You of course know what your five year old can manage in a day, but I would be prepared to modify your days if necessary. Day 2 Please check with your baby's doctor that the Jungfrau trip is suitable, check the Jungfraubahn website for their advice on taking babies to that height, and be preapred to change plans if the weather is not suitable. Day 4 is another long day and I would not personally want to this trip with young children as a day trip. Day 8 also looks to be another long day for the children.

Sorry I should have added that you are covering the same ground on days 4 and 6. You take the Golden Panoramic Express if you go to Lausanne.

You are Right- any other suggestion for day 6 & 8 then?

Any other suggestions to see on Day 6&8

I don't understand why you are basing yourself in the Bernese Oberland, yet you don't seem to want to explore the BO but want to go to Lausanne and Chillon Castle.

That doesn't make any sense to me.

The BO is so much more than the Jungfrau.

There is plenty to see and do in the BO for 6 days.

If you want to explore the Geneva area, why are you flying into Zurich? Why not fly into Geneva.

Why do you want to go to Lichtenstein?

As Tipsy Gus has stated above, you are looking at long train rides with your kids.

Do you want to see Switzerland or the inside of a train?


Thin

OK- got the point! can you then recommend someother place in BO for Day 4 and 6? This is my first trip to Switzerland so any help is much appreciated!

Can you also suggest a trail that we can do with kids - stroller?

Any suggestions.?

If I were you, I'd stay in Lauterbrunnen, Wengen or Grindelwald or the first 4 days. That way you'll be able to play it by ear to go to the Jungfrau (some hotels have a TV in their lobby showing the weather conditions up there) and explore some of that area. Go to Pfingstegg for the toboggan ride. Walk the Panoramaweg between Mannlichen and Kleine Scheidegg (it's pretty level and the unpaved paths aren't narrow and could accomodate a stroller - you'll have a couple of uneven parts but it's also mostly downhill and there is a tiny playground just before you reach Kleine Scheidegg. It's normally a relaxed 1 1/2 hour walk so consider that too), relax and enjoy the mountains.

I haven't stayed here, but you could check out the Derby Hotel in Grindelwald. 3 reasons I mention this particular hotel (other than having eaten there and it had great food)...
it is right at the train station so you wouldn't have to shlep all your stuff + stroller very far, with a 5 year old maybe the family apartment overlooks the train station (but the south facing rooms are reportedly large and have a great view of the mountains if you prefer that), and Tripadvisor gives it mostly great reviews (and says that there is no noise from the trains). That's just a starting point and of course I don't know your budget, but with a 5 year old I would consider the advantages of train watching to keep him occupied during downtimes.

In any case, email whichever hotel you choose and discuss the different types of rooms they offer.

Good luck with the planning!

There are so many outings you can do with your kids in the BO.

Some examples: boat rides on Lake Thun and Lake Brienz, Schynige Platte, Schilthorn, Ballenberg Farm Museum, Harder Kulm, Thun and Thun Castle.

Easy walks: Lauterbrunnen to Stechelberg, Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg, Murren to Grutschalp (at half-way point there is a restaurant and playground).

There is also a playground across the road from Hotel Schonegg in Wengen. Walk up the road behind the playground to see cows--on the way to the public swimming pool in Wengen.

Hope this helps.

Thin

As others have said, there is plenty to do in the Bernese Oberland, and you need to keep flexibility because the weather is always a big question. Going up into the mountains isn't a good idea if you can't see anything, which is quite often the case. It's often hazier in the afternoon than in the morning. If you can go up, as others have pointed out, the trail from Maennlichen to Kleine Scheidegg is a "granny walk" with spectacular scenery--you start out heading toward the famous North Face of the Eiger, then round a corner to see the Jungfrau, then down to Kleine Scheidegg (which, by the way, is where the Jungfraubahn starts). The Jungfraujoch is 11,000 feet up, and I had a little altitude sickness there. The best way to get to Maennlichen is the spectacular half-hour cablecar ride from Grindelwald-Grund (down from Grindelwald). We've also enjoyed going up to the Schilthorn, where you can eat in the revolving restaurant.

If you can't see the mountaintops from Interlaken, then better to take a boat on one of the lakes (maybe by way of the Giessbach Falls or the Beatenberg Caves) to visit Brienz or Thun; go to the Ballenberg Open Air Museum; see the Truemmelbach Falls (very impressive); take a low-level walk in the Lauterbrunnen Valley or along one of the lakes; or take a daytrip to Bern or Meiringen (for the Aare Gorge or the Reichenbach Falls--where Sherlock Holmes and Professor Moriarty fought to the death!).

But I hope that the weather cooperates, because this is some of the most spectacular scenery in the world.

I have to say that sometimes, even if you can't see the mountains from Interlaken, the top of the Jungfrau can be clear. Our first trip to Switzerland, before we knew better, we could barely see the trees in Interlaken one morning but went up to the Jungfrau anyway because we had only planned one day for this trip. It was spectacular, not a cloud in sight and we had a perfect view. We were pretty lucky that day!

I'm not saying to up and go when it's very cloudy. I'm saying that it's a good idea to ask the hotel personnel if they know the weather conditions at the top before going, no matter what the weather is where you are. They have been very helpful to us. Do the trip the first good day in case the weather worsens as time goes on.

I have also noticed that the clouds seem to roll in as it gets later in the day so it might be best to try to plan the trip for the morning. Same if you go up the Schilthorn.

If you stay in Lauterbrunnen and want to take the hike from Mannlichen, you would take the train to Wengen and the cablecar from Wengen to Mannlichen. There's a playground up there too before you start the hike. Then take the train back to Lauterbrunnen from Kleine Scheidegg.

With that wide-ranging itinerary definitely investigate the Swiss Pass which would cover all the trains you mention and for that much travel be better than the Half-Fare card or regular tickets I suspect - great sources of info on Swiss trains and passes and lake boats, etc - www.swisstravelsystem.com; http://www.budgeteuropetravel.com/id3.html; www.ricksteves.com and www.seat61.com - sites that give a lot of great info and not just the usual pass and product prices.

You have two kids under 15 - thus you get free with a Swiss Pass a free Family Pass whereby the 5=yr old never pays a dime for any form of transport - even those trips to mountain tops the pass may only cover 50% - the 1 yr old of course goes free even within the Family Pass - but the 5 yr old in effect gets a free pass and never pays a dime for any type of travel. If you do not buy a pass you can buy the Family Pass for around $35 in Switzerland I believe but with the Swiss Pass it is free.

I have to say that sometimes, even if you can't see the mountains from Interlaken, the top of the Jungfrau can be clear.>
tis true also IME - but be sure to check the ubiquitous weather forecasts TVs inevitably in hotels or in the Interlaken tourist office or other tourist offices to make sure - there is a web cam on the Jungfrau to show you exactly what is is up there!

ah the Mannlichen to Kleine Schiedegg hike is not to be missed - by anyone and anyone practically who is ambulatory can go this flat short ridge walk affording views down over both the Lauterbrunnen and Grindelwald valleys as well as from the Mannlichen, Interlaken itself, lovingly wedged between the two lakes bookending it!

Thank you all for great suggestions! Where can I find/ search good apartments in interlaken? The Beau Rivage is too expensive-$400/night!

http://www.interlaken.world-guides.com/

try this site

http://www.booking.com/city/ch/interlaken.en.html?aid=342443;label=city-interlaken-QyubgFvoH1q3inicl88e4AS16627276790:pl:ta:p1:p2:ac:ap1t1:neg;ws=

Booking apartments in Interlaken.

We instead of staying in Interlaken, have booked 5 nights in Bern and will take day trips from there. Any suggestions on day trips?

Hi PalenQ - thanks for all your help. As i mentioned, we booked 5 nights in Bern. Please let me know your opinion on the below itinerary so i can make it more efficient and improve on it:


Day 1 Saturday, June 30th
o Fly out from JFK to Zurich at 4:30 pm
Day 2 Sunday, July 1st
o Arrive Zurich at 6:40am and take the train to Bern. [Zurich HB to Bern; departure at 9:02, 9:32 - every 30 minutes. You take the InterCity from Zürich HB departing track 16 to Bern. You arrive at Bern is on track 6 at 09:58.]
o Visit Bern
 Hoheweg- Interlaken's main street runs between West and Ost Railway Stations
 Visit Unterseen - small old town near the Interlaken West train station
 If time permits, take trains to Grindelwald [35 minutes direct train from OST], Lauterbrunnen, Wengen, Gimmelwald;

Day 3 Monday, July 2nd
o Junfraujoch- Top of Europe tour [3 hours train ride via Interlaken  Lauterbrunnen Kliene ScheideggJungfraujoch]
 Stop at Interlaken and visit Unterseen, Hohewegl
 Cruise on lake Thun or Brienz from OST station
 Stop at Lauterbrunnen & Kliene Scheidegg on way back from Jungfraujoch to visit the towns .

Day 4 Tuesday July 3rd - Train to Zermatt [2:06 hours train ride via  VispZermatt – Leave early by 8:30]
 Paragliding [AlpinAir.net]
o Guided Village tour at 4:30 PM only on Tuesdays.
o Visit Matterhorn Glacier Paradise- & Glacier Palace

Day 5 Wednesday, July 4th - Train to Lausanne [1:30 hours train ride]
• 2 hours or so around Haute Ville, the Upper Town, visiting the Cathedral of Lausanne OR take a walking tour - http://www.lausanne-tourisme.ch/view.asp?docId=20296&domId=63893&language=E
 Vieille Ville (Old Town)
 Ouchy, the port and resort area of Lausanne, opening onto Lake Geneva - especially the promenades, Quai de Belgique and Quai d'Ouchy.
o Take train to Montreux (25 min)
 Visit Château of Chillon
 If possible, Rochers-de-Naye, at 2,042m (6,698 ft.), reached by cogwheel train from Montreux


Day 6 Thursday, July 5th - Train to Interlaken [55 min direct]
o Visit other town like Wengen, Grindelwald

Day 7 Friday, July 6th – Take train to Zurich [~1 hr] – Check in At the Hotel
o Take afternoon tour [12:15 PM - http://www.viator.com/tours/Zurich/Zurich-Afternoon-City-Tour/d577-3885SW301BS] OR at 11 AM http://www.viator.com/tours/Zurich/The-Great-Tour-of-Zurich/d577-2460CITB
o Landesmuseum
o quays of Zurich, such as the finest and most famous, Limmatquai.
o stained-glass windows at the church, Fraumünster.
o walking tour of Zurich's Altstadt (Old Town)
o Romanesque and Gothic cathedral of Grossmünster
o take another tour, this one by boat and aerial cableway to Felsenegg at 795m
o Rhine Falls???

Day 8 Saturday, July 7th – Train to Lucern from Zurich [50min direct train ride – leave by 8]
o Walking tour of Lucerne, offered by Lucerne Tourist Office (located at train station) called “A walk around Lucerne”- 2 hour tour starts at 9:45 AM everyday - http://www.luzern.com/en/classic-walking-tour
 Visit Swiss Transport Museum
 Chapel Bridge
 Picasso Museum
 Gletschergarten (Glacier Garden)
 Boat trip on Lake Lucern
o Mt Titlis – 1 hr train to Engelberg

Day 9 Sunday, July 8th – Trip to Heidiland & Liechtenstein
http://www.viator.com/tours/Zurich/Heidiland-and-Liechtenstein-Tour-from-Zurich-Two-Countries-in-One-Day/d577-2460HEID

Day 10 Monday, July 9th – Fly Zurich - JFK @ 10:05am

Sorry, but this just sounds crazy with a 5 y.o. and a 6 m.o. in tow. Someone has already mentioned that 'you know your kids best,' but I wonder if you've previously attempted an ambitious trip like this with them. Does the 5 y.o. still take afternoon naps?

Day 1 might be impossible even for adults. Do you not anticipate any jet lag?

Day 5 sounds like a forced march.

Day 6 is confusing to me. Weren't you just in Interlaken on day 3?

Days 7 and 8 are way too ambitious IMO.

I second the suggestion that you speak with your children's pediatrician about taking them to the top of the Jungfrau. If you do get the OK, be sure to take warm clothing because it is much colder at the top.

Honestly, I would re-think this entire trip. Cut the sightseeing by half, factor in some do-nothing/play time for the 5 y.o. (especially on the arrival day), and reconsider the early morning starts.

Or keep the itinerary as is but leave the kids at home.

Thanks for your concern and suggestions. I modified my itinerary a little bit. My kids are generally fine with these kind of trips and we are hoping this will be the same.

SWITZERLAND TRIP – JUNE 2012

Day 1 Saturday, June 30th
o Fly out from JFK to Zurich at 4:30 pm
Day 2 Sunday, July 1st
o Arrive Zurich at 6:40am and take the train to Interlaken. [Zurich Airport to Bern – 1:15 hours; departure at 9:02, 9:32 - every 30 minutes]
o Visit Bern
 Old Town (Altstadt - main street is Kramgasse)
 1 museum (Swiss Alpine Museum, Bern Historical Museum, Natural History Museum, and Museum of Communication)

Day 3 Monday, July 2nd – dependent on weather
o Junfraujoch- Top of Europe tour [2:17 hours train ride via  Lauterbrunnen Kliene ScheideggJungfraujoch]
 Stop at Kliene Scheidegg on way back to visit the town
 Hike from Kleine Scheidegg  Maennlichen
o Visit Interlaken
 Hoheweg- Interlaken's main street runs between West and Ost Railway Stations
 Cruise on lake Thun(may be with the visit of Beatus caves and/or Oberhofen castle) or Brienz from OST station

Day 4 Tuesday July 3rd - Train to Zermatt [2:05 hours train ride via  Spiez VispZermatt – Leave early by 8:30]
 Paragliding [AlpinAir.net]- if time permits
o Guided Village tour at 4:30 PM only on Tuesdays.
o Visit Matterhorn Glacier Paradise- & Glacier Palace
o Hike to Riffelberg

Day 5 Wednesday, July 4th - Train to Lausanne [1:10 hours train ride- every 30 mins]
 2 hours or so around Haute Ville, the Upper Town, visiting the Cathedral of Lausanne OR take a walking tour - http://www.lausanne-tourisme.ch/view.asp?docId=20296&domId=63893&language=E
 Vieille Ville (Old Town)
 Ouchy, the port and resort area of Lausanne, opening onto Lake Geneva - especially the promenades, Quai de Belgique and Quai d'Ouchy.
o Steamboat to Chillion caste from Ouchy
 If possible, Rochers-de-Naye, at 2,042m (6,698 ft.), reached by cogwheel train from Montreux
 Take golden Panoramic Express via Gstaad to Bern.


Day 6 Thursday, July 5th - ?Gstaad? Bern?or Basel?

Day 7 Friday, July 6th – Take train to Zurich [~2 hr via Bern]
o Take afternoon tour [12:15 PM - http://www.viator.com/tours/Zurich/Zurich-Afternoon-City-Tour/d577-3885SW301BS] OR at 11 AM http://www.viator.com/tours/Zurich/The-Great-Tour-of-Zurich/d577-2460CITB
o Landesmuseum
o quays of Zurich, such as the finest and most famous, Limmatquai.
o stained-glass windows at the church, Fraumünster.
o walking tour of Zurich's Altstadt (Old Town)
o Romanesque and Gothic cathedral of Grossmünster
o take another tour, this one by boat and aerial cableway to Felsenegg at 795m
o Rhine Falls???

Day 8 Saturday, July 7th – Train to Lucern [50min direct train ride – leave by 8]
o Walking tour of Lucerne, offered by Lucerne Tourist Office (located at train station) called “A walk around Lucerne”- 2 hour tour starts at 9:45 AM everyday - http://www.luzern.com/en/classic-walking-tour
 Visit Swiss Transport Museum
 Chapel Bridge
 Picasso Museum
 Gletschergarten (Glacier Garden)
 Boat trip on Lake Lucern
o Mt Titlis – 1 hr train to Engelberg

Day 9 Sunday, July 8th – Trip to Heidiland & Liechtenstein
http://www.viator.com/tours/Zurich/Heidiland-and-Liechtenstein-Tour-from-Zurich-Two-Countries-in-One-Day/d577-2460HEID

Day 10 Monday, July 9th – Fly Zurich - JFK @ 10:05am

Your programme is full of errors.

Three that I noticed--the boat cruise launch for Lake Thun is behind Interlaken WEST, not Interlaken Ost.

--Kleine Scheidegg is not a town. It is a train station with a few facilities like a restaurant and a playground for children. There is nothing to tour there.

--If you are hiking from Kleine Scheidegg to Mannlichen you are going UP HILL and in the oppposite direction that everyone else hikes. Most hikers walk FROM Mannlichen TO Kleine Scheidegg.

I also hope you realise that Zurich is one of the most expensive places on earth. I would stay in Bern or Luzern and do a day trip into Zurich if you really want to see it.

Zurich is a business city. It is a city of money. It really is not geared for tourists.

Have a good trip. Enjoy the BO.

Thingorjus

How much uphill is the stroll from Kl Schiedegg to Mannlichen - I'll have to look at elevations and see - I remember it as being fairly flat and an easy putz in any direction - I saw baby carriages doing it last time I did it. But perhaps early onset dementia has set in?

I've done the walk from Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg a couple of times now and have never seen a single person going the opposite direction. None of it is steep, and a good bit is level, but the end (or beginning, going the other way) goes downhill (or uphill) quite a bit. I wouldn't want to start off that way with a stroller and small child.

Well, it's your trip, not mine, but I think I would be totally exhausted and angry after the trip because I had not enough time to do even half of what was on the schedule.

Agree that the logical order is Wengen - cable car to Männlichen - hike to Kleine Scheidegg - cog-train to Jungfraujoch etc. I have done the hike a couple of times and always in that direction. A) the elevation difference is about 200 m. It's easier to hike downhill from Männlichen and B) (and more important) by hiking Männlichen to Kleine Scheidegg you have the gorgeous panoramic views always in front of you. In the other direction the view is not very exciting.

Day 2: You're not really saying you want to tour Bern's old town and even visit a museum after a transatlantic flight plus train transfer, do you? Jesus! Your kids will want to kill you.

Day 3: There is no way you'll have time for a lake cruise or visiting a museum after the trip up to Jungfraujoch and the hike and strolling through Interlaken.

Day 4: If you want to go up to Kleinmatterhorn, how do you want to include the hike to Riffelberg? That's on the Gornergrat mountain.

Day 5: Did you check how much time the trip up to Rochers-de-Naye takes? And afterwards the looong train ride via Gstaad? Ugh.

Day 7: I agree that Zürich doesn't have the most exciting attractions, but I like it a lot and think it's underrated. Very expensive, though, that's true. I don't think your list includes the highlights, unfortunately.

Day 8: No way you can do justice to Lucerne, see two museums (the Transport museum is HUGE) and do a boat cruise AND go to Engelberg/Titlis. No way.

Day 9: A total waste. Liechtenstein is boring, Heidiland totally overrated. Especially with a tour. Did you see the cost is $68? And what for? Transportation with the coach! But you have free transportation with your Swiss Pass ... The landscape you'll see is by far not more beautiful or more spectacular than what you have already seen. Quite the opposite - the Bernese Oberland is much better!!

Just my opinion. I know, it's not my trip.

Ingo

Thank you for that, kwren.

I am condradicted by the above poster at every turn.

I just walked from Mannlichen to Kleine Scheidegg in September and, like you, never saw one person walking up to Mannlichen from Kleine Scheidegg and that is probably one of the busiest trails in the BO.

Kleine Scheidegg elevation: 6762 ft.

Mannlichen elevation: 7687 ft.

Thingorjus

Thank you all- with so many nice reccos- I will update ans post my itinerary gain for feedback,!

Umm, small correction, Thin - the elevation of the top station of Männlichen cable car is 7316 ft. What you gave is the elevation of the Männlichen peak.

So a 500 foot or so rise over a few miles - nothing to sweat about - but yes it could be a tad easier going the other way - but take into account perhaps that winds usually... of well it ain't a big deal IMO.

Who cares?

Uphill is still uphill no matter how the daft ones try to spin it.

I wouldn't want to walk uphill for over an hour with two kids in tow.

Also--wouldn't the family walk up to Mannlichen Peak? I always do. You assume that they are going to get right into a gondola and go down to Wengen or Grindelwald when they get up to the gondola stations.


There are too many daft posters with axes to grind on this forum.

Thingorjus

The first ascent, right at the start, from Kleine Scheidegg to that restaurant is quite steep and definitely not "without sweat", especially with two very young kids. That could already be the end of the hike, I'd say.

Secondly, the views in that direction are only half as nice as in the direction Männlichen-Kleine Scheidegg. That's the major point for me.

Umm, Thin, in either direction, the hike to Männlichen Peak is the same. It's not between the cable car station and Kleine Scheidegg, it's an additional hike with starting and ending point at the cable car station. Of course, after hiking UPHILL they probably wouldn't want to add that short hike to the peak (which is really, really steep).