The REAL Buenos Aires

I just visited BA in May so cannot take u up on your offer. I would only note that my "cicerone" gave me a similar experience and it was one of the things I loved about my trip. We went to la Lucilla where he lives, took a local bus and train, went to a parillaa where I was indeed the only non Spanish speaker - why don't u register with the Cicerones avrooster?

Well, Hobbes, thank you for your suggestion, but I am rather independent, so I prefer to do this on my own. La Lucila railway station, by the way, is two stops ahead of mine. I gather you did not get to see the "cartonero" train? Do you expect to come back any time soon?

well, I don't really know if you are joking about this or serious...as someone who takes a crowded commuter train every day betwee Baltimore and Washington, DC, the idea of doing it on my vacation is a bit silly (it's part of what I want to get away from), but then again, I travel also to see how people "really live."

However, if you are serious, I'm up for it as a way to spend part of my evening in BsAs. I'll be there in NOvember. I've also contacted the cicerone, and they sound great, but would meet with you too...that is, if you are serious.

send me an email ourgalellen@yahoo.com if you want to chat about this further!

ciao, Ellen
ps. of course, I'd reciprocate. and, I'll let you know now, the commuter train at rush hour is quite the unpleasant experience....

Hi, elr!

Of course I'm serious. Some people I took on this tour were quite well-heeled (they were staying at the best hotel in town) and they loved every minute of it, including the standing-room-only "colectivo" and the crowded rush hour train.

Did you read the first reply to my offer by "hobbes"?

When you reciprocate, I'm sure I will enjoy taking your "crowded commuter train between Baltimore and Washington, DC", but most certainly not every day, of course.

I'll write to your e-mail tomorrow.

well, I'm not all that "well-heeled," and never stay in the finest hotels! can I still join you?!

the more I think about this, the more interesting it sounds! I look forward to your email!

Hi, elr!

My offer says my tour "should be of interest to intelligent foreign tourists." You certainly can be "intelligent" while not necessarily "that well-heeled".

So, obviously, you can join me.

I've been reading your previous posts, trying to understand what you are looking for.

I'll write to your e-mail later. Gotta run now.

Anyway, we are FIVE MONTHS away from your visit, so we have plenty of time to plan.

just so you know, I also post on virtualtourist.com, if you need more insight. I go by "ellielou." No offense to anyone on fodors, which has been incredibly helpful, but the board there is a bit different, much more international, and more "backpacker" types. I "travel" between the two boards because they are both helpful in different ways....and I feel that as I traveler, I'm sort of in the middle...!

yes, five months is a long time to plan, but, then again, it gives me something nice to think about during my very long commute and when I'm "pushing paper" in my cubicle!

We'll stay 5 days in B.A. frm Dec.18, 2005.
2 couples, no kids anymore, ~55. We are interested in such tour. Sign us up for one of the days.

elr and Govacgo: Too tired today, will write tomorrow.

elr: I did some checking with a search engine for "Día de la Tradición" and found its festivities are celebrated in San Antonio de Areco on the Sunday after Nov. 10, which is Nov. 13, right in the middle of your stay. I do NOT promise anything, but since I've never been to it, I just MAY drive you out there (about 70 miles), if I'm in the mood, of course. It's bound to be crowded, which I do not like much.

To elr: I expect your comments about the "Día de la Tradición" information I gave you. You can e-mail me to albertovgallo@yahoo.com for further information about my "REAL Buenos Aires" tour. It seems we could do it on Monday, Nov. 14, but I am not quite sure you will still be in Buenos Aires on that date. Friday is not a good day for me to do my tour, because I'm always very busy from Friday afternoon until Saturday afternoon. I read other posts from you and it seems to me you are giving Uruguay too many days, but, of course, it's a matter of taste.

Got into virtualtourist.com, but it felt to me more like a site to meet people than to get travel advice, with all the pictures of the members and that kind of stuff.

I have also written a little on tripadvisor.com and I feel it is better, if all you want is advice from other travelers.

OK, Govacgo, we can do my tour on December 20 or 21. There are four of you and that is an ideal number of people for my tour, as indicated in my post.

We can go on writing here, or, if you prefer, you can e-mail me to albertovgallo@yahoo.com

Is there anything else you would like to know about Buenos Aires and/or my tour?

hi,
I was expected an email because I thought that perhaps we should chat off this board. And, I really appreciate your potential offer of driving all the way to San Antonio for the fiesta! I'm just afraid that it may be too tour bus oriented....

Regarding virtualtourist, that's what I thought at first, that it was some dating site; sure, some of that goes on, but I've made real, live friend there (I know people have on fodors, too), and it's easier to see if people have similar sensibitilies by how they put together their travel pages.

anyway, I'm writing to you on your yahoo account now!

see you there!

Hello. I will be visiting Argentina and Brazil in September and would be very interested in your real tour. I am going with a group and we arrive in BA on September 6 for a few days, don't remember the exact date we leave as I just booked the tour this week. I'm sure others in my group would also be interested. If you give me your email address, we can discuss further. Kind regards, Maura

Hi, Maura NYC:

We could do my tour in the late afternoon of September 6, 7 or 8.

As indicated higher up on this thread, my e-mail is albertovgallo@yahoo.com.

I look forward to hearing from you.

avrooster, I think this type of tour sounds fascinating. We will be visiting Bueonos Aires on a South American cruise and will be in B.A. 3 days ( February 7,8 and leave at 5:00pm on February 9, 2006). We live in Southern California and would welcome recipricating. My email is: marciematassa@adelphia.net

If you email me, please put something like Buenos Aires in the subject line or I'll delete it thinking it's spam.

Hi, petlover!

We have two dogs and 4 cats, mostly strays we picked up, so we are pet lovers too.

The problem with your dates is that early Feb. in Argentina is like early August in the US, holiday time.

So, I have no idea, at this writing, where I'll be at that time. It could most likely be in Bariloche, a place you certainly should visit when you get a chance (splurge on the Llao-Llao hotel and resort), but it could also be Disney (Orlando) or Anywhere, World.

Please DO write to me again in Nov. or Dec. Maybe at that time I'll know for sure whether I'll be in town or not in early Feb. 2006. It should be quite warm in Feb. and I think maybe a fodor's member called santiagov could have a good boat outing in the Río de la Plata to suggest, which would be perfect for that time of the year.

You are welcome to ask me anything else you wish to know about Buenos Aires. I'm no expert, but I should be able to at least point you the right way.

AVrooster, you have referred in a couple of your postings to the best hotel in Buenos Aires. In your opinion which is the best hotel in Buenos Aires?
If you were planning a trip to Tierra del Fuego from Buenos Aires, how would you do it?
Thanks. Your postings are quite interesting.

Hi, cmcfong!

The Alvear Palace Hotel is, almost indisputably, the best hotel in South America, particularly if you like "old style" hotels.

About Tierra del Fuego, I have never been there and I am not quite sure what you want to know, but I'd certainly fly there, if that is what you are asking.

Thank you, AVrooster. I was wondering if one should go there from Buenos Aires or whether one should go from Santiago. I will be coming from the USA.

cmcfong: I would say fly from BA. I would NOT drive from BA to Tierra del Fuego. I have seen you asking about that in another thread.

Extreme poverty is a constant in all major cities of the world.
I have seen Homeless people in New York doing what you describe as a "deplorable spectacle", rummaging through other people's garbage to find something to eat. I have seen it in Lima, Rio, Delhi, Panama, You name it and its not something I feel compelled to see.
What you show is maybe the other face of BA, not the real BA.

Thank you, AVRooster.

lelc00

You raise an interesting distinction between the "real" Buenos Aires and "another face" of BA. There are over 40 distinct neighborhoods in the city itself and probaly an equal number of suburbs in the Provincia or Buenos Aires...Each has its own face, or distinct way of life....As well, there are different faces for people in different socio economic levels...sometimes even within the same general class there are differences...Cartoneros, Piqueteros, workers in recovered factories, kids who juggle at intersections for tips, maids, etc...are all poor and lower-working class, but their lives are very different....and at the other end of the spectrum, I have a friend who lives in Martinez who has a second house near a ski area and collects Rolex watches....He makes obscene amounts of money in the construction business.....all are the "real" BA....just different faces of the same city...

The other point I agree with, though perhaps for different reasons, is a negative reaction to watching the poor try to eek out a meager existance...followed by dinner out at a nice restaurant.....Go to a recovered factory and buy some of the goods produced by the poor or volunteer in a Comedor (soup kitchen) if you are interested in understanding poverty in BA......just my two cents worth....

actually, I took the idea of seeing the "cartonero" train as something along the lines of confronting the reality of poverty that tourist rarely see, rather than as a "curiosity" of watching poor people as some spectacle.

I've been on work trips, where I've met with workers in border towns in Mexico and farmworkers in the Dominican Republic, and these have all been incredibly meaningful, and help gain a true sense of place. Of course, it is uncomfortable....I've spent time in SE Asia, where the gov't tries to make sure travelers don't really see the poverty....etc. Of course, there's plenty of povery in the U.S., too, including a few blocks from my house in Baltimore.

I don't need to defend AVRooster, since he could do it himself, but perhaps the use of the world "spectacle" was unfortunate. I found the idea of this trip was to be a "learning experince," and "real" was meant as opposed to "tourist," but was not meant to be the very last word in understanding the city....

Thankfully rather busy at this time, but this thread is now getting REALLY interesting.

Will post later today. Hopefully, there will be still more opinions by then.

Av rooster doesn't need to defend himself in my oponion...the service he has volunteered to provide is great, providing tourists a glimpse of life that gets them off the tourist trail. His independent service and the Cicerones organization provide a valuable service...the idea of riding a train and a colectivo to the suburbs is an excellent way of experiencing life as a Porteno experiences it.....

I would also agree that it is good to find out about poverty in Argentina instead of remaining at a distance from it....but I think a better way to do it is via volunteering or visiting a recovered factory and buying goods produced by the poor and not merely observing the poor...

drdawggy,
I agree with you. It is best to buy locally when one travels, and to stay in accomodations that support the local economy, and not in hotels, etc. that support large, U.S.and European -based hotel companies, etc.

However, the first step in helping people in poverty, is understanding the situation; I don't want to get into a discussion of global economics here, but I think it's important to see that all economic models have problems, and, in general, one size does not fit all....

drdawggy: since you are the acknowledged American expert on these matters, do you think you could help lelc00 who posted a question 11 days ago and got no replies?

av, I have stayed in many hotels in BsAs...but since I have not stayed at the Sofitel I did not respond to the original question..I have eaten in Le Sud, the Sofitel restaurant, and like it very much. I also like the Retiro location, but the rates are too high for me....I agree with you about the Alvear being the best hotel in South America, but the rates are too high there as well....I limit myself to an occasional glass of wine and a stroll through the lobby of this great hotel....

I think the best bargains in Buenos Aires are in the mid-price or four star range....many five star hotels cost as much in BA as in other parts of the world.....

This is what I love about the Internet. Everyone can have his say and we can agree or disagree or, even better, agree to disagree.

First, I’ll somewhat reluctantly concede two points:

1) Maybe, just maybe, “the other face of BA” would have been a better name for my tour, but I do not feel its name is THAT important.

2) Maybe, just maybe, as elr (my first “volunteer”) says: “perhaps the use of the word "spectacle" was unfortunate.”

Next I’ll reply, perhaps somewhat aggressively:

lelc00 has chosen to tour Buenos Aires by staying at the Puerto Madero Hilton, dining at “Cabaña las Lilas” and “El Mirasol”, going to “Señor Tango”, keeping away from “achuras” (some of which I like, but this is wholly a matter of taste) and labeling our famous Calle Florida as a “more insecure shopping zone”.

Well, that’s great and it’s his privilege. He’s certainly sticking strictly to the places which we locals call “for export” and maybe even hearing more English than Spanish spoken while he is staying in Argentina.

That is exactly the opposite of what my tour offers, because, as I promised in my first posting, “my guests will NOT find a single tourist in the places where I will take them.”

drdawggy “gets it” when he says: “the idea of riding a train and a colectivo to the suburbs is an excellent way of experiencing life as a Porteño experiences it”. But, then he adds: “volunteer in a Comedor (soup kitchen) if you are interested in understanding poverty in BA”. I wonder how many tourists would volunteer for this. If any, I know of a place where they could apply.

elr really “gets it” when she says: “the first step in helping people in poverty, is understanding the situation”. That is why I said in my first posting: “it will help you understand the Argentine crisis better than any book. Of course, I'll offer my own theories about why this happened and gaze into my crystal ball for the future.”

lelc00: comparing our “cartoneros” to what you have seen in New York, Lima, Rio, Delhi and Panama is not valid. Some of the people you saw in those places, most likely the ones in India, maybe were actually starving and that is why they were and I quote YOU: “rummaging through other people's garbage to find something to eat.”

What I said was that the cartoneros “have to make a living rummaging through other people's garbage”, which is NOT the same thing.

In fact, the “cartoneros” roam Buenos Aires picking up mainly old newspapers and cardboard, which they sell to be able to survive.

But the important point here is that this "occupation" did not exist until a few years ago and is clearly a by-product of the late 2001 crisis.

One question: besides yours truly and maybe drdawggy, have any of the people on this forum actually SEEN the "cartonero train"???

Drdawggy have a very interesting point of view.
I dont think I am being insensitive with other people problems, I see enough extreme poverty where I come from, and in a way that is not worth to mention, I get involved trying to fulfill those people immediate basic needs more than I am expected to do. I would never make a profit with their misery.

When I travel abroad for pleasure, I have a better way to spend my hard earned Dollars, I deserve it.
I really like the face of Buenos Aires I know, sorry to disagree.

By the way, I like Achuras; riñones, criadillas, chinchulines, morcillas... all are very tasty but the criadillas, wich I didnt dare to try.

I got robbed by to guys in calle La Florida, they took my camera and a US$100 bill, but that was my personal experience. I would not challenge my luck going to more insecure places.

lelc00:

You are not being consistent.

On 08/03/2004 you advised this forum to: "Keep away from the Achuras plate, wich includes testicles and other organs."

Now you say: "By the way, I like Achuras; riñones, criadillas, chinchulines, morcillas... all are very tasty but the criadillas, wich I didnt dare to try."

Did you change your mind?

Last year after my first visit to BA, I was shocked with the idea of eating organs,
But yes,I changed my mind after my second visit to your wonderful city due to a recommendation from Cintia from wowargentina.
I repeat Achuras are tasty, but I wouldnt dare to eat criadillas wich are bull testicles.

Great, then maybe, just maybe, you will change your mind and take my tour.

avrooster writes: "This is what I love about the Internet. Everyone can have his say and we can agree or disagree or, even better, agree to disagree."
____________________
AV, spoken like a true Porteno where to live is to have antimated agreements to disagree over virtually everything...But better by far than the internet is to have these types of discussions in a cafe over a cortado or mate cocido.....

If you are available during the day sometime soon, we can carry on our conversation. I'll buy your coffee, as long as its not in the Alvear (sonrisa).....

Hi, Doc Dawggy!

I work out of my home in Acassuso and normally go into town only on Saturdays, to deliver my work.

You can reach me at albertovgallo@yahoo.com

So far, no one, not even you, has replied to my question "have any of the people on this forum actually SEEN the "cartonero train"???"

I will email you.

No, I have not seen the cartanero train...but I have certainly seen cartaneros at work in a number of zonas, from Retiro to Belgrano. I have also worked in a Comedor within view of 9 de Julio, visited a recovered woodworking factory on Cordoba (near Bulnes, I think), watched Piqueteros blocking traffic and stating their case for employment, and ridden many a Colectivo, including bus 17 from Libertad/Alvear to Wilde, which certainly gives a different perspective on life in Buenos Aires....

Today I am off to Ciencias Sociales to hear a lecture on the impact of Neo-liberalsim on the economy of Argentina. I don't think it will be from a pro-American perspective.

You sound a little like what in local politics we call a "zurdo". Am I right?

Doc Dawggy: I withdraw the question, since this forum is not for politics.

I will answer anyway, but keep it brief....No, not a leftist...at least in the sense it is usually used in Argentina....

But I am particularly interested in the plight of the poor in Argentina, especially in the wake of the crisis of 2001...and efforts to combat poverty....

Hi, Doc!

I am no expert on "the plight of the poor in Argentina, especially in the wake of the crisis of 2001...and efforts to combat poverty...." but perhaps I can help you understand.

So, write to me like you said you would.

At this writing, I expect to be in the Recoleta area Saturday afternoon, not sure of the exact time yet.

Hi, everybody!

The good drdawggy and his students may be taking my tour sometime within the next few days.

As an American who lives part of the time in BA, he is, at least as far as I'm concerned, the acknowledged top foreign authority on Argentina in this forum.

I imagine he will write a report on my tour and post it here, so everybody (myself included) can find out how good (or bad) it is.

Hi, nomadwoman! This is my "The REAL Buenos Aires" thread.

avrooster,

We're on! My wife and I are coming to Buenos Aires in late Oct. and I can't think of a better way to get to know your City. Please contact me at nicecolors@colorpeople.com. I can't wait to show you around the magnificent mountains of Colorado in return and serve you a Buffalo Steak!
PAPAJAS

Great, Mr. PAPAJAS!

As indicated higher up on this thread, my e-mail is albertovgallo@yahoo.com

Contact me at your convenience, to arrange for the exact day and time. As indicated in my first post on this thread, my tour has to be done from Monday to Thursday at about 6,30 PM.

Furthermore, I would suggest doing it during the first part of your stay, so, if we hit it off (which I'm sure we will) maybe we can arrange for other activities during the rest of your stay.

Next Wednesday, Sept. 7, I'll have forum member MauraNYC as the first volunteer for my tour, so it is very likely that, before you leave for Argentina, we'll have here some feedback from her about my tour.

I imagine the Colorado mountains must be really beautiful and I hope I will like buffalo steak.

Hello fellow travelers. I just wanted to post a message informing you all that I was the first person to take avrooster's alternative BA tour. It was most interesting to say the least. As Alberto says words can't describe the cartonero train, you have to see this to believe it. I also enjoyed seeing the very nice shopping center and supermarket, I think the biggest I have ever seen with the cheapest prices I have also ever seen!
We also went to a very nice Brazilian restaurant, Rodizio, in the port - I am not a red meat eater so part of the experience was lost on me but the food was very high quality and of course very reasonably priced for a non Argentinian. If you are a curious traveler I highly suggest taking this tour which is free of charge.

Dear AVRooster

Can you help me? I am bringing a group of 16/17 year olds to play rugby in Argentina. This is not my first trip but I woinder if you can give me info about what to do with the boys in towns/cities such as Parana, Cordoba, Venado Tuerto and BA. I am looking for activities they will enjoy andwill also let them learn something about your country.

Thanks

EBAN from Cape Town

Hi, Eban!

I visited your town a quarter of century ago and always consider going there again, but the rand is very high, at the present time.

I'll think about your question, but it is a difficult one for me, because we only had daughters and they are already grown up, so I am out of touch about what you can do with a group of 16/17 years old males (except being driven crazy, of course).

One thing I'll do is ask my youngest (21) daughter.

You did not say what time of the year you are coming, budget, etc.

I must say I'm rather puzzled about why the parents of the boys on OUR rugby teams do not seem to be helping you with this, as they should be.

One suggestion: ask the same question on tripadvisor.com and direct it to santiagov, who does not post here any more. He may be better able to help you than I am and he could well be a former rugby player.

His English is not terribly good, but I hope you'll manage to communicate (joke).

I'll let you know if I get any bright ideas.

Of course, I'd be pleased to show you around Buenos Aires. You can write to me to albertovgallo@yahoo.com as indicated higher up on this thread.

Hi, Eban!

I saw you also posted this question in Frommer's and did not get much feedback.

However, in that thread you provided much more information than you gave me, such as: "They are coming to experience Argentina whilst playing rugby eg horse riding, boating, fishing, visiting ranches etc." I also read you plan to come next winter.

I again suggest you post on tripadvisor.com, providing as much information as possible.

Obviously, horse riding and visiting ranches should be easy and can be done in any number of places. Not exactly the right season for boating, but fishing should certainly be possible, particularly in Concordia and Paraná.

Again, I come back to the fact that the parents of the boys your boys play against should be of great help with this.

Of course, you could also research previous threads, both here and on tripadvisor.com and you should find at least part of the information you are looking for.

Talk to you later.

Dear AV Rooster

My humblest apologies. I did not go through your replies very carefully. Thanks for your offer.

I have been to Argentina several times before but am always looking for something different. Yes, you are correct the clubs we play against and parents who host the boys do help us tremendously but perhaps the readers may know something different and exciting.

Earlier this yearI brought a team as well and went up from BA via Santa Fe, Posadas to the falls and on the return we played in Concepcion del Uruguay. This was a great trip and the falls were unbelievable. We were there for 6 hours and the boys did not want to go home they enjoyed it so much.

See what you can do re more info and once again my apologies for not reading through all your replies.

Regards

EBAN

Hi-
It seems like you have a HUGE amount of "takers" for your tour.
I would also love to try it. We will not be there until December, though, so I was wondering if you could help me now with where would be the best place to stay.
We would like to be near the beach. Where would the best place be?
Also, we live in Brooklyn, right near the subway to Manhattan.
I look forward to hearing from you.
-rwsherman10@hotmail (feel free to email)

rwsherman10:

No beach in Buenos Aires.

You ask about the "best" place to stay, without indicating any cost limitations. That would be the Alvear Palace Hotel. Best hotel, best location, but expensive. If that is not what you want, or no accomodations are available at the Alvear for your travel dates, you should do your "homework", by looking at any number of previous threads in which all kinds of hotel accomodations in Buenos Aires have been discussed in this forum and other tourism forums and then come back with more specific questions.

"Cartonero" train:

For those of you who can read some Spanish, a reader's letter titled "El tren espectral" was published yesterday in our leading newspaper:

http://buscador.lanacion.com.ar/Nota.asp?nota_id=741937&high=cartas

Hola Alberto,

We are going o visit Argentina in late November we will be there for 2 wks some day in BA, Bariloch, Calafate and Iguazu. We are a group of 10 people and we are interested in your tour. We are flying form Mexico City (we are mexicans) and will like to know more about your tours. We will like o know some of those markets MauraNYC mentioned. If you can contact me at mcvelez@hotmail.com I will appreciate it.
We are realy looking forward for this trip!!!!

Alberto,

I noticed I made a mistake on the e-mail address... the correct one is mcvelezc@hotmail.com.
I am looking forward to hear from you soon....

Well, Mr. Mc Velez (I hope you appreciate my sense of humor), when I worked in the hospitality business I usually related well to Mexicans, so we should have a good time together.

I suggest you do your homework by reading carefully this thread and others I have posted in and e-mail me to albertovgallo@yahoo.com telling me more about the dates of your stay in Buenos Aires, the people in your group and any further information you wish to provide.

The mall Maura mentioned is called the Unicenter and you do not find many tourists there, because it is away from town, but near where I live.

Let me hear from you, in Spanish, of course.

Hola Avrooster..
Aqui estoy - a sus ordenes.
I hope to be in Buenos Aires from November 5 to 12th with a friend and would be interested in taking your tour. I am not sure whether my friend would want to though. Since it would be 1 or maximum 2 people, I was wondering if you have any other people doing the tour in that time period who I could join in with. Or would you be prepared to give the tour for one or 2??
You may wonder why I say my friend might not be interested. I am not sure she wants to see the "real" anything. We each want different things from our travels I think her main reason for going back to BA is to shop and perhaps eat and drink lattes in cute cafes. For example when she talks about the trip we took to Costa Rica, she tells people that what she remembers is "the nice hotel near the airport and the Tex Mex Restaurant around the corner form it." The "nice hotel" was the Hampton Inn (a hotel devoid of any character and besides not even that nice - but just like the ones we have here... So if that is what made the most impression on her when we saw all sorts of nature and more typical things in the country, then I am not sure exactly what she wants from her travel.
But perhaps she will surprise me.

This thread is getting very long... maybe it is time to restart it. (though it is full of interesting information and discussions)
regards,
Raquel

Hola, doña Raquel!

Only one person is OK. In fact, my first guest MauraNYC (see her post dated Sept. 18) took it by herself.

We would have to do my tour between Nov. 7 and 10 (Monday/Thursday) but, if you wish to watch a sport which very few tourists get to see, we may be able to arrange to attend a "pato" game (see www.fedpato.com.ar) on Nov. 5, 6 or 12. It is our national sport.

You can write to me to albertovgallo@yahoo.com

Quedo, como siempre, a sus gratísimas órdenes, doña Raquel.

BTW, I like this thread nice and long, just as it is.

Thanks Alberto,
I will email you within the next few days. Although Pato sounds interesting - I doubt if it will work because we arrive late Saturday afternoon and we will probably spend Sunday at Plaza Dorrego and maybe the Feria de Mataderos. (As you recall my friend wants to shop) So during the week would be best.
Have a good week..
Ciao.. hasta
Raquel

Maybe the Nov. 12 date would work for the pato.

ttt

to the top

Hi everyone.
I am planning on taking Avrooster's tour one day between November 7th and 10th. (exact date and time to be determined). If there are any readers out there who will be in Bs As at that time and are interested, why not email Av at the address he gives here and maybe we can make it a bigger group.

raquel_z

I suggest you to visit this bunch of "porteños"of different ages and interests but with a good level of English and fun at a public bar.
www.theenglishgroupofba.com.ar

Av,

I'd be interested in exploring the neighborhood with you - I'm always up for a part of BsAs that I haven't been to yet - and there are so many of them! No need to make it a special trip for just me, I'd be happy to join in on one that you set up with someone visiting (I think you have something coming up next week?), if that works for them.

Dan

Hello -

We are going to BA on Friday November 4 and will be there over the weekend. Are you available (we are a party of 4 adults)

Thanks
Mark

Well, VTmark, as explained in my post, my tour can only be done between Monday and Thursday. So, if you are here on the evening of Monday, Nov. 7, we can do it with raquel_z and saltshaker, whose posts are right above.

avrooster,
i'll be in BA nov. 8-13. your tour sounds interesting. i am interested in Argentina's economy and politics. specifically would like any information you could share regarding the formerly closed factories that have been taken over and are run by the workers. are there any other things like that are happening there that you can share with me?

Well, balibound lady, we certainly can talk about "Argentina's economy and politics.", in general. My views and theories run counter to most of what you will read or hear about Argentina.

More specifically about "the formerly closed factories that have been taken over and are run by the workers." dr_dawggy is an expert on that, as on so many other things. I'll let him know about your question.

About "any other things like that are happening there that you can share with me?" it is not quite clear whether you want to talk about these things personally, when you are in BA, or correspond on the subject. I prefer the former.

I don't know how much of an "expert" I am on recovered factories, but it is an area that interests me a good bit.

An excellent beginning point for information is the website for a Canadian documentary called The Take..
www.thetake.org Follow the links for tons of updated information about the movement.

Briefly, some of the businesses (not limited to factories, but including hotels, hospitals, insurance companies)have been successful, some have not.

There are two organizations that provide support for recovered factory workers, one very much to the left and the other more centerist. Unfortunately, sometimes they compete with each other rather than working cooperatively.

Some of the businesses have launched their own schools, day care centers, health clinics, and cafeterias...

Some city and provencial governments have bankrolled businesses, providing them with loans so they can purchase the business outright. Other groups of workers have no interest in purchasing the property. They believe it is theirs, because the former owners left owing them back wages and because the state provided what we in the United States would call "Corporate Welfare" to the former owners from state funds.....

In short, while it is one movement there is a lot of diversity withing the movement and success has varie widely as well.....

The Cicneros volunteer organization can arrange for one of their volunteers to meet with you to provide an overview and possibly to visit one of the recovered businesses. Some businesses are open to visits, others are indifferent or downright hostile to outsiders.....

Another excellent source of information is the Anthropology department at the Universidad de Buenos Aires, Facultad de Filosofia....

Hope this helps.

Well, balibound lady, I certainly delivered, so far, if I am allowed to congratulate myself!!!!!

Thank you, "Sage from Athens"!!!!!!

sorry for being so slow to respond. i had a very busy last few days. thank you very kindly for all the information. i have seen The Take and found the concept very interesting and inspiring.

avrooster - i will send you an email shortly. i am actually leaving for BA on Monday. if you have room and our schedule permits we would love your tour.

AV:

I have been reading the work of avrooster, santiagov, and dr_dawggy at various threads in this forum and at TripAdvisor. I must say I really look forward to every new post.

My wife and I ( dyed in the wool New Yorkers ) have been to Bs As three times since January '04, and the last time ( Easter '05 ) we bought an apartment on Av. Sta. Fe at Plz San Martin. That's how much we have fallen in love with your city. For 3 - 4 months every year ( starting a few years from now ) we want to make it OUR city.

So, as you can imagine we have seen many things, but it will be a good while before we have seen ALL things. We'll be there 23NOV thru 04DEC and would like to take you up on your weeknight offer. How about the two of us on 28NOV, a Monday night?

We'd love to explore your views, as we have Belgrano based family friends who have worked with us through the purchase, but we don't have a long list of Porteno contacts. In a way ( a good way ) your posts remind us of the English speaking realtor who worked with us to find our Bs As property, the late Jorge Gibbons...a really dear man who died before we could become closer friends.

Anyway, there's obviously much to tell, and probably not all of it is interesting or appropriate for all the thread readers in cyberspace. Give me permission to email you directly and I will happily do so.

Oh, one more thing. We're having Ana Luna pick us up at EZE and we'd like to arrange, with her, a day trip to an estancia on one of the days of our stay. Think about what would be your choice for the best 'day trip' experience.

SUSSnyc

Hi, SUSSnyc!

Nov. 28 is OK.

Of course, you can write to me to albertovgallo@yahoo.com

I appreciate your asking, as most people write without asking.

About the estancia day trip, you need to say what you expect. "Gauchos" dancing on top of your head? or a quiet day with a good meal and maybe some horse riding? It would be a good idea to post the question here and on tripadvisor.com, indicating what you expect.

Don't you want to stay for a couple of days in an "estancia"? I'll soon have direct feedback about "Estancia La Bamba" from a couple who took my tour last week and are staying there right now.

Go ahead and e-mail me.

Hi, SUSSnyc!

I'm sorry, but I have just realized I have a previous commitment for Nov. 28.

How about Nov. 29?

I'm expecting your e-mail

Just returned from a week in Buenos Aires. I took Alberto’s “The Real Buenos Aires” Tour.

I know there has been some controversy about how REAL it is and about the concept of taking people to see the cartonero train. From my viewpoint, REAL is very subjective. We each have our own realities and in Bs As - a city of 12 million full of diversity there would be 12 million realities… and this is one of them.

Alberto is a gracious host and very knowledgeable. The tour was as described. We met at the Retiro Train Station at 6.30 PM. We probably travelled a bit later than the true rush hour. The train was not all that crowded. As we headed toward Acassuso, Alberto provided us with information about the various barrios we passed through, pointed out places of interest and answered any questions we might have.

In Acassuso, a relatively affluent suburb where Alberto lives, we walked around to get a bit of a feeling for the area. Then we headed back to the station to watch the cartonero train. As pretour reading, Alberto had provided a link to a recent article in La Nacion to give us background about the cartoneros and their situation. We did not stand and gawk at the train and the cartoneros. We watched discreetly on the other side of the track and definitely did not stand there with our cameras snapping pictures. For me, the whole exercise did give me an awareness of one of the realities of Argentina after the economic crisis. I am not about to make any social commentaries on the situation.

We then went for dinner at a local family style parilla called La Porteña. In true Argentinian style, when we arrived at about 8.30 PM the place was almost empty. However by the time we left - after 10.00 PM it was packed. The prices were reasonable and the food abundant and tasty. As promised, we were the only tourists in sight. After dinner, we returned to Bs As by remise.

Alberto was the perfect host. He encouraged us to try things we otherwise may never have. He provided commentaries and opinions. Rather than a tour, I considered the outing a chance to spend time with a Porteño and get off the beaten tourist path. I would like to thank Alberto for taking the time to show us his city and a part of his reality.

Dan who accompanied us on the tour has a far better account of the evening as well as interesting background information in his excellent and insightful blog (the November 8th entry – The Burbs
http://www.saltshaker.net/

Muchissimas Gracias Don Alberto!!!!!

Raquel

Thank you, Doña Raquel y saludos a su simpática amiga, whose name escapes me at this time.

Thanks for your report Raquel. When I return to Buenos Aires for a real visit (not business related), I hope to meet Avrooster in person.

Thank you, SharonG!

As you well know, after our little misunderstanding in your initial Buenos Aires post, I posted several peace offerings, which I hoped would be accepted.

Come to BA soon, with LOTS of time to spare.

Avrooster, no problem. All is forgotten in the afterglow of a wonderful trip to Buenos Aires.

We just returned from Baires and took Albertos tour. We enjoyed a lot. The previous description is
as good a job descirbing as I could, probably better. My wife and I would just tell you what a gracious and convivial host he and wife are. He was
extraordinarily giving and helpful. I recommend the tour just to meet this fine fellow.

I have just returned from BA where I was priviledged to spend time with Alberto and take his "Real BA" tour.

Alberto is a kind and gracious host, who went out of his way to make my time in BA as enjoyable as possible.

Of course, the "highlight" (or should that be "lowlight" ??) was the excursion to see the cartoneros train.

The train trip out of BA was not as crowded, nor did it feel as dangerous as I had imagined. But it was certainly filled with numerous commuters who spend a couple of hours each day travelling from their suburbs to central BA to work.

We alighted the train at a station north of BA and waited for the cartoneros train to come through. Although there weren't many people on the train we saw, it was still a moving experience to see the conditions in which these people travel. A metal train, with metal bars across the open windows and locked, metal doors. It reminded me of the kinds of trains that carry cattle or other farm animals. And what would happen in an accident, or fire, I have no idea as people wouldn't be able to escape the carriages.

I would highly recommend Alberto's tour to anyone who wants to add to their BA experience and find out more information about the realities of life in Argentina after the recent political and economic crisis.

Dear Avrooster,

I have read the posts about your wonderful "real Buenos Aires" tour and am wondering if you might be able to give a tour on Thursday, 24 November? It would be for two people from Washington, DC. We have been to Buenos Aires before, and we love your fascinating city, but have never visited a "real" neighborhood. I am very interested in seeing a supermarket in particular, as well as the other things you have described. If you might be able to give a tour on 24 November -- I apologize for asking so close to the date -- I will email you at the address I have seen on this forum. Many thanks! Marie

Hi, Marie!

You can write to my e-mail address indicated in several posts above, but Nov. 24 is not available.

Tell me a little more about yourselves and that kind of thing, if you feel like it.

Your travel dates, where you will be staying, the phone number of your hotel, etc. would also be useful, in case something suddenly opens up.

At his time the only PROBABLY available date is Nov. 22.

Have a good trip and a great time in our town.

To the top for Muriel

You can run, but you cannot hide.

Nobody's hiding. I post here with serious info and fool around with my friends on TA. Did you read my threads here?

Yes, AV.....

I simply wanted others to know one of your friends from TA found you.....

in a playful way.

Tio Pepe

Tío Pepe: For some fun with my serious contributions here, I suggest a thread titled "BA..please help with name of shop"

I am leaving for Buenos Aires on 2/3 arriving 2/4. I might be interested in your tour. I would also like to find a hotel for about 30 bucks in Recoleta or Palermo Vieja.

I have 7 days, then on to Chile which I am not hearing good things about. I speak Spanish. I am interested more in meeting Argentinians or other travelers than anything else.

How do I contact you once I am in BA.

Thanks

John

You can write to me at the e-mail indicated in several of the above posts, but I'm afraid I am leaving for our South on holiday. Maybe on some other trip.

Have a great time in our country.

Very intiguing (especially as a photographer), but I'm a little cautious...has anyone taken you up on this offer?

Princess: Have you gone to the trouble of reading the whole thread?

You may also find some comments about this on the tripadvisor.com Argentina forum.

AV - reading the string I know that you are planning to be on vacation during February. Will you be back in town during the week of March 12 to 19?
Thanks.

My husband and I will be in BA on March 17 to the 20th and would like to take you up on your offer - please reply if you will be offering this tour and also will be happy to return the favour if you come to Canada.
rtrewin@nbnet.nb.ca

Claydine and HuberaSanti:

A good day would be March 18, as I have decided to do my tour preferably on Saturdays or Sundays, so it does not interfere with my work.

Please write to the e-mail indicated several times in this thread, giving me more information about yourselves, your interests, where you plan to stay, plus anything you believe would be of interest to me.

But Av, if you switch to the weekends, you lose the fun of shoving other commuters aside to get a seat on the train!

Well, I guess we'll have to shove the weekenders aside, instead of the commuters!!

This is in answer to an e-mail from Jeff Salyer, who is planning to come to BA in mid April:

Your question ("recommendations") is too general. I suggest you research this forum and the tripadvisor.com Argentina forum and you will find the answers to most or all of the questions you can possibly imagine about Buenos Aires and our country, from a tourist's point of view.

This way, you'll get input from many different sources, which should enable you to make better choices.

Once you have an idea of what the alternatives of greater interest to you and your family are, you can ask more specific questions on one or both of these forums.

Have a great time in our country.

I shall be in Buenos Aires by the end of this week. I am wondering if it is possible to take your by now famours tour.
As you know I have lived in the past in Buenos Aires, and go fairly often but I am always happy to learn and see new things. Thks.

Sure, Graziella. Write to me to check date availability and arrange for it.

Hello again mr rooster, we just met on tripadvisor i think! seems a very popular thing you have going here.

would i qualify for taking your tour? - i am only one person (i have an argentine girlfriend but i doubt she would want to take the tour, she is a little scared of the REAL Buenos Aires!) and have been in argentina teaching for over a year (i´m from england originally. with a bit of irish too). not sure if i match your requirements exactly! let me know...

Well, Mr. Abasto, now you are on MY turf, so tread carefully!!!! LOL!!!!

If you have attentively read my thread, you should know whether or not you qualify.

My tour is a barter proposal, which means you may have to show me YOUR town, if I ever get there.

Definitely NO tour unless your girl friend comes along!!! No danger, EVEN for an Argentine girl who fraternizes with a Briton. LOL!!!!!

So, if you feel you qualify, write to me to the mail indicated somewhere in this thread.

treading carefully....

sorry, i was way too lazy to wade through the whole thread! i did see the barter proposal part and kind of elected to ignore it, seeing as i don't plan on returning to my home town for a long time. i love argentina! (y mi novia tambien!)

but i can at least agree to it in principle

i will email sometime soon (though not immediatey). thanks av!

I just have one quick question. What's the national dish in Argentina and where can I try the best? I'm gonna 2 days in Buenos Aires in late March(I know it doesn't do BA any justice for such a short trip!)

The national dish is.....STEAK, preferably washed down with MALBEC wine....FLAN with DULCE de LECHE for dessert. For a side dish, try PURE de CALABAZA (mashed pumpkin squash....like sweet potato, only better).....

Pasta is everywhere as well..

Hijackers!!!!! LOL!!!!

Is there any great ice-cream shop around the Plaza San Martin area(or easily accessible by subte)?

hijackers indeed! though any hijacker that likes ice cream is a friend of mine...

fatbully, freddo is the most famous ice cream chain here in BA, and despite being a chain, it is pretty damn good in my opinion (up there with the ice cream parlours in rome and florence).

i believe the closest freddo to the marriott plaza hotel in plaza san martin is under three blocks away. walk down florida, the pedestrian street that starts almost right outside the hotel, for two blocks, cross the main road (cordoba) and then on your left is the shopping centre "galerias pacifico". there is a freddo inside there, in the downstairs foodcourt. plus it is a nice building, make sure you LOOK UP at the murals on the dome whilst enjoying the ice cream.

of course, you have to try a dulce de leche variation flavour. imho.

yum.

A fat hijacker and a British hijacker!!! LOL!!! Well, as long as they like Argentina, it's OK.

I'll definitely try freddo. btw, have anyone tried Chungo or Volta ice cream?

Volta is outstanding icecream, but there is not one within walking distance of the Marriott.

Munchis is very near, and the Freddos idea is a good one.

How about Persicco?

Persicco? Not one nearby the Marriott, but my favorite ice cream in Buenos Aires....Freddos and Munchis are close and the cream is yummmy

Well, I guess ice cream must be part of the REAL Buenos Aires, or so thinks Doc Holliday!!!!!

Sorry, AV, for borrowing your thread for a stroll down helado land


Not just ice cream but food in general says a lot about the real anywhere...
Galeano (you don't have to like his politics to appreciate his writing) puts it well--

"The stomach is part of the human soul. The mouth is its gateway. Tell me what you eat and I’ll tell you who you are. It’s not about how much you eat but what and how you choose to do so. How people prepare food is an important part of their cultural identity. It matters greatly to poor or even very poor people, who have little or no food but who respect traditions that turn the trivial act of barely eating into a small ritual."

since the thread's been hijacked anyway - I'll put my two cents in... Volta, spectacular - both the gelato and the service; Chungo, excellent as well, though their service tends to be a little scatter-brained; either of them tops Persicco - which after trying it repeatedly I've found has ice crystals in their gelato and has some of the most unhelpful and arrogant staff I've encountered in a gelato place here.

This is clearly your fault, Doc!!!!

And to think, I used to trust your judgement Dan. Persicco's raspberry (frambuesa) ice cream is nothing short of heavenly .....

Despite your flawed judgement on ice cream in Buenos Aires, I still plan to try the restaurant in Belgrano that you recently recommended..... lol

And now we return you to the feature presentation, The REAL Buenos Aires....

Is this tour still being offered Mr. avrooster?
It sounds very interesting...

Yes, jaspertl, it is still being offered, but, intentionally, not being promoted.

If you have read the above carefully, you should already know it is sort of a barter deal: I'll show you at least a part of my town and you will show me at least a part of YOUR town.

So, if you are still interested, write to me at the e-mail indicated somewhere above and we'll take it from there.

Hello avrooster,

I've seen from the last post that this tour is still being offered. I would definitely love to see the "real" buenos aires.

In return, i think you would find how enchanting Manila, Philippines is, if ever you get to travel here. By your description it seems that we may have the same thing to offer, although culturally it may have its differences.

I will be in BA on July 31st, would that be a good time to tour?

Thanks so much, hope to hear from you soon.

OK, muma! Please write to my e-mail indicated somewhere above, telling me a little more and we'll take it from there, like I also said in the post immediately above yours.

avrooster will respond to your e-mail almost immediately.
We plan to take advantage of his generosity this "spring".
M (SMdA, Gto.)

Mikemo: above I said my tour is "still being offered, but, intentionally, not being promoted."

Please do not promote it. LOL!!!

Be warned: AV does not kiss other men and does not drink Malbec. How he can call this a tour of the "real' Buenos Aires is beyond me. REAL Argentinos aren't ashamed to express their emotions and enjoy a good glass of vino tinto now and again. lol...

Ok, turning serious for a moment, taking the train from Retiro to the suburbs, witnessing the White Train with Cartoneros who represent visible evidence of the failure of the Argentine economy, eating in a local parrilla far, far from the tourist trail, make this tour worthwhile for those looking for a glimpse into the world beyond El Caminito and the Casa Rosada and other tourist destinations.

That AV conducts this tour not as a means of making money but soley for the reason of promoting cross cultural understanding (ok, that and an invitation to visit your hometown speaks volumes about his character and heart, even if he doesn't enjoy hugging or vino.

The FAMOUS drdawggy, who took my tour recently, INSISTED on kissing me when we met that day. Somehow or other, I managed to evade his hug.

Besides, he shaves rather infrequently!!! LOL!!!!

One more thing, Doc: "soley" ???? And you opened ( and never closed it.

This is a serious forum, Doc, not like the other place where we meet all the time. LOL!!!

Claro,
M (SMdA,Gto., MX)

I just got back from a great week-long trip to Buenos Aires, this time on my own – I’ve been several times before and love the place. One of the highlights was the Real Buenos Aires tour!!

Here’s what I did:
The first night, I took the Real Buenos Aires tour with AV Rooster and a very nice family (mom, dad, son, daughter, and grandmother) from Scotland. It was the second time I took the tour – the first time, I was so jet lagged I missed things, but mostly just wanted to take it again. We took the TBA commuter train from Retiro to an upscale suburb, an interesting thing to do in itself. Then we waited on the platform for the cartonero train. It is the cattle car-like train that the people who collect cardboard ride to and from Buenos Aires. The trains are old, very beat up, grim-looking, run very fast, and have no heat or light, and only bars covering the windows. Children ride them along with their parents. They make just enough by selling the cardboard so they don’t starve. B.A.’s a magical place, but that’s also part of the reality, and one I wouldn’t have seen otherwise.
We also went to dinner at a local parilla – great place, and I really wish I could have dinner there tonight. AV gave us the rundown on the various types of steak, and we split a few amongst ourselves and had some other B.A.-type things like grilled provoleta. The family’s tour guide, Mariana, also joined us. She is a native of Buenos Aires, cultured and sophisticated, and also warm and sensitive to the various needs of three different generations. She drove us back to the city in her station wagon, which was big enough for all of us. If I had it to do over again, I would definitely want a B.A. native guide to take me around at least the first time, and then to do special things on return trips. The city has so much to offer, and it just takes too much time to try to figure things out on your own, like milongas, getting tickets to the Colon Theater when it’s about to close for two years, what restaurants are a good value etc. I think it would be even more important if you have a family along with you, if you have limited time, and if you don’t speak Spanish.
I also had the good fortune to have lunch later in the trip with AV at the Hotel Alvear – what an incredibly beautiful place, with perfect service, and exquisite food. The buffet was wonderful, with the best salmon I’ve ever seen or tasted, other seafood, various vegetables and salads; also great warm dishes such as pasta with spinach, pork, and lomo. The dessert buffet was in an adjacent room, an amazing display of beautiful small cakes, creme brulee, etc. And they tasted as great as they looked. It’s hard to describe how beautiful the Alvear is – gilt, cherubs, chandeliers – and the buffet was served in a particularly gorgeous part of the hotel. Highest possible recommendation! It was a highlight of my trip, along with the Real Buenos Aires tour. AV is a real Argentinian gentleman – though he would be a gentleman anywhere.
I stayed in an apartment in Barrio Norte, which I rented on-line through Bytargentina.com. I wouldn’t have had the nerve to do it the first few times in B.A., but it was really affordable compared to a hotel and I just took the leap. The place was fine but the street noise was really loud just about 24 hours a day – cars and trucks roaring by, motorbikes, plenty of honking, dogs barking etc. If I do it again, I’ll make sure it’s a unit not facing the street. The ad said it was quiet, maybe quiet for B.A., but not what I’d call quiet. You have to put up a deposit equal to a week’s rent, but I got it all back with no trouble at all. I either walked or took the Subte everywhere from there.
Also took two walking tours with Robert Wright, an American who lives in Buenos Aires and obviously loves it. He’s incredibly knowledgeable and genuinely enthusiastic. The first was of Art Nouveau buildings and was fantastic. We went on Sunday to avoid the buses and crowds. There’s something wonderful on almost every street in B.A., almost too much to absorb, and Robert has found some amazing buildings I wouldn't have noticed on my own. I got a rich historical perspective on the city through its architecture. I also took his Caballito tour – it’s a middle-class neighborhood, huge, and didn’t see any tourists there. He also showed me a couple of parks in Caballito that have been recently renovated, after having gone to ruin with the economic crisis. Highly recommended.
Otherwise, I walked around a lot and tried to go to good restaurants as often as possible. I had lunch at Le Sud, in the Hotel Sofitel, one of the best French places in town. They have a lunch special with two courses and a glass of wine for US$15. Some of the best food and the best service I’ve ever had. Also enjoyed La Parolaccia, Riobamba 1046 (Italian); Nucha, Parana 1343 (fabulous bakery, had medialunas and café con leche there as often as possible); Cumana, Rodriguez Pena 1149 (empanadas); and Los Inmortales, Parana 1209 (pizza); and Confiteria las Violetas, Rivadavia 3899. One thing I love is the refined, formal service from the waiters in just about every place: No “You still working on that?,” “Let me get that out of your way” (as they snatch my food away while I’m still eating); or “My name’s Jason and I’ll be your server.” I went to lunch at Olsen in Palermo Hollywood, which is gorgeous and a great bargain, just for the experience. I didn’t eat big dinners and didn’t stay out late. I didn’t feel especially awkward eating alone – just enjoyed the beautiful restaurants and the food.
I did notice that there has been inflation in the past couple of years. The things tourists buy cost more now, but still affordable given the exchange rate. I took the TBA train to San Isidro, a well-to-do suburb, and bought gifts there, both in the shops and in the shopping area around the Tren de la Costa, finding them noticeably cheaper.
I also had a haircut and highlights for less than $30 – still can’t believe it – in a salon in a gorgeous mansion on Ayacucho. That would set me back $200 in Washington – maybe for a fancier highlighting process and more sophisticated haircut, but give me the one in B.A. any time.
If I’d wanted to, I could have gone on an estancia trip, or to a tango show, but I had done those things before and wasn’t bored for a minute. It was fun just to walk around and take pictures. Also loved the TV commercials and the telenovelas, even if I only understood 20% of the dialogue. I’ll be back at the first opportunity.

Hello Alberto;

My husband, Marvin & I will be in Buenos Aires over Christmas and would like to take your Real Buenos Aires tour, if it is still available. Our itinerary is already quite packed, but we would love to squeeze this in! Would it be possible for us take the tour Dec. 19th.? We will be staying at the Home Hotel in Palermo - I am unsure as to where that is in relation to your meeting place.

Please let me know if a tour is possible. I am sure a visit with you would be a holiday highlight! I met a man in Brunei when was backpacking through Asia in 2001. He was a local interested in giving tours solely out of love for his country. The Lonely Planet guide had short-changed Brunei, suggesting it was a place not worth a visit - this kind man took it upon himself to leave tourists with a positive impression of Brunei regardless of how short their visit to the country. Meeting him for an impromptu tour remains a wonderful memory from my travels.

I am looking forward to hearing from you.

ali2of3: I assume you have read this whole thread and are aware my tour is a sort of barter deal. Please write to me to the address indicated in this thread telling me a little more about yourselves and we'll see what I can do for you.

Hi Avrooster, we shall be in Bs As till the end of this week. Any chance of a tour going on?
Best regards,

I'm sorry, Graziella5b, I just saw your post. I'll reply by e-mail.

I replied to your bellsouth e-mail address.

We also spent our first night in BsAs on 19 Oct. with avr and his lovely wife. A truly magical experience with a great meal at Rest. El Porteño.
M (SMdA, Gto.)
writing from Iguazu, AR

Well, thank you very much, Mike. I know you live in the "pueblo mágico", but somehow I would never have expected my tour to be called "A truly magical experience". LOL!!

I certainly had a great time with the TA Local Expert for San Miguel de Allende and the enchanting Louisa.

avrooster: I would love to take this tour with you, if you and Teresa accept the first experience of a moonlight walk in the salt flats instead...LOL
Flintstones

Done, barter accepted, Angie (Flintstones)

avrooster, I will be in Bs As from the 14th of December to the second of January and I would like to take your tour. I don't know if I have anything to barter but would gladly buy you dinner.

Well, ciza, if you have read this whole thread you should know that my barter deal is "I'll show you my town/You'll show me yours." Please write to me to the address indicated in this thread telling me a little more about yourself and I'll see what I can do for you.

WOW, strange time this should show up, just as I was concerned about doing an independant trip to S.A. I'm going to save this for future reference!

What a terrific and generous idea!

Dear avrooster. My Fiance and I have just arrived and rented an apartment for the next month. We would love to take your tour if you have the time. As per your request - we are Canadians from the West Coast from the city of Vancouver. We would gladly reciprocate anytime, but strongly recommend a visit only in the spring or summer! I can be reached here by email at jsdyson@telus.net .

Sincerely,
Jeremy Dyson

It's a really delightful evening!
avr, when are you and Teresa coming to visit?
M (SMdA, Gto., MX)

Jeremy: I'll e-mail you. If you'll be here for a month, we'll certainly find a good day to do my tour.

Mike: To visit el Pueblo Mágico and stay at Mike and Louisa's home!!! It's a dream come true!! I'll see what I can do. Merry Xmas and a Happy New Year!!

AV What about scenic Abilene, Texas? You have a standing invitation to visit here as well....

Wow, Doc Holliday, thank you!!!!
However, isn't it dangerous, with so many trigger-happy cowboys out there? LOL!!!!

Happy holidays Alberto,

I am will be in BA on 2-23 through 3-8-07--my first time. I know that this is during your vacation time from reading the thread, but if you are available any time during that period, I would love to take your tour, if you are still offering it. Please let me know if I may e-mail you directly. I have read many good things about you and your tour both here and on trip advisor and hope to have the opportunity to meet you while I'm visiting.

All the best,
Kristen

P.S. I live in Santa Monica CA and would be happy to reciprocate if you find yourself here someday!

Happy Holidays to you too, kristen 990!!I do NOT expect to be on vacation at that time, so I'm sure we'll find a good day to do my tour.
Go ahead and write to me at the e-mail indicated several times in this thread.
If you have read this thread carefully, you already know what kind of info I would like to have.
At this time, I prefer to do my tour between Monday and Thursday, on a cool day, if we can find one during your stay.
Touring Santa Monica with you as a guide should be absolutely wonderful! LOL!!!
I'll look at my mail all the time!! LOL!!

Hi
My friend and I arrive in BA Dec 30. and are there thru Jan.4 and back again Jan.12-14.Any chance of a tour.Sorry for the late message, I just read about your tour.I am leaving tomorrow nite.
Lisa

Lisa, as I said in the previous post:
"Go ahead and write to me at the e-mail indicated several times in this thread.
If you have read this thread carefully, you already know what kind of info I would like to have."
Have a great time in our country.

Hi Avrooster

It is Bill from NYC. You might remember me. I went on your REAL Buenos Aires Tour in early November 2006. I had a great time, learn things about Buenos Aires, it's people, the Argentina financial crisis and even learned things about myself.

We did end the tour by having a very good steak dinner were the only tourists where the other two Americans who also went on the tour and me. I think I never told you this but the restaurant you selected to have dinner, served far better quality steak than some of the popular restaurants in Buenos Aires I had eaten at and was cheaper too!

Just proves again that saying “The locals always know were the good inexpensive food is served”

I am planning to visit BA in November of this year. Is there a REAL Buenos Aires Tour Part II?

Bill

Allow me a strange question, Bill:

Did you or the other people by any chance tip me for my services?

In other words, is my tour really free or not?

Besides, of course, the repeatedly mentioned fact that it is a barter agreement: I'll show you my town - You'll show me yours.

About your final question: sure there can be a part II, but November is still quite distant.

Are you available on Wednesday, March 14, to provide your totally free tour to a small goup of university students visiting from the United States?

Of course you tour is free!

But it was agree to before we had dinner that dinner was on the Americans.

We just skipped the part to let you know that dinner was on us until the bill came.

Bill

Doc: I would say yes, but I'm not much for planning ahead, as you know.

However, I'll tentatively reserve that date for you.

To further sweeten the deal, IF I am in a good mood, MAYBE you'll get a FREE barbecue dinner at Casa Rooster.

However, there MUST be something wrong here, Doc, because, as you "estadounidenses" always say, "there is no free lunch".

What do you think?

So, we're back, eh?

Well, I hope there is a REAL BA Tour II, and I'd like to reserve for late November.

Are there openings? I promise NOT to tip.

Tio Pepe

I'm not taking reservations for ridiculously distant dates, not even from you, dear Tío Pepe!

Anyway, with all this promotion, my tour may no longer be free by November!! LOL!!!

You know what, Tío? I would like to see the people who said I took tips take a long ride in the "cartonero" train!! That would "learn" them!! LOL!!

Due you recommend a hotel or apartment for a week's stay in BA. We would arrive around 27Feb2007 and would be interested in your tour. We live in the wine country adjacent to Santa Barbara, CA USA

Hotel or apartment is a matter of taste. For a whole week, I would probably prefer an apartment. I am now in Paris for 8 days and staying in an apartment.

I will not be in BA when you arrive, but I expect to be back before you leave. Please write to me at the e-mail shown somewhere above, telling me a little more about yourselves and giving me your contact info in BA.

Have great time in Argentina.

I remember this Avrooster fellow, strange bird in my opinion.. ha ha

We had dinner one night and he brought a sword with him...

He also invited me to the Masters Golf Tournament.

Next trip we will take your tour...

signed,

coastin

The reason I brought the gaucho long knife called "facón" is because the "other fellow" was coming and because all birds are endangered in your trigger happy presence

Old fashion expert from the OC:

I pressed the wrong button and forgot to add: LOL!!!!

ha ha... oh yeah the other fellow... And your right about the birds too. Good to talk with you again dude....

Hello, AV,

We are making plans to visit Argentina at a ridiculously distant date--mid February next year!

We are intrigued by your barter proposal and would love to participate. We realize that you don't book folks a long time in advance, but would like to know if you think you'll be available in February next year. Our plans have us in Buenos Aires midweek on February 19th and 20th. Are you currently leading midweek tours?

Of course, we will plan make firm plans much closer to those dates, but would like to know now whether there's a remote possibility of setting up a tour.

If you come to see us in Southern California, we can show you much that is not on the usual tourist agenda and some that is--if you wish!

Hi, goforfun!

I'm glad you are planning to visit our wonderful country. Will it be your first time?

There is no way for me to know, at this stage, whether I'll be in BA in February 2008, as that is in Argentina the equivalent of August in the US, in other words a vacation period.

If I am here, I'll be pleased to take you on my tour, which I am now doing ONLY from Monday to Thursday.

If you have read all of this thread, you already know I would like to hear a little more about yourselves.

I have several invitations for the West Coast, so it's very likely that my next trip to the US will be to that area. I was there way back, in 1979.

So, goforfun, let me hear more from you, to the e-mail address mentioned several times in this thread, or right here, if you prefer.

Av.... My nephews and I would also like to take your tour. Unfortunately, we do not plan at all. You and yours are also welcome in the OC, beachside, for a tour...We can also take you on a tour of the poorer sections of Newport Beach...

We like long walks on the beach and malbec...

You sure sound like the trigger-happy retired fashion expert I met and befriended in another forum, realoc!! LOL!!!

No planning at all...Sounds like you are just Coatin through life.

Our Doc means "Coastin", the TA screen name of a fellow I nicknamed "Tomasito". LOL!!!

Hola AV! I respectfully request you contact CCDM who has lost track of you.
Manenita

CCDM: I respectfully suggest you write to me to the e-mail address indicated several times in this thread and which you have used before.

"Anyway, with all this promotion, my tour may no longer be free by November!! LOL!!!"

I booked my flight for my return trip to Buenos Aires for late October of this year. I was looking forward to go on the REAL Buenos Aires tour PART II. Already did part one.

It is going to be real expensive? If so I going to add another day of horse back riding at Estancia Los Dos Hermanos or extra dinner at Casa Saltshaker.

I probably do both anyway and still go on the REAL Buenos Aires tour PART II.

Alberto, see you in October.

Bill
www.WilliamBert.com

Prices have gone up in Argentina, as you well know, Bill.

The cost of my tour has increased accordingly (30%).

Do your math, Bill. How much is 30% of zero? LOL!!!

See you in late October or early November, Bill, but don't forget there are lowly liars who have told censors from another forum that "gratuities are expected in return for his company".

I even take plastic, Bill! LOL!!!

Hi there,
I'm visiting from Washington, DC, and am interested in taking the REAL Buenos Aires tour. I see from the boards that you have had several offers from others to serve as hosts for you when you travel to the DC-area. I hope you would welcome one more! I hear your perspective is not to be missed. I'm in BA now and will be here through the end of August. Let me know if I may email directly to arrange...Many thanks.

Hi, Katie!

I expect to be picking up you and Shelley (Karmalaw) to take you to that dinner on Wednesday. We'll talk about my tour then, but Shelley gave me your phone number to arrange at what time I should pick you up, so I may call you tomorrow. I called just now, but got the recorder.

Hey Avrooster,
Shelley mentioned that a friend would be calling but I had no idea that you'd be the infamous avrooster. What a small world. I look forward to talking more with you soon!
Katie

What is a good time to call you today, Katie?

"Infamous" is an apt description imho.

Professor: the only thing I miss from the TA forum is not being able to correct your spelling in front of the larger audience you have out there. LOL!!!

Lately, several news reports have indicated that the "cartonero" train will be discontinued soon.

See:
http://www.lanacion.com.ar/934649
http://www.lanacion.com.ar/934412
Sorry, only in Spanish.

Should this happen, that could mean my REAL Buenos Aires tour will cease to exist. Or maybe I'll find some other facet of the REAL Buenos Aires "which should be of interest to intelligent foreign tourists" (using one of the key sentences of my initial post in this long thread).

Anyway, rest assured you'll have a great time in BA.

The real value of your tour is not the Cartoneros but the opportunity to hop on a train along with other commuters to journey to the suburbs and enjoy dinner in a restaurant where there are no foreigners...and to be entertained by the infamous AV Rooster.

The good doctor must have used his spell-checker, because I couldn't find anything to correct in his post. LOL!!!

Infamous AV Rooster,
I will be in Buenos Aires 29 Sep to 7 Oct for my first trip there and would love to take the real tour. I posted another item but I am new to this and hope to chat with you.
Michelle from San Diego

Hi, Michelle!

Have you read ALL of this thread? Do you know my tour is a sort of barter deal, like "I'll show you my town, you'll show me yours"?

If you have read the most recent posts, you may have noticed the "cartonero" train may no longer exist by the time you are here. I simply don't know for sure.

Anyway, I suggest you write to me to the e-mail address mentioned several times in this thread and we'll see what can be done.

Anyway, you'll have a great time in our town.

Hi, I have now read ALL of the thread. Apparently I must have skipped 2006, LOL. Yes indeedy, I'd love to show you sunny San Diego! I will email you shortly after I get my eyesight back. Whew, what a great story! If the cartonero is not running, I'm pretty flexible for what ever tour you feel like.

Is the doctor going to be in town? Perhaps he should start a culinary tour?
Michelle

I believe the good doctor is more oriented to wine tours. LOL!!!

I wine constantly.

I am going to Buenos Aires on 5th Feb 2008 and would be interested in doing the tour to your part of the town. Is this possible??

Well, Wonkyknee, I usually take my holidays at that time of the year, so I would suggest writing to me again in January, to confirm. My e-mail is mentioned several times in this thread.
Have a great time in our country.

Went on my second REAL Buenos Aires tour again. My last year in Buenos Aires I went too.

It was an extremely fun tour, meeting all the new people and the cost was just right. Free!

Have to wait until next year to do this tour again.

Bill
www.WilliamBert.com

Will you be posting photos of the venerable AV Rooster to your web site anytine soon?

Doc: Bill's photographic equipment is too valuable to waste it in taking pictures of older people. LOL!!

BTW: "anytine"? ANYthing argenTINE?

I learned not to shoot photos when I drink.

My photos turn out to be good looking people look like hideous monsters and monsters into blonds who are visiting BA and wonder if it is safe for blonds to walk the streets of BA. ))

But to be perfectly frank about it, if felt like a dinner with loving family that night. I could not capture the love in my photos.

Bill
www.WilliamBert.com

well you can't ask for a better endorsement than Bill's eh
A/D

I want to be POST 200!
AVRooster, I know your "Real Buenos Aires" show a little of the bloody `90 I always talk about. Tsunami-Katrina plus all the disaster, natural or not have a name in Argentina meaning unemployment, industries closing down, railways destroyed privatization, poverty and the social phenomenon of "cartoneros".
Just to say something and to be post 200!
Flintstones

Thank you, Angie 200!!!! LOL!!!

I am going to be in Buenos Aires from 12th to 19th January and would very much like to take your tour - what is the possibility of doing this? I shall be staying at Casa Palermitano for the week. Being Irish I have a spirit of adventure!! Look forward to hearing from you.

Hi, Wonkyknee!

If you have read this whole thread, which is a requisite for taking my tour, you already know my e-mail address.

Please write to me when your travel dates are nearer, telling me a little more about yourself, but keep in mind that January is a peak holiday period for us locals and I may be away.

Have a great time in our town.

Wonkyknee

Staying at Casa Palermitano and going on the REAL Buenos Aires tour?

Sounds like your are following my footsteps because I did both on my last BA trip.

Enjoy both I did.

Bill
http://www.WiliamBert.com

Hi AVROOSTER,I will be visiting B.A.from the 5/12/2007 until 13/12/2007.This will be my second visit,the last time being Dec.2004 when I visited to watch SOUTH AFRICA play LOS PUMAS at rugby.I live in JOHANNESBURG and also travel regularly and would like to take up your offer and then treat you if you ever come to South Africa.Please reply which day would suit you.
Many thanks and have good day.

Hi, André!

I suggest you e-mail me to the address mentioned several times in the above posts.

I visited SA about 30 years ago. I hope to do so again, maybe when the rand weakens a little!!! LOL!!!

Hi AV.,
I sent e-mails to your e-mail address and have not heard from you.I will be in BS.AS. ON 5 Dec.until the 12th Dec.Please let me know where to contact you inB.As.
Regards Andre'

Hi, André!
I have answered immediately all your communications. I wrote to you on Nov. 22, 27 and 30. Maybe you deleted them.
This is what I said in my first reply, of Nov. 22: "Good days to do my tour would be Dec. 5 or 6. Tell me where I can call you, in other words, where are you staying in BA and the phone number. My tour requires meeting at 6 PM and you'd be back in town by 10 or 11 PM."

Great thread! bookmarking

A whole month goes by and no one asked about the REAL Buenos Aires tour? I hope avrooster is still giving them because I want my third strip for taking the "free" tour for a third time on my next visit to Buenos Aires.

Bill
http://www.WilliamBert.com

About that "third strip", Bill, there are two problems.

One is that I have a bad knee in rehab after an operation. So, at this time, I have some difficulty walking.

Besides that, as mentioned in previous posts, the railway tried to cancel the "cartonero train" and was partly successful, meaning it apparently no longer runs in certain lines and still runs in others.

Yesterday, a veterinarian who has his business in front of the railway station where we normally get off the train when we do my tour, told me it was still running, but maybe not on the same schedule.

So, your "third strip" will have to wait until my knee is OK and we know for sure if the train is running and on what schedule.

Will we have to wait until next November to have you here?

I'm not Bill, but am planning a 2nd trip to BA in November, so I hope I can do the tour then. Of course, I hope your knee is all better way before then!

AV

I am really sorry to read about your bad knee. Do not worry when I come you just take care of yourself that is the most important.

But I am planning late November of this year. Spending less time in Buenos Aires and more time in the North, Salta and that region of Argentina. It will be my first visit.

Maybe I can at least shot one good photograph in Northern Argentina?

Bill
www.WilliamBert.com

Angie can help you shoot thousands of great photos in our NW, Bill, by showing you the best places.

Hi AV,

I will be in BA for 2 nights (Feb 18 and 19 2008) and then again Feb 23. One person. Are you still doing the tours? I would like to get some more info on this please.

Thanks
wes

wesmma11@hotmail.com

wasmma,

You obviously have not read this full thread - which is one of the requirements of taking the tour.

Otherwise you would know
(1) How to contact AV to discuss setting it up
(2) That currently AV has a problem with his knee that probably prevents him from getting around at his normal pace

and other inportant info

raquel

raquel,

I have send an e-mail to AV and also read the entire thread.

You obviously can't read or type!!

wesmma

Peace!!!
I'll answer in full later. No time now.

Wessma11

First of all - sorry for spelling your screen name wrong and for misspelling important.

As well as not being able to type and spell, I am unable to read minds.

If you have done as AV asks, which you indicate in your second. message, he will get back to you.

Again - sorry since you feel I did a very poor job in replying to your question. I will not comment on your either grammatical error or perhaps typo... I'll just fade into the sunset

raquel

I'm not much of a peacemaker, in fact I relish controversy, but I'll do my best.

Ladies first, OF COURSE:

RAQUEL, thank you very much for helping me with this thread.

PLEASE, please do NOT "fade into the sunset" or anywhere else.

Just go on doing the great job you do here and in other forums.

However, don't you agree you just MAY have been a little harsh with our new friend wesmma11?

Could it be the heady influence of the title of TA Local Expert for Costa Rica recently and most deservedly bestowed upon you? LOL!!!

Gentlemen next:

wesmma11: you said you wanted "more info on this" and that you have "read the entire thread". I confirm receiving your e-mail.

Whatever info you can possibly want about my tour is in the above posts.

Unfortunately, I don't expect my knee to be up to doing my tour in less than two weeks' time. Perhaps some other time?

Please try to post a trip report. Have a great time in our country.

AV,

I thank you for your response, and look forward to meeting with you another time. My apology to Raquel. I'm sure all this was in good fun, and I do respect her opinions. Although she's still having a little trouble with my name. Ha Ha

Wes

Raquel: it's wesmma11

One "s", two "m"s!

Got it?

Come back from the sunset and wish a good trip to wesmma11, will you?

LOL!!!!

wesmma11

Sorry. I apologize too.

I guess I am getting old..hopefully this time I got it right.

And (as usual) AV is right. Enjoy your trip to Buenos Aires. Its a great place.

raquel

Raquel,

Me too!!! I guess we're all getting older. LOL I do want to thank you and all on this forum (and others) for all the great advice thru the years. I have been very fortunate to have traveled quite a few places and used alot of the advice I received. It seems now on this, my first BA trip, my buddy of many years (and trips) will not be making the journey with me. He had a stroke 3 weeks ago and although he is doing fine, can not travel that far away, this early. My wife, also a veteran partner in my travels, can not go either due to prior commitments. So, at this late date, it looks like I may be going solo. Something I haven't done much of since my younger years. I needed to get some added local knowledge. AV's real BA tour looked like it was just what I needed. Maybe next time.

Thanks again to all

Wes

I'll see what I can do for you, wesmma11.

Are you going to look during your trip at that e-mail address you posted?

As I have mentioned somewhere above, my tour, which included watching the "cartonero train" pass and explaining the circumstances that led to its existence, does not exist any more, at least in that format, because the "cartonero train" was discontinued late last year.

However, the "cartoneros" are fighting to get it back, as reported today in our leading newspaper:

http://www.lanacion.com.ar/990818

A good friend told me that my tour was being discussed in another forum. http://tinyurl.com/2s4mm9

A self-proclaimed expert on this town referred to it as "people on other forums offering a tour to the cartoneros train, as if they were a tourist attraction."

Another friend, who has taken my tour twice, replied:

"I think you are talking about the "Real Buenos Aires Tour", which I have taken twice and some of the well known members of this forum too. Feel free to speak up if you went on the tour.

It was the few times in Buenos Aires; I put away the camera, watched and learned something. You can learn something about yourself, or others, the people you happen to be on tour with and maybe you are lucky enough to have all three happen.

But I agree it not for the tourists. It is for those who want to expand their knowledge of the world.

Maybe this is not good for tourism in Buenos Aires or the image of Buenos Aires but it is a true picture."

Thank you, Bill.

Another poster replied:

"The "The Other Argentina" tour that AVRooster so generously offers (I say generously because he doesn't make any money off of it) gives those tourists an opportunity to see the other side of life in Argentina."

Thank you, Roberto

I could ask many other friends who have taken my tour and know what they are talking about (as opposed to the self-proclaimed expert I mentioned above) to reply to that comment, but I feel it's just not worth it.

AV, I have unfortunately not taken your tour, so I don't feel I should comment. However, here is an article from this morning's Washington Post Travel Section. I will post a link. Sometimes, it stays active, and other times, you have to register with the Post. It is free.
Anyway, only in America would this kind of tour turn into a "Disneyland" event, complete with a stop at a gift shop at the end of the tour......
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/03/07/AR2008030701352.html
AV, maybe you can turn this into a "tiny url". Saludos

About poverty tourism....

Those who are interested in expanding their view or the world and the impact of "globalization" on the social and economic structure of countries around the world would find it instructive to acquaint themselves with the literature (online or in print) about the how the integrated global economy is evolving...and which groups are the winners and which groups are the losers....

With this bit of background knowledge about the conditions that created Cartoneros or the fabricas recuperados....a tour of a recycling facility or a recovered factory would be enlightening and educational.

In terms of AV's Real BA tour...the focus of the tour is much broader...it has always been more about a commuter lifestyle than about Cartoneros per se...and with the demise of the Cartoneros train...the emphasis on poverty is even less nowadays....

A similar tour in New York might include a guide who took a group to Penn Station to catch a train to the suburbs at rush hour, and a tour of the suburban villages and towns in which commuters live, with a dinner in a restaurant where there are no tourists....a trip made more interesting when the volunteer tour guide shares his insights into the political, social and economic climate..past, present and anticipated future....

I highly recommend this tour for those who want to experience a day-in-the-life-of a Porteno (sorry I am typing on computer where the alt 164 instruction does not produce a tilde...must have been made by an English-centric manufacturer )

Milltown, here you are:

http://tinyurl.com/2gx3dl

To do it yourself, just go to:

http://tinyurl.com/create.php

See you soon in BA.

Says drdawggy, the universally acknowledged TOP Internet authority
on BA:

"I highly recommend this tour for those who want to experience a day-in-the-life-of a Porteño" (I corrected the lack of an "ñ" in his computer).

Wow, this could make my tour even more popular than I want it to be!

I'll have to do something about that! LOL!!!

Drdawggy recently asked:

"Will there be a quiz? To be certain prospective tour goers have read all 206 posts from the thread?"

THAT would be great admission requirement! LOL!!!!

AVRooster

That is why Buenos Aires is special for me. I seem to have done many first time thing while in BA.

First time gone horse back riding and did it at Estancia Los Dos Hemanos. First time I have taken a cooking class and that was Cooking with Teresita for some empandas. First time I gone to some one's home to have dinner, paying for the privilege to eat in their home. That was at Casa Saltshaker.

And in Buenos Aires, it was the first time I gone on a non touristy tour and enjoyed it. The was the REAL Buenos Aires tour.

I know I am a better person for all these first I did.

AV look for an email from me. On was recently on TV here in New York City. Of course the only thing I would be on TV is as a photographer.

Bill
http://www.WilliamBert.com

You seemed REALLY happy among all those "plus" gals, Bill! LOL!!!

Hi Avrooster, Have been reading with interest your many posts and in particular, this one. Are you still running these tours? If so, we are spending a month in BA in December at teh end of our year long round the world trip and would very much like to take advantage of your tour and your knowledge. Do you have an email address I can contact you on?

Hi, crellston!

On 02/27/2008 at 03:36 pm, I wrote in this thread:

"As I have mentioned somewhere above, my tour, which included watching the 'cartonero train' pass and explaining the circumstances that led to its existence, does not exist any more, at least in that format, because the "cartonero train" was discontinued late last year."

So, the answer is no, I am no longer doing this tour, at least not in its original form.

About my e-mail, if you read this thread, you should find it soon enough.

"A month in BA in December at teh end of our year long round the world trip"! Wow, that's great! Write to me whenever you want.

Hello, avrooster:
You may not recall, given the volume of your correspondence on this board, but you were kind enough to offer some counsel a while back on apartment location (Recoleta, Juncal near Montevideo) for my wife, teenage son and myself. Well, we arrive next week for an 11-day visit, our first. We are "city people" (having lived in NY, Washington DC and Paris in various incarnations) and thus are looking forward to experiencing, well, the "Real" BA to the extent that is possible for non-Spanish speakers. In an earlier exchange, you suggested I contact you again when our visit grew near to see if there was a chance of participating in your tour or, if that's not practical given the holiday season (or lingering knee issues!), to seek some direction on how to approximate it ourselves -- perhaps specific thoughts on train accessible neighborhood visits that might offer our son (and his parents!) a glimpse of real life? Many thanks.

Hi, brk01!

Well, I suggest you write to me using the e-mail address you'll find in this thread's 10th reply, posted by yours truly.

You'll have a great time in our town.

AMEN!
tptr

<<<You'll have a great time in our town.>>>

Hello avrooster,

I have now read every single word of every single posting on this thread - from the educational to the slightly contentious. You are quite a good diplomat! I think of you as the chief 'chamber of travel' for Buenos Aires with several fine assistants! Here are three questions:

1. How is your knee ? Hopefully, it is healed and no longer so painful.

2. Does Washington, DC hold any barter appeal now that we have a promising new administration/global direction?

3. May I write to your e address above regarding a possible get- together in February or early March? I do undertand the the original 'Real Buenos Aires Tour' is no longer feasible.

Best in the New Year,
~MarnieWDC

Hello, Marnie from Washington, DC!

You certainly deserve a medal if you have read ALL that thread!

Would you believe some people consider me just the opposite of a "good diplomat"? Well, it takes all kinds to make a world, I guess. LOL!!!

About your questions:

1) My knee is improving, but I still cannot walk much, without pain.

2) You don't need anything to barter with. Having read ALL of that thread gives you unlimited credit with me. LOL!!!!!

3) Of course you can e-mail me. There is a thread titled "BA Fodors GTG in February", in which you may be interested.

Happy New Year.

avrooster:

I thought maybe a Master's degree on the Real BA thread?

I will certainly check the other suggested thread. And thanks. ~M

You have just been awarded "a Master's degree on the Real BA thread". LOL!!!

Hello Avrooster,
it has been a pleasure reading this thread. I am finally making my first visit to Argentina. A long time coming. Although the original tour is no longer being done and unfortunately your medical problems may have slowed you down a bit, I was wondering if you are still offering a tour of your city. I am a solo traveller and will be in B.A. from March 6-15. No definite itinerary yet(other than to go to Iguaza) so my schedule is completely open. I have to admit, the tour sounds great but my ultimate motive would be to meet you. You sound like a great person who knows alot about his city and it would be a great way to meet a Porteno. I live in Rhode Island and as it is the smallest of the states in the U.S., I would offer my hospitality for all of New England. I know you have an email on yahoo but I found it only appropriate to post here first and if any follow up to be done on your email at: albertovgallo@yahoo.com. My contribution to keep this thread going.

Did you ever think when you sat down to right the original post on 6/9/2005 that it would have turned into this??

Thanks in advance,
Jim
Lincoln, Rhode Island(no it is not an island)