Two weeks in Italy - tips and itinerary help required.

Hi and welcome. Your itinerary has quite a few "leave for"s so first, I'd combine days 5, 6 and 7 and just stay in one place. You can get to Capri from Naples, Sorrento, etc.

I'm not sure about the condition of Cinque Terre towns after all the bad weather they had. Hub and I took the train to CT towns from Pisa and it was fine as a day trip. You could combine Days 8-13 and stay in Florence as a base.

None of the distances between the cities warrants taking a night train I don't believe. Easter is a very busy travel time for Italian families and students. So, I would buy your ticket for Rome to Naples area as soon as you arrive in Rome, your Florence tickets as soon as you get to Naples, etc. I don't know why you are having trouble with tren italia. Can anyone make suggestions?

getting a Eurail country pass or taking local domestic trains?>

The Italy Eurailpass may be good for you as you have lots of train days and this pass becomes cheaper the more days you buy on it - at some point extra days costing only about 15 euros a day or so - but go to www.trenitalia.com - the Italian railways site and price out your trips and then compare to a pass - keep in mind that most Italian trains require seat reservations and these cost between 5 and 10 euros on top of the pass - so figure in that for each long-distance train - regional trains like you may take to the Cinque Terre do not even offer seat reservations. And on trenitalia.com you can score in advance online discounted fares but those are hard to change so you lose any flexibility - with the pass you can decide as you go along which trains to take so if you want flexibility the pass will be a better deal as fully flexible tickets can cost a lot of money.

And IMO after zillions of train rides I advise paying the relatively little extra to go first class - in many ways a much more relaxing experience (though 2nd class ain't no cattle car) - seats are significantly bigger in first class and there are often empty seats - I can always put my luggage on a nearby empty seat in first class but 2nd class is often IME chock full - anyway check out these superb sites IMO for lots on Italian trains and passes - www.seat61.com; http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id12.html and www.ricksteves.com. Again it is very easy to see which is best for you buy looking at sample fares at trenitalia.com to compare with a pass and the pass is a better deal even in first class vs first class fares, especially if flexibility is needed.

In terms of the Cinque Terre, three of the five towns were totally undamaged from the flooding of October 25th. Riomaggiore, Manarola and Corniglia are as they were, and totally ready for visitors. Vernazza and the Old Town of Monterosso were heavily damaged, but have been working like crazy through the winter to reopen, and most businesses in the Old Town of Monterosso that were damaged will be reopening around Easter, which is in your time frame - some are open now, many in late-mid March. Rebuild Monterosso has posted reopening dates on their website, www.rebuildmonterosso.com, as well as information on hiking the trails. Vernazza, smaller and heavily damaged, is also reopening slowly from mid-April to the beginning of may - they have timetables for openings on their website, savevernazza.com
I'd say if you want to make this a part of your trip in April, keep it on the itinerary.

I'd skip Naples and probably the Amalfi coast as well and spend more time in Venice, pricey tho it is.

Not nearly enough time in Venice, so I would skip days 5-7 and add them to Venice.

That's an awful lot of train rides with a 20-month-old, who I assume is mobile.

I agree---drop the AC or the CT---you do not have time for both. I would skip Venice unless you spend 3 nites, which I would make happen.

It leaves a lot to be desired - mostly it's just TOO MUCH.

A few thoughts:

Fly into NAPLES for 4 nights. It makes no sense to fly into Rome, head south, and then double back to Rome. Allow two full days for seeing Naples (not nearly enough, but you're time is super tight). The other two days can be day trips from Naples (or not, as you may want to see more in Naples). Pompeii, Capri, Sorrento, Positano, and Amalfi are some popular options for day trips from Naples.

Train to Rome - stay 5 nights. Maybe one day trip - though there's enough to see in Rome for 10 days or more.

Train to Venice for your last 4 nights. Maybe one day trip - though there's enough to see in Venice for 5 days or more.

Fly home from Venice.

Night trains make no sense - the travel times are too short.
Eurostar times: Naples to Rome 1 hr 10 min - Rome to Venice 3 hr 40 min

No rail pass either - you aren't taking enough trains.

Hotel ideas - though you may find it tough getting rooms at the best located/priced places only one month out. Good luck. Hotel prices in central Rome and Venice are comparable to Manhattan, that is to say, pricey.

Naples http://www.decumani.it/ Super central in a most charming neighborhood. Huge rooms. Inexpensive. Can't recommend it enough.

Rome http://www.hotelteatrodipompeo.it/ Great central location, relatively inexpensive.

Venice http://www.hotelalpiave.com/ Great central location, relatively inexpensive (compared to nearby places of similar level). Hotels on the Grand Canal are much higher priced.

No rail pass either - you aren't taking enough trains>

depends - if going first class a railpass could be cheaper than regular full fare tickets - if you want flexibility.

>>>The trenitalia site does not seem to work for me at all! I can't get any timetables or rates for the travelling between cities. <<<

I'm not sure why you can't get Trenitalia to work. If you are using the Le Frecce link, you must enter the Italian spellings of the cities (Roma/Napoli/Firenze/Venezia). Trenitalia does not go to Sorrento or Amalfi (no trains in Amalfi). You use a local commuter line to get from Naples to Sorrento. If you want prices for the slow trains to show, you must enter a date within 7 days.
http://www.trenitalia.com/cms/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=c79686605528a110VgnVCM1000003f16f90aRCRD

Le Frecce link if you want to search fast trains only (fast trains are only between major cities, not small towns).
http://www.fsitaliane.it/cms/v/index.jsp?vgnextoid=1d85c6b9455c2210VgnVCM1000003f16f90aRCRD

Naples/Sorrento trains:
http://www.vesuviana.it/web/en

>>>Wherever possible, we would like to take the night train, to your knowledge do night trains operate on the highlighted connections?<<<

No night trains for the itinerary you have selected. Rome/Naples on the fast train is only 70 minutes. Naples/Florence is 2:56 and Florence/Venice is 2 hours.

>>>getting a Eurail country pass or taking local domestic trains?<<<

I doubt a pass would be cost effective, but you would have to look at prices on Trenitalia to see. The train to Sorrento would not be included (different train company) and the trains between Florence/Pisa, Florence/CT are very cheap (although you don't really have time for the CT and should drop it and use the time elsewhere).

Are you planning to sightsee in Naples? If not, and Sorrento is more your destination, you might find it easier to take either the Marozzi or Curreri bus from Rome to Sorrento. Marozzi departs Rome Tiburtina station at 3pm most days with an early morning departure on weekends. I think Curreri departs at 2pm, but you would have to check schedules. Price is about 17€. Your luggage goes under the bus and you don't have to make any changes.

Thank you so much everyone! All your responses have been very helpful.
I agree with you, this seems like too much travel but we are being greedy and want to see as much of Italy as possible

I think i will cut out stays in Cinque Terre and Amalfi and make them day trips instead. I have a couple of follow-up questions though.

- The trenitalia site finally seems to be running for me now after comparison with Eurail ticket which allows for 5 travel days, the price difference doesnt seem to be too much for the 1st class ticket especially if you factor in the flexibility Eurail will give. So i think i'll go with the 5 travel days pass, however, my question is how do i reserve the seats? do i need to call up someone on the day of travel? how does it work? I'm sorry if this seems like a very basic question but i've never taken such a pass before and was wondering how will they accommodate me if the travel schedule is busy, which might be the case on the days i travel.
- Will the pass work on the smaller city connections too i.e. naples-sorrento, pisa-Cinque terre, etc?

Looking forward to your responses again.

- The trenitalia site finally seems to be running for me now after comparison with Eurail ticket which allows for 5 travel days, the price difference doesnt seem to be too much for the 1st class ticket especially if you factor in the flexibility Eurail will give.>

I added up flexible fares for only your three longest days and a first-class Italy Eurailpass was actually significantly cheaper - contrary to Fodor mantra folks abovve repeat over and over from thread to thread that a railpass is never cost-effective - why there is a bias against even presenting a railpass as a viable option for some folks requirements boggles me mind - I guess if you make your rep solely on highlighting online discount fares you are blinded to everything else?

Your pass doesn't include the cost of seats which will be 10€ per person per train ride. The ticket prices on Trenitalia includes seats.

As I stated earlier, the pass is not good for Naples/Sorrento as that is a private train line. For Pisa/CT, buying a ticket from Trenitalia will be cheaper than the cost of a pass for a day. You need to realize that the many of the trains on Pisa/CT lines do not have 1st class or reserved seats. A saver pass would cost you $72 per day. You need to make sure your train rides would cost that.

You cannot easily visit your list of sites on the Amalfi Coast as a day trip from Rome unless you book some kind of tour and tours to the area usually include a lot of shopping stops.

As I stated earlier, the pass is not good for Naples/Sorrento as that is a private train line.>

Oh common on that ticket costs all of 3 euros yet you keep mentioning it time and time again as another factor to consider in a pass - BTW Trenitalia tickets do not include that line either. Oh well anything to make railpasses look bad.

and some trains - the fastest ones Florence to CT cost over 30 euros in first class.

Here are my calculations for a 3-day first class pass

Rome-Naples 58 euros
Naples-Florence 103 euros
Ct-Venice 75 euros

T= 236 euros or about $320

vs for a 3-day pass/flexipass over longer period first class Saver p.p. $239 add in 30 euros for seats and you get $279 - still $41 cheaper than full fare first class tickets for folks who want flexibility.

bourbon - what am I missing?

maybe they do not want 5-day pass but what about 3-day pass for the 3 longest and most expensive days of their trip?

PalenQ, if they need 3 seats for trip, then wouldn't they be adding $90 in euros for seats - not $30 - which would make the first class tickets cheaper? And if you have to make seat reservations, even when you have a pass, how does a pass give "more flexibility"?

I am not being sarcastic or trying to get you riled up, I am just trying to understand railpass vs. tickets.