Using US Credit Cards in Spain
Oct 28th, 2011, 10:21 AM
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Using US Credit Cards in Spain
I have had so much fun struggling with the my bank and Spanish travel websites in getting them to take/approve my Visa or Mastercard. I plan on calling the banks just before my trip to tell them that any charges will be ok. What about American Express? Can I use that in Spain? I suppose I will call them, too.
We went to France in 2007 and had no problems with our credit cards being accepted. Has something changed?
Any other tips you can give me on being able to use credit cards in Spain, would be greatly appreciated. We want to use them to pay for meals or other purchases. When we were in France, we used the AmEx to get Euros from bank machines--can you do that in Spain or are we going to have to get a LOT of euros in advance? I am just a bit flummoxed here.
We went to France in 2007 and had no problems with our credit cards being accepted. Has something changed?
Any other tips you can give me on being able to use credit cards in Spain, would be greatly appreciated. We want to use them to pay for meals or other purchases. When we were in France, we used the AmEx to get Euros from bank machines--can you do that in Spain or are we going to have to get a LOT of euros in advance? I am just a bit flummoxed here.
Oct 28th, 2011, 10:39 AM
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I was just there and never had any issues using credit cards. I don't recall if I used my Amex there or not, I don't usually use it abroad as my Amex card has a 2.7 pct foreign exchange commission. But I'm sure some places will probably take it if you really want to use it for some reason.
I really think getting euros using a credit card is a terrible idea and can't imagine why you want to do that, given the large fees for getting cash advances with credit cards. But sure, you can do it if you really want to. Are you at all aware of what you pay to do that? I guess you must be as the charges would be on your statement.
I know there are some very expensive Amex cards (with a $450 yearly fee) that do not have a foreign transaction fee but I think they all have cash advance fees according to their
website: << Are there fees associated with accessing cash on my American Express Card?
This depends on the product. For most products, the fee is usually either 3% of the transaction or $5.00, whichever amount is greater. International Cash advances are subject to either a foreign transaction fee or an increase in the converted U. S. dollar amount in addition to the cash advance / ATM fee.>>
So what kind of fees do you pay when using your Amex card to get cash, and why do you want to use a credit card in an ATM machine rather than your bank debit/ATM card to withdraw cash from your bank account?
I really think getting euros using a credit card is a terrible idea and can't imagine why you want to do that, given the large fees for getting cash advances with credit cards. But sure, you can do it if you really want to. Are you at all aware of what you pay to do that? I guess you must be as the charges would be on your statement.
I know there are some very expensive Amex cards (with a $450 yearly fee) that do not have a foreign transaction fee but I think they all have cash advance fees according to their
website: << Are there fees associated with accessing cash on my American Express Card?
This depends on the product. For most products, the fee is usually either 3% of the transaction or $5.00, whichever amount is greater. International Cash advances are subject to either a foreign transaction fee or an increase in the converted U. S. dollar amount in addition to the cash advance / ATM fee.>>
So what kind of fees do you pay when using your Amex card to get cash, and why do you want to use a credit card in an ATM machine rather than your bank debit/ATM card to withdraw cash from your bank account?
Oct 28th, 2011, 10:41 AM
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You can use a credit card to withdraw euros from ATM's -- but it's essentially called "borrowing money" and the card company charges you interest from the first day it is borrowed (unlike making purchases). Don't you have a debit/ATM card linked to your checking account? That's much better than using a credit card for ATM withdrawals.
I can't imagine the problems you are encountering with Visa or Master Charge, although American Express is less widely accepted in Spain. The credit cards should normally work fine, except in some small businesses or small restaurants that might not accept credit cards.
If you have a Capital One credit card, there will be no charge for using your credit card. Most other credit cards will average about a 3% conversion rate.
I can't imagine the problems you are encountering with Visa or Master Charge, although American Express is less widely accepted in Spain. The credit cards should normally work fine, except in some small businesses or small restaurants that might not accept credit cards.
If you have a Capital One credit card, there will be no charge for using your credit card. Most other credit cards will average about a 3% conversion rate.
Oct 28th, 2011, 11:10 AM
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You need to inform Visa that you will be using your card outside of the US. Amex has no notification requirement.
NeoPatrick is right that a cash withdrawal with a credit card is a loan subject to interest. I minimize the cost of the loan by zeroing the credit card account when I return. That means paying the total amount owed, so the balance owed is zero.
Also, take the email address for the bank that services your card. If you have trouble, an email may be enough to get the problem fixed.
Christina, we found the Hotel d'Anglaterre in Montpellier satisfactory. Thanks for the tip.
NeoPatrick is right that a cash withdrawal with a credit card is a loan subject to interest. I minimize the cost of the loan by zeroing the credit card account when I return. That means paying the total amount owed, so the balance owed is zero.
Also, take the email address for the bank that services your card. If you have trouble, an email may be enough to get the problem fixed.
Christina, we found the Hotel d'Anglaterre in Montpellier satisfactory. Thanks for the tip.
Oct 28th, 2011, 12:14 PM
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The usual misconceptions but no matter how many times you try, people still have the same misconceptions.
1. You don't notify visa (or mastercard for that matter) you will be travelling outside the country of issue of your credit card (people here always assume everybody posting is an American travelling to Europe or just about always). You notify the bank issuing the visa (or mastercard) card. Different banks have different policies and they set the policies of the individual banks. No bank I know of actually requires notification, not that it is a particularly bad idea, but all banks have fraud departments that analyze charges and if something seems strange as compared to your usual pattern it will trigger a phone call and might lead to a hold being placed on the card causing you a problem. But one bank executive told me that even if you notify the bank, a hold might be placed anyway. I never notify the bank and quite frankly have never had trouble but I emphasize I am not suggesting you shouldn't.
2. As far as fees are concerned, again there is no such thing as visa charging a fee (well there is but we'll get to that). Every bank sets its own fees for issuing its visa (or mastercard). Every bank decides if it wants to charge other fees such as a foreign transaction fee. Now visa (and mastercard) do charge a 1% fee to convert currency over what is called the interbank rate and that 1% is passed along when the charge gets to your bank. Some banks just pass along the fee. Some banks add an additional 2% to the fee. Some banks eat the fee. This is an individual bank decision, not the decision of visa (or mastercard). The same banks which charge these foreign currency exchange fees also usually charge a foreign transaction fee, that is all transactions taking place outside the country of issuance of the card, even if it is done in that country's currency, are charged 3% so if your credit card is issued say by Bank of America in US dollars and you charge something and fall for the dynamic currency conversion scam where a merchant converts the charge for you, for your convenience naturally (and not to make a profit for itself), you still get hit with the 3% fee. Again that's a bank decision not a visa (or mastercard) decusuib,
3. The questiuon of cash advances on a credit card comes up from time to time. Yes it's a loan. Yes most (but not all) banks charge for a cash advance the moment you get the cash in your hands at high interest rates, as much as 24% a year. Oh my god, I hear people cry but remember, that's 2% a month until the loan is repaid and usually, but not always, it doesn't affect the grace period on purchases. So sometimes you only have the credit card, your debit/ATM card is blocked and you're forced to make a cash advance. I've had to do that from time to time but thanks to internet banking, I can usually re-pay it almost as soon as I can find an internet dafe and payntext to no interest...even if I have to wait till I get hoe, 2% on the equivalent of a $50 advance is only $1...I would only do that if I'm in a situation where I'm making a small purchase and the merchant doesn't take credit cards. No big deals but then again you have to check with yourt bank to see if they tack on additional fees to the interest for cash advances. Some do with percentages or a flat fee say of $5 but again that's not a visa (or mastercdard) decision. That's a decision of your bank.
5. Finally Amex. Amex is accepted throughout Span and indeed most places but not nearly as much as is visa (or masterdard) as the fee to the merchant is somewhat higher for Amex than it is for visa (or mastercard). Visa/mc are almost uniuversal today. Amex not nearly as much but it is widely accepted. Of course there was a time Amex was considered more prestigeous and an indication the user is well richer than the peasant who might use visa/mc. Those days, of course, are long gone. You can get Amex cards from various banks and other brokerages fpr as ;ott;e as free and while Amex in general does charge 2.7% for foreign currency transaction fees, the one I have from Fidelity only charges 1% (and gives me a 2% cash reward back for everything I use it for so the net effect is I only get a 1% reward if I use it outside the USA and only on foreign currency transactions). Amex dos not allow the use of dynamic currency conversion. Charges must be written up in local currency.
So it behooves you to be aware not of the policies of visa, mastercard or Amex but rather of the bank or brokerage issuing the card and they differ widely from bank to bank.
1. You don't notify visa (or mastercard for that matter) you will be travelling outside the country of issue of your credit card (people here always assume everybody posting is an American travelling to Europe or just about always). You notify the bank issuing the visa (or mastercard) card. Different banks have different policies and they set the policies of the individual banks. No bank I know of actually requires notification, not that it is a particularly bad idea, but all banks have fraud departments that analyze charges and if something seems strange as compared to your usual pattern it will trigger a phone call and might lead to a hold being placed on the card causing you a problem. But one bank executive told me that even if you notify the bank, a hold might be placed anyway. I never notify the bank and quite frankly have never had trouble but I emphasize I am not suggesting you shouldn't.
2. As far as fees are concerned, again there is no such thing as visa charging a fee (well there is but we'll get to that). Every bank sets its own fees for issuing its visa (or mastercard). Every bank decides if it wants to charge other fees such as a foreign transaction fee. Now visa (and mastercard) do charge a 1% fee to convert currency over what is called the interbank rate and that 1% is passed along when the charge gets to your bank. Some banks just pass along the fee. Some banks add an additional 2% to the fee. Some banks eat the fee. This is an individual bank decision, not the decision of visa (or mastercard). The same banks which charge these foreign currency exchange fees also usually charge a foreign transaction fee, that is all transactions taking place outside the country of issuance of the card, even if it is done in that country's currency, are charged 3% so if your credit card is issued say by Bank of America in US dollars and you charge something and fall for the dynamic currency conversion scam where a merchant converts the charge for you, for your convenience naturally (and not to make a profit for itself), you still get hit with the 3% fee. Again that's a bank decision not a visa (or mastercard) decusuib,
3. The questiuon of cash advances on a credit card comes up from time to time. Yes it's a loan. Yes most (but not all) banks charge for a cash advance the moment you get the cash in your hands at high interest rates, as much as 24% a year. Oh my god, I hear people cry but remember, that's 2% a month until the loan is repaid and usually, but not always, it doesn't affect the grace period on purchases. So sometimes you only have the credit card, your debit/ATM card is blocked and you're forced to make a cash advance. I've had to do that from time to time but thanks to internet banking, I can usually re-pay it almost as soon as I can find an internet dafe and payntext to no interest...even if I have to wait till I get hoe, 2% on the equivalent of a $50 advance is only $1...I would only do that if I'm in a situation where I'm making a small purchase and the merchant doesn't take credit cards. No big deals but then again you have to check with yourt bank to see if they tack on additional fees to the interest for cash advances. Some do with percentages or a flat fee say of $5 but again that's not a visa (or mastercdard) decision. That's a decision of your bank.
5. Finally Amex. Amex is accepted throughout Span and indeed most places but not nearly as much as is visa (or masterdard) as the fee to the merchant is somewhat higher for Amex than it is for visa (or mastercard). Visa/mc are almost uniuversal today. Amex not nearly as much but it is widely accepted. Of course there was a time Amex was considered more prestigeous and an indication the user is well richer than the peasant who might use visa/mc. Those days, of course, are long gone. You can get Amex cards from various banks and other brokerages fpr as ;ott;e as free and while Amex in general does charge 2.7% for foreign currency transaction fees, the one I have from Fidelity only charges 1% (and gives me a 2% cash reward back for everything I use it for so the net effect is I only get a 1% reward if I use it outside the USA and only on foreign currency transactions). Amex dos not allow the use of dynamic currency conversion. Charges must be written up in local currency.
So it behooves you to be aware not of the policies of visa, mastercard or Amex but rather of the bank or brokerage issuing the card and they differ widely from bank to bank.
Oct 28th, 2011, 12:27 PM
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You used your amex to get cash? That is preposterously foolish - that meant you were getting hit with interest charges from the moment you confirmed the withdrawal. Do you have a bank? Does it have ATM cards for you? Use that OR open a Capital One account online and take their debit card for use in the ATM - NO FOREIGN EXCHANGE FEE with Cap One cards. If you repay your cards monthly and timely, then xyz123's point #3 is a good one. If not, you screw yourself with fees by withdrawing cash via credit card.
You need to check with your card issuer for your foreign exchange fees. A credit union card or a Cap One card will have low-to-no fees. Amex fees are dependent upon the Amex issuer - the base Amex forex fee is 1%. And xyz is right - you call the card issuer. Visa, Amex, MC, etc. are primarily financial networks that license their names and access to their payment mechanisms to credit card issuers, who get their own small cut (and if you saw Office Space, you know those small cuts add up).
You need to check with your card issuer for your foreign exchange fees. A credit union card or a Cap One card will have low-to-no fees. Amex fees are dependent upon the Amex issuer - the base Amex forex fee is 1%. And xyz is right - you call the card issuer. Visa, Amex, MC, etc. are primarily financial networks that license their names and access to their payment mechanisms to credit card issuers, who get their own small cut (and if you saw Office Space, you know those small cuts add up).
Oct 28th, 2011, 12:57 PM
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I'm not sure it is clear that it isn't just a matter of interest being charged from the point of taking out cash (on a CC), there is also a fee just for doing that (which as noted above for Amex is the greater of 3 pct or $5) which you cannot avoid even if you paid it back the same day. xyz doesn't mention that fee from what I can see. This is in addition to the interest and also in addition to any foreign exchange markup, if one. Which is why it is such a bad idea, except in the case of an emergency, of course. I have never seen a credit card that did not charge a flat fee for cash advances in addition to the interest. So maybe there is one somewhere, but I have had many CCs and checked out the terms on many others when considering them and they have all had that fee, so I think it is the norm, not an exception.
Oct 28th, 2011, 02:46 PM
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Christina...I did mention it' it's there and yes there are banks although I can't name any off the top of my head which only charge interest on credit card advances.
My main point is we shouldn't generalize. Every bank, every financial provider that has card media has its own policies and one has to check the policiies to come up with what's best for them!
My main point is we shouldn't generalize. Every bank, every financial provider that has card media has its own policies and one has to check the policiies to come up with what's best for them!
Oct 28th, 2011, 03:47 PM
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El Corte Inglés, Carrefour and most Hypermarkets take Amex, as do most gasoline stations and larger hotels.
Smaller shops/hotels DO NOT take Amex. Perhaps in the large cities the most visited tourist souvenir shops MAY take Amex, but I have not had much luck using Amex, and I live here. I think you can find a list at Amex about what shops/restaurants take their card.
Smaller shops/hotels DO NOT take Amex. Perhaps in the large cities the most visited tourist souvenir shops MAY take Amex, but I have not had much luck using Amex, and I live here. I think you can find a list at Amex about what shops/restaurants take their card.
Oct 28th, 2011, 03:49 PM
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Good to know that the credit cards should work fine. As for getting cash advances--thanks for all of the info. Given our individual situation and the fact that we are practically debt-free, I am sure my husband will make a good decision on how to get necessary cash.
Oct 28th, 2011, 05:45 PM
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I would call the number on the back of your credit card and notify the people who answer that you'll be traveling in Spain.
Where possible know the PIN for your credit card. Most of the time people recognized we were Americans and pressed the right buttons to produce a paper receipt we could sign (and yes, most of the time they wanted a photo id, they'd ask or a passport, but a driving license always worked). However, a few times they handed the machine to us to type in the PIN - which we did and it worked. I'm sure we could have told them we didn't know the PIN and they'd have re-run the charge, but knowing your PIN would be helpful but not essential.
Some ATM/Debit cards charge a fee (on top of any non-bank ATM fee that may be charged), but some do not (Fidelity for example, who also reimburse ATM fees). So if you have/can get a foreign fee free ATM/debit card that's the way to go.
Because cash was surcharge "free" I liberally got cash and used cash in most situations except hotels, train tickets, rental cars, other big ticket items. Meals etc. we paid cash. Worked for us, but I can see people being nervous carrying cash or not wanting to search for ATM machines (we never searched, we kept walking by them).
I used Amex at hotels a couple of times, but all I know is the conventional wisdom that Amex is not as widely accepted.
I agree with the comment that the prevalence of Internet allows you to take cash advances and quickly pay them off thus reducing your interest charge exposure. We had Internet access pretty much every day we were there at different hotels (much more than I expected). So I could have easily managed money moving it around between accounts. I probably won't go that route next time (seems like more work than I want to do on vacation), but it was certainly a viable option.
Where possible know the PIN for your credit card. Most of the time people recognized we were Americans and pressed the right buttons to produce a paper receipt we could sign (and yes, most of the time they wanted a photo id, they'd ask or a passport, but a driving license always worked). However, a few times they handed the machine to us to type in the PIN - which we did and it worked. I'm sure we could have told them we didn't know the PIN and they'd have re-run the charge, but knowing your PIN would be helpful but not essential.
Some ATM/Debit cards charge a fee (on top of any non-bank ATM fee that may be charged), but some do not (Fidelity for example, who also reimburse ATM fees). So if you have/can get a foreign fee free ATM/debit card that's the way to go.
Because cash was surcharge "free" I liberally got cash and used cash in most situations except hotels, train tickets, rental cars, other big ticket items. Meals etc. we paid cash. Worked for us, but I can see people being nervous carrying cash or not wanting to search for ATM machines (we never searched, we kept walking by them).
I used Amex at hotels a couple of times, but all I know is the conventional wisdom that Amex is not as widely accepted.
I agree with the comment that the prevalence of Internet allows you to take cash advances and quickly pay them off thus reducing your interest charge exposure. We had Internet access pretty much every day we were there at different hotels (much more than I expected). So I could have easily managed money moving it around between accounts. I probably won't go that route next time (seems like more work than I want to do on vacation), but it was certainly a viable option.
Oct 29th, 2011, 01:05 PM
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Hey BR,
>You used your amex to get cash? That is preposterously foolish...<
No, it isn't.
You can tie your amex card to your bank account and use it just like an ATM card. I assume that is what the OP is doing.
>You used your amex to get cash? That is preposterously foolish...<
No, it isn't.
You can tie your amex card to your bank account and use it just like an ATM card. I assume that is what the OP is doing.
Oct 29th, 2011, 02:39 PM
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ira, I think that is a huge assumption (and probably a false one), given the OP's wording of the question. But of course, you could be right.
By the way, while I know that Capital One doesn't charge anything, including a conversion fee for foreign purchases on their credit card, I know that now you can also have a Capital One checking account with an ATM card and again, there is no fee or conversion charge when you use it.
By the way, while I know that Capital One doesn't charge anything, including a conversion fee for foreign purchases on their credit card, I know that now you can also have a Capital One checking account with an ATM card and again, there is no fee or conversion charge when you use it.
