Ackislander

Francetv reports today that Uber has been fined €100,000 euros for violating business regulations. The authorities threaten additional fines against the websites in France through which potential passengers connect to Uber.

http://www.francetvinfo.fr/france/gr...es_721183.html

I am slightly confused by their referring to Über as an American company. I understood that Uber were domiciled in the Netherlands precisely to avoid liability under US law.

Possibly not the last we have heard of this.

sparkchaser

If I understand correctly, Uber is based in the U.S. but European HQ is in Netherlands.

flanneruk

"I am slightly confused by their referring to Über as an American company"

I see no reference in the story to Uber's nationality. Or the relevance of raising this issue.

Uber almost certainly breaks French law. I realise American internet fanatics are convinced they've got some special moral right to scoff at laws in general, foreign laws in particular but above all laws requiring them to bear the same costs, and pay the same taxes, as companies who don't benefit from decades of taxpayer subsidy to the IT industry.

But France's laudable determination to force these parasites into bearing the costs real taxis have to bear is an utterly equal-opportunity determination. They'll fine Uber whether it's based in Holland, France or Azerbaijan.

BigRuss

<< I realise American internet fanatics are convinced they've got some special moral right to scoff at laws in general, foreign laws in particular but above all laws requiring them to bear the same costs, and pay the same taxes, as companies who don't benefit from decades of taxpayer subsidy to the IT industry.>>

I realize that English commenters on the Fodor's forum who know nothing about Americans other than what they pull from the Guardian are convinced that free enterprise is a terrible system and that state regulation is a wondrous thing, but of course that ignores how such state regulation and high barriers to entry throughout the EU have stifled innovation and left it with higher unemployment and unsustainable sub-30 year old unemployment rates that stagnate those economies.

flanneruk

As the owner of a business that gets no subsidy from anyone, and refuses to accept any government contracts, I'm as committed to the free enterprise system as anyone else. I certainly don't need lectures from citizens of a country as addicted to state regulation, unnecessary bureaucrats and protectionism as the USA on the benefits of self-reliance.

Or on why the only newspaper on earth worse than the Guardian is the New York Times.

Or on the awfulness of American taxis. The only city in the world, for example, where a cab driver has asked me for directions to the airport is New York. That awfulness is the direct result of New York's dysfunctional system of local regulation, resulting in some of the world's most unjustifiable barriers to entry. In everything, from its quaint State monopoly of airports to its absurd laws on taxis, to the universal public-sector ownership of public transport, to its rent control, New York is practically the only bastion of pure Marxism left outside Cuba.

Try this test. Travel from Hyde Park Corner to Times Square. In Britain, every step of the journey uses facilities provided by private businesses who survive only by satisfying their customer. Often foreign-owned businesses (for we have no truck with America's terror of letting foreigners compete for its citizens' spending). In the US: Moscow 1954. If a travel organisation's not owned by one of America's infinite layers of government, it's supporting an army of regulators telling it how to run its business.

Uber's frustration with the way American bureaucrats intrude into every aspect of daily life (except, of course, public health) is understandable. But that's no excuse for seeking to break our laws.

chartley

The problem appears to have been that Uber claimed they were simply running a car and cost sharing service (covoiturage) while the judge said they were actually running a commercial service with fixed charges according to the distance and time taken for the journey.

You may think that daft. I see it as the inevitable conflict between traditional operators seeking to preserve their position when challenged by a new service provider using new technology. I think that it is equally daft that Siemens are obliged to build factories in the USA in order to sell new trains to San Fransisco. So much for free trade.

And incidentally Russ, some of us get most of our information about the United States from relatives and friends and from visits to the country. The Guardian is not particularly anti-USA: it is the right-wing press and right wing political parties in Britain that is now the more xenophobic.

Michael

<i>to the universal public-sector ownership of public transport,</i>

I believe that the express buses going from downtown to the outer boroughs are privately owned but operate under city contract.

sanderskn

All the hate for America makes me sad. America is much more than New York City. Try visiting the Rocky Mountains or California's Central Coast. I live near San Francisco and Uber is from here. I love using it. It actually ends up being cheaper than a taxi and I never get ripped off. However we are even having problems here, such as at the San Jose Airport, with how to regulate and tax it. I think they will figure it all out.

kerouac

I will approve (maybe) of Uber and other such companies when they offer to reimburse the cost of the taxi licences to every single taxi in their zone of operation, just to level the playing field. This of course means 200,000 to 250,000 euros per taxi in Paris. That means 17,137 taxis in Paris. That's only about 4 billion euros to get the ball rlling.

sandralist

Unless this article from The Economist is out of date, it explains that London's taxi cab system is a monopoly, and one of the most regulated by "bureaucrats" in the world, and therefore one of the most expensive, because the system is completely anti-competitive.

http://www.economist.com/blogs/schum...ulating-cabs-0

The Economist argue that London should emulate the taxi industry of Teheran. Since the article is 2 years old, maybe I missed the news that advice was followed and the system flanneruk is frantically waving his Union Jack about has recently come into being. But otherwise, it is another rant from flanneruk that is based in fevered fantasies, not reality.

sandralist

sandrskn,

So hate for NYC would be okay?

Most people in Europe who criticize America actually like NYC more than most other parts of America. But the main reason people form a dislike of America is that it bombs so many other people for no known military purpose, not because a NYC cab driver (allegedly) needed directions to the airport.

apersuader65

I may be splitting hairs here, but isn't the definition of public transport as one operated by a government. Otherwise, isn't it just called private transport? At least that is the way I've always looked at public/private transportation.

There are numerous private bus lines in the U.S. that operate nationally, regionally and locally (in some cases) but most local operations are government ran and funded, due to the instability of customers.

Mikenmass

I have to say that I like the fact that Uber drivers are rated by the passengers and vice versa. You can get ratings on both drivers and passengers and make decisions on who you share the ride with as well as ETA of your ride.

I doubt you'll ever see that for a taxi company, but if you do, you can thank Uber and some code writing geek.

I don't want to speculate on whats fair and whats not, but plenty of brick and mortar giants are falling because they chose to ignore the future.

kerouac

Vehicles with internal combustion engines are already ignoring the future.

SAB

Many people in metropolitan US have drunk the Uber/airbnb Koolaid and espouse the idea of leaving the "sharing economy" unregulated. But not all regulation is not bad, it ensures that some of the worst business abuses no longer occur. Most businesses cannot be trusted to self-regulate, especially where profit is involved.

So is it wrong to have regulations for example that require Uber to carry liability insurance for its drivers, not if you are a passenger who is injured. If you are injured in a taxi accident as a passenger you will be compensated, based on regulations, whether it was the fault of the driver or a third party. No so if it is Uber in the US. Here you have to rely on the driver's personal coverage and many US policies have exclusions in personal policies that will not cover injuries when a vehicle is used for profit.

crosscheck

Uber (and its competitor Lyft) are game changers in Los Angeles, where I live. Drunk driving rates are down. Working parents can safely transport their teens to activities. Seniors and the disabled get around easily and cheaply without a stigma. And trips to and from the airport are suddenly relaxing because we no longer have to worry whether the cab will show up or if the driver will know which route to take.

I 'Ubered' yesterday on a work trip to Florida. There, a taxi from the Ft. Lauderdale airport to my destination cost $76 + tip, with lots of anxiety when the driver got lost twice. I took an UberX upon my return and the trip (during the morning rush hour) was $55, including working A/C and a cold bottle of water.

in Prague last August, after my husband was given small Hungarian bills worth $3 instead of the CZ equivalent of $40 as change (the only time we've ever been ripped off in 50+ countries), we decided to try the newly-arrived Uber, even though it had been there for less than a week. Worked great. We also loved Hailo, the app for taxis in Madrid (funded in part by Sir Richard Branson).

I would use Uber in Paris in an instant, especially during the hours when it's impossible to get a cab. Cities where Uber is legal are much less stressful for visitors and locals alike. It's about time car services have entered this century.

SkipHudgins

Total union/govt Bs. Countries like France abhor innovation and seem determined to stop it.

sandralist

Another Londoner's view of Uber and London's traditional cabs

http://glennelliott.co.uk/uber-isnt-...b-complacency/

Michael

<i>Countries like France abhor innovation and seem determined to stop it.</i>

Which is why it has a functioning hi-speed rail system while the U.S. does not, or has hi-speed internet at a lower cost than in the U.S. from what I heard. I'm sure others could add to the list.

sanderskn

I definitely wish the US had a high speed rail, Michael! I love the trains in Europe. perhaps we are too attached to our highways now and it will be too expensive to ever make the switch. I heard for a while they were trying to do a high speed train from LA to San Francisco but I think it has been abandoned for now. I don't know.