Why I'm Green With Envy of the English: A Tale Begun in S'hampton

Was wondering how your trip turned out. Nice descriptive detail as usual. Can't wait for the rest and especially for the QM2 report. Sounds like I shouldn't put Southampton on my list of "must sees" for next trip to UK.

I'm glad you liked Southampton.

"I'd probably opt for Winchester as a Hampshire base " Now don't say we didn't warn you

I'm glad you enjoyed the trip anyway
(low class citizen from near Southampton)

Yeah, while other places I visited (such as Winchester) had an almost mindblowingly incredible charm & beauty in places, I can say I did like Southampton... pedestrian-friendly, good central places to eat, shopping needs taken care of, free buses, great transit connections, beautiful ferry rides available... Perhaps it's the wretched lack of this pedestrian-friendliness in so many parts of North America, but I truly thought Southampton by and large was pleasant. And like when I've visited parts of Mexico, I appreciated the historic remnants (and the walls surprised me how intact they were in places), as they are suggestive of what an important town S'hampton once was.

There was even a small farmer's market with (excellent!) local produce by Bargate on the Sunday we arrived!

P.S. Don't mind my friend's comments...I love him dearly but he really can be such a snob sometimes .

Hello Daniel_Williams, looking forward to more of your trip report. An interesting and fun read. I must remember to go to the Cruise Forum too to read about your experiences on the Queen Mary2 as I have read conflicting thoughts about the ship. Your report will be interesting to read.

Hello again

This next reply I do from my return journey as I sit in the library aboard the QM2, my first full day as I look out at the thankfully calm ripplets in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean. Leaving London yesterday morning, I passed through Southampton one last time... I felt rather fondly toward my 5-day base as I observed a larger farmer's market by the Bargate, with a vibrant energy, but yet a relative calm that I somehow appreciated after the occasionally overwhelming crowdedness of London (even Brighton), where I'd just spent the past few days. I then understood why, when I'd asked a White Star Pub waitress from London how she liked Southampton (and who did like Southampton) she preferred the relative quiet of the port city. Anyhow, now to scroll back to the early part of my journey...to Winchester...

**Winchester. Day 2.**

My snobbish friend, unamused by S'hampton, was very taken by the beauty of Winchester from nearly first sight from the train station (as was I). While Southampton might be thought to be somewhat more (although not quite) North American in feel in parts, with its ASDA and West Quay Shopping Centre, Winchester has more of that picture-perfect, Tudor-style-homes-galore, narrow-winding-streets, busy-high-street-with-monument, Medieval-cathedral-with-Norman-frescoes, etc... incredible magic that visitors yearn for on a visit to England. I too found myself right-away captivated by this beautiful town; I'm such a sucker for those original gateways with overhead arches, especially the one by the Wykeham Arms Pub.

Oddly enough, one of my fellow dining companions attended Winchester College, and he was quite surprised when I described my first stop in Winchester Cathedral as being, to my (possibly inexperienced) eyes, a "Wonder of the Modern World". I highly recommend going on a guided tour; our 70-something lady guide "Friend of the Cathedral" was just magnificent, offering detail and insight with a humble yet radiating intelligence on the history of the artifacts and architectural style as we walked through each section.

The Norman frescoes, crypt and baptismal font amongst others left me thinking we must really stop referring to the Dark Ages as being so "dark", considering that the Norman (and indeed Gothic) sections of the cathedral to my eyes are undeniable masterpieces of architectural engineering and showcases of artistic talent. Perhaps since I come from mostly-architecturally-young North-of-the-Rio-Grande-North-America, I found myself just gawking at the Norman frescoes especially...such is the draw of the paintings that made me ponder life and thoughts of those living some 900-odd years ago. Incredible to think how many tons the magnificent vault of the nave weighs (if one of those discs falls, I imagine that would be kaput for someone underneath!) and how thankful I am for the work of one "diver" William Walker who toiled ceaselessly in the mud underneath the cathedral during the 1800s to buttress the building and is deservedly given a great place of honour in the cathedral. I equally tip my hat to the architects and builders of the 1000s-1100s and 1300s for each of their contribution to make such enduring solid Norman and Gothic sections.

After remarking that Jane Austen's epitaph was incredibly humble and enjoying a lunch at the Cathedral's cafe, upon finishing a stroll past the Bishop's Secretary and through the remnants of Wolvesley Castle, my jealousy of Winchester residents was complete after doing the nearby riverwalk along the Itchen River... the watercress in the river, the gardens of the houses opposite, the appearance of the Riverwalk... simply everything about the portrait before me conspired to entirely seduce my heart and soul.

Winchester, could I afford it and if I had E.U. citizenship, would be somewhere I believe I could happily while away my years, such is what seems to me a terrific balance of centuries of enduring history, a vibrant but not out-of-control High Street life bursting with amenities and restaurant selection, and yet peaceful walks are always close-at-hand (good rail connections to boot!) with views of gorgeous English countryside on hills surrounding.

**What will I think of Salisbury? Day 3 next!**

Daniel, so enjoying your account. If I may ask, do you write professionally? Blog regularly? If so, please sign me up...

Thanks dfr, willit, nonconformist, LoveItaly, latedaytraveler for reading and sending you smiles over the ocean waves for those who are enjoying. And Willit--the advice you gave me here some months ago is much appreciated, so instrumental in planning!

**Salisbury**

While my friend was grumbling that I did not make reservations in Winchester instead, my logic of using S'hampton as a base still seemed to me to have been sound. Only 5pound70 to Winchester and 9-pound-something to Salisbury, with frequent service.

Salisbury, like Winchester, had a charming high street, nooks and crannies that would pique the curiosity, much Tudor style, a riverside path with watercress, and of course a famous cathedral...but rather than pointing out terrific similarities between the two towns, here I'll try to emphasize some of the differences, to give a sense as to why I was glad to have seen both.

To begin, might I say that I loved the names of the streets in Salisbury, Fish St., Butcher's Row, Salt Street...I imagine it was more indicative at one point of where one should go for what.

My friend was mocking my appreciating of the differences between the cathedrals ("cathedrals mostly look alike to me; there's a nave, a quire, a screen, statuary, shrines to saints, etc... what's really so different?", said he). And yes, while I'll grant that these similarities exist and certainly both had gorgeous quires and screens, I found the uniqueness of each quite salient, much to my friend's harrumphing and eyes of condescension to this point of view.

As at Winchester Cathedral, for Salisbury Cathedral, I would equally recommend partaking in the guided tour, again lead by an excellent Friends of the Cathedral intelligent lady volunteer, who clearly felt deep love for her house of worship.

So, did I prefer one cathedral over the other? The answer truly to this question is "no"... Winchester's I felt was magnificent for its preservation of distinct Norman and Gothic sections; while Salisbury's was Gothic in style, I felt it to be special for its tall spire, as well as the airiness, polish and clean colours of the nave, which to me, gave it a very different look from Winchester's. I also enjoyed Salisbury's for the preserved cloisters, and certain historic remnants, such as the gold pomegranates on the ceiling in the chantry, the pomegranates being a symbol of Catherine of Aragon, and one of the few traces of her not destroyed during the Reformation.

For those who enjoy historic churches, I highly recommend visiting St. Thomas near the High Street in Salisbury as well, to see "the Doom" fresco situated above an arch of the church.

What I especially appreciated about Salisbury was that, within 5 minutes WALK of the business of High Street, my friend & I found ourselves in a setting that seemed to be countryside... with a river right in front of us, *lots* of sheep bleating in wide-open pastures on the opposite side, and a lovely path adjacent the field toward the neighbouring town Harnham with terrific views of field and the cathedral spire in the distance. Our walk on the path made us wish that we had beautiful country walks so accessible from the hearts of our city... and walking through Harnham afterward back toward another bridge across the Avon River and the gates near Salisbury Cathedral, I was such a sucker, oohing-and-aahing at those houses with thatched rooves.

After tea and scones with clotted cream & jam on the High Street, our day was capped off with Evensong at the cathedral... a hypnotic, almost chant-like atmospheric musical experience quite different from the Protestant hymn-singing or the introits/anthems that characterized my upbringing. I'd recommend to both religious and non-religious to listen, perhaps especially captivating in the awe-inspiring nave of somewhere like Salisbury Cathedral.

First Winchester, and second Salisbury... if I had a choice to live in either, in truth, I think I might have trouble deciding!

**To come... Day 4. Isle of Wight. Does the Isle of Wight make me jealous too or will it be an exception?**

Wow, I've put Winchester on my list of future must-sees. Salisbury I want to return to; we really liked it there too.

In England I particularly enjoy towns with easy access to the countryside, preferably with views of said countryside. So much better than the ugly suburban sprawl that surrounds even smaller towns in the US.

Great writing, Daniel.

Visiting Salisbury Cathedral with it's famous off-centre spire was one of the highlights of our trip around England last year. Guiding us around this beautiful place of worship was Air Chief Marshall Sir Joseph Gilbert KCB CBE and Friend of the Cathedral. His tour was fantastic. He simply refers to himself as Joe.

Looking forward to your take on the IOW which I visited on two occasions many years ago.

Hello Daniel, family members who visited England fell in love with Winchester but they never really went into details about it, typical of them. So I was enthralled with your descriptions! No wonder they loved it so much. And what I would give to have lovely pathways to enjoy, we have nothing like that here where I live in N CA. Absolutely nothing!

Did your travelling companion get on your nerves with his negative comments or were you able to just chuckle to yourself and ignore him? I only had one trip where one person was so negative and I found it to be quite irritating. We wished we could have ditched him, lol.

LoveItaly...I love my friend dearly, but I must admit that he had a way of getting under my skin with his ho-hum manner of diminishing my sense of discovery and his impatience in places. There were nice moments though in the midst of all this; I found it worked best for harmony to say, "let's split up and meet at point X in 2 hours".

**Day 4. Isle of Wight**

The boon of being in Southampton availed itself especially on this day, as all we had to do was walk down to the Red Funnel ferry to East Cowes. The 50-minute ride down the Solent Sea was quite lovely (OK, minus the industrial plants) and the Isle of Wight initially seemed to tempt us as we approached with hills in the distance...Cowes seemed much larger and busier than I had expected, although with a pleasant-looking marina and waterfront area..

My advice: Do NOT take a day trip to the Isle of Wight.

So, we wondered what we were getting into as we arrived on the Isle, with a kind of uninspiring industrial port road all to be seen as we looked away from the ferry terminal. I'd recommend at this point getting a map of each town (there's one of all Isle of Wight towns that accompanies the Southern Vectis bus schedules brochures) you plan on visiting.

Anyhow, Osborne House looked within walking distance from my original map of the city. Up a hill, it takes about 15-20 minutes to get to the entryway to Osborne House from the ferry terminal. Although my friend griped a bit about having to pay the 10 pounds entry fee, I felt it was once-in-a-lifetime, so didn't mind especially.

Well, the house is undeniably grand; the sitting room with yellow curtains and chairs, along with the slate painted legs of the billiard table really was a spectacular demonstration of the heights of Queen Victoria and Prince Albert's incredible wealth. And the Durbar Room and Corridor were not only unbelievably ornate and fascinating in how they revealed the extent of Victoria's interest in Indian culture and art of the time, but also had to be one of the most elaborately detailed rooms I've ever seen. I suspect seeing the lavish expenses here (and the excesses at the Royal Pavilion in Brighton) is enough to make even a more devoted Canadian doubt their monarchism....

After touring the expansive grounds with planned gardens and statuary with gorgeous views of the Solent Sea, we bought a 10 pound unlimited Southern Vectis bus pass, something I would highly recommend doing. The first bus that passed by Osborne House was going to Ryde, so off we went... my friend was not amused when I quietly sang to him "we got a ticket to Ryde...we got a ticket to Ry-y-yde"...

Ryde itself had a bit of a Brighton-ish look with white Regency-style architecture and surprised me with its busy-ness; my friend, as those of you might imagine who know Ryde, was very quick to pronounce it low-class. Nevertheless, we thought we'd do a Ryde experience, ordering fish & chips. The batter was for-the-birds... too greasy so I couldn't eat it. No, literally, I mean. I threw the batter to the birds, who squawked and quarreled over it... truly making quite a scene!

Anyhow, I was glad to see Ryde for what it was, but the true highlight of the day (along with Osborne House) for me was catching the #3 Southern Vectis double-decker bus. This bus goes from Ryde through Brading then Sandown then Shanklin then Ventnor and up to Newport. My favourite stretch was from Sandown to Ventnor, as the bus passed through the charming, curvy-roaded town of Shanklin with thatched-roof homes and then precipitously winded up steep, curvy roads with incredible views of white cliffs and the English Channel in the distance. One of most visually stunning roads I think I've ever been on.

Gods Hill between Ventnor and Newport looked like an idyllic country town. Our final stop, Newport, seemed a pleasant enough place, with a lovely central churched square (St. Thomas church?) where we had tea & scones with clotted cream yet again.

But all in all, I would NOT advise spending a day in Isle of Wight. A DAY is too whirlwind... I felt like we were visiting the isle on some stimulant drug and whizzed by everything. I'd recommend a LONG WEEKEND in Isle of Wight... a truly visually stunning place where you'll want to linger and explore. And don't judge things by Ryde or East Cowes... there are some amazing places elsewhere!

**Bath is up next**

I have enjoyed your other trip reports, and this is no exception. The lady who showed us Winchester Cathedral had been married there. She loved it, too.

Lovely trip report!

I would have enjoyed spending a little more time in Winchester, as we only had part of a morning there.

Lee Ann

Yes, Daniel. Lovely. Thanks for your report.

I too find that being easily pleased is an advantage when travelling.

hi Daniel,

if you want to learn more about the building of Salisbury cathedral, try reading nobel prize winner William Golding's "The Spire".

great trip report - your enthusiasm is infectious.

regards, ann

Daniel_Williams:

I am enjoying reading your trip report.

Sandy

Daniel, I rarely read trip reports but your title enticed me and I'm glad I did take the time. Excellent job. A minor correction: the dates for William Walker are not 1800s but 1906-1911.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Walker_(diver)

This is very enjoyable.

ann, I need to remember that book on Salisbury Cathedral. Thanks.

Re William Walker: He is commeorated with a small statue in an uninspiring bit of the Cathedral - and he saved the damned thing. Compare and contrast with any number of completely forgotton Bishops with their own chapels etc.

It always struck me as terribly unfair.

Daneil: I'm glad you enjoyed my home town (and I don't like to say "I told you so...."). I used to live next door to the Wykeham Arms.

"Compare and contrast with any number of completely forgotton Bishops with their own chapels etc."

Well, they weren't forgotten at the time.

Very enjoyable report. And sounds like your friend hasn't realized -- and you have -- that discovery can be fun, even if it's discovering that someplace doesn't look like you expected!

"cathedrals mostly look alike to me; there's a nave, a quire, a screen, statuary, shrines to saints, etc... what's really so different?", said he"

Does he judge books, wine, food and other people the same way?

I've been thinking about my own memories of the Isle of Wight since I read your report. What I come up with is (a) impressive cliffs on the east end, and (b) a wonderful laughter-filled cold rainy summer afternoon spent in an old-fashioned games arcade in Ventnor feeding coins (20p?) into a speaking pinball machine named "Xenon" to hear its, er, suggestive groan each time a coin went in. Not what the tourist board would feature, I imagine, but great fun regardless.

On a completely superficial note... I sure did notice a lot of very good-looking English folk throughout the South...

So, during the Isle of Wight, I notice my darling camera was starting to flash red...the battery was running low! It seemed to survive for my day on the IoW, but I wasn't going to take any chances (said I) for my first day ever in the historic town of Bath! Unfortunately, while smart old me remembered to bring the battery recharger for my camera, in my preparation process, I somehow conveniently forgot about the plug differences between UK and North America. Sadly, although I believed ASDA would carry some sort of adapter, the only ones they had were for going from the UK to some other location...I'd have to take my chances and hope my camera would survive the day!

**Day 5. Bath**

After walking 5 minutes from my hotel to Southampton Central, for 24pounds50, I purchased my round-trip ticket for the 1.5 hour ride on the Great Western railroad line from S'hampton to Bath.

The time passed quickly as I sat admiring the lovely Hampshire, Wiltshire and Somerset countryside through my train window and before I knew it, we had alighted in Bath. At first, I wasn't quite sure what to think of that unique somewhat tannish/beigeish colour of the stone with which the buildings of Bath were constructed. However, gradually as I walked toward Bath Abbey and saw Pulteney Bridge, it was the pervasiveness of this colour EVERYWHERE (of the three-storey apartment buildings, the bridge, the abbey, etc...) that to me, combined with the narrow-streets/nooks-and-crannies that seemed so prevalent in each town I'd so far visited in Southern England, that gave the city such a unique beauty that I almost felt emotional as I rounded each turn. I couldn't help but feel sad that Bath had only entered my visual consciousness at 38 years old (I'd heard others say it was lovely in the past, but yet somehow it seemed lovelier to my eyes than words can convey (although I'm sure these others tried)), although I felt simultaneously thankful for the opportunity to see it at all.

The first thing I did was to pay one pound to walk through the Parade Gardens, so as to snap a photo of the Pulteney Bridge and the water cascading down 3 steps in the Avon River in front. It seemed a bit odd to have to pay for what appeared to me a pretty minor city park...in fact, I'd recommend NOT doing this, but to instead, as I discovered later, walk on the other side for free (access via Pulteney Bridge) and snap what would be more or less similar photos from THAT perspective.

After strolling through Bath Abbey and admiring the beautiful fanned vault ceiling there and reading about its history in the Crypt below, I crossed the street to see what I had been greatly anticipating for days, the Roman Baths. When I was a child living in London (1978-1982), I was fascinated with the remnants of Roman Britain, from the mythology to the art and more...and went on numerous field trips to Verulamiam (St. Alban's) and Camulodunum (Colchester). Oddly enough, in the four years we were there, we never ventured out to Aquae Sulis (Bath)...If I had known that I would only visit this part of England some 27 years later, I certainly would have tried to insist upon the parental units as a 7- to 11-year-old to take me!

Sadly, although I had hoped that fate would let my camera battery hold up throughout the Roman Baths, after taking a first picture of the handsome entryway (before seeing the Baths themselves), my camera battery went kaput. Ack. In the end, however, I bought the recommended book at the front desk, which frankly probably had pictures of most things I would have snapped a picture of anyway.

From the initial sight of the baths (do note that the statues of the Roman emperors are much later added enhancement, I believe in Victorian times?), I was entranced. The audio tour was excellent (with the price of admission) and I would highly recommend listening to as much as possible if you enjoy Roman history; even the commentary by Bill Bryson (specifically labelled) describing his impressions and emotions I felt were an enjoyable listen.

From the head of the gorgon on the terrifically preserved temple pediment (I felt I could just stare at his eyes endlessly, such a compelling face he had) to the incredible architectural, scientific and engineering skills as evidenced by the hypocaust that would heat the tepidarium (medium-heat sauna)and caldarium (ouch-hot sauna), it was entirely mind-blowing to think that I was looking at a space where people, with an ancient and really quite mind-bogglingly different belief system, congregated on a daily basis for social activity, business and the worship of Sulis Minerva and others.

And while these relics would tantalize me with only the vaguest of insights into the Roman mind, I yet was struck by certain commonalities between them and us, the humanity we share. I loved one stone bust of an evidently wealthy Roman woman, her hair weaved into tight curls on the statue, clipped with jewelry... illustrating that vanity long pre-dated Cosmopolitan or Vogue. The coins found in various pools with I enjoyed for the so-cleanly-visible carved heads of Vespasian and other emperors visible; how similar it all seemed (Queen Elizabeth now, Vespasian then), with a control of Roman Britain exercised with common money... apparently they even had inflation in the A.D. 200s (how historians know this or how inflation came to be in an all-powerful empire seems incredible to me)! But what I loved almost most of all was how the prayers (maybe not the right word?) stencilled into metal thrown into the hot springs for Sulis Minerva to hear (!!) were in large part related to personal (in some cases, almost petty-seeming) grievances, for example asking Minerva to wreak terrible vengeance upon whoever it was that had stolen their livestock, etc...

Aside from the Roman aspect, the geologic aspect of seeing a hot spring, naturally producing 46 degree temperature water with gases bubbling up from deeper within the earth, was fascinating to see as well. You can understand given its unusualness in the Empire why it was a sacred place to the pre-Roman Celts (believed to be a place of miracles then as one king was supposedly cured of leprosy), the Romans subsequently (Britannia, as the plaques said, may not have been the most popular post in the Roman Empire for the lack of sun, cooler weather, some antagonistic islanders, etc..., so the baths were likely a balmy place to relax and mentally escape), and much later, was enjoyed by wealthy folk in the 1700s.

I too tasted the water as offered with the admission price in the beautiful stately Georgian Pump Room as you leave the premises. While unconvinced personally of its healing powers and the influence of Sulis Minerva , finding the water (while not bad) somewhat sulfatey-tasting, apparently one older Bath modern female resident goes daily and believes it brings daily relief to her backaches of yore.

During my final hours in Bath, after admiring the stately Georgian architecture of The Circus and the Royal Crescent, and subsequently walking across Pulteney Bridge to the Sydney Garden, my energies were petering out, so I then caught the train home. In hindsight, I would recommend, like I did with Isle of Wight, spending longer than a day in Bath. For everything besides the Roman Baths (which I think I did justice to, visiting for 3 hours), I felt I could have lingered much longer to get a real appreciation of town as a whole. Although, I will add, I do believe a day trip to Bath is preferable to no trip to Bath! Bath truly is another wonder of the world...

**Next... I, the ~30-year-old time capsule, a font of childhood memories of London, am reopened, visiting the city I have not lived in since 1982***

Sorry for the aside, Daniel.

Cholmondley_Warner, I seem to recall a short documentary about William Walker but can't find it. Do you remember it?

jsmith--You're most welcome to an aside and thanks for the earlier compliment.

ElendilPickle, carolyn, annhig, yk, SandyBrit, LoveItaly, tod, tahl, Mimar... thanks for reading and mentioning your enjoyment, and I've enjoyed hearing your experiences and perspectives... some of your names I recognize and I think have read other of my blurbles... I'll try to keep a lookout when you share your thoughts on your travels in the future.

Latedaytraveler...thank you; no I don't write professionally... I do something really rather different, teach chemistry! My only "blogs" if you will are on Fodor's Forums... it's just my way of sharing after a trip. This blog is making me happy since some are actually reading it .

Cholmondley_Warner... thank you for all your earlier advice on visiting Hampshire. I actually thought of you as I saw that beautiful gateway near Wykeham Arms... what a beautiful neighbourhood to have when you lived there.

dfr4848... The QM2 report will come last; I'm still on it...Day 2. Last night had my first with "rough waves" announced on the QM2 TV screen (pitching not rolling). I thank goodness wasn't seasick but the up-down did make me a bit... hmmm I don't if I can think of the right word... some combo of anxious? aware? feeling a bit "uh-oh"? slightly concerned? vaguely off/unequilibrated? Having fun though...

Daniel

My cousin, who lives in walking distance from Hampstead/Finchley Road tube stops kindly offered her place to stay, despite the fact that she discovered in the spring that she would be out of town for the week of my visit. So, for 35 pound round trip, my friend and I left S'hampton... friend was "happy to get out of this (fill in the noun you think he might have used)", but I told our B&B owner that I'd enjoyed myself very much using the Polygon as a base.

**Days 6-12. Based out of London**

Oddly enough, even though I lived in nearby Hampstead Garden Suburb, Hampstead itself looked very unfamiliar to me. It truly is a charming area of London, I dare say one of my favourites I've seen, with several storey red buildings and a charming high street (based around a high corner?) with some lovely local bakeries and other tantalizing shops. The Hampstead Heath was about a 12-minute walk from my cousin's and I loved jogging by the lakes and up to Parliament Hill with its incredible green views of the city below from a higher vantage point and people flying kites & walking dogs. I could even see the London Eye from my cousin's window!

Just a plug... the first night we visited some Canadian friends who lived in Highgate Village and went to their local pub (Angel?) on the main street; a very charming area that they (and I) were glad to have moved to (after some bad luck in the past).

**Central London**

A number of the days I went, I spent in central London, meeting friends... either Brits that lived in Canada or Canadians that moved to London. I must say, Central London has a bit of a Midtown New Yorkish feel, more than what I remember some 30 years ago, and is a bit too chaotic-busy overall for my taste. Nevertheless, there were things that I appreciated and discovered in this part of town which I will list below.

1. St.-Martin-in-the-Field really has good deals on lunches, in an incredible setting of their crypt.
2. Borough Market I went to for the first time... although insanely crowded, the quality of the produce was exceptional. Ate crosslegged on a square of grass in front of Southwark Cathedral.
3. People aren't feeding pigeons any more in Trafalgar Square, an interesting change from 30 years ago.
4. Walking along the Thames is still enjoyable (liked the "Candyland" trees) from Houses of Parliament to the Globe, although the view is very different with the "Gherkin", the London Eye and many skyscrapers that didn't look like the view from the early 80s I remembered.
5. Although it adds up ($$$), the Verger tour at Westminster Abbey was very interesting, well-presented. The Abbey is spectacular, although I'd imagine Queen Mary would be rolling in her grave if she knew who her coffin is next to.
6. The British Museum is an incredible repository of ancient artifacts and I enjoyed visiting. Earlier however, a Greek-Canadian friend expressed annoyance feeling much of these artifacts were "stolen"... I too could not help but be disappointed that there was not more of a focus on what is actually British? (I focused my visit on the Roman Britain section, which definitely is British history and is excellently done!)
7. Southwark Cathedral is a beautiful building and was a terrifically beautiful setting for Evensong.
8. The tube system is amazing (so frequent, so extensive!), even more than I remember it being.
9. The view of the Horse's Guard and the skyline from St. James' Park were my favourite vantage points of the city (what wealth of birds).
10. Was that circular near Buckingham Palace always closed to traffic?

**Emotional visit to my former neighbourhood... Hampstead Garden Suburb next...**

I also thought Hampstead is a lovely area. I took a walking tour of "Old Hamstead Village" with London Walks. I couldn't believe how peaceful it is there, just a few tube stops north on the NOrthern line!!!

Daniel

I'm enjoying your report.

Bath is on my to-do list - I didn't make it last time there - but did manage Winchester, which I loved.

Carry on.

Daniel, you enjoyed your time in Winchester/Salisbury so much I hope you get the opportunity to visit again with a rental car.

There are so many gems to visit. New Arlesford, The New Forest, Wimborne Minster are but a few. Getting to them takes you to so many other wonderful places.

Thank you again for the report.

Still enjoying very much. Yes, the Verger tour of Westminster is worth it IMO. Extremely informative with a strong sense of background and history.

I always thought Bath was uniquely alluring and enjoyable. Had a sense of history and perspective that was quite different than many other towns.

BTW, I've also traveled with friends who exhibited a sense of snobbery. It was sometimes unexpectedly helpful - helped to reinforce my own perspectives and to be satisfied with them.

Daniel:

You've added to my confusion by forcing me to put Southampton on my list of possible bases for a two or three night stay outside London on our trip this autumn.
But your trip report is so delightful, I'll forgive you.

Finally got the time to read your report straight through - love it.

I remember all the to-ing and fro-ing back when you were trying to decide between S'hampton and wherever. I still wouldn't have picked Southampton -- but it seems to have worked out great for you (if not your friend so much)

But now you see what we meant about Winchester, Salisbury and especially Bath.

Staying up in Hampstead was a real treat - it is a lovely part of town.

Note - you are right, the circle around the Wedding Cake in front of Buckingham Palace used to be a big roundabout w/ lots of traffic. They closed it off several years ago.

You've added to my confusion by forcing me to put Southampton on my list of possible bases for a two or three night stay outside London on our trip this autumn. >>>>>

Don't do it!

Despite Daniel's kind words Southampton is a tip. I used to live there I should know (I lived next door to the HEll#s Angels clubhouse....but even so)

I wouldn't live there again (or even visit it) for a big clock.

translation if needed: >> Despite Daniel's kind words Southampton is a tip <<

tip = garbage dump

**Remembering Being a 7-11-year-old. The Hampstead Garden Suburb (HGS)**

Between 1978 and 1982, my Dad was a journalist based out of London and we lived mostly in the Hampstead Garden Suburb, a neighbourhood (not to be confused with Hampstead) within walking distance of Golders Green tube stop.

On Sunday July 19th, I returned after 27 years of NOT living there; even the last time I was in London (in 1991) in transit on my way to Nigeria (sadly I just had an overnight in London then, so it was a quick-in-quick-out), it's hard to believe was a whopping 18 years ago! So re-visiting London was packed with an odd sense of nostalgia, but could be almost eerie at times as certain visuals/certain thoughts I knew had not entered my consciousness for almost 30 years.

I kept saying and thinking, "I'd forgotten about this... but now that I see it, I remember". Memories stored hidden within me, that I would not have been able to pull out without the jogging visual reminder. It's funny... growing older (especially in teenagedom), sometimes we think we've changed so much (in teenagedom, I had a tendency to come back after summer vacation with a transformation of look from the year before... "this year I'll be punk" LOL). But as memories were flooded back, there was no doubt that I, a 38-year-old man, was seeing many things through those same eyes as I had as a 10-year-old... indeed, with so much knowledge gained (and lost!) since, but I am unquestionably the same person.

Certain trivial things had re-entered my consciousness up until seeing the HGS... the medieval mural at Charing Cross tube stop; the fact that the Northern Line splits via Bank or via Charing Cross; the way the tiles at Belsize Park tube stop say "Belsize Park"... I found it would bring me a little shiver to see and know that I had seen before, but not in a very, very long time.

Walking through the Hampstead Garden Suburb though, I was reminded of treasured memories of childhood. A truly, beautiful, peaceful green neighbourhood of north London with handsome homes and gardens, I attended my parent's old church, the Free Church, which sits on the Central Square where I used to roller skate (not blade!) and play with pill bugs with my best friend Melanie. After attending the church service, my old Sunday school teacher, now in her late 50s (she was quite young as my S.s teacher), invited me over to her and her husband's place for lunch (and then later tea). Even though they had only known me as this 7-11-year-old, amazingly enough, we seemed to have an infinite number of things to talk about with so much common memory and so much time passed in between...and whiled 6 hours together in warm, heartfelt conversation.

I won't tire you with the non-travel-details, but will leave you with one thought should your life ever bring you to the HGS. One thing I loved about the HGS that I missed and didn't realize that I missed were all the "snickets". These "snickets" were pedestrian-only passageways that would serve as a short-cut to get from one street to a parallel street. While some "snickets" are wider and between walls, in the HGS, they have some narrow snickets...so narrow that maybe only 1 or 2 people can pass through them at a time between two rows of hedges. When I was a child, I always imagined that when I would reach the end of the snicket that I would end up in a magical world of elves, unicorns, naiads and dryads (probably from having read a number of books in the Narnia series). A truly forgotten childhood memory, and a wonderful characteristic of a neighbourhood that encouraged my creative spirit as a young man... As a 12-year-old living in the Washington DC 'burbs, this fantasy world had disappeared.

**Last hurrah? Did I equally love my day trips to St. Alban's and Brighton?**

Wonderful report!!
Thank you
P

Enjoying every sentence Daniel! You write with ease and with ease I read your lovely trip report!
I totally agree with your sentiments regarding the IOW - it's not a day trip place. A week would be the best option as I have lists of places and things to see. A walk on Tennyson's Down on a sunny day is one of them, and a descent into Blackgang Chine another. A drive along the Undercliff, a walk along Winkle street and treading the ramparts of Carisbrooke Castle but to name a few!

**St. Alban's**

As a child, I had mentioned, I had enjoyed the field trips I had taken to St. Alban's or Verulamiam as the town was called under Roman Britain. It was really here that my interest in the ancient Romans was born, so I wanted to re-visit just once more, so see if I The High Street area is lovely, and enjoyed seeing the old clock tower and abbey here as well. As seemed so prevalent in other British towns I'd visited so far, passageways twisted and went between buildings in an often surprising, pleasing manner.

I might mention at this point that one thing I still am processing, is that it seemed every town, even towns I hadn't heard much of like Newport on the Isle of Wight, had a buzzing pedestrian-friendly center, built more on a human scale. I truly wish that North American towns (there are exceptions of course) would be this way more, but I'm not holding my breath. I also loved that I had yet throughout all my sojourns in Southern England to see a town where I did not find a charming spot to sit and have tea & scones . St. Alban's was no exception...

So, in St. Alban's, I went to Verulamiam Park, an extensive green-space where I saw a wide variety of unfamiliar water fowl in the lakes and one can observe the free, well-preserved hypocaust and mosaic of a villa dating from Roman times. The Verulamiam Museum is worth a look-see, pleasing for those interested in more detail on Roman Britain. I often thought of Roman times as being "an occupation", but it seemed the Catevellauni people who lived in Verulamiam actually seemed to embrace the Roman presence quite peacefully. Nevertheless, for some reason I find myself drawn to Queen Boudicca of the nearby Iceni tribe who led a revolt around A.D. 60 or so, sacking Verulamiam, Londinium and Camulodunum (she probably was not amused that the Verulamians accepted Roman law so readily). She is portrayed in paintings as this kind of wild, brutal warrior in Celtic wear with wild hair, but really, she must have elicited great respect and admiration out of her fellow citizens to have launched such a successful rebellion against such a powerful empire. Undoubtedly, a woman of great bravery and know-how, in a way a true English queen that fought to keep the land for the English.

The Roman Theater for 3pound50 I felt was more than I wanted to pay for what is mostly ruins, but what remains does give a good sense of the appearance of the Verulamian arena must have looked like. I was glad here (yet again ) for the views of the English countryside surrounding... the sounds of sheep bleating pervaded the air as I walked through the theater area.

St. Alban's is lovely. While the Ancient Roman remnants might seem sparser/disappointing to someone who has just come from Bath, I felt pleased in part to relive memories, but also for the lovely setting. In St. Alban's, one gets a sense of a Roman British town that was not the exception that Aquae Sulis (Bath) was due to its hot springs... but rather a more typical (if somewhat favoured by the Romans) town of Roman Britain.

**Brighton next**

What a wonderful report! It brought back many things I remember, and I'm ready to hear more. I agree about Winchester and Salisbury, having done both on one trip years ago. It was good to hear you recommend the Roman Baths audio guide. Some people dislike such things, but that one is truly superior. (Sorry about the camera, though.) You mentioned London's St. Martin's in the Field for the Crypt and lunch; check in advance or just stop by in the afternoon and you may well be able to attend free rehearsals of an upcoming concert in the sanctuary.

What a lovely report! I just discovered if and read it straight through. I'll have to read the QM one too, every time I fly the Atlantic I think about sailing instead!

I grew up in England (not that far from St. Albans), and we holidayed on the Isle of Wight (in the 60s) several years in a row, staying near the Needles. I went back in the 80s and thought it had changed a lot - for the worse! Much more touristy and crowded. Alum Bay (colored sands) especially seemed to be overrun and overdeveloped. BTW, did you skip the castle?

Your descriptions of the towns and countryside really bring England back to life for me. I, too, have thought about living there again, but although I have a UK passport, my pension is paid in feeble, no-COLA, dollars... The town I've been thinking about is Wells, near Bath, which I'd recommend checking out if you go back.

I'm another fan of Hampstead. For those who don't have a cousin's flat available, this place is worth checking out: www.lagaffe.co.uk . And you shouldn't miss Kenwood House and its pictures if you're in the area. I like the cemeteries, too.

If you want a more "British" museum in London, try the Museum of London. Although my favorite London museum is the V&A.

Flanneruk-- Thank you for seeing the cathedrals as I do. It's reassuring to hear an echo of one's point of view. When we were in London, my friend was trying to curry sympathy to London-based friends about how tedious it was that I was "going on" about (I'd prefer to say I "commented twice or so on my appreciation of", but I'll state things from his point of view) the "differences" between said cathedrals.

yk--That "old Hampstead Village" walk sounds like a great idea!

jsmith, tod--Thanks for the suggestions for possible future visits to Hampshire/IoW!

thursdaysd-- The Needles are somewhere I want to go next time! As tod agreed, a day trip WAS too short!

309pg, margo_oz, Linda_C -- Thank you for stating your enjoyment of the post . It keeps me posting! It's nice that you too thought that Bath audio tour was exceptional... even though it was just a black walkie-talkie-shaped thing, strangely enough the voices I felt added a human (!) touch to my visit.

janisj-- Thanks for enjoying and for your candour during the planning months and I do see what you meant about those other towns!

VirginiaC-- Have fun deciding on whether to use Southampton as a base! My opinions (and my friend's ) are pretty well stated here but if you want additional points of view, read this post I started a few months back: http://www.fodors.com/community/europe/worthwhile-to-spend-some-time-in-southampton-itself-after-boat.cfm

Oh my. What a wonderful report. Time to plan a visit, I think.

**Final day. Brighton**

I caught the approximately 50-minute train around 11am southbound to Brighton from (the-crowded-chaotic-insanity-that-is) Victoria Station. The immediate visual walking out of Brighton's train station is one of busy-ness, and an unexceptional concrete High Street (my first view of S'hampton was far more inspiring!) as one moves south toward the waterfront.

But it was not long before Brighton started to reveal its soul... as I turned left toward the "North Laines", my impression was decidedly becoming rosier as I saw some cozy restaurants and knick-knackery of the narrow, highly-peopled streets. Reaching a parkspace by the Royal Pavilion and Brighton Dome and I was definitively sold on Brighton's charm, as musicians jammed and a dreadlocked girl practiced tricks with a hula hoop a la Cirque du Soleil.

If you really want to get your anti-monarchist friends worked up to the point of frothing at the mouth like a rabid raccoon, I highly recommend a visit to the inside of King George IV's masterpiece, the Royal Pavilion. Especially while Prince of Wales and later Regent when dear papa George III went cuckoo, he commandeered this outrageously luxurious home. Despite the fact that dear George and most of his wealthy friends were too busy having lavish dinner parties to go to China, the so-called "chinoiserie" style was all the rage on the inside, for example, a chandelier such that four gold dragons decorated lanterns coming out of their mouth in the obscenely ornate banquet hall. I have to say that word again... obscene... the whole place truly is... obscene... even a devoted monarchist I hope would have a bit of sympathy for those poor sucker 18th century taxpayers. Truly Prince of Wales George IV's vision, some at the time were tut-tutting its excessiveness, and English traditionalists were unamused finding the Asian-influence on the outside and in as being ridiculous (I however WAS amused at one of the scoffers who said, "like four turnips were placed upside down on top of the building").

This said, the decorations, furniture, china, you-name-it, everything is undoubtedly exquisite, and of course in the finest taste... for those of you who love admiring wealth, this is the Regency at its height. And I'll say, it is a TRULY beautiful home, and again, I will recommend the audio tour to get a more well-rounded of all that you see.

Next I walked to Brighton Pier, I enjoyed sitting out on a deck chair, the sun stroking my face, looking toward the beautiful water and stony beach, watching the crowd, peering over toward the beautiful white Regency-style architecture on the streets by the water, thinking "what bliss"... until a fellow came over "2 pounds to sit on the deck chair"... And here I was thinking how nice, how civilized it was that the City of Brighton provided deck chairs for its citizenry to enjoy the beach and water... LOL can we say "o wa ta foo lye am". Thank goodness he let me get away with a "sorry, I didn't realize...I won't sit here then!". Loved sitting on that chair, but not for $4 I don't!

My final hurrah in Brighton was walking down that boardwalk that is Brighton Pier... brought back more happy memories of my childhood in England. Those games where you'd drop 2 pence in to try to knock out more 2 pence coins, the House of Horror, the rides like the flume you'd pay for with tokens... I'd almost forgotten how much fun I'd had at these British boardwalk-type places. There may be exceptions in the US & Canada, but in the US/Canada most of the places I know of, for an amusement park, one pays an exorbitant admission for entry... which ropes one into spending a whole day at the park to feel like one is getting one's money's worth (which ropes one into eating lunch IN the park itself). I preferred this Brighton-Pier-like-concept, where one could if one wanted to, only buy the tokens necessary to say, enter the House of Horror, take a ride on the flume, or hit one's colleague with a bumper car during one's lunch break and not make it a full day at an amusement park. I also liked that I could just admire people screaming on rides, watch the water lap the legs of the pier (with the lovely white Regency Brighton architecture as always as backdrop), while paying absolutely nothing!

Brighton, you have a fun energy and thanks for entertaining me this past July 23rd!

**Final words and QM2 post to come**

Daniel:

First, I'd dump your chum. There's no reason why he should share your interest in cathedrals - but that phrase "going on about" is a real warning sign. Dismissing friends' interests (even if they include morris dancing or train spotting) is tantamount to dismissing them, IMHO.

A couple of historical notes:

Medieval wallpaintings. Very rarely are they frescoes in England: there are a few, and there MIGHT be some in Winchester Cathedral (though my notes say not, it's the kind of place that would have had a budget that ran to them and I might have taken the notes down wrong), but certainly not in minor Salisbury churches. A fresco results from paint being applied to wet (ie fresh, or fresco in Italian)plaster: the pigment and the plaster bond, giving great permanence. It's cheaper, and takes less skill, to paint onto dry (secco) plaster, and just about all are wallpaintings are seccoes. Usually lasted only a few centuries: in England's case roughly 6% of medieval churches have some visible medieval wall paintings - painted over by the religious extremists who hijacked our government in the 16th century, and therefore preserved (the whitewash actually protected them) a lot longer than they'd have survived otherwise. Bet the vandals are turning in their graves, tee hee.

Inflation: we know about ancient inflation by looking at prices: it's what historians are there for. It was caused mainly by Roman governments running out of cash to pay for the army: they debased the coinage (we know that by assaying coins) so that by AD 350 there was about (off the top of my head) a tenth the amount of silver in a given coin there'd been around the year 0

Boudicca. The only thing she was fighting for was for her daughters' right to rule over "their" bit of East Anglia. There was no such thing as "the English" to fight for, and her commitment to the waves of continentals who'd settled here before the Romans turned up was less than zilch. She showed no discrimination, when she slaughtered most of the population of London, Colchester and St Albans, between the native-born, Romans and those who'd moved here because of the Romans. Closest historical parallel was Pol Pot (she clearly just hated cities), except she lacked his military skill (her armies vastly outnumbered the Romans, but still lost to them).

True we've only got the Romans' word for all that (though the archaeology shows great destruction in the cities). But there's not a scrap of evidence she was a nationalist - or that anyone at the time would have known what the point of nationalism was.

For most people, after all, these foreign conquerors meant reliable wine imports, higher prices for our copper, furs and wool, relatively honest government - and baths. That's why the English have never understood foreigners getting upset about English occupation.

Thanks, Daniel (fun to read) and flanner(informative).

Flanneruk--

Firstly, thanks for the clarifications, inflation and seccoes vs. frescoes . I'll be sure to just say "wall paintings" in future whenever I'm not sure .

I see your words about Queen Boudicca and I downgrade my words "drawn toward" her to "curious about" her . First I'd heard of her was the few blurbles about her at the Verulamiam Museum and at Bath, so I appreciate your more informed insight and knowledge of the Roman perspective of the Boudiccan revolt. I also agree that my stating "fighting for 'England'" was inappropriate (to better phrase it, I think I wondered if she were more in her eyes fighting for the "peoples of her land", at least how she saw it?).

In coming to some of my ramblings, my understanding from what I read is that it was speculated that those who accepted Roman rule (such as citizens of Verulamiam) such as the Catuvellauni may have been seen as "in league" with the Romans (and therefore in her warriors' eyes, to be equally punished).

Her story (and side of the story, remembering, as you say, that we're getting the point of view only of the Romans from tablets) still piques my curiosity though...after all the revolt was not just her but many loyal followers, so for some reason she commanded respect at least among those. I think she grabbed my attention too because it's not often you hear of a woman too from ancient times as a head of an army. Maybe I'm putting my own perspective into it, but if brutal and selfish were her only qualities, it seems to me unlikely that so many of her warriors would have laid down their lives for her; these warriors must have felt on some level their cause was just.

Then again, it could be that they ultimately were just looting and greedy...covetous of Roman wealth and power? Like I said (and as you see given all my speculations on the whys), the story definitely does pique my curiosity and I've enjoyed your thoughts on it.

Boudicca again:

We don't rely on tablets for information about Boudicca. By an odd coincidence, for her rebellion we come closer to having real reportage by contemporaries than almost any event outside Rome in the Roman era.

One of the generals under Suetonius Paulinus (the bloke who eventually smashed Boudicca) was called Agricola, and found himself repeatedly posted to Britain, ending up as governor. His daughter Julia married a writer (you can imagine how THAT went down with a career soldier) called Tacitus, who wrote a gloriously laconic and cynical history of Rome called the Annals (available in the Penguin translation from most decent libraries and from Amazon - an appropriate place to buy books about the lady).

He also wrote 'Agricola', his father in law's life story (a bit trickier to find sometimes). Between them, the Annals and Agricola give Boudicca's revolt far more detailed coverage than any other trivial bit of bother on the far reaches of the Empire ever managed to get. For a rain-sodden island of zero economic value, the Romans made an extraordinary amount of fuss about conquering "Britain" - though actually it was just a bit of England.

Worth reading.

Very rarely are they frescoes in England: there are a few, and there MIGHT be some in Winchester Cathedral >>>

There are.

You really have to peer at them. Then you can make 'em out. Don't go on the basis of them.

They're on the left hand side of the Apse. So they are.



ps Whae did Boadicea become Boudicca?

1. No-one's disputing that there are wall paintings in Winchester Cathedral - and not just in the LH of the Apse (there are medieval paintings in the Holy Sepulchre Chapel, the Guardian's Chapel, and the south transept. And modern copies of defaced paintings in the Lady Chapel). The question is whether they're frescoes or seccoes. My notes imply they're seccoes, and some certainly are.

2. She was Boudicca the day Suetonius Paulinus first wrote to his boss saying he was having a bit of bother with the local fuzzy-wuzzies. We've no idea what she was called in Icenic (or what the Iceni spoke) - but she's always been Boudicca in Latin.

One Tacitus manuscript got miscopied (the monks were always doing that kind of thing. CW doubtless ignored all that tiny text at the bottom of the pages of Virgil he was always copying lines out of after school. It's called apparatus criticus and it lists all the different variations on the text every inept monk has ever accidentally invented). The dozy prat miswrote 'Boadicea', and the English - but no-one else - started using Boadicea. from about the 15th century.

Personally I think we should keep Boadicea (why should some bloody Roman tell us what to call an Englishwoman, even if that probably is what the lady called herself?). But the OP said Boudicca and I was being enough of a pedant already.

For any interested, in case you don't go to the cruise channel, here's my QM2 report.

http://www.fodors.com/community/cruises/roughing-it-on-the-qm2-transatlantic.cfm

You know, it's funny... I recollect learning about some Boadicea in school (practically ancient times now, the early 80s, and I probably was too busy hoping recess would come to actually remember anything of substance other than the name) during the classes on Ancient Rome, while the name Boudicca, when I read the plaques at the Verulamiam Museum and Bath, was entirely new to me.

Great read, Daniel! This time last year I was recounting my 2 weeks in London for a Forum TR, and reading yours (although we didn't cross lots of the same ground) was a wonderful reminder of the joys of our travel there. You do have a way with words and I'll bet that transfers to some great chemistry classes!

** Final thoughts**

Oh England, I shall miss the charm and vibrant nature of many of your towns, the incredible frequency and scope of your public transit, the millennia of continuous history that you give to your people, the accessibility and beauty of countryside within a short walk your busy Hampshire and Wiltshire town centers. As it is, my life is not with you, but thanks for all those lovely visuals I have to keep with me and the reminders of my childhood.

This trip was the first time I'd been to England since I moved to Montreal some 15 years ago. Sitting now back in my humble home in the Plateau district of Montreal, I was struck upon arrival by how North American and modern this city now looks. After the busy-ness of England, Montreal (which I moved to many years ago because in part because I liked how vibrant and European-like it seemed to me at the time!) seems incredibly quiet. I thought I might feel a sense of let-down returning... seeing some characterless suburbs coming into the city and waiting 8 minutes for the metro, I did momentarily be-moan my return. But no, my beloved neighbourhood the Plateau still seduces me... it seems somehow kind of graceful in its relative quietness... as the tranquil bike riders go by with their summer dresses... I do still love it here, but it really does feel worlds away from the England I left a week ago.

Happy travels Daniel

Intersting and enjoyable post. BTW I've never seen Southampton abbreviated to S'Hampton before. The local abbreviation is "Soton" for some reason.

Well as the fierce lady was around before the Angles arrived, she was a Briton, not English.
BTW, when did the daft custom start of calling ancient Britons Celts?

Thanks Gordon_R and texasbookworm for your words.

Josser: "Celtic" wear= my bad, just me that's daft, I suspect it's not custom

Sorry about that, like many in other corners of the world, I'm not exceptionally well-versed in ancient British history ... I was just trying to describe her outfit with what incorrectly seemed the most appropriate words I could find.

Thank you for the correction Would "Britonic" wear be using the appropriate adjective and understood?

Daniel

PS If I were to ever have a son, I would definitely want to name him Suetonius Paulinus...what a seriously cool name!

In my family's hometown, Southampton is normally abbreviated to Scumton or just plain Scum.

Among residents of Southampton, the written abbreviation is normally Soton. The University address is soton.ac.uk

I wasn't calling you daft.
It's just that recently, there is a fashion to call the early inhabitants of these islands "Celts".
I suspect that some inhabitants of the "Celtic Fringes" have a silly prejudice about being Britond.
When I were a lad, they were called Ancient Britons as in the good old song.

To the tune of Men of Harlech
Anon.

What's the use of wearing braces
Hats and spats and boots with laces
All the things you buy in places
Down on Brompton Road
What's the use of shirts of cotton
Studs that always get forgotten
These affairs are simply rotten
Better far is woad!

Woad's the stuff to showmen
Woad to scare your foemen
Boil it to a brilliant blue
And rub it on your back and your abdomen.
Ancient Britons never hit on
Anything as good as woad to fit on
Knees or neck or where you sit on
Tailors you be blowed!

Romans came across the channel
All dressed up in tin and flannel
Half a pint of woad per man'll
Dress us more than these
Saxons you can waste your stitches
Building beds for bugs in britches
We have woad to clothe us which is
Not a nest for fleas!

Romans keep your armours
Saxons your pyjamas
Hairy coat were made for goats
Gorillas, yaks, retriever dogs and llamas
Tramp up Snowdon with your woad on
Nevermind if we get rained or snowed on
Never want a button sewed on
Go it, Ancient B's!

Thursdaysd--

Your words on how the Isle of Wight has changed since the '60s reminded me of my musings on Queen Victoria while in East Cowes, how she might feel were she to see her precious Obsorne House today... I'm sure she would be horrified to see...

a) The tourist buses arriving, releasing mobs of common rabble into her cherished summer home and grounds like locusts.
b) Her precious view of the grounds and Solent Sea (while certainly still lovely by modern standards) now marred by the view of the port of Portsmouth and its kitschy skyscraper in the distance.

I'm sure she's rolling in her grave .

Seeing that it was the port of Portsmouth , or more specifically, the Royal Navy based there, that kept her Empress of India etc,etc , I am sure she would put up with it.

Would the Kitschy skyscraper be this one ?
http://tinyurl.com/m4b3kp

Josser - lol

Daniel - I'm sure she would not have been amused by the rabble! But willit has a good point about Portsmouth.

I couldn't see that it was a tower from Osborne House... but indeed the Spinnaker Tower (and possibly also its mascot Spinny which I read about from wikipedia) is what I thought was too modern to fit in with her idealized image of the Solent.

Dear Daniel, after a rather stressful week I decided to take a breather this afternoon and again read your trip report. I started with your visit to Bath which was special to me as my late husband's Godmother who was born and raised in Cornwall often talked about her love for Bath and how she loved it when they visited there. And of course I have read many books about Bath also.

A question, who is buried next to Queen Mary?

You are a good sport regarding your travel companion, I salute you! I, as so many others, find your enthusiam and love for all that you visit and see so refreshing. Writers like you are the reason I stopped all travel related magazines as I found some Fodorite's present trip reports that are so much more interesting and also have a human touch that writers for travel magazines do not display. Your thoughts added so much to this report, Daniel.

Now I am off to the Cruise Forum to read about your adventures while at sea!

Thank you LoveItaly...

You made my day LoveItaly and I agree about trip reports; there's a liberty of expression that I love to write and with certain authors, read. A travel magazine wouldn't have let me get away my sort of commentary, and definitely not the fact that occasionally I get so mentally ready for the next sentence that I forget to finish the previous one (e.g. "so I wanted to re-visit just once more, so see if I The High Street area is lovely") Ack. I groan when I see these sorts of mistakes LOL.

Her half-sister Queen Elizabeth I is buried next to her... Mary to my understanding wanted under no circumstances Elizabeth to succeed her...

Best wishes, Daniel

Haha josser--

I had to look it up on Wikipedia but once I read & figured out what "woad" is... hiiilllaaarrrious!

Hi

I know it's probably bad form to re-surface one's posts from several months back... but a friend of mine was very impressed by this one church in central Southampton (east of the High Street, I seem to recall) and asked what it was called.

It's not the Holyrood Church remnants, I remembered that name, but rather the one with an unusually tall pointy silver steeple (kind of like an oversized dunce cap) with a greystone base... really quite distinctive-looking (and in opinion, quite charming). I can't seem to find anything on wikipedia or in my cursory browsing on the Internet. I thought I might try here...since I know some of you have been to Southampton.

Best wishes, Daniel

Daniel, thank you for 're-surface'-ing your report. If you hadn't, I would have missed it entirely. On this cold, wet, dark and dripping morning in Oregon, you have provided me with a lovely interlude, bringing back memories of visits to Bath, Salisbury, etc, yes, even Southampton. I have thoroughly enjoyed your delightful writing style! Thank you so much for sharing with us in this way.

The church sounds like St Micheals.

It's got a spire rather than a steeple.

Its the oldest thing in Southampton - bits of it are Norman.

I can't cut and paste at the moment - but have a google and tell me if it's the one.

If it's the one you're on about it has some rather lovely free lunchtime concerts.

This one ?

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/17863435

That's the bugger.

Now who do we throw it at?

Matthew Le Tissier!

Nah. Peter Osgood.

Thank you CW, willit.

Yes, St. Michael's is definitely it. My photo is from a different angle, and the spire looks a little more polished, smoothed and rounded in my photo, but there's no question that's the one. Looked quite nice on the inside too, but I didn't linger long, as there was some meeting of great importance that looked like it was going on inside.

Best wishes,

Daniel

This is all well and good Daniel. But the question of the day is who would you throw St Michael's church at and why.

Enquiring minds wish to know.

Willit wants to throw it at Matt Le Tissier and I want to throw it at Peter Osgood.

We need help (in more ways than one).

So who do we hurl a largely Norman building at?

sorry, we 've GOT to throw it at wayne rooney.

go on, you know you want to.

Well I've just remembered that Peter Osgood is dead so it would be a waste.....

So Sepp Blatter it is then.

>>So Sepp Blatter it is then.<<

Did ever a man's name sound so much like his effect on people?

That Jack Warner should be hit with every religous building in Christendom and maybe a few synagogues for good measure.

Thanks for bringing this TR to the top again! somehow I missed it first time around. I loved reading and revisiting in my mind these wonderful places in England.

yes yes yes, but who do you want to throw St Micheals at?

Loved reading this. I am so wanting to do the QM2 crossing but am getting lots of static from the DH. He thinks he would be sick the whole way and bored, Is the $900.00 plus round trip? That ceaper than flying and 10 extra vacation days to boot!

But during that time you would have to decide who you wanted to throw the Queen Mary at.

I'd throw it at bloody Katie Price.

In fact it could dock in Katie Price.