Borntotravel55

I am organizing a trip to Paris for myself and 2 friends. I have reserved an apt in Paris and Saint Remy de Provence. After sending both deposits via PayPal I came across information about scams and other problems with VRBO rentals. Should I be concerned? Has anyone else recently had issues with rentals in Paris using VRBO. Thank you for any information! Signed...Terrified!

DebitNM

There are more concerns about Paris rentals; most are not legal and there inherent risks.

Do an "advanced" search in the box above; type in Paris Apartments and check the box below "Search full topic and replies"

Or just wait, cause lots of posters will chime in.

Sarastro

Most vacation rentals in Paris are illegal. Your risk is that the apartment you think you have rented might be withdrawn from the market and is no longer available. This occurs subsequent to actions by the mayor's task force enforcing laws to prohibit illegal short term rentals. I would be very careful about vacation rentals in Paris.

The law does not apply to areas in France with fewer than 200,000 inhabitants and should not be a concern in St. Rémy.

Borntotravel55

Thank you Sarastro & DebitNM for the advise. I have another pending rental in Aix-en-Provence. I guess I could risk it and hope that when we get to Paris the apt will be available. I would lose the deposit and be left with the problem of finding accommodations on such short notice! We are actually renting an apt for 5 days upon arrival and then 2 days on our return from Provence. The apt for 2 days is asking for pmt in full 2 weeks before we arrive. Does calling the owner provide any assurances, as VRBO suggests?

Kathie

Do you think the owner will tell you that it is an illegal rental? Something like 95% of the short-term rentals in Paris are illegal. Whether it will get shut down before you go or while you are there is a different question. You may be just fine. Up to you whether to chance it or not.

DebitNM

We like apartments for longer stay, 5+ nights.

We would not rent an apartment for 2 nights. The cleaning fee usually it economically less desirable.

Is this the same apartment both times?

Have you (or your friends ) been to Paris before; if this is first time, sometimes a hotel is a bit more "comfortable" with a staff that answer questions, give suggestions etc.

When is this trip? Do you have to pay balance on arrival or ahead? How much deposit did you pay? If you cancel now and book hotel, you'd lose your deposit but you'd save on having to scurry round to find a hotel room and at who knows at what price.

StuDudley

I think Kathy might be correct. The only addition I would make is that "95% of all short term rentals of less than 30 days are illegal".

Stu Dudley

DebitNM

It's known as being able to read and have the ability to comprehend. Skills that seem lost on some people.

crefloors

http://adrianleeds.com/ I know it's true because I am on the e-mail list for Adrain Leeds property management. She has also been featured on House Hunters International helping people find apartments or homes to buy in Paris.

That is her business. She has been selling her rentals in Paris. You might check her website and see what may still be available. She IS legit. She has some properties in Nice and will have those for awhile, things are not as strict there.

I have looked at her apartments in the past and they really don't seem to be all that expensive, realizing that "expensive" is all relative.

Vivi004

I have rented from VRBO twice (2013,2014) while staying in Paris. I also have friends that have as well. Never had a problem. Of course that is not a guarantee you will not have an issue, but it seems unlikely.

Borntotravel55

DebitNM - I have been to Paris 3 times and speak a little French. We all agreed an apt would be more comfortable since we will have 2 bedrooms and a kitchen. I'm not too worried about the Provence rentals since someone commented that this is more of a Paris issue. I have put down a small deposit on both apts in Paris, one for 5 days and one for the last 2 days. Since we are splitting the cost 3 ways the deposits would not be a significant loss. I may take the chance and have a list of hotels in case of an emergency. I will post my experiences when I get back, our trip is in Sept. Wish me luck!

uncledge

I am looking to rent with Paris Perfect. I asked them about this problem and I received an email reply that their apartments are all legal. This company has a stellar reputation. Any comments about Paris Perfect apartments legality would be appreciated.

Sarastro

<i> I received an email reply that their apartments are all legal.</i>

Ask them to show you the ownter's permit issued by the town hall (marie) of the arrondisssement in which the apartment is located. All legal apartments rented short term (for a period of less than 1 year) require such a permit unless the apartment is the official residence of a principal occupant. You can tell which this apartment is simply by looking at how many months a year the apartment is offered to renters. Principal occupants cannot offer their residents for a annual period exceeding 4 months.

Additionally, if they are not asking specifically for the <i>taxe de séjour</i> corresponding to the number of occupants multiplied by the number of nights of your stay, they themselves are operating illegally.

pariswat

Creflor
' I know it's true because I am on the e-mail list for Adrain Leeds property management.'

She IS still legit because she has not been caught yet, but she is definitely under scrutinity of the authorities.
And as far as I know she already sold some properties in Paris.

manouche

You can't judge a rental by the calendar, because most owners and agencies have caught on that this is a dead giveaway to the Mayor's task force. Most will not update or will falsify the calendars, taking the chance that people will inquire even if the dates are already taken. Most people don't seem to look at the calendars when they inquire, anyway.

Rent in Paris if you want to, but realize that there are no guarantees. If you are going on someone else's prior happy experience, good luck with that - because that was Then, and this is Now. Not many people take the time to tell what went wrong - this is often because they have been given incentives to say nothing (cash rebates, discounts on future stays, free meals, etc).

There are two remaining sting operations scheduled before the end of September, targeting the Marais, Latin Quarter and Montmartre. This will not affect anyone staying in the apartment - you'll just get a short visit from a city agent, if you're home - but if the owner is sanctioned, upcoming rentals must be cancelled.

If you're travelling solo or in a couple, it should be fairly easy to find someplace to stay, but if you're with a family or someone with mobility issues or need specific amenities, you'd better have a backup hotel already booked for the near future.

DebitNM

Borntotravel55-
I wish you a grand trip and hope that all goes well. It sounds like you're an "old pro" Enjoy

Christina

VRBO has thousands of listings, and yes, some of them are scams but not the majority of them. I don't think there is any way to predict for sure except usual precautions. Don't wire money, look for reviews, just gut feeling from correspondance, etc. When I have rented an apt, I always get the exact address before committing and find what it looks like on pagesjaune.fr or some similar street view website. I also do that just to make sure it's what I want, of course, regarding other issues.

I wonder how Paris Perfect apts can be so legal since, as far as I know, they are investment apts and have no regular residents. And that is what is illegal. I think there are some exemptions based on those owners having to thus also invest in some apts accessible to residents or something(not sure what the details are), but I doubt if those Paris Perfect owners do that.

manouche

For Paris Perfect to be "legal", the property owners would have had to form a commercial group, register that license with the City, pay commercial taxes on property and revenue, etc.

If this was done before the loi ALUR was passed, the group would have been exempt from having to construct an equal-sized residential complex somewhere in Paris.

A regular client of PP has mentioned on a couple of other travel sites and blogs that they were told that a group of investors got together and eventually bought up all the apartments in one building when the owners died. None of them lives there full-time, and no other changes have been made to comply with the law. Therefore, ParisPerfect is not technically "legal", though it has always claimed that this is so.

iris1745

Listen Born; There are 10 of thousands of short tern rentals in Paris.

We have a few who suggest what could happen. They are always on these threads.

But one never hears how many of these rentals have been shot down.

In the scheme of things, it probably would not show up as a 'blip'.

So naysayers, is 1 out of a 100 apartments that have been shut down.

1 out of 1000?

1 out of 10,000?

1 out of 50,000?

Born, go and have yourself a great vacation, as we did.

And, Born, I was called immoral, fu*k these same naysayers that show up consistently.

Can it happen, probably, but what is the ratio?

1 in 25,000?--they never answer these questions, just scare people.

pariswat

Iris
You need to use foul words ?
Va te faire voir aussi !

Axtually the same goes for stopping at a red light.
How many who don't stop get caught ?
I'm one of those who always stop. And I respect the law.
You don't care - no prob. People don't care to take a risk and break the law ? No prob for me.
You'll probably not get caught.
If you are, not my problem.
And try to stay polite please.