ps. I have to add in Crumbs (on Madison Ave.) and M&M Store!

The first thing I would do is head to Top of the Rock to get an overview of the city from above. BUT, before you go you shuold get - and both study - a goo street map of the city as well as a subway map. You can use hopstop.com to find the best routes between any two places in the city and the website of any sight willlist the nearest subway station.

Do not do the long bus tours - you just spend a lot of time sitting in trafic in the hot sun.

I would add the Museum of Nat'l History (great minerals and gems and human evolution if not the dinos). And I would do Central Park on foot. The bike rides are fine - but you MUST stick to the very limited roads - adults aren;t allowed to ride bikes on any sidewalks or park paths in NYC (only kids - as in little kids on trikes) - so you will miss seeing alot of things.

I agree. I would just get out and start walking!

I would definitely add Soho and Chinatown to your list. (i think in terms of neighborhoods, generally lower Manhattan is probably better for you to wander)

If you walk the Brooklyn Bridge and dont' want to walk both ways be sure you walk from Brooklyn towards Manhattan. That's the view you want.

I thought Jacques Torres was overrated. Their products are available now in a variety of places anyway, I"m pretty sure.

I will get the name from my D of this wonderful little place in Soho that has fabulous homemade gelato and candies and a very charming little cafe inside. Soho has galleries, shopping, adorable places to eat, etc.

Definitely Dylan's Candy Bar. Better than Economy Candy, which has more nostalgia appeal for adults. Dylan's is more of a bright, whiz bang place.

When you go to Top of the Rock, be sure to stop and see Rockefeller Center (which I'm sure you'll do!) and don't forget to see the wonderful gardens that are in the plaza that comes down from Fifth Avenue.

For the boat ride, you can either just take the Staten Island Ferry, or do the Ellis Island tour. Both boats will take you so you can see the Statue of Liberty; I've never actually stopped on the island to visit the Statue itself. I think it would be quite a long and tiring day to try to fit both the Statue and Ellis Island in together, but I might be wrong. IF you reserve your boat tickets in advance, there is a shorter line when you arrive.

tamaraten - When we went last year for 6 nights with our 13yr old and 10 yr old boys we did lots...

For my kids the Statue of Liberty was key to knowing they were in New York, so the first night we arrived we took the Staten Island ferry across and back - free and gave us a view of the statue and the skyline.

First full day we did a full day private tour with Real New York tours - we opted for the private tour so that we could do it completely at our own pace and it was perfect. I e-mailed the company and listed a huge list of 'the kind of things we would be interested in' and I think they pretty much incorporated every one The guide (Fabrice but I am sure they are all great) had researched all the things I had mentioned - even sort of obscure things - and worked them in. It was a great orientation for the first day - we covered lots and lots of ground and got much more of a sense of the city than we would have alone. For example, my son wanted to find 'funky t-shirts' and had found a store online, and so Fabrice included stopping by the store (and pointing out some other interesting things while we were there) so later in the week when it was actually time to shop, we were able to find it right away. Especially with 4 of us, the price difference for a private vs public tour wasn't huge, but even if it had only been two of us, I would definitely reccomend it. Like I said, they can tailor the guide and the content 100% to what you want to do. You could also set the pace for your daughters foot...

We got 5 day New York Passes and used them for Top of the Rock & Empire State Building; Bike rental which we used to bike across the brooklyn bridge; NY city water taxi; Food on Foot walking tour, Statue of Liberty (didn't go in) and Ellis Island; Intrepid museum, Guggenheim, MOMA, the MET, museum of natural history; NBC studio tour, Harry Potter exhibit. Plus we saw 3 broadway shows, did some shopping. That is definitely a long list now that I write it! But it worked for us... the benefit of the pass was permission to not like something. i.e. the Guggenheim - we enjoyed the building more than the art. Some things (like the Harry Potter exhibit and the NBC studio tour) we wouldn't have done without the pass - and for us it really worked not to have to worry about any specific thing was 'worth it'. It was very full, but it worked out well for us. Everyone picked up at least a couple of 'highlights' and everyone wanted to come back again this summer.

This time, we are fitting less in and have more 'wandering' time built in - but I don't think we would have been as prepared to do that without having packed in everything that we did! For example, we have one day where we are going to go to the Lower East Side Tenement museum with a tour at 11am, and then spend the afternoon wandering around Chinatown, sampling as many $1 a plate fried dumplings as we can find, so see how they compare to the 5 for $1 dumplings Fabrice took us to during our walking tour...

Sorry for a long winded answer that didn't really answer!

In short... I would reccommend the Real New York walking tour on the first day. After that, our experience was that there is so much to see and do, that there is nothing 'can't miss' because if you missed something, you were doing something else, and you shouldn't have missed that either!

I can understand that you would want to go to the glass cube Apple store on 5th, but it is unbelievably crowded and your daughter will probably not get her hands on products to play with which can be frustrating for an Apple lover. When you go to Grand Central, do the audio self tour and visit the new Apple store. It is usually not very crowded and you can play to your hearts content and sit if she needs to rest her leg.

Visit Central Park on a weekend when it is likely that there will be lots of 'street' entertainers. Common areas are Bethesda Fountain and the Mall (north end by the band shell and south end by statues of Columbus and Shakespeare), but as you walk, you may find them anywhere. The entertainment varies from rap, dancing, classical music, jazz, etc. Some of these people are very talented.

Oh, and when you're at the Met, go up to the roof. There's a very cool outdoor exhibit.

You need: A good map.

I wouldn't bother with Grimaldi's Pizza nor with the Brooklyn Ice Cream Co, nor with Jacques Torres. The best part of the Brooklyn Bridge experience is walking (or driving) from Brooklyn TO Manhattan. It's a long walk, you might want to take a cab for this.

I have already suggested going to TOTR first thing, but anything you choose will be wonderful.

However, the free Staten Island Ferry will be packed at that time with the start of all the commuter travel but it should be on your list too. Remember that you must disembark and then re-board the ferry once on S.I. and returning to Manhattan.

The Real New York tours take some time, not sure she nor you would really appreciate this walking tour at the end of your first day after traveling, settling in, etc.

If you're staying near a Crumbs bakery, you might want to stop in there for a little "Hello, New York!" cupcake. There's a really good Limited in that area, I believe.

You have plenty of time to enjoy some of the neighborhoods of New York City; take it easy and take little bites of each. The best parts of New York City are also things that aren't necessarily listed in the guidebooks. Allow yourself enough flexibility to discover your favorites.

When we are in New York City we always take a long walk, following this general path: Central Park, Rockefeller Center, Broadway Theater District, Murray Hill, Gramercy Park, Chelsea, the Meat Packing District, Greenwich Village, SoHo, the East Village, the Lower East Side, Little Italy, Chinatown, Brooklyn Bridge and Wall Street.



If you time is limited, you could take the subway to the area of the High Line: http://www.thehighline.org 

From there you could meander through Greenwich Village, SoHo, Little Italy, Chinatown, and eventually to the Brooklyn Bridge.

HTTY

Continue north after visiting Columbia University to visit The Cloisters, the medieval branch of the Metropolitan Museum of Art in Ft. Tryon Park!

It's magnificent.

There's nothing better than a lazy walk in Manhattan! If it were me and my DD, I'd walk from your hotel toward Fifth Avenue (head west), then up Fifth Avenue (north) toward Central Park, a little around Central Park, then down Fifth Avenue toward Rock Center, and back to hotel before dinner.

I agree with Bowsprit, forget Grimaldi's pizza. You will have at least a 2 hour wait and it is not worth the wait. It is a big tourist trap. Right around the corner is a pizza restaurant that is just as good with hardly no waiting called Ignazio's. If you do venture to the area definitely check out the Brooklyn Ice Cream co. and sit in the beautiful Brooklyn Bridge park and enjoy.

nytravelr & bowsprit- I definitely need to get a map - a paper one- to have beside me when I'm reading all these wonderful suggestions! And nytravlr - interesting that you said not to do the bus tours - it helps me a lot to have a realistic assessment of things. Also helps to eliminate possibilities.

skatedancer - thanks for suggestions, and especially helping me remove something from the list (Economy Candy). One less thing to feel obligated to do.

vcanada - thanks for comprehensive answer! Please don't apologize for being long-winded - I appreciate every word - it's so helpful to me. It really sounds as though you truly maximized your trip, and really wisely. I'm really considering the Real New York Tour for the first day.

centralparkgirl - thanks for Apple store tip. I want to go to GCS anyways, so we will go to Apple there. But, is the Apple Store on 5th impressive from the outside if we just pass by?

Bowsprit - re Grimaldi's and Brooklyn Ice Cream - are they just all hype and a real disappointment in reality? Wow. They have received such great reviews all over the place. If we take a subway to Brooklyn in order to walk the Brooklyn Bridge to Manhattan, as you and others suggested, would it still be a waste to go there? (ie. is it close to the start of the Bridge? - sorry, don't have my map yet...). Also, I think vCanada meant the Real New York Tour to be on our first full day there (ie. the day after we actually arrive). I like the TOTR suggestion for the first thing to do (thanks also nytravlr). It makes sense and will give perspective, especially since you mention the packed ferry at that time which was my other top choice for the first thing to do. Thank you - that narrows it down a lot.

Maybe TOTR and a walk as suggested by sf7303 (thanks for the route sf7303!) for a first thing to do would be good.

Question re TOTR - I've read a lot about the extremely long lines, even with people who have City Passes who received a voucher and then were told to return a couple of hours later - Does anyone have a suggestion of the best way to get tickets with the least amount of waiting in line?

I heard the same things about boat rides to Ellis Island or any other place (except for free ferry) - are there any tips to do this in the most efficient way?

We just returned from a five day trip to NYC with our 12 year old granddaughter. She had never been, and she absolutely loved everything! I'm sure your daughter will too!

Our hotel was at 42nd between 2nd and 3rd. We started out the first day walking down 42nd. We passed Grand Central, the NYC Public Library, Bryant Park and continued on to Times Square. We went into ToysRUs to see the Ferris Wheel, went to the Disney Store, the M&M store, etc. We then continued to Rockefeller Center where we had a quick lunch downstares in the food court. We took a city bus up to the MET and spent some time at the top overlooking the city. Then we spent several hours seeing the MET before going to dinner on the upper east side. I felt like this was a good overview for the 1st day. We considered the hop-on-off bus, but felt like we might spend too much time waiting for the buses, so we decided on a walk. Of course, you will have to see how much walking your daughter can do by the time you arrive.

The next day we did the American Natural History Museum and really enjoyed that. We went into Central Park where we enjoyed the park and all the people on a Sunday afternoon. It was sunny and lovely after a short rain shower earlier. We stopped at the Plaza Hotel on the way out of the park and loved seeing the downstairs food court and shops. Stopped at Trump Tower and rested a bit. Later we went to Rockefeller Center and went to the Top of the Rock before dark for the daytime views and stayed until it got dark for the night time views. I highly recommend this as it was wonderful. You can get a timed ticket online which is great as we didn't have to wait in line.

On Monday morning, we went down to Battery Park and took the ferry to Ellis Island. That was a very moving and wonderful experience, and our granddaughter loved it. We saw some of Wall Street in the afternoon and then had tickets for the World Trade Center Memorial. That too was very moving. I would try to get those tickets as soon as possible as they go very quickly. It doesn't take very long to do - you just have to go through security with your timed ticket.

On Tuesday, we took the subway to Brooklyn and walked back to Manhattan on the Bridge. We loved that - it's a great experience. We walked on into Chinatown for lunch and shopping. We saw Mary Poppins that evening and thoroughly enjoyed it. Our granddaughter just loved it - said it was her favorite thing!

On Wednesday before our flight home, we went to FAO Schwartz, Dylan's, and Serendipity for frozen hot chocolate. We also stopped by the NYC Public Library as we had missed that earlier in the week.

We didn't get to do everything we had on our long list - but we did the most important things. We didn't really do any shopping, but passed all the big stores and looked in the windows. NYC is wonderful for all ages - your daughter will have the time of her life!

Are you sure you're not confusing TOTR with the Empire State Building?

I thought Grimaldi's pizza was pretty darn good -- not the best in the city, but still very good. Yes, it's very close to the entrance to the bridge.

Do you not have Apple stores where you live? I wouldn't pass up the 5th Avenue branch for your Apple-obsessed DD. It's open 24/7. http://www.apple.com/retail/fifthavenue/

<<<That too was very moving. I would try to get those tickets as soon as possible as they go very quickly.>>>

We went two weeks ago on a Tuesday at 6 p.m. and walked right in (without advance tickets), as did a friend of mine this past weekend (Saturday I believe). I'm not sure it's a problem anymore.

blh - what a wonderful trip report that was! Lucky granddaughter! Your first day sounds terrific. I'm wondering about the day you went to Ellis Island - how long did you spend there and was that enough time? What time was that tour and what time was the World Trade Centre Memorial? And could you please tell me how long you spent at the WTC? I'm trying to gage what's possible in a day.

sf7303- I know the ESB lines are famous for being even longer, but I did read about long maze-like lines at TOTR, even with tickets, only 2 elevators with tons of people and extremely long waits.

Re Apple stores - don't really have them, just Apple dealers - NOTHING compared to what exists in the US, Canada and Europe (was recently at Apple store in Paris, wow, gorgeous...)

A logistical question - Is it unreasonable to think we can do the Tenement Museum, Brooklyn (first to Grimaldi's and Brooklyn Ice Cream), then to walk the bridge, and then the World Trade Centre all in one day? If unrealistic, to drop the WTC that day, or does the Tenement Museum make better sense with something else? Does WTC make better sense with something else? I think I have more or less an idea on the upper city side of things, having trouble with the lower!

You are getting lots of good advice here! As for a map, I would recommend the Streetwise Manhattan map...it's laminated, plus it contains subway and bus routes. It lists EVERY street, not just the main thoroughfares, and we used it constantly. Note: we didn't take one with us, but at the end of the first full day, after making some wrong turns on the Lower East Side, I bought one at the gift shop at the Tenement Museum. You should be able to get one at a good bookstore or online. $6.95 and worth every cent.

The Apple store on 5th avenue is open 24 hours and its not too far from your hotel. Visit it on your way back from the theater one day if you're not too tired. Or one evening or early morning when you've got nothing planned and sitting in your hotel thinking "we're in NYC, what can we do now...?"

musicfan-I agree; I'm getting great advice. Thanks for map suggestion.

nyer - it sounds like I really have to go to the Apple store on 5th!

I just looked online exactly where Tenement museum is, etc.

Could I have suggestions please on what would be paired nicely with the Tenement - I see from their site and link that the Russ and Daughters restaurant has received incredible reviews. Maybe there for lunch after museum.

I need suggestions incorporating the Tenement Museum, maybe neighbourhoods around there like Chinatown & Soho, the Brooklyn Bridge (with Grimaldi's and Brooklyn Ice Cream), and the WTC and Battery Park. Plus boat ride?? I don't have a sense of how long all the logistics of this would take because I'm unfamiliar with the distances, transportation and reasonable time at each site, also taking into account not wanting to rush through things.

Would this be a two-day deal? (oh I forgot...and Ellis Island?)

There is no "best" first thing, but I'd do something that makes a real impression on her. On my first trip to NYC, the first thing I did (literally after getting off the airport bus at the Port Authority) was to walk over to TKTS and buy half-price tickets. Then I had a hot dog at Nathan's (the real one, not the awful fast-food tourist trip it is these days). Then I had cheesecake at Lindy's, followed by my first Broadway show (Into the Woods). That made an impression on me.

The area around the Tenement Museum is the Lower East Side, which has numerous trendy bars and restaurants as well as good shopping. It's fairly close to SoHo, but there are a lot of better things nearby, including the original Donut Plant on Grand Street, il laboratorio del gelato, lots of traditional Jewish businesses, the Meatball Shop, etc. YOu could spend hours just in the Lower East Side if you want to explore it thoroughly. I'm not sure how much a 14 year-old will be interested in the shopping, but there is also Economy Candy. It's not really at all close to Brooklyn, so that's a different trip, as is the Brooklyn Bridge, though it could be tacked onto the end, after a walk through Chinatown.

We had breakfast at the Doughnut Plant the day we did the Tenement Museum. For that day we really just wandered through Chinatown and then Little Italy...basically kind of made a big circle (oval?), very random, but that was fine...we just wanted to get a feel for the area.

I should clarify one thing: Russ and Daughters is not a restaurant. It's a store. And it's not a real draw unless you are particularly fond of smoked or picked fish. That's what they specialize in.

Also: I'm not aware of long waits at Top of the Rock. The easiest way is to just walk over to Rock Center and buy a ticket from one of the myriad booths. Tickets are timed, so if it's a busy tourist day you might have to wait a few minutes, but I've never encountered a long line. The Empire State Building is a different story entirely and not recommended (by me at least).

The only way to streamline your entry into Ellis Island is to book a time in advance. A few weeks in advance should get you a decent time. It's best to go first thing in the morning, but you need to have several hours. This isn't a quick trip. It requires waiting in line, going through security, taking a ferry, and then exploring a very interesting but crowded museum (watch the film if you go). Skip Liberty Island entirely. It's the first stop, and with the Statue closed there's just nothing to warrant getting off.

We have several Apple Stores, including a great one in Grand Central and ones in SoHo and west 14th St. The Fifth Avenue store isn't my favorite. It's way too crowded, and the others have great stuff going on, though Soho (Prince Street) is still undergoing a major renovation, I believe, so it's a bit more cramped than normal.

Doug_Stahllings - your "first thing" sounds wonderful. I think you're really right about having something make an impression - that's really what I mean - something really memorable. At the same time, I was hoping to at the start of the trip give her some "context" - hoping that that and the impression would meld!

What would you group with the Tenement Museum for a 14-yr-old then? I appreciate your thoughts that the LES might not be too interesting to explore for her. Is Chinatown/Little Italy
interesting for a teenager do you think?

Thanks for clarification re Russ and Daughters - didn't realize it wasn't a restaurant.

Also, sounds like you're not too thrilled with Ellis Island - would you not recommend?

We did Top of the Rock on Memorial Day afternoon. We just walked in (eventually...it's on the lower level so took some doing to find it), bought our tickets and were up top in just a few minutes. For a $ cost per minute activity, it was probably one of the pricier things we did, but I can't imagine NOT doing it.

Beware the posters that tell you what you must and must not do.

I love Grimaldi's. Would I wait 2 hours in line? Hell no, but maybe a half hour if the timing is right. What fun you will have!

I've never had to wait on line at TOTR. A lunch at Grimaldi's will entail a long wait. Honestly. Go to John's in the West Village instead; you'll be much happier and the quality of the pizza is superior, imo. There's nothing special about Brooklyn Ice Cream. If you're really into ice cream, there are better places around. If you're looking for a fun afternoon, you'll enjoy pizza and an ice cream, that's for sure. (who wouldn't?)

btw: Bring cash for John's Pizza.

Lkn-glass: That's funny! By telling her to 'beware' you've become the poster that has told her what to do!

The OP is a seasoned traveler; she's looking for recommendations and is perfectly capable of making up her own mind, I am assured.

So recommend away...

We had 9:00 am tickets for the ferry to Ellis Island which I bought online. It takes about half hour to get to Ellis Island. We were there about 3-l/2 hours. You could spend longer than that, but we felt like we saw most of the exhibits. We didn't hurry through, but we didn't read everything either. We took the 45 minutes to see the video which gave us the history of Ellis Island. When we arrived at about 9:30, we were almost the only ones there, but it quickly got crowded after two or three more ferries arrived - they come about every 20 minutes. There were hundreds of school children - and some were not very well behaved or supervised. But by the time you go, school will be out, and it should be better. It wasn't that it was too crowded, just that the kids were running everywhere and made it a little overwhelming.

Our timed ticket to the Memorial wasn't until 5:30 pm, so we spent the afternoon (from about 1:30-5:30) in the area. There was plenty to do with Wall Street and the churches in the area. Trinity Church is right there and so is St. Paul's where all the World Trade Center memorial things are on display. WTC Memorial took less than an hour - probably 30 minutes. We should have tried to go in earlier, but our tickets said not to arrive more than 30 minutes prior to our time. But they really never looked at the time on our tickets. We did spend some time waiting in a cafe when we could have probably gone on to the memorial.

We didn't experience any waiting in long lines at Top of the Rock either. Our ticket was for 7:45 pm, and we went right in and right up on an elevator. Of course, we then waited until dark at about 8:30-8:45 so we could see the city lights. There were benches to sit on - so that helped. I had also heard that there could be long waits even with the pre-purchased tickets. We were there on a Sunday night, so that might have been better than a Friday or Saturday night.

You could also do Chinatown or the Brooklyn Bridge in the afternoon after Ellis Island. We took the subway to Brooklyn and walked back to Manhattan - this would be great to do at night as well. My timed tickets - 9:00 am for Ellis Island and 5:30 pm for the WTC Memorial took the whole day. The 5:30 tickets were all I could get. But it's possible that we could have gotten walk up tickets. I just didn't realize that.

tamaraten - our plan for after the Tenement Museum is 'wandering with a purpose' through Chinatown - the purpose being trying $1 a plate dumplings and ending at the "Original chinatown icecream factory" www.chinatownicecreamfactory.com

Here is my google map of cheap dumpling places that one of several people I found through googling liked LOL. http://goo.gl/maps/hy0v

We go in July so I will let you know how it goes over.

We went up both ESB and TOTR. We did TOTR and ESB both. We got a timed ticket for TOTR and then went and grabbed dinner at Tri-Tip grill which was right by the entrance (we picked it because it was what we found close by but it was actually really good - salads, burgers, steak sandwiches). There were some elevator lines, but nothing unbearable. ESB we thought going after the theatre would be good - the worst thing about it was that the lines are very deceptive. After each corner it seemed like there was another line - then we got to the point like we felt we had invested too much time waiting to bail. And when we got to the top it was crowded, and a view we had already sort of seen, so we didn't spend much time there. But youngest son summed it up by saying it was the 'sight' that he enjoyed the least, but he was glad to know he had been up it...

And yes we did the Real New York tour our first FULL day (i.e. arrived on Sunday afternoon... spent Monday on the tour)

As far as travel times, I used both google maps and hopstop to get transit and walking distances between places that gave a good indicator when planning.

I must be the only person on this forum that had a horrible experience with TOR.

Certainly, I should have known better as we had just left a Rockettes Holiday show, BUT, we walked in to a no line downstairs area, where we purchased tickets for 10- minutes later. Well it wasn't until we were told where to line up that we realized that the reservation in 10 minutes was over an hour wait. By the time we realized, it was too late to turn back, and by the time we got to the top we had to consider the hour long line down in order to make our dinner reservation. The ticket people basically lied to us that we had a reservation. It was a really really bad experience.

I only share this, as I was foolish to trust that we were in a 10 minute line. I am sure you will not have that issue during your visit, but perhaps my story will make you be pro active when purchasing tickets.

And yes, I think if it is a quiet night that would be a lovely way to introduce your daughter to NYC including the stroll!

Don't forget to Look Up! when you're ascending in the elevator. A twilight or visit at dusk is especially appealing.

I wouldn't miss Ellis Island. You can easily spend a day there but 1/2 day might be enough for you. Get on the first trip in the morning!

I actually really like Ellis Island. It's an incredibly worthwhile experience, but it's not a fast one. That's all I meant. You have to budget at least a half-day for this to really get something out of it. Now the Statue of Liberty is a different story ... right now at least. Since the statue itself is closed, I find absolutely nothing interesting about Liberty Island. You can even get a better view of the statue on the Staten Island ferry.

I think TOTR is busier on some days, and the Christmas holidays is one of the heaviest crushes of tourists NYC ever sees. I went to Rockefeller Plaza one night after the tree was lit, and it was scarily crowded. That's not the case right now, though it is very busy. But I've been up twice and didn't encounter a line either time. Nothing.

Your daughter might enjoy the frenetic atmosphere of Chinatown more than the Lower East Side, but I love the LES myself. And there's a much better range of dining options. But I"d still try to set aside some time to have dim sum in Chinatown. That's well worthwhile.

I'm sure you'll have a good time regardless of how you schedule your time. Just realize that, except for stuff you have pre-booked and paid for, you can always change your mind if you get tired or just have a change of mood. Don't feel like Brooklyn? Save it for another trip. Have a hankering for dim sum early? Then do it. Don't get too hung up on itineraries. That's my best advice.

Sorry ... I keep remembering things I wanted to tell you. If you are ever looking for a nice meal close to our hotel, consider Le Relais de Venise L'Entrecote, which is on the corner of 52nd and Lexington. It's a French steakhouse with exactly one meal and nothing else: a salad with vinaigrette and walnuts, and then a slice sirloin steak with their delicious secret sauce. And good bread. They also have good cheap wine and decent ice cream desserts. It's a reasonably priced restaurant by NYC standards.

Bowsprit - when you say get to Ellis Island first thing, do you mean for less crowds? What would you pair that with given my list and people's suggestions? (ie. Brooklyn Bridge, Tenement Museum, LES in general, Chinatown, WTC..) Never heard of John's in all my reading - thanks for recommending.

Lookin_Glass - you might be the minority on this Forum re TOTR line-hassle, but believe me, I've read so many types of reviews on TOTR, and there are many that talk about experiences you describe. That's what caused me to ask about TOTR lines to begin with. It's not unreasonable that you would trust the place from where you purchased the tickets!!

Doug_Stallings - Whatever you remember is appreciated!! Even if it's in many different posts - I love hearing all the great advice and recommendations. It truly helps, as indecisive as I sound at the moment!

VCanada - I look forward to hearing about your trip - when do you get back?

blh - thanks for very informative answer re timings.

BTW, for all who have done TOTR - Is it anything at all like going up to the top of the EIffel Tower in their elevators? I did this in March and never ever had a fear of heights in my life. I felt really scared for the first time ever, and really nauseated. Maybe I'm starting to have a problem with heights in my (mid-40's) old-age (!), but wondering about this re TOTR.

tamaraten - we will be back July 15th and I will let you know how things go

When we rented bikes and biked over the Brooklyn Bridge we got them from Rock and Roll bikes that was right beside the boats to Ellis Island. We also went first thing (tickets for the 9am ferry) and really liked the Ellis Island museum. So the Brooklyn Bridge might be a good one to combine with the Island. Although we haven't gone to the Tenement Museum yet, I would think that the stories from Ellis Island and from the Museum are similar enough in theme that I would personally want to put them to two different days (and maybe Ellis Island first) so that each experience had a chance to sink in on its own. We've found that for us it is always good to combine a 'brain activity' with something more active (like a walk or a bike).

Doug's advice about flexible itineraries is I think really good. Even with our 'packed full of things' trip last year had no more than one 'planned activity' per day. Each one of us picked the one thing that we didn't want to miss, and we scheduled in that, and then we had options for the rest of the day. We still ended up packing a lot in, but it didn't feel packed in because most of it was optional (if that makes sense).

And the TOTR elevators are more just like an office building, not like the Eiffel tower

The Apple glass cube and staircase on 5th should be seen. But be prepared to not spend much time there. It is the highest grossing Apple store in the world and the most crowded. Sometimes, it's oppressive. So see it, but if your daughter wants to sit and use the iPads, PowerBooks, etc., GC is the place. I was there yesterday, and there were plenty of places to sit and plenty of Apple staff to speak to. The GC self tour is worthwhile and there are some shops, markets and places to eat while there.

agree that you should pick one sight for the day, and then have a list of nearby neighborhoods and possibilities and then just see how you feel. It will be tiring!

When it comes to the food recommendations, I would just carry the list of places with you and if you happen to be near one when you're hungry, then give that place a try if you want. I find that many of these places don't meet the high expectations (Jacques Torres and John's Pizza come to mind for me); they're good, but not so great as to make a special trip for, at least IMO.

You will find so many charming and interesting restaurants and food choices along the way; don't miss out on making your own discoveries.

I wanted to add to your list: Washington Square Park (in the Village). There are entertainers and a fabulous chalk picture guy near the arch. I am pretty sure you can find them every day of the week, but maybe someone else can chime in on that.

Bryant Park is also a nice respite (behind the main branch of the Public Library).

I also agree that if you are looking for a whiz bang / orienting stop for your first day, to do TOTR for that (and wander Rock Center area) maybe also head to Central park -- Don't go in Central park after dark though! New York is really safe, but I am pretty sure that this is still one of the caveats for anyone there.....

If your daughter likes chocolate, lunch or dinner at Max Brenner's in Union square might be fun if you're headed downtown. You could take a subway to the union square station and it's right there (make a res first on open table). Maybe on your way to the tenement museum? Or, if you'd like your daughter to go to NYU, go to brenners then walk to washington square park, which i just really love. If she likes books, The Strand bookstore is right in that area where brenner's is. It boasts 18 miles of books!

The Brooklyn Bridge is about a 15-minute walk from the Ellis Island ferry. So if you want to pair Ellis Island with something that would be a good day to do it. Wall Street, Federal Hall, the Museum of Jewish Heritage, Trinity Church, the 9/11 National Memorial, Century 21 (a discount department store that will have little, sadly, for your daughter), J&R (the excellent discount electronics stores along Park Row), the World Financial Center, and Shake Shack downtown are all in the same general area. A bit further east along Fulton Street is the South Street Seaport, which will have more shops that will interest your daughter, though in truth it's really touristy and not so interesting. You could also walk up to Chinatown after the Brooklyn Bridge if you just walk halfway to Brooklyn and then return.

I just can't recommend going all the way to Brooklyn and then walking back over the bridge. That's a very long walk (well over a mile), and the approach to the Bridge on the Brooklyn side isn't that interesting to me. You're far better off walking out from the Manhattan side.

We really enjoyed John's (we tried the one on 44th Street). Our current favorite is Keste (Bleecker Street). Going to try 3 or 4 more next time we're there!

To everyone who suggested TOTR: halleluya, I decided that's what we're doing first!!! (Okay, now just 8 more days to plan!). I do believe it's going to be a great first-thing to do, and skatedancer, I did decide along with that to just stroll, including to Central Park. I think we'll still have plenty of sunlight, so that should be fine.

centralparkgirl: Another decision - we will go to the Apple on 5th at some point when we're strolling along 5th. It sounds too good to pass up, and in any event, we can just go in and out if it's crazy busy - I think the point is just to check out the building. Even if crowded, I'm sure it's still cool as anything.

emcash- "likes chocolate"? She's a certified chocoholic. She would just die to go to a place like Max Brenner's - if it works out, we'll check it out. Thanks for telling me about it.

Doug_Stallings - Wow, you're original! I think in all of the reviews I read about the Brooklyn Bridge, the recommendation is always to walk from Brooklyn to Manhattan. You're the first person (I've read) who is saying the opposite - I'm intrigued! Now you've given me a whole new perspective (and literally, if I do it as you've suggested!). I wanted to pair Ellis Island with BBridge, but I really thought of going to Brooklyn first. But you pose a very interesting alternative. This way, we'd still see the Manhattan skyline when we walk back...

What do people think about it? (although of course, I'd then pass on Grimaldi's and BICFactory...which I understand from many of you is overrated.

Before the above suggestion, my thought for one of our days was to do Ellis Island first thing, then get to Brooklyn (to Grimaldi's and BICF), then over bridge and then WTC Memorial or something else in the downtown area if we have any energy left, but not mandatory. But now, you've given me a whole other way of thinking about this.

And then I thought on another day, doing the Tenement Museum, China Town, and areas around there.

Also, if I've done the ferry to Ellis Island, do you think doing the ferry on another day to Staten Island is overkill?

Comments? and thank you again.

Although I don't understand Doug's logic as walking either way will entail the same path. . . since 9/11, I have told people to walk from Manhattan as a pilgrimage to the exodus we all witnessed that day/night as well as the big blackout of 2003.

We did as Doug suggests and walked from the Manhattan side almost all the way to the Brooklyn side and then back. While I think we would have enjoyed the areas in the immediate proximity of the Brooklyn side (like the Promenade), it was brutally hot and sunny, and we got to see some great views. Also, they are doing construction on the Manhattan side so the large and ugly construction barriers are an inconvenience.

musicfan - not sure I understand. If they're doing construction on Manhattan side, how does walking from the Manhattan side help? Or did I not get what you said?

It doesn't help, really...I just wanted you to be aware of it. Although we would have probably walked the same distance regardless, the barriers on the Manhattan end did get in the way of the view so we had to go farther out to be able to see. Does that make sense? Sorry to be unclear.

Got it, musicfan!. So are you voting then for starting on the Brooklyn side because of the construction?

Of course you should start walking from the Brooklyn side or you will simply be walking the bridge to Brooklyn as you look over your shoulder for the mind blowing views of Manhattan. If it's too much to walk bothe ways (it might be) you can take a cab or train into Brooklyn then walk back to Manhattan.

If the views of Manhattan are compromised because of the construction, don't bother with this walk at all. You'll get a great view of Manhattan if you have lunch or dinner at The River Cafe' or if you take a Circle Line Cruise from the Seaport.

Not necessarily, especially as I have no idea what's involved in getting to the Brooklyn side to get started; if Doug says that starting in Manhattan is the way to go, I would go with him--he lives there and works for Fodor's!

You want to walk from the Brooklyn side to the Manhattan side. Unless you are a Jehovah Witness and want to see your world headquarters, all the other reasons are compelling to see Manhattan.

Oh don't suck up to Doug the Editor muicfan! He posted that about an easy 15 minute walk and then posted about a very long walk, well over a mile. A quick mile walk takes 15, a normal walking mile takes 20.

So please Doug the Editor, explain your opinion on why it is better to walk one way on the same path and how that makes the path easier. To me it is simply a direction of walking.

The first thing we did was to do the Hop-On/Hop-Off Tour Bus but we didn't hop-off at all on the first day because we really wanted to have a general idea of the city, its neighborhoods, street's, people, it's atmosphere in general and it was worth every penny we paid.

I agree with AmericanGuestHouse. The open top bus gets such a bad rap, but there is no better way to SEE the layout of the city and the major sights within a couple of hours. Sure it's not the best way to travel around in the city but that's not the point.

Now I'll admit that I've never done it -- not even sure if they had them when I first started going to NYC (maybe by chariot?), but for a first time visitor -- I'd say it's ideal!

You want to walk from the Brooklyn side to the Manhattan side. Unless you are a Jehovah Witness and want to see your world headquarters, all the other reasons are compelling to see Manhattan.
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How's the weather in NYC today, Aduchamp?
The Jehovah Witness headquarters was all I could picture in my mind as they walked, walked, walked over the bridge to have marginal pizza at Grimaldi's. Anyway, I look forward to Doug's clarification.

The approach to the Brooklyn Bridge from Brooklyn entails (for me) a very long, inhospitable walk. It's not pretty scenery, and unless you have a compelling reason to be there (and there are a lot of compelling things to see in Brooklyn), you can much more easily walk half way out from the Manhattan side (about 10 minutes as opposed to perhaps 3 or 4 times as long walking from the subway on the Brooklyn side), see the view, and then come back. I've done both. If it's hot, I really wouldn't recommend the walk from the Brooklyn side.

To get there from the Brooklyn side, take the subway to High or Clark and then head for the bridge. Brooklyn Bridge Park is actually very nice and worth seeing, but it's underneath the bridge on the waterfront, so you don't pass through it on this walk. You have to go through Cadman Plaza. I'd guess it would take a normal person about 45 minutes to do the whole walk from Brooklyn over to Manhattan (that's really long to me), when you can do the best part in half the time by starting from Manhattan and then walking back.

I have no stake in this argument, but I've done it from both sides, and unless you want to do something over in Brooklyn, then it's just not worth it (for me at least).

The Hop On bus costs $40-45 per person.
_____

It is rainy and windy in NYC today, not a day for the Bridge in either direction.

And I too think there is better pizza than Grimaldi's.

I agree with Doug: I've walked the Brooklyn Bridge innumerable times, starting from both ends, but share his opinion of the long, boring walk as you climb from the Brooklyn side to the middle--it also seems longer and steeper to me. OK, so some has said that when walking from the Manhattan side you are facing Brooklyn, but when I walk toward Brooklyn I'm always looking to the side, down toward the seaport, further away toward the harbor, toward the upriver bridges, or at the lovely architecture of the bridge arches and cables. And the parts of Brooklyn I can see--the promenade, the river-side park, DUMBO--look interesting to me, too. For me the walk to the middle from the Manhattan side seems consistently more interesting and shorter. And then you turn around and head back to Manhattan, with all its glory before you.

tamaraten, I had totally the same reaction to the Eiffel Tower. I love TOTR and have no fears when visiting there--no sense of hanging in mid air like the Eiffel Tower. You are firmly on top of a building with very safe-feeling enclosures. In at least a dozen visits, my longest wait to get in an elevator was about 8 minutes. If you also plan to go to MoMA, check how the combined TOTR/MoMA works--it is a good value.

I get what Doug is saying about the bridge. It is not so easy to figure out the access from that side. The main thing is to get out on the bridge so you can then walk towards Manhattan. The whole idea of the bridge walk is for the views of Manhattan. It is an incredible vantage point.

It isn't quite as difficult as all that. One option is to take the subway to High Street and then walk back to Manhattan.

While you can not eat at Russ and Daughters, you can eat at Katz's Deli a block or two away for a hot dog or corned beef and pastrami sandwich or chicken soup. The scene from When Harry Met Sally was filmed there.

Besides the Met, the Museum of Natural History is one of those "must see" museums. I think it is the best natural history museum in the country and I have been to many.

Any local pizza place should have good pizza. You don't have to go after the name. Sometimes the local ones are the best.

Battery Park City is nice to stroll along the waterfront and you can get a glimpse of the statue of liberty from there.

The highline is very popular too these days.

The Bridge is an easy walk and easy to get to Brooklyn on the subway as Bowsprit said - to High Street. As you exit the subway, there is a sign on the window of the ticket attendant with directions to the Bridge. It took about 5 minutes to get to Bridge. We enjoyed the walk as it was a cool day. If it is a hot day, it might be different. We did this about mid morning on a cool day, and it was great. The construction is on the Manhattan side and is not attractive. However, the views of the city before you get to the construction area are breathtaking. The walk did not take more than 30 minutes even with all the photo stops. We saw a lot of people renting bikes on the Manhattan side, and I assume they rode across and back to turn in the bikes. That also would be a fun thing to do.

We had wanted to see some of Brooklyn, but were running out of time. It sounds wonderful. http://www.in-nycsite.com/2011/05/29/brooklyn-bridge-park-pier-1-pier-6-development/

Agree with everything europeannovice said except about pizza - there's plenty of awful pizza in NY! John's, Keste, Motorino, etc ARE local.

Okay, now I'm really in a dilemma. I was absolutely certain that I'd take subway to Brooklyn, follow the very precise instructions I found on a TripAdvisor Post that are supposed to be really clear and idiot-proof, and walk back towards Manhattan to see the gorgeous views.

Doug came up with an alternative perspective and for all those suggesting walking FROM Manhattan, I hear you.

But as bowsprit says, wouldn't walking towards Brooklyn, looking over my shoulder at Manhattan defeat the whole purpose, and be irritating? Until I turn around of course. The question is, is the walk really only 10 minutes out before I could turn around for the spectacular views? That seems a bit short considering I've read the whole bridge can take 40 minutes to walk (at a nice pace - not quickly-sort of stroll. Don't forget I'm with dd with just-over broken leg).

I'm kind of tempted to forget the whole Brooklyn experience since we will be there in August - I'm sure it'll be boiling - and it will give us a bit more time for other things. On the other hand, the whole reason I want to do this is to be able to "walk the Brooklyn Bridge" with my dd, and see the stunning views approaching Manhattan.

Hey tamaraten - no matter whether you walk one way or the other or bike it or not do it at all it will be the right decision

If the 'reason' this is on your list is for the view and the pop in to Brooklyn, then one suggestion might be the NY Water taxi. there is a stop right at the Ellis Island ferry, and it goes up as far as the Intrepid museum and then down to under the Brooklyn Bridge. http://www.nywatertaxi.com/tours/hop You can get off at a number of sites, including the park with the Brooklyn Ice Cream factory.

If you want to want to have been on the Brooklyn Bridge with your daughter, then I would say either direction is fine - and maybe have a couple of options figured out (walk to Brooklyn... walk to Manhattan... walk there and back... bike there and back) figured out and decide on the day based on the weather and how you feel.

Oh, and one comment on the fact of having biked across the Brooklyn Bridge (and not being from New York), it shows up in LOTS of movies - so the kids (and us ) like the fact of having been across it when we see it on screen maybe even more than we enjoyed the actual act of doing it!

Re. the cyclists: Stay OUT of the cycling lane as you walk across the bridge! Also be aware that there are few places to sit and rest on the bridge.

It does take 40 minutes to walk the bridge from Brooklyn because of the very very long approach. The approach from Manhattan for pedestrians is quite different and infinitely easier. But if you fear that you will be disappointed by not going to Brooklyn, then go. It's not difficult to find the bridge entrance on the Brooklyn side; it's just that the walk is not very scenic from there. But if that's what you want to do, then you should do it. If you do go, I'd definitely find another attraction to see there.

Doug-Stallings - I don't feel as though I'd be disappointed not going to Brooklyn. The major reason from starting from Brooklyn was just that that was the recommended most scenic route. I figured if I'm there, I'll check out the pizza and ice cream places recommended. But it's not mandatory.

VCanada - the reason to walk it is to be able to walk it with my dd, and to enjoy with her what has been so highly recommended as a must-see. As I said above, Brooklyn sites are secondary (no offence to Brooklyn - just have time constraints). I love the water taxi idea!! I looked at the site, and found it a touch confusing - is there some kind of taxi we could take from Ellis Island directly to under the Brooklyn Bridge (ie. one stop without doing a whole hop-off-on thing)? OTOH, I'm paying for the boat to and from Ellis Island, right? But it's such a great idea to go directly to Brooklyn if I could without having to pay for a whole HOHO deal since we won't have time to take advantage of it.

I think your advice, VCanada, is good - I'll just see how it goes on that day I suppose, because at the moment, I really can't decide. I guess I don't have to. The only reason it is good to know in advance, is for planning purposes and to figure out what else we'll be able to do that day.

There are so many other sites and days to plan - and this was only one small component! I appreciate everyone's input, truly.

ellenem - I'll check out the MOMA/TOTR combo for sure - planning to do both, and haven't heard of that in all my reading. Thanks for suggesting. Do you know a link? And thank you for the reassurance re TOTR elevator!

europeannovice - thanks for taking the pressure off Grimaldi's! (same to everyone else who voted it "not necessarily NY's best").

blh- thanks for reply re access to Bridge. It's so interesting that you say it is a 5 minute walk from the subway to the bridge - I've read so many different assessments of time estimation on that one, with a large range!

tamaraten,
The only boat that goes to Ellis Island is the Statue of Liberty/Ellis Island boat. When VCanada wrote about the Water Taxi "there is a stop right at the Ellis Island ferry, and it goes up as far as the Intrepid museum and then down to under the Brooklyn Bridge" I assume he/she meant that there's a stop in lower Manhattan, near where the SOL/Ellis Island ferry leaves and departs. NOT directly from Ellis Island

" I love the water taxi idea!! I looked at the site, and found it a touch confusing - is there some kind of taxi we could take from Ellis Island directly to under the Brooklyn Bridge (ie. one stop without doing a whole hop-off-on thing)? OTOH, I'm paying for the boat to and from Ellis Island, right? But it's such a great idea to go directly to Brooklyn if I could without having to pay for a whole HOHO deal since we won't have time to take advantage of it."

This is a private company that has all sorts of tour boat options but it isn't offering just single rides from one location to another. It's a siteseeing tour setup, not a ferry/transportation system so it's pricey.

They do run a shuttle service to Ikea in Brooklyn (which happens to be in a hard to get to by subway location) but that doesn't really offer you much unless you happen to want another boat ride
http://www.nywatertaxi.com/tours/ikea

Yes sorry for the confusion
I meant that when you get off the Ellis Island ferry, the NY Water Taxi is right there... And the name taxi could be misleading - it is painted up like a taxi, but it does a fixed single circuit that you can get 'hop on and off' at the pre-determined spots.

And when we went for a week last year we had New York Passes, which included the Water Taxi, so I must admit to not really worrying about how much things like that cost. We hadn't planned it in our itinerary, but took advantage of it when the weather, where we were and where we wanted to be all made it a good choice.

That is the quandry of 'is a pass worth it'. What we would have paid to do all the things we did with the pass would have cost much more than what the pass cost - but that is not an entirely fair question because if we hadn't had the pass we wouldn't have done all the things we did. The pass cost about the same - maybe a few dollars more - as the things we would have definitely done, but we were able to work in things like the NY water taxi without worrying about whether they were 'worth it'. We aren't getting any passes this year, because are now experienced New York visitors better able to assess what we will like and what we want to do. But if I was going again for the first time, I would get the passes without hesitation - not so much for the cost savings, but for removing the stress of 'is this going to be worth it' at each site.

FYI nyer - I'm a she

Thanks nyer and VCanada for clarifications.

Ellenem, I found the MOMA/TOTR link, thanks. From what I gather, this combo cannot be bought on-line but rather in person at either site. Also, I realize it doesn't really pay for us since my dd gets in for free at the MOMA. The MOMA/TOTR combo is $38.00 a ticket and I don't see any place for discounts for youth.

Question about TOTR ticket purchase - if I'm arriving at airport at 2:00 (La Guardia), how long do you think it would take by cab to get to 54th and Madison? I figured by around 4 p.m. If we're going to TOTR as our first outing after settling in to hotel, what time would good for TOTR reservation time? I figured at 6:00. Is that realistic?

If you make it a little later you will see New York twinkling in the twilight before your eyes.

Were you planning on buying tickets in advance?

Maybe it's because we had a lot of rain on our trip, but you may want to wait to see what the weather is like before buying the tickets? We put off our TOR excursion several times due to the rain and clouds. Just sayin'.

Since I've only walked the Bridge one time (last week), I may have misjudged the amount of time as I wasn't paying that much attention to time. Doug mentions the very long approach which I was probably thinking was part of the bridge. I was thinking more of the time between the subway station and the stairs going up to the bridge (which is probably more accurately the approach to the bridge). I could be wrong since I didn't time it, but I think it would take less than an hour total from the subway station to the Manhattan side including lots of stops for pics. We enjoyed it as it was something I had always wanted to do and had never been in NYC in the spring/summer but always in the winter with snow on the ground or cold temperatures. Had it been August - I don't know if I would have done it. I would say - go very early in the morning or do it after dark which would be fun. Whether you do it or not, you will still have a wonderful trip, so don't stress too much and have fun!

tamaraten,

The price of the TOTR/MoMA combo used to be $30, so the price has increased, but so have the entry fees to both TOTR and MoMA. At $25 TOTR + $22.50 MoMA = $47.50 for an adult to visit both, perhaps you should just get the combo and buy your daughter a youth ticket to TOTR. I believe children 16 and under are free to MoMA.

ellenem - That's what I should do if I don't do timed tickets but if I want to time it, I think that would be tricky. Actually the question is if I buy the combo for me, meaning I have to go to the actual TOTR or MOMA location, could I then get a timed ticket? (I have a feeling I can't) And then if I can do that, how do I get the same time for dd? (Moma is indeed free for kids, and for TOTR there's a reduced rate for kids, but just until age 12. For her I'll have to buy a $25.00 ticket).

musicfan - I hear you re weather. The thing is I want to avoid the lines....Can I actually do it as late as the day before? Or even the day of? (But again, I don't know how to coordinate this with timed tickets for MOMA/TOTR combo....)

Re bridge issue - if I go to Ellis Island in the morning, and maybe hang around and do other stuff in lower Manhattan, wait until it's a bit cooler for the evening to get to Brooklyn in order to walk over the bridge, how do I get there by subway? (or any other logical way)?
I still haven't decided which way we're walking, but I'm trying to explore the options of even getting to Brooklyn once we've gone to Ellis Island for the first 1/2 of the day.

Hey tamaraten - If you use www.hopstop.com and put your start and end destination it will give you all the subway options, plus walking route (plus how long it would probably take for a cab)

All TOTR tickets are timed tickets. They all come with a time on them for when you plan to use them. In about a dozen visits, I've purchased tickets at the booths in the plaza as well as the official ticket line inside, but I've never requested a different time than the next available time. I have never pre-purchased tickets for any of these visits. My most recent visit a few weeks ago was most crowded. It took 3 minutes to buy the tickets and then we were on line waiting to board an elevator for about 8 minutes. (You have 8 days in NYC. I would wait and watch the weather to decide on TOTR.)

(If you want to avoid lines, don't go to Grimaldi's--I think you've already reached this conclusion. The pizza is fine, but the one time I went we waited 2 hours for a table. The size of our group caused us to have a longer wait. If it had been up to me, I would not have waited, but I was with visitors who had created the plan and really wanted to do this. To my mind, there are too many other places to eat in NYC to wait anywhere for more than 15 minutes.)

Without knowing exactly from where you will be heading to Brooklyn, it would be difficult to advise on the best subway, though it would probably be the A or C from Fulton St. Start studying the map for your visit:
http://www.mta.info/nyct/maps/submap.htm

Also, Hopstop.com is a great facility to plot transit routes.

Both the 4 and 5 trains stop at Bowling Green, the closest stop to the Ellis Island ferry. If you want to take the subway to the Brooklyn Bridge entry in Manhattan, take the 4 or 5 train two stops to Brooklyn Bridge and get out. There are signs that point you to the bridge entry, and you can get there directly from the subway. Or you can walk from Battery Park, where the ferry from Ellis Island lets you off.

If you want to take the subway all the way to Brooklyn, then you get off the 4/5 at Fulton St. and transfer to the A or C train to High St., which is one more stop. That's the closest subway stop to the stairs leading up to the bridge.

Regarding Grimaldi's. No, I don't think the wait is worth it either. I remember getting there quite early once and the wait was minimal, but seated very close we noticed the pizza next to us was really burned black around the edges. My partner and I both HATE that burned taste, so we said when ordering that we wanted one "not black and burned if possible". The waiter became very aloof and said something like, "well, obviously you know nothing about coal fired pizza. That's the way they are supposed to be". So just as aloof I replied, "well, I see the one to our other side is NOT black or burned -- so it must not be coal fired. We'd like one like theirs please, even though that's the way coal fired pizzas come out at places who know how to make them without burning them." Too patronizing for a pizza place -- you'd think they were a five star restaurant with that attitude!

VCanada - that's an excellent site - thanks for introducing me to it. I need to ask a question though - maybe I don't know how to work this, but just to try it out, I put in "World Trade Centre" as the first location, asking to get to "Brooklyn Bridge" (no differentiation as to which side of the BB possible) as second location. The only information it gave was the route to take by bike. I tried the same thing with "Battery Park" as location #1 and BB as #2. For every other mode of transportation, it said "route not found". What am I doing wrong?!

ellenem - Another decision made! Each time I knock one off, I feel such accomplishment! I am not pre-purchasing TOTR tickets - all of you who have recommended waiting to see what the weather will be are so right.
And another - I am not going to Grimaldi's - at least as a planned destination. (unless for some strange reason we happen to find ourselves there, and it happens to be empty and we happen to be hungry...)
Also ellenem, thanks for the subway map site - I have SO much studying to do, and I feel as though I have been doing this to the (almost) exclusion of everything else in my life - no joke- with SO much to yet figure out. I feel as though I'm at the very tip tip of what I need to know...

Doug-Stallings - Thanks so much for the clear-cut instructions. How long do you estimate it would take to walk from the Ellis Island ferry drop-off to the Brooklyn Bridge entry in Manhattan - at a regular, stroll-type pace. And how long by subway?

tamara - you aren't doing anything wrong - I just tried it and got the same weird result... I wonder if it is confused because there isn't public transit that links the two... you can do a similar thing on google maps - it shows that it is a mile walk from the WTC and the start of the Brooklyn Bridge, and the transit options map out a route that walk then take a subway sidways which gets you marginally closer, then walk again. So I think it might just be that there are relevant transit routes so hopstop has a problem.

I would assume a 30-minute walk from the Ellis Island ferry to the Brooklyn Bridge, because it may be warm, PLUS the most direct route up Broadway takes you past the bronze bull, Wall Street, Trinity Church, St Paul's Chapel, and City Hall, all of which might make you pause a minute or two (or more) to contemplate. You could spend a lot of time in the area as well, stopping off for your visit to the World Trade Center Memorial, strolling long the waterfront from Battery Park to the World Financial Center, visiting South Street Seaport--depends on your interests and energy levels. It would be easy to find things to fill an afternoon after a visit to Ellis Island.

I have just read this thread in entirety from start to finish. We have a ticket to Ellis Island for 9 am on a Saturday and will probably spend a good half day there given the reports here. We may also get off at the Statue of Liberty first because it's on my younger son's wishlist to do so; I fully expect to get back on the next ferry possible.

Having read this thread, I am very tempted to do some--not all--of these things mentioned on the way back toward the subway and our hotel in Murray Hill. Since we have a Broadway show that night, I do not want to turn the day into a maitaitom death march....We also have another day in our trip left open for exploring, so maybe I should resist and come back another day?

5alive: Come back where another day?

I think she means the rest of lower Manhattan.

I may have been one that mentioned Real New York Tours. Our group of 5 took a private all day tour. We did a great deal of walking and were pretty exhausted at the end of the day. However, we got a great overview of the city. For a private tour, they will take your interests into consideration and might be able to cut out some of the areas that require more walking. Or you could ask to sit and take a break. You could always email them to get a better idea of the range of walking that they might include.

Unfortunately, I never took the time to condense my trip notes into a trip report. However, I just went through and made a list of things that we saw and that that I listed in my notes. Most things were seen from the outside with the tour guide giving us lots of history and interesting stories. At the end of the tour, he even gave us his phone number in case we had any questions during the rest of our trip. It worked out well since we realized after we broke up that one of our friends had offered to put the guide's jacket in his backpack when it got warm.


Times Square
Central Park
Greenwich Village Christopher Park Stonewall Inn.
Empire State Building.
West Village.
86 Bedford
Cherry Lane Theater
Narrowest home in NYC
Aaron Burr’s house
Washington Square Park
lunch at Joe’s Pizza
Minetta Lane
Café Wha
Macdougal St.
NY University
Washington Square Park
Soho
Triangle Shirtwaist
Little Italy
break at Ferrara Bakery & Café
China Town
Five Points
Suggestion to see – NY Tenement Museum
courts area
Brooklyn Bridge
St. Paul’s Chapel
Wall Street
Canyon of Heroes
Wall St. – National Stock Exchange
Trinity Church
WTC Memorial (we ended there, so we could spend more time)

Yes, sorry, I meant that I had a day that was not booked yet and we remain undecided as to what we want to do. We thought the Brooklyn Bridge and the Wall Street area, perhaps with some Greenwich Village thrown in. Then I am seeing the suggestion that these activities might be tacked on to the end of the Ellis Island outing. Trying to decide if that's too much for one day.

5alive: Why not just go to Ellis Island, see how you feel at the end of that visit (you may end up spending more/less time there than you expected) and then decide what you'd like to do next. None of the options you've listed need a reservation; just play it by ear.

okay, after days and days and days.....I have a semi-loose plan for the first three days of our trip! (our of 8). Please tell me what you think!

Very broad strokes:

Monday:
arriving around 4 p.m. to hotel (54th & Madison) and settling in
visit to Crumbs (it's near hotel) for a Hello-NY Cupcake for dd! (a Bowsprit quote!)
TOTR
Stroll wherever we feel like: through Times Square maybe, Central Park, 5th Ave., whatever.
Figure out a hopefully great dinner somewhere along the way..

Tuesday:
Met
Frick (maybe)
Some more Central Park
7:00 p.m. Wicked

Wednesday:
Ellis Island (hopefully early...don't know if we'll be able to get to ferry by 9:00 a.m. considering where we're located...our hotel includes breakfast so it would be a shame to miss it - that would mean waking up pretty early and I figure the night before after Wicked we'll do some post-theatre strolling, eating and maybe go to sleep late. Any advice on this would be really welcome.)

Brooklyn Bridge - a thoroughly canvassed issue thanks to all of you wonderful people. Still haven't decided from which direction. Will wait and see as so smartly/logically suggested by the experienced posters here - depends on weather, how we feel, how dd's leg is....

WTC Memorial - thinking about this here maybe.

Battery Park - thinking about on this day too

We'll see what else if there's time...

Thursday:
Tenement Museum
maybe Little Italy
maybe China Town
8 p.m. Once


The above is pretty general and broad, but it's a framework. Obviously we'll have to fill in lunches and dinners, and other things in between.


Please critique!

Thanks.

I have a Solomonesque solution to the Brooklyn Bridge question. Start in the middle and then walk both ways simultaneously.

Problem solved.

i would reserve your Ellis Islands tickets online. It is a much shorter security wait. You won't have to worry so much about missing / rushing breakfast.

You might want to change the Ellis Island Day to a day when you could have an early evening the night before. We actually just had a breakfast bar and coffee in the room that mornning so that we could catch a subway early (by 8:00 if I remember). That gave us plenty of time to get down to the ferry and go through security by 9:00 AM (our ferry time on prepurchased tickets). Actually, there is a pretty good cafeteria on Ellis Island where you can get drinks and snacks as well as lunch. Everyone always says to go early - and I think they are right considering all the crowds that arrived in the hour after we got to Ellis Island. Also, there is a snack bar on the Ferry. I saw quite a few people getting snacks as I'm sure they skipped breakfast. If your hotel serves muffins and such, you could stop by and pick up some things to take with you. If it's a sit down/full breakfast, of course, that won't work.

Your plans sounds very workable to me. The key to enjoying Ellis Island and not wasting too much precious vacation time is the early ferry. If you don't think you can do it on that day after Wicked, then don't or choose the Staten Island Ferry, but definitely reserve the Ellis Island ferry if you are going. Otherwise, you quadruple the wait times, and that just isn't worth it when you have a limited amount of time in the city. Of all the attractions you are planning to see, this is the one that must absolutely be booked as far in advance as possible. Really the only one.

Choose the Frick or the Met, you will poke your eyes out (or your daughter might)after going to two museums in one day. Best way to squash an interest in art is to go to two museums in one day.

I wonder if the two of you would enjoy MoMA?

Make sure you have time to wander through the West Village, one of the most interesting neighborhoods in Manhattan.

Have fun, girls!

I just did a first day in NY today with my child who is a 15 yo boy. He is just back from Beijing so he was a little jet lagged although we still managed to fit a lot in. Rather than bore everyone with the details, I just posted it as a trip report so you can read it if you wish:

http://www.fodors.com/community/united-states/my-sons-first-day-in-new-york.cfm

For a place to eat, I really liked our selection today, Cask, in Murray Hill around 33rd and 3rd avenue.

To me, TOTR is very expensive just for a view. Maybe I am missing something but taking an elevator up for a gorgeous view is worth no more than $10 to me. (it is currently about $25 though you may find a discount)

I would also recommend adding seeing Grand Central station if you can, we were very impressed with it and enjoyed the dining concourse downstairs. You can get great cupcakes at Magnolia bakery there.

Hope you have a great time!

Maybe I am missing something
----------------------------------------------------

You are. Spend the money once for a singular experience. You won't need to spend the money again but you should see this iconic view once.

GCT is great. Crumbs is better than Magnolia.

I'm definitely going to reserve Ellis Island tickets in advance - no question - thanks to the great advice on this thread. And it's true that the night before we should get to sleep at a decent hour. But I don't think we'll feel like doing that...we travelled to Paris together in March and despite her age, we were out really late each night (I mean for a kid - back to hotel by about 11p.m.-12 a.m) just because we did so much during the day and were just so energized and excied by it all and by the time we finally got to a restaurant for dinner it would be after 9-10 p.m. (we also ate a late lunch because there our hotel also included breakfast and we were never hungry until quite late in the afternoon).

Anyways, we will reserve the tickets for sure. Now I'm wondering if we should even go there - is it a must-see?


Aduchamp1- great idea. Can you arrange a helicopter to get me to the middle?!

Bowsprit - we definitely are going to the Moma - on Saturday. In fact, if I had to choose only one museum, it would be the MOMA because dd LOVES modern art - the wackier the better.
Can you tell me a bit about the West Village - what makes it so interesting, what's cool there for a teenager, etc.? Is it the general atmosphere?

And btw, after spending days and days deciding on the first thing to do with dd when we get there, driving myself and everyone else nuts, and finally deciding on TOTR, I am not changing my mind - no matter what the price!!!

ncounty-your day in NY sounds fantastic! (what a great work-out to boot!)

To be completely honest, there is little, if anything, of interest to teens in the West Village aside from perhaps the original Magnolia. Parts of the West Village are really beautiful and have lovely, bucolic brownstone-lined streets, but I can't imagine that's going to be of much interest to teens. The stores on Bleecker are now expensive designer stores for the most part with few fashions for teens. Better would be either SoHo since there's just a LOT more to see and do. Even Prada, while out of a normal person's price range, does have a great store to look at. And there are myriad stores in SoHo (particularly along Broadway between Price and Grand, not to mention the side streets) that would interest teens. My niece always like Yellow Rat Bastard. The East Village and Lower East Side are also filled with young-trending designer stores that might interest your teens.

If you are particularly interested in U.S. history and the history of immigration, or if your own family immigrated to the U.S. during the periods when Ellis Island was in use, then I think this is a must-see attraction. Otherwise, I think you'd get more out of the Tenement Museum and its tours. And that puts you in closer proximity to other stores and attractions that will interest your kids. I do feel that a ride on the Staten Island Ferry to at least see the Statue of Liberty is a must-do event for anyone coming to NYC for the first time. And it's free. That will give you the opportunity to see the sights downtown and takes only an hour round-trip, leaving plenty of time for your Brooklyn Bridge Walk. Ellis Island, on the other hand, is a minimum investment of 4 hours time.

totally agree with Sf7307- lazy walk in manhattan, up and down fifth ave with a walk in central park. Maybe a slice of pizza somewhere. Don't plan the first part. Don't plan all of it. Leave time to just enjoy.

To be completely honest, there is little, if anything, of interest to teens in the West Village aside from perhaps the original Magnolia.
____

I know many of the following have been mentioned above.

It all depends on their interest. Washington Square Park can be a freak show is filled with teens during this time of year. If they are intersted in music, there is Bleecker Bob's, Matt Umanov and scores of places to listen to music complete with the history of modern American music.. And if the kids are interesting in writers there are many other places.

It has two of the better ice cream stores Cone and Grom on Bleecker. John's, Keste, and Arturo's pizza. Many unqiue stores. And scores of other restuarants.

In nearby Soho there is Evolution that mesmerizes teens.

The Wshington Mews and I always show them the house the Weathermen blew up.

Then they can far west to where the High Line starts.

And if she a typical teenager start at 8th Street and Broadway and walk down toward Chinatown where there are literally scores of clothes and show stores for he rage. And near the end is Pearl River where a panoply of good things and things she never needed or wanted awaits.

It is still one of the more interesting neighborhoods in the city and I always take visitors of all ages there.

If kids are interested in basketball take them to "The Cage" on Sixth Ave and 4th Street. You better know how to play and they play tough brand of city ball.

And also Raffetto's where they make their own pasta and watch a machine that was obsolete 50 years cut pasta to size and do not forget to get a rice ball at Fiacco's, pastries at Rocco's, and a smoked mozzarella at Joe's on Sullivan street.

The West Village, SoHo, Chinatown are all great places to explore. Go there. Each is unlike the other. To get a real sense of NYC, it's important to get out of midtown.

If you do find your way to the W. Village, take a look at the outside of the smallest house in NYC, 75 1/2 Bedford Street. This is one of the most charming streets I've ever had the pleasure of visiting.

http://today.msnbc.msn.com/id/43415893/ns/today-money/t/new-yorks-skinniest-house-market-million/

Stop in at Milk and Cookies Bakery on Commerce near the Washington Irving house:

http://www.milkandcookiesbakery.com/site/

The W.Village is a little magical.

I cannot imagine a teen not from NY not loving the West Village on a nice summer night.

okay, it looks like the West Village will have to get fit in somewhere!

I have another idea - has anyone been to the Ground Zero Museum Workshop? I was thinking that maybe on our second full day, instead of Ellis Island (and the pressure of having to get there at 9 a.m. despite being interested in the subject), we'd go to Ground Zero Museum Workshop and maybe then Ground Zero, and from there the Staten Island Ferry and then Brooklyn Bridge.

Does anyone have comments - is this doable?

And then on our third full day - The Tenement Museum, the Museum at Eldridge Street (Just heard of this yesterday -supposed to be fascinating), and maybe into Chinatown.

What do you think? Where do I then fit in the West Village? (our first full day is the Met, possibly Frick but not if it's too much after the Met, Central Park and Wicked).

You don't want to go to the Ground Zero Museum Workshop. It is riddled with controversy and hints of a scam. It is a mile away from the WTC site. It is to be avoided.

St. Paul's Chapel, close to the WTC site, and the Tribute Center along with the WTC Memorial all offer an appropriate way to pay one's respects.

I really wouldn't pair the Frick with the Met. You could make your way to the West Village when you're near the Tenement Museum. Try not to spend all your time inside buildings when you're here.

Have you discovered the Foods of New York tours yet? They're fabulous. The Chinatown tour and the W.Village tour are really great.

http://www.foodsofny.com/

Wow, Bowsprit - what is the controversy about? It sounds so sincere (I read the website and all the reviews on tripadvisor).

re food tours - I did hear of them, I'm certain on this thread - but beause of dd's leg situation, I'm trying not to schedule any kind of formal walking tour. I need to really play the walking part of this trip by ear.

If you do a search on Trip Advisor's New York City forum for the workshop you'll be able to determine for yourself if that's something you want to participate in.

Re. the food tour: There isn't much walking as much as there is strolling and stopping to listen to the guide's narrative. In any event, the tour is not fast paced at all.

Also, many of the reviews on Trip Advisor were actually written about the Tribute Center.....

I just passed the Ground Zero Museum the other day, I did not know it even existed. It is on 14th Street and 10th. They are working on a museum/memorial at the Trade Center itself.

I was surprised to see it and would wait for the long overdue memorial/museum by the Trade Center.

I just read a ton of stuff about the Ground Zero Museum Workshop - I would never have known about it, Bowsprit, had you not mentioned it. On Trip Advisor, it comes in #14 on things to do in NYC, although it is apparent, as you said, that some of the reviews are clearly referring to Ground Zero itself. The people who obviously did see the Museum all say they were very moved. Still, the controversy is quite shocking. Was anything else written about it in the media aside from the New York Post?

I just ran a search on the NY Times for the past year and there was nothing on this independent museum.

When I passed this week it is located on a block which now houses expensive designer clothes stores.

From a personal standpoint, I truly resent all those who try to profit from the Trade Center killing. I always want to smack the vendors around the site trying to sell this or that. We visited the Memorial a few months ago and even that was strange, even though it is free.

I hate the vendors. I'm not at all thrilled with the visitors taking pictures in front of the site while their subjects smile for the camera. I really can't stand it.

Perhaps go to St. Paul's first, then decide if you want to continue on to the Memorial.

I'm not judging anyone's intent, but I wonder: Is the Memorial a tourist attraction? I guess it is but I just don't see it that way.

check out cheapchicshoppingtours.com
great nyc activity with teens

The girl is 14, but Coney Island is not on the list? Shame on you! Put on your flame proof jacket, cuz I iz bouts to flame u like a steak on a grill.

Take the subway (F or Q) to W8 st. Dont get off on Stillwell as it's a mad house. Walk across bridge to the boardwalk. Check out the park, the pier, rides, etc.

Then, if you really want to see how the rich folks in Brooklyn live, go to W36st. to check out SeaGate.

Take the B36 bus back to civilization, and go check out Brighton Beach. Then take the B1 to Emmons ave. or walk to Manhattan beach... no, dont even ask, it's not in Manhattan.

BTW, why would a 14 year old be interested in the Tenement museum?
NYC's only Aquarium is on W8st. America's 1st Nathan's, and the Coney Island museum is fun. Also, on the wall behind the baseball park is a mural to those who died on 9/11.

Why not even 6 Flags in NJ?

The rich do not live in Seagate. The average home price is less than $600,000 which could not get you a bugalow in Manhattan Beach or in the now super hip Park Slope.

Seagate is a gated community, which is rare with NYC, but MOST houses are smallish and it is an enclave of middle class families. Now inhabited by many from former Soviet bloc countries.

And whenever there is a storm up the East Coast, Seagate often gets battered.

http://www.trulia.com/real_estate/Sea_Gate-Brooklyn/5229/

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/09/05/realestate/05living.html?pagewanted=all
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There used to be three race tracks where Sheephead Bay and Manhattan Beach are today. And there was a spur of the Long Island Railroad which took people who wanted to get away from the City and people like Diamond Jim Brady had his own railcar.

POMAH - I didn't even think of Coney Island - but don't have a flame proof jacket, so put the grill on low!

"Why would a 14 yr old be interested in the Tenement museum?" - because it's supposed to be extremely interesting, well-done, interactive, and original. My dd loves museums, all kinds - art, history, science - actually, she's been dragging me to museums since she was small. She's interested in all kinds of things and loves learning and asking questions. By the same token, she'd be just as happy shopping, going on rides - the scarier the better - bakery hopping and food exploring, walking the streets, seeing amazing buildings, going to the Apple store, bike-riding, going to the theatre or to a concert, whatever. She's a varied kind of kid.

apropos above- vaca247- wow. This would be right up her alley. Did you do this with your daughter or do you know teens who have done it?

Bowsprit - somehow I missed your post re Milk and Cookies Bakery and smallest house - they both sound amazing - especially the milk and cookies!! DD will LOVE that. Are you familiar with any good shopping for teens in that area?

Aduchamp1- thanks for the many suggestions. Raffetto's sounds great - DD actually is taking a cooking course and that would be so much fun to do. Is it actually a sit-down restaurant?

No Raffetto's just sells storemade pasta.

For some excellent restaurant with store made pasta try Cacio e Pepe, it is Romano style and the signature dish Cacio e Pepe which is pasta turned in a hollowed out wheel of pecorino cheese with pepper. It is a strong taste but addictive.

http://www.cacioepepe.com/menu

If she is intersted in cooking Raffetto's will be of interest. Here are some other Italian provision stores that she will probably like. Print out the list and if you pass one stop in.


Bakeries

DeRobertis (Established 1904)
176 First Avenue
It has the original tin ceiling and tiled walls and floors. Be selective in what you order, order nothing chocolate but the lobster tails, cannoli, and pignoli cookies are good and they are known for their lemon and orange things. (I am sure it has a real name) They hollow out the fruit, then fill it with a sorbet and freeze the whole thing including a peel lid.

*Sullivan Street Bakery
533 W 47th Street
You have probably eaten there breads many times and didn’t know it. It is offered in scores of restaurants and markets. You can identify many of the breads by sight. They are brown and crusty will the inside is light and airy. A paradigm for carbs.

*Veniero’s
342 East 11th Street
Established in 1894 some of those people are still waiting on line. I love this place, the best inexpensive tiramisu, addictive ricotta cheesecake, moist pignoli cookies, there are scores of offerings and no losers. The take out staff is never the same and the lines are long for the café. For Thanksgiving and Christmas, the café is turned to a waiting room for take out. They use an old fashioned machine to wrap the string around the box, while quaint, adds to the interminable line. You can also call in an order.

Cheese
Alleva Diary (Established 1892)
188 Grand Street
Not as good as its neighbor DiPalo but extremely offers a fine selection of Italian cheeses.

*DiPalo Dairy (Established 1925)
200 Grand Street
One of NY’s great stores. Not only are the cheeses spectacular but sell perfect prosciutto. Their selections are impeccable. If at all possible avoid the weekend crowds, even though they have adults behind the counter. Expansion is made things easier.

*Formaggio Essex
Essex Market on Essex Steet.
That should be enough Essexes. This is a tiny outlet from a Boston company. The cheeses are excellent but they have to vats where you take a bottle and fill it with a vinegar sherry or olive oil and both are redolent and extremely flavorful. There is some rules about deposits but I am not good at rules. The Essex market is a poured concrete structure with many stalls selling veggies and Hispanic staples with a barber shop in the back. Do not be deterred that it looks like pig farm from the outside.

*Joe’s Dairy (Established 1925)
156 Sullivan Street.
If you do not like Joe’s you do not like New York. They have been making mozzarella for over 80 years and the smoked version is addictive. The store is tiny, tiny, tiny and the staff is family and know their stuff and the neighborhood. One time I bought my mother-in-law a smoked mozzarella here. The next time I saw her she said she cut off the outside because she thought the outside was burned.

*Murray’s Cheeese
254 Bleecker Street and another in Grand Central
Best in show. They carefully choose only the finest quality of every variety. The staff is cheesemongers, one is even a gossip monger. The ricotta cheese cake is worth going to jail. This is a must visit for anyone who has the slightest interest in cheese.

*Russo’s Mozzarella (Established 1908)
344 East 11th Street
Cleverly they make fresh and smoked mozzarella which are excellent but they also make pastas, sauces, and there own olive varieties. Cramped but the guys know what they are doing.

Gelati


*Il Laboratorio de Gelato
188 Ludlow
95 Orchard Street
Everybody claims their gelati is the same as in Italy, blah, blah, blah. Their gelati is like Italy. It is the type you eat four times a day as you walk around Rome or Florence before you realize you have ruined your appetite for dinner. Expensive and cash only. (They just re-opened their old location next to the Tenement Museum besides the cavernous space across the street from Katz’s.)

Grom
Various locations
Expensive Italian chain now available here.

Food Markets
Unless otherwise noted these places are expensive or very expensive.

Agatha and Valentina
A large department features hard-core Italian cold cuts like soppressata and hot or sweet cappicola, while the cheese department sports a huge number of offerings and loads of free samples. The prepared foods section also has a thick Italian accent and is among the more interesting in the city. The just opened one on University Place.

*Citarella
Various Locations
One of the best spots for fish from standard stuff with gills to razor clams. Knowledgeable fishmongers. Same is true for meats. Their prepared foods are universally good with outstanding soups. The collect bread and cakes from various but good places.


Grace’s Marketplace
She is the daughter of old man Balducci, who was such a difficult character, she opened her own place. Physically it resembles the long gone Balducci’s on 6th Ave, but retained the good qualities such as the prepared meats and excellent meat, fish, and produce selections.

Eataly
Mario Batali’s theme food park. Mixed results with a frenetic atmosphere and high prices.

Meat

*Faicco’s (Established 1900)
260 Bleecker Street
They make their flavorful sausage, rice balls, sauces. You get the old schmooze from the guys behind the counter as well. If you like old fashioned Italian butchers who know what they are doing, this is the joint.

Pasta

*Raffetto’s (Established 1906)
144 W. Houston Street
They cut fresh pasta from sheets to your specification in front of you on a machine that looked obsolete 50 years ago. Not a gimmick just the freshest, tastiest pasta yet. They have many types including saffron. Cash only.

Both the smallest house and Milk & Cookies bakery were included in our Foods of NY/Greenwich Village tour. Also Faicco's, Murray's Cheese and Joe's Pizza (all mentioned in this thread)in addition to other stops. While the tour filled three hours, we did not walk a great distance at a time.

unbelievable Aduchamp1- what a list. Thank you.

And musicfan - thanks for adding.

I don't know how I'm going to fit in all the wonderful suggestions that have been made here - I keep vacillating between excitement about the trip and worry that I'm not going to fit in everything I want to do...!

What Adu said....(cheese/gossip monger, indeed!)

great list, Adu! Do you have a list for Paris, London and Dublin as well?

Sorry Ncountry I do not have lists for other cities. The entire list I have for NYC is much longer but I lived here all my life. And in order to have a list of the good places. you must also eat in a lot of bad places.

But what we do in cities like Paris and Rome is as we walk around a city buy chocolate, bread, wine, cheese, meat maybe, and pastries and throw them in our backpacks and have a feast for dinner in the hotel room. I love that meal and call it my Continental Dinner, which can easily be done in NYC. It is a wonderful way to sample what a city has to offer at a relatively cheap price.

If you check in your bags pack knives, forks, spoons, and a corkscrew. If you take carry-ons steal or ask for plastic utnesils and buy a cheap corkscrew.

Now that I realize that you will have a 14 year old girl with you, I suggest that you make an attempt to visit and eat at 'Alice's Teacup' (somewhere around Amsterdam and 73rd) - great lunch stop especially for a young-girl thematic eatery

ThomasSchwarzmann - thank you very much for letting me know about this place. I hadn't heard about it in all my reading. My daughter will love it - everything sounds delicious and the reviews were great (of course, I'll have to go when there aren't any screaming kids...). It sounds as though you're experienced - any other ideas for must-sees with a 14 year old girl?

My 11 year old granddaughter used to love Alice's Teacup. Now that she's 13 she prefers going to the Plaza for tea in the afternoon. Also highly recommended. Nothing like the Palm Court at the Plaza. And they love kids there. Of all ages.

Adu: You and Mrs. Adu should run tours. They'd be wonderful, I'm sure.

Bowsprit, you're a grandmother?!!?!! You sound so young and hip and energetic! You're probably the coolest grandmother ever!

The Plaza for tea....sounds dreamy. How are the desserts?

Adu: You and Mrs. Adu should run tours. They'd be wonderful, I'm sure.
____
Thanks. I have an English friend who said I should specialize with the British because I have the same sense of humor as them.

But it sounds like work.

But it sounds like work.
---------------------------------------

Only for you.

Exactly and any way I hate tours.

Wow, I had bowsprit figured wrong ,too. I pictured as a. 20 -30 s man.....

yep, I've got kids, grandkids, in-laws, dogs, horses, parents, a husband, siblings, etc. I've got them all. They keep me young. I am lucky. I am also cool and hip. Too cool and hip to use the words 'cool' and 'hip', btw!

I have a son in law who is in his 30's. Does that count?

Did not read this really long thread but....the costume museum at FIT is ia must see for your daughter. IMHO better than costume exhibits at the Met. Of course the current costume at Met is also must see.

Elainee: What is the current costume exhibit at the Met?

Bowsprit- son-in-law in his 30's counts big-time....and add in horses...wow, especially if you ride. I love that you appreciate it all, so inspiring!

Elainee-just yesterday I was on the FIT website- got linked there on a site about free museums. Showed it to dd, she flipped and said we have to go! Thanks for suggestion. We'll go to the MET too.

Btw, I told dd about the trip yesterday!! Couldn't keep it a secret any longer when she saw me for days and days sitting at the computer and researching and I also wanted her to get in on the planning. She started sobbing and screaming at the same time! She was so moved. This has been a dream of hers since she was small. She completely flipped out and is beyond thrilled!

You are going to have a blast. Take lots of pictures.

You're a good mom! I had wanted to go to New York from when I was little (I blame the tv series "That Girl"), and I didn't make it until I was 38!

Musicfan, I LOVED That Girl!

It was just wishful thinking on my part, Adu.... I am in Paris right now, heading to London, then Dublin. I am eating up this town and doing justice to the culinary effort though. I just thought your NY list was great.

Reporting back with tidbits from my last 2 days in NY with my teenager:

-Staten Island Ferry was fantastic!
-My son, who never liked shopping before, loved shopping in SOHO. He wanted to go back the same day. We had a great time at FCUK; they were having a great sale.
-Sunset at Battery Park was lovely. We are going to go out to brunch soon at North End Grill, a Danny Meyers restaurant.
-We found Katz's deli overpriced ($15 for a sandwich alone, and they only take cash..... it was a near calamity; my meal was exactly $24 and that was exactly all I had on me). It was not in a great area and we had walked from SOHO (Houston st. subway stop) on a very hot day to get there. It IS quite the scene and the sandwiches themselves are very good but not the size I expected (their website says they dare you to finish one). I did not like their knish; preferred the knish place 2 blocks west that features the owner in a photo with Woody Allen. You should stop in to see the Katz scene if you are nearby but don't go out of your way.

Ncountry

We live 10 minutes from Katz's and it is a fine area. There are some housing projects to the east that are dicey. But in fact one of the colleges just erected a dorm a few blocks from Katz's.

It certainly has a gritty feel which might make one think it is unsafe but the nights are teeming with under 30's.
And yes for a long time it was a tough neighborhood, but it has changed dramatically in the last 20 years.

There are scores of restaurants and bars in the area and now there are expensive shops.

As far as Katz's is concerned, if it is your first time there are many surprises including the price and size of the sandwiches. Two can share a sandwich and have a side dish and get by nicely. Their pastrami is at the town of meat food chain.

Re Warren's (Aduchamp1's) post about Cacio e Pepe, you can join Savored.com for free and get up to 30% off food and beverages.

Sorry - the area arond Katz's is fine. This is a city, not a suburb - and you will see all kids of people - inclding some very colorful, wherever you go.

I do remember when that area was not the best (people used to joke not to go without your own personal bodyguard due to the denizens in the drug culture - but that was MANY ywars ago).

And $15 is a bargain considering the size of the sandwich and quality of the meat. (This is like complaining that you can;t get a steak for $10). Sorry - this is NYC and a real deli - not a fake Deliland at Disney (where they would probably charge more than this anyway) or a chain "deli" in CA.

We dined at North End Grill for brunch this morning and loved it. If you go to Battery City, you could combine it with this.... it is right there. The Irish Hunger Memorial is right across the street and is worth a stop as well.

We had the best sticky bun ever and Bostock which is hard to describe (a sweet pastry) but it is sublime. We definitely will add those to our must dos on every NY trip from here on. My son had the shrimp and bacon cake burger with chili crusted fries which were unique and delicious. The lemon meringue pie was the best we have ever had and their coffee was as good as it gets, for me.

Thanks Burt, I always forget to use it. Last Staurday we had a wonderful meal at Gnocco and could have saved a few bucks.

NCountry
No problem. The Lower East Side has been a tough neighborhood for the longest time. I think this year was the 25th anniversary of when the NYPD brought in a tank to clear out the drug dealers and squatters from Thompkin's Square Park. And now it is filled with families and kids playing.

Did you tip the meat person in advance? If not you probably got a skinny sandwich. If you do, a sandwich is easily enough for two!

This is an amazing thread and full of great advice. RE the Brooklyn Bridge discussion -- we did the walk from Brooklyn to Manhattan. We took the subway to Brooklyn (doing nothing else in Brooklyn first) and followed some very exact and correct directions in finding the stairs to the bridge. Probably they are the same "idiot-proof" directions you found because I think I found them from a link here on this forum. The walk was hot (July), but not particularly long (a mile or a bit more total), but it's just cool to able to say "I walked across that" anytime you see a picture of the Bridge or see it in a movie, etc.

I did a trip report a few years ago. We traveled with kids also. Anyway, have a wonderful trip. I'm looking forward to going back soon.

I did, sf, I had read all the advice and tipped him well. He called me "sweetheart" thereafter. It was a good sandwich but I've had bigger, much bigger. I must have a big appetite; I could definitely have had a full sandwich all on my own. When their website says they "dare you to finish one", it set up an image or expectations that it just didn't meet for me. The falafel and schwarma sandwiches I had at L'As du Falafel in the Marais in Paris, now those made my eyes widen.

I didn't mean that the area around Katz's was unsafe or "bad"; just that it is not an intrinsic draw in and of itself.

kansasmom - how long did it take you to walk from the subway in Brooklyn to the bridge?

tamaraten - I don't remember how long it took, but I know I didn't think that it was particularly long to get there or particularly confusing. We just followed those directions. Sorry, it was a few years ago when we were there. Our kids were 11 or 12 at the time and had no problem (of course they weren't just recovering from a broken leg).

I believe this link will take you to the directions we used for the Bridge.

http://tinyurl.com/4rvrah

Just last week we took friends who live in the burbs around the LES for a food tour which they liked:

The Pickle Guys
Il Laboratorio de Gelato
Russ & Daughters
Essex Market-an odd combination of Latino stalls and hipster foods
Donut Plant
Kossar's Bialys
Economy Candy
Yonah Schimmel's Knishes
Then are scores of Chinese markets if you head a little southwest

kansasmom- thanks, I did get those instructions at some point way back and immediately printed them out. They do indeed seem quite clear. Now all I have to do is still decide whether we're walking from Brooklyn to Manhattan, or from Manhattan halfway out and back....

Update on my daughter's leg - (actually this is causing the indecision) - while her cast has come off, and she is (finally!) not walking with crutches, she is still limping and still in a little pain, especially when she walks, even around the house. But, as we're still going to physio 3x/week and we're not going until the end of July, I'm hoping by the time our trip happens, she'll be okay.....

Aduchamp1- sounds delicious - and fun.

another place that has good bread is balthazar on spring/crosby st. in soho.

i guess gus's pickles is now closed?

if you are near the metropolitan museum of art on 5th ave., you could try the absolutely delicious coffee and apple strudel at cafe sabarsky in the neue gallery.

one of the best cups of coffee i have ever had in my life.

thin

Wow, Pepper_von_snoot - I'm intrigued by the coffee recommendation. Can you describe?! (I'm a coffee addict, but limit myself to one huge cup a day - so it has to be good!)

Yes Gus's Pickles has closed but the owners of The Pickle Guys used to work at Gus's. Gus's is now out in Brooklyn.

By the way The Pickle Guy's have two addictive new products-pineapple in a brine and mango in a brine. We were speaking with the guy and now the pineapple is the second best seller after sour pickles.

Also if you venture out of the LES a little there is the main Dean & DeLuca near Balthazar. And I agree with Thin, the bakery is excellent with a curiously small place for customers to stand. And the best chorizos I have had in the US at Despana where they also import many Spanish provisions.

And in Little Italy one of NY great shops Di Palo and nearby Alleva's.

Adu: I had a terrible meal at Oceana the other night. What's going on there? I predict a closure or a major overhaul within the year. Pretty space: nobody's home.

I have never eaten there. If you want excellent seafood that is just a little pricey try Aquagrill. And if you want seafood that is a little more moderately priced try Mary's Fish Camp. Mary's does not take reservations and it gets extremely crowded.

I'm back from the city. I love Aquagrill but wanted to stay in midtown this time, to my detriment. I'll add Mary's Fish Camp to my list. Does Mary take cc's?

Yes they accept credit cards. But have a Plan B in the West Village as it gets crowded.

Thank-you very much!

aquagrill has always been one of my favourite places. i have been recommending it here for years.

love their salmon in falafel crust.

i like to sit outside on their terrace on a beautiful day.

can's describe cafe sabarsky coffee other than to write that it is real viennese-style coffee and very rich.

my favourite chocolate place in manhattan is kee's. it is near aquagrill, by the way

thin

Yes Kee's is wonderful as well. She opened up a shop in midtwon about 18 months ago. She was a banker or a lawyer and gave it up, before the recession, to make exotic flavored truffles.

Hi tamaraten, I remember seeing you create this post but I think after being on your other threads, I'd not replied to this one. Now it's topped and I see you're possibly heading my way, to Brooklyn!

That TripAdvisor link has some odd directions, or at least not the most direct...

The best subway to get the closest to the Brooklyn Bridge pedestrian entrance is the A/C. From your hotel at 54th and Madison, you can take the downtown E train at 53rd St/5th Ave and change on the same platform a few stops later for either the A or C. Take it to High Street, the first stop in Brooklyn, and exit at the front of the train. This will place you just a few blocks from the flight of stairs up onto the walkway (IMO a much better entrance than the out-of-the-way and bicycle-centric ramp at Tillary Street). When you reach street level from the subway, walk around the bend to the left so that you see the park across the street. The stairs are under the overpass to your right.

If you're okay with a few blocks' farther walk, from the same originating station in Manhattan, take the downtown F to York Street, the first stop in Brooklyn. Exit at the back of the last car - note, this station has two flights of stairs separated by a long, sloping corridor. But once you're out, you'll be on Jay Street in Dumbo, with hip shops, restful Empire State-Fulton Ferry park between the two bridges... and some of the best locally roasted coffee around! This place is a few blocks down Jay Street towards the river: www.brooklynroasting.com (You could also have lunch at Rebar (rebarnyc.com), tasty salads and sandwiches!)

Bowsprit, be prepared for a loooong wait! When we stopped by Marys Fish Camp two weeks ago, the host said three hours... We went to Fatty Cue instead. Still a wait, but much more bearable - and their cocktails make the time pass so sweetly!

FWIW, Marys has an outpost in Park Slope, Brooklyn: Brooklyn Fish Camp.

// I just dined this past weekend with out of town guests. I was angling for Aquagrill, but they were jet-lagged and decided to stay close to their hotel, so we ended up at the Grand Central Oyster Bar. You know, it's really not bad! My day-catch grilled scallops were amazing, and the oysters on the half shell are always good. One member of the party ordered a tandoori-style swordfish(!) and another's catfish was just that - fried fish. So stay away from the exotic and stick with the local/fresh! The wine list was good but they ran out of ours after one bottle, and the recommended switch was jarring.

So, a bit hit-or-miss, but if you're looking for seafood in midtown, I'd take the Oyster Bar over Oceana any day! (Never did care for that place...)

Balthazar is gorgeous as well. It is definitely worth a trip, especially if you are around in SOHO.

While Balthazar has a wonderful bakery, the restaurant is over rated and has become a place where tourists stare at other tourists. When it first opened "celebs" frequented the place.

Casimir is a more genuine bistro and has better food. And if the weather is good, there is a tiny outdoor garden. And is cheaper. And if you wish to spend the same bucks as Balthazar Lucien is better.

Mermaid Inn is also good but not in the same league as Mary's but the approximate price range.

for french bistro i like cafe d'alsace on the ues. the baekeoffe is really delicious. and it is a friendly place.

thin

ggreen - thanks for the clear directions. I'll definitely use yours as you obviously are in the know if we do decide to walk the bridge from Brooklyn. Still undecided on that issue... Brooklyn Roasting Company sounds heavenly!

good to know that about balthazar, adu. We didn't eat at balthazar, just stopped in but it was gorgeous.

It would be hard to beat my recent brunch at the North End grill in Battery Park. The best sticky bun I've had ($4) and Bostock ($3) and lemon meringue pie for dessert ($8). Brunch prices were very reasonable ($15-17) for such an elegant nice place with great service.

There have been other glowing reports about North End Grill. We will put on it our list for a future visit.

ncounty, you had a sticky bun AND lemon meringue pie? And I assume went for a 10-mile run afterwards?

yes, we enjoyed clam chowder and raw oysters at the Grand Central Oyster Bar yesterday afternoon. You can't beat the atmosphere especially if you're hosting guests. It was fun.

tamaraten, I totally meant to put in my two cents on that point, too-! Personally, I'd walk from Brooklyn to Manhattan. It's a little less crowded on the ascent. And it may be my imagination, but that ascent from BK feels less steep than from the other direction. Additionally, the renovation work on the BB means that part of it is covered over for the painting they're doing; they've been moving from east (Bklyn) to west. Currently, that coverage is closer to the Manhattan side than to Brooklyn.

Do keep in mind that the span is almost a mile and a half from end to end!

Here's another thought. You could take the subway (A/C or F) to Dumbo, walk up onto the span from that side and turn around before crossing entirely. Of course you could take either of the subways back - or you could take the ferry to Wall Street! It leaves just below the base of the Brooklyn Bridge anchorage in Brooklyn Bridge Park and drops you at the eastern end of Wall Street (zoom in on a Google Map and you can see the line). The Brookyn Ice Cream Factory is (too) conveniently located at the pier...

Bowsprit, and that was even before my impromptu review! Glad you enjoyed it too. Was the clam chowder up to New England standards?

ggreen: Everything was great at GCT Oyster Bar.

I lost 2 lbs. after this trip, sf! I had a sticky bun, and bostock (a wonderful almond cake thingy, sublime), AND lemon meringue pie, lol.

The only thing I didn't care for at NE Grill was the bucatini with lobster, Adu. I would avoid that one. My son's shrimp and bacon cake burger with spice dusted fries was very flavorful.

Walk and gawk.

HTTY

Thanks. I will never remember what not to have.

For a big hamburger go to any Five-Guys. biggest burgers, w/seasoned fries, wow! free soda re-fills too.

BTW, Wendy's now has the best grilled chicken sandwich.

please do avoid the W hamburger at Burger King; people have gotten sick from it, and throw it out, as I did. Trust me, this W has something in it that's making people throw it up.

Trust me, this W has something in it that's making people throw it up.
______
POMAH, if there is one thing I trust you about, is what makes people throw up.

Happened upon your listing tonight and have a few thoughts/suggestions: breakfast at 'Good Enough to Eat' (try the strawberry butter on homemade buns and any omelet) - when you get to the hotel, relax, walk around the neighborhood commotion, but get plenty of sleep - don't pass up the Museum of Natural History...the subway should not at all be intimidating, just ask anyone - cops, fellow riders, subway kiosk - and definitely get the official/free subway map called The Map, it has all the routes throughout the city...enjoy!

It's October 2012 and I'm going to NYC Dec. 17-21, this thread has been so very, very helpful, thank you. Tamaraten-I hope you and our daughters trip was fantastic and thanks for asking so many questions.