not familiar.
But I can't offer any great recommendations.

I know native St. Louisans think this is blasphemy, but St. Louis pizza is horrible. A local newspaper writer once said, "To say that St. Louis pizza is like Velveeta on a cracker is an insult to Velveeta and crackers." I couldn't agree more.

St. Louis style pizza is very thin crust (which I love) with something called provel cheese on it. Provel is to provelone what Velveeta is to cheddar. So, if you like processed, slimey, tasteless cheese that sticks to your teeth, you'll like StL pizza.

Imo's uses all provel, Elicia's uses half provel, half mozzerella. The only decent pizza I have had here is from national chains: Uno's, Pizza Hut, etc. I wish they had Donato's here - now that's great pizza.

The Black Thorn Pub has pretty good pizza. The original one is in the South Grand neighborhood - which has much better restuarants than Black Thorn (King and I for Thai, Pho Grand for Vietnamese) but if you want pizza, it's good.

There is a lot of great food here. I love pork steaks and toasted ravioli, and Ted Drewes frozen custard is good, the atmosphere and tradition make it great. You'll find toasted rav at most restaurants and bars, pork steaks are hard to find at restaurants, but you'll find them at most backyard barbecues!

Let me know what neighborhhods/areas you'll be in and I can narrow it down more. You'll find much better pasta in StL than pizza. Go to the Hill!

Erica,
That is what I always call it - cheese on a cracker. I live in St. Louis, and the pizza is dreadful.

One place everyone talks about is - Cicero's. It is in the trendy loop area. It is a fun place to walk around and people watch, eclectic shops, good restaurants, etc...
anothr area to consider for pizza is The Hill. It is an Italian area which has endless fabulous restaurants. Most any one of them should have decent pizza.
Have fun!!!

I remember stopping for the night in St. Louis with friends, and ordering a pizza to our hotel room. When it arrived, we paid for it without opening the box. When we DID open it, one of my friends said, "This is pizza nachos!"

This is a crying shame! I grew up in St. Louis and we used to have the most delicious pizza. All the little places we went to are gone now, but I can't believe the pizza itself has gotten so bad! There was a place in the Loop called Rinaldi's I think, and so many others.

You may want to try Vito's, 3515 Lindell near St. Louis U., Black Thorn, 3735 Wyoming in the Grand South Grand neighborhood, Fortel's 7922 Mackenzie Road in Affton (south county - but has other locations) Racanelli's, 6655 Delmar in the U. City Loop and a couple of other locations if you want really good pizza.

I also didn't understand the lure of Imo's until I had it off and on for a few years but "dreadful"? Yes, they use provel cheese and it is VERY creamy, and the crust is super thin. However St. Louis is a city with a definite Italian lineage and with Imo's having 93 locations in the St. Louis area - also spreading into outstate Missouri including Kansas City MO, and Kansas City KS, and southern and central Illinois (I went to their website and counted), you can just dismiss that if you want - but 93 locations!!! ? they are obviously making a product that is making a lot of people happy! Personal preferences may cause one to use the term "dreadful" but there are many who would use the term "delicious."

I was in New York week before last and went to Grimaldi's in Brooklyn on a Sunday - pizza there is always recommended on the NY board and was meeting my daughter who lives in Elizabeth NJ - really wanted to have pizza ther but they were closed because of air-conditioning problems. But had a good pizza at John's on lower west side.

And Chicago! I've had great pizza there, but Pizzaria Uno - don't get it. If you like lots of grease from the cheese combined with lots of grease from the sausage, pepperoni, then go for it. (BTW - I think I did - but I'm one who thinks there are very few bad pizzas.)

In St. Louis, my personal preference is Fortel's (Affton location is great). They also have a location in Kirkwood and Fairview Heights, IL. Also, Vito's has a very thrifty lunch buffet - for St. Louis U. students - and others.

Also, some pizzarias in STL that use provel have a notation on the menu that mozzarella cheese will be used on request.

Just have to respond to Ziggy. How many locations does McDonalds have? KFC? Taco Bell? I really don't think having a lot of franchise locations has anything to do with quality or good tasting food.

I know tons of people who love Imo's and provel - all of them are native St. Louisans. I grew up in Cincinnati and would , at times, give my left arm for Skyline Chili. Growing up with something makes a big difference.

But please do not say that provel has anything to do with St. Louis' Italian heritage! I don't know one self-respecting Italian-American who will claim provel as Italian!

I stand by my claim that Imo's is awful, in my opinion. I'll eat most anything, but won't touch provel cheese.

I really hesitate to recommend a place, because, as you can see - St. Louis style pizza is an acquired taste, and not everyone acquires it. There's a very strong possibility that no matter where is recommended, if it really IS St. Louis style, that you aren't going to care for it. This just based on reactions I'd seen from out of town guests.

In that St. Louis has a large Italian population and some of the best "other" Italian food anywhere, I guess the pizza style had to come from somewhere.

No that I did my disclaimer. Personally, I don't like Imos. They just do their crust a little too dry and crispy for me. I always went to a like a little place out in St. Charles called Saullo's, since I was young. But closer into the city, I agree with ziggy (who explained the style very well), and would pick Fortels.

On top of what ziggy said, look for a pizza cut in squares, not slices. Authentic STL pizza is always in squares. Chances are that the pizza will be kinda round, kinda square. No consistant shape at all really.

Actually, it may not even be an acquired taste. I think you may have to be born with it.

Racanelli's, no question.

I live in St. Louis (born and raised) and I have to agree that St. Louis-style pizza is, at least in my opinion, awful. St. Louisans definitely have a love-hate relationship with Imo's. Either you love it or you hate it. There are people in my office that have it delivered about once a week and love it. I can barely even stand the smell of it. But its obviously very popular around here and may be worth a try if you like this type of pizza.

That being said, there are some great pizza places around St. Louis. A few of my favorites are Guido's, which is on the hill. Another is Il Vicino, in Clayton. Both have good pizza that is not "St. Louis-style". Talayna's, a chain here in St. Louis, also makes decent pizza.

I agree Racanelli's has delicious pizza. It is New York style pizza though. Like it or not, Imo's would be considered St. Louis style pizza. Not only does Imos have provel cheese and extremely thin crust, but it is cut in little squares instead of triangular slices. It is unique to St. Louis.
I have two comments to make on this discussion in general.
First, most ethnic food in the United States has been modified to American tastes. To say that Imo's pizza isn't Italian is true. But then most pizza in America can't be duplicated in Italy any more than Chinese food in America looks or tastes anything like the food eaten in China. You will find toasted ravioli on many Italian restaurant menus in St. Louis. It is not Italian. You will find something called crab rangoon on many Chinese restaurant menus in St. Louis. It is not Chinese. Both are St. Louis inventions.
Second, when I visit different parts of the US and beyond, I look for the foods unique to that area. Many are different versions of familiar items. Some are unique items unavailable anywhere else. From these experiences I have found foods I miss and some I live happily without, but I am always glad that I tried.
St. Louis style pizza is Imo's. Is it good? Is it an aquired taste? Why don't you try and decide for yourself. Either way, its what makes travel fun.

WendyLynn, you are absolutely correct - I thought the original poster was asking for recommendations of where to eat pizza in St. Louis but upon closer reading, they are asking about St. Louis style pizza. I am originally from NY so Racanelli's is where I always go when I am in St. Louis - it is definitely NY style and Imo's is what I think most people would consider St. Louis style.

See? Now I'd agree if you said Imo's was St. Louis style pizza but not if you said St. Louis style pizza was Imo's. The basic logistics are the same: cheese type, crust depth, square cut. But not all St. Louis style pizza is wafer crispy. I've had it at a number of places where it's soft enough to roll a slice up without cracking. The best STL style crust has air pockets. Much lighter on the provel than Imo's does it but with more parmasan. And really, provel isn't anything more than provelone with a little cheddar and swiss thrown in (I know, I know...)

Mind you, I'm not saying it's a gourmet dinner, but Imo's hardly represents the style best.

HI EricaS, I couldn't agree more re: your comment on franchise locations< just because there are a ton of Domino's pizzerias around the world certainly has nothing to do with quality or good tasting food.( I personally can't stand that either,sorry.)
Imo's certtainly is a love/hat thing in this town. Out of five of us in my family only one likes Imo's.

Again, there are a number of restauarants on the hill which serve St. louis style pizza. I have been told that Lou Baccardi's is great....

Okay, you have convinced me to skip the pizza. What should I have, other than lots of frozen custard at Ted Drewes?

Sorry to have put you off St. Louis pizza. But there are lots of good things to eat here. If you have a car, and I assume you do since you're going to Ted Drewes, you should eat at least once on the Hill. Once again I will utter StL heresy by saying that Cunetto's (the most popular restaurant on the Hill) is terribly overrated - long wait, mediocre food. Here are my suggestions:

Rigazzi's - cheap, fun, loud, family-style spaghetti house

Lorenzo's Trattoria - a little more modern than other Hill places, good food, good service, laid back, decent prices

Dominic's - very elegant, very expensive

Or go to South Grand for Asian food. Or Peublo Solis for good Mexican food (in south city). Or Chuy's for good Tex-Mex (in Dogtown). Or Blueberry Hill for good burgers and great atmosphere (in the Loop).

I can give you specifics if you want, just let me know what interests you.

Favorite is Favazzas on the Hill for sort of "mid-level" Italian. Rigazzi's is ok, but haven't eaten there in a long while. One of those, once you've been in the kitchen things...

Its hard to go wrong with the many wonderful restaurant in Clayton. Remy's is our favorite. We also enjoy Figarro's, Barcelona, Almond's. The restaurants in the University City loop (on Delmar Blvd) offer an ethnic mix. Blueberry Hill is a classic for burgers and such and has outdoor dining for interesting people watching. New to that area is Mirasol where we recently had a great meal (latin fusion cuisine?)
I wouldn't skip the pizza. I would try one and let us know what you think!

ziggy, I haven't tried Vito's yet but last weekend they were at Taste of the West End and their pizza'a looked wonderful!

Clifton, your descriptions of St. Louis pizza variations was intriguing. Where would you suggest for a soft thin, parmesan added, air pocket pizza? I am up for a cultural adventure. My kids are native St. Louisians, they need to be exposed to these things

Aw.....WendyLynn,

I take it I missed the Taste of the Central West End!

That's one of my favorites (Collinsville Italianfest and Strassenfest are the others).

I guess with returning from my vacation and going back to work I must have missed the articles in the paper. I've been going to the Taste of the CWE for a few years now. Love to hang out around the stage they set up at Maryland and Euclid and then wander through the art exhibits and food stands.

Rats! - But thanks,

Zig

WendyLynn,

I'll have to admit it's been awhile since I came into the city and had pizza, so my mind is going. Living out of town now, so when I make it back and I get , I tend towards a couple of favorite dishes. So Saullos has been it for awhile.

Used to have a real favorite at a place called Franco's. But, Franco had a sideline that got him shut down. Shame. He used to come out singing love songs in Italian after a few too many and always made it an interesting night out. Man, could he make a pizza though.

If you are interested in the Hill, I eat there quite often and my favorites are Favazza's and Zia's. Both have great Italian food, wonderful pizzas, and decently priced. I also agree with Pueblo Salis for good Mexican food. Another good Mexican restaurant is Arcelia's in Lafayette Square. If you like chocolate, Lafayette Square is also home to The Chocolate Bar, which has wonderful chocolate desserts in a really neat setting. There are several other good restaurants around Lafayette Square (which is in the city, not far from downtown) like Squires, if you like more modern food and restaurants.

There are some great neighborhoods in St. Louis that have a lot of really good restaurants. As I mentioned above, Lafayette Square is good, as is Soulard, the Loop, Central West End, etc.

Have a good trip!
Tracy

Yikes, I just re-read my post above and I have 'pizza' on my mind! I meant to say that both have great Italian food, wonderful SALADS (not pizzas...I don't think they serve pizza!), and decently priced. Sorry about that!

I love St. Louis Pizza, but then I hate all other pizza - which means, my husband claims, that I hate pizza.

Anyway, as far as other restaurants in St. Louis go I suggest: Geno's and LaRusso's for Italian (just off the Hill on Hampton and Watson respectively), Pho Grand & Pho Saigon for Vietnamese, King and I for Thai, Blue Water Grill in Kirkwood, and the Tap Room downtown for great beer (micro brew) and sandwiches. I can't recommend Rigazi's at all for the food, but the atmosphere is fun.

And of course O'Connells (kingshigway and 44) for a great bar, burgers, and roast beef. Dressels (in the Central West End) is a favorite as well.

I remember Saulo's from my childhood - but ours was in North County, not St. Charles. It was the best pizza, and I've yet to find any st. louis style that compares. But i still love it anyway.

Bluewater Grill and Remy's are my favorite St. Louis restaurants from recent years, but I'm always happy to try new ones. I haven't been back since 2000, but I'm going to a high school reunion this fall.

picapica, my cousin did quite a lot of cooking at Dressel's and managed it for years. I've spent many hours sipping single malts in the upstairs bar.

Marilyn,
I live there, so if you need some names of some great NEW restaurants when you return for your reunion, let me know.
For now I can give you 2 names that are terrrific and kind of trendy, you will probably run into people you know....

1. 1111 Mississippi - near Lafayette square

2. Moxy - in Cental west end.

Ok.... for the typical st. Louis question,...where did you go to High School?(chucle chuckle) that is a favorite question in STL.

I'll be there in early October, and restaurant recommendations are always welcome. They are holding the reunion at Harrah's (do not get me started) so I guess there's absolutely nothing around there, right? But I doubt if I'll make it all the way downtown.

UCITY!!

My favorite is Chez Leon in the Central West End.

It was featured at the beginning of the year on the Food Network's "The Best of..." The topic was a prix fixe menu.

I've eaten there 4 or 5 times in the last couple of years and foie gras has always been on the menu.

I don't know of anything around Harrahs. Who knows, maybe you will hit the Jackpot and win loads of money!!

What a small world Marilyn... I live in UC.
I hope you have fun at the reunion!!

Having lived in St. Louis, you've probably been all around for site seeing, so I won't try to go into all that.

Harrahs is in Riverport (Maryland Heights/Earth City) on the Missouri river flood plain. You'll be up in the banquet rooms on the 2nd floor, behind the buffet. The complex is just across the river from St. Charles. You could visit old main street there if you haven't before. Old buildings and street from the 1700's. Tea rooms, little restaurants and craft shops. Historical sites (see Lewis and Clark thread).

Thanks, Clifton! I'm only there a few days and I expect most of my time will be spent reconnecting with my classmates, but it's good to have a back up plan that's not too far away.

Hi Marilyn,

I understand and would feel the same way. The Harrahs complex is pretty isolated, back behind a summer ampitheater and a large office park. So, it's not walking distance to anything. But there are a couple of restaurants (steak house and Italian) plus the buffet in the building.

I can't go into the food quality, pro or con (a conflict of interest!) but hope you have a great time. We'll just miss you, as we'll drive into town and fly out from there on Oct 22.

Awwww, that's too bad, Clifton! It would be fun to meet and toast fodors in person. If we have to wait til my NEXT high school reunion, I may be too decrepit to attend.

It sure would have been, Marilyn. Ah well, in the meantime, I'll raise my glass anyway. It's a great site (most of the time ) Perhaps we'll cross paths in some other part of the world.

Hope you have a wonderful trip and I'll try to give enjoylife back his or her thread.

OH My Gosh, I grew up in STL and ST Charles and I have lived in KC for last 12 years, I LOVE IMO's, CECIL WHITAKER's
and STEPHANINA's and Always love coming home to all the GREAT ITALIAN and other foods, You don't appreciate it until you can't have, GEE I MISS BELLY BOMBERS and JACK IN THE BOX TACOS!
You wouldn't think the cuisine in KC would be sooooo Different than STL.
By the way, the only descent BBQ in KC is at SMOKEHOUSE BBQ !!!!
There is one in INDEPENDENCE that is the BEST, and the ONLY REAL Italian Restuarant is CAFE ITALIA on North of Barry Rd and N OAK. Stroud's for Fried Chicken off of I-35 and Vivion Rd.
This is served Family Style at the table. Manny's Mexican Food is about the best in KC in the Westport area.
The Corner Cafe in Liberty and Riverside is about the best down home family place with great breakfast, lunch, & Dinner. In A Tub for Fast food
Mexican, Deep fried Burrito's etc.

There ARE NO Greasy Cheesy Cracker Pizza Place's here, Imo's tried but did not get the KCMO area to inhale the Provel Stick to your teeth stuff.

Personally, I miss it!

Actually, St. Louis pizza is an acquired taste. I was born and raised in St. Louis and I've never been a big fan of the pizza - but, then again, pizza is not what people come to St. Louis for. "The Hill" has great restaurants for Italian food. A great restaurant is Bartolino's (the one on Hampton, don't go to any other one!).

I personally like Chicago style pizza - so, if you would like some great Chicago style pizza while in St. Louis, go to Uno's. Your best bet for food in St. Louis is to walk into a little "hole in the wall" that you would normally be scared to walk into - they usually have the best food in St. Louis

I've been here 15 years now, and IMO, the only really delicious St. Louis-style pizza is Fortel's. The style is thin crust and square-cut, but the cheese is fresh good-quality mozzarella, and the sauce is slow-simmered and full of herbs. It's a pizza that is generous in terms of sauce and toppings, but sparing with the cheese, so it's never gloppy. The crust is not quite cracker-thin, but flexible enough to fold, and it does have the occasional air bubble.

I agree w/ Ryn. Fortel's is tasty. For a little more "upscale" pizza there is Il Vicino's located in Clayton.
By the way, you missed the St.Louis Fodors Get together!!

Another great place is Sieberg's if you like pizza and wings - both very good. There is one downtown and there is one in South St. Louis - great atmosphere too.

I love Sieberg's but didn't realize they had pizza! I work very close to the one on Market...guess I'll have to check it out!

I'm still voting for Il Vicino for the best pizza in St. Louis!

I myself do not like St. Louis style pizza. I prefer NY style. If you like
NY style go with Racanelli's. They now have a few locations around St. Louis. Going there tonight, in fact.

If you want to try St. Louis style pizza at least once when visiting town, there are Imos all over the place. (I have 4 within a 3 mile range of my place.)

Three good options:
Black Thorn Pub. A kinda run down dive bar place off of Grand in south St. Louis city. Great pizza with a regular hand tossed and a deep dish Chicago style. Waits for a table can be long at times (even during the week.)

Fararos Jersey Pizza. In the Soulard neighborhood. Does the New York style pizza tons better than any of the Racanellis. Very friendly and helpful staff compared the the bored and grumpy trolls at Racanellis. If the weather is nice there are some tables to sit at out front and watch the Soulard drinking crowd go by.
(It's also open until 3am on the weekends and sells pizza by the slice.)

Joanies Pizzaria. Another nice pizza option in Soulard. All their food is good: appetizers, salads and pizzas. Kind of a spin on the St. Louis style with a thinner crunchy crust that is totally different than the cardboard like stuff you get at Imos. Very friendly crowd and workers at Joanies. There's also a nice patio out back.

I just read somewhere where Black Thorn Pizza won best Pizza in St. Louis.
I have lived here my whole life, never heard of it, but I am excited to try!!!

Ah, dweebe you are after my heart. Joanies Joanies Joanies! I love their food! Especially the garlic cheese bread! Mmmmmm! I live down the block from the restaurant, so, you can guess where I go to eat!

"Provel" cheese sounds scary.

Having 94 locations is no indicator of quality - has anyone ever tried Papa John's?

Actually, Papa John's used to be my old roommate's fave. So, I kind of got swept into it too. I still think it is good, but definitely not the best!

The people of St. Louis know that the best place for pizza is Fenway Park in Boston. It sure tasted good there last year!

mm

P.S.
Could not resist - Go Cards!

I've had Papa John's many times. While its not bad, it's definitely not my favorite. To me its more in line with Domino's or Pizza Hut, although I do like Papa John's better than those two. Its more of a chain with delivery service, as I believe most of the stores (at least in my neck of the woods) are carry-out or delivery only.

Tracy

Going to STL for the pizza.. is like going to FL for a swimming pool vs the ocean.. anyway, what I am getting at is as good as STL's pizza is.. (CHI's is horrible, but I've only been to about 30 of their places).. as good as STL is.. their Italian food is better. I have spoken to athletes from CHI, NY, STL, football players, hockey, etc.. they all agree STL has the BEST Italian foods they have ever had. From Dominic's on the hill to Charlie Gittos.. to the Bistro in Clayton.. to Trattoria Marcella on Watson (I think).. skip the pizza, enjoy the Italian cuisine STL has to offer..personally, I thought Ted Drewes was always overated. I mean it was good, but standing in line for an hour is not worth the Ted Drewes. The Hill and beyond has some of the best Italian food I've ever had. Dominic's is suit-and-tie.. where the presidents themselves eat when they happen to be in STL. To say one city "has good pizza or not.." is a tough assertion to prove or not. I like Unos, did not like Imos, but everynoe there likes Imos.. and I know people in CHI personally who mail-order Imos once monthly.. and they despise CHI pizza.. I also know a guy who went into the hospital after having Fortel's in Affton (they always burned their crust anyway).

Does Pantera's still exist in St. Louis? I used to love their pizza. If not, are there any places with simiar pizza?

Pantera's???? Now tht is a blast from the past.....

I do not think it is here any more.

There was last a Panteras in North County.. or O'Fallon, MO (the new North County--haha, but true).

Panteras is the same as pizza hut.

Imo's is ok, or was years ago.. Cecil Whittakers was similar. Pasta House had good pizza as well, but they are a national chain (?) started in St. Louis (best salads in the world!!).

I went home this past weekend and there is still a Pantera's pizza in Edwardsville, IL.

Tracy